Stat rosa pristina nomine, nomina nuda tenemus.

    Stat rosa pristina nomine, nomina nuda tenemus.

    post #1 of 53
    Thread Starter 

    Reincarnation

    I don't care about rose.

    Sure, I like some rose things, like Egoïste, and ... well Egoïste anyway. But comeon ... that doesn't really count. I didn't even notice it had rose in it until Redneck Perfumisto called it "a rose in a sandalwood box" or something like that.

    I once gave away a new-to-me blind-bought vintage bottle of Van Cleef and Arpels pour Homme after spraying it once.


    I have so many Guerlains, but which one do I almost never touch? That's right - Nahema.


    I knowit's supposed to be the queen of the flowers. I guess it's the most important material in all of perfumery, it's regal, beautiful, etc., etc.


    Whatever.

    I still don't care.

    I feel like I should, like I'm not a real perfumisto if I don't love rose.

    But I really just don't.


    Of course, that's not true.

    That was true upuntil about a week ago.

    I posted in a thread about rose perfumes that got off on a chypre tangent. I offered to send the OP some chypre samples as a sort of crash course.

    Just a few days before that, I had picked up a bottle of Dans Tes Bras at Saks. Either I looked like I have a lot of money to spend, or I was just verycharming - I don't know because both sound hugelyimplausible. Anyway,Iended up with nearly a full set of Frederic Malle samples, including Une Rose.


    I had been meaning to test the Malleline, so this a very nice surprise. I wasn't that interested in the rose one, or course, so I put it in the little pack of chypre samples. But I didn't want to let it go without trying it. I sprayed the back of my hand first.


    I was paying some attention, because I wanted to have some idea what it was like.

    I honestly think I hadnever really tested a rose perfume before. They are such a cliche, so stereotypically feminine - girly or matronly.

    I had written off the whole genre. No, not even. You have to first consider something before you can reject it. I had never even thoughtabout rose perfumes.

    This was a quick test just for the sake of thoroughness.


    It was beautiful. Une Rose is a soliflor, but not like most. This rose is not crisp, fresh and green. It's not clean and soapy like I imagine rose perfumes to be (probably because a lot of soap is "rose"-scented). Une Rose isheavy, dense and lush, dark and earthy. No lightness or fruit. Just a rich red rose in damp dark earth.

    It has a "truffle accord", which I guess is what creates the earthy/rooty effect that grounds therose. Geranium and wine dregs? Ok, sure - whatever. I'm not going to try to break this down. Firstly, because I can't (though I'd be very happy to read thethoughts of someonewho can), and secondly, because I'm happy experiencing this perfume as a whole thing.


    The rose used isrosa centifolia,Rose de Maior, less glamorously, cabbage rose,which looks like this


    But Une Rose smells like this


    Here's a short video of Fléchier talking about Une Rose. He is not the most fluid and engaging speaker, but he says it all through the juice in that bottle.


    The blurb from EdP Frederic Malle's web site:

    UNE ROSE
    ITS CREATOR: EDOUARD FLÉCHIER
    Singular like a skin’s perfume, Edouard Fléchier’s Une Rose marries the voluptuousness of the flower to the carnal depth of a truffle accord. A fruit and honey burst of Turkish rose absolute is punctuated with geranium and wine dregs. Vetiver, patchouli and castoreum create the link between the skin and the vegetal fragrance of the flower. Une Rose seems to emanate from the skin, the intoxicating, earthy aroma of a garden rose pulled from the ground with its roots - that's Une Rose. A master’s rose.



    It was like a switch flipped in my head. The rose is the queen of the flowers, and I'm ready to swear fealty.

    I'm going down a red velvetyrabbit hole. Not sure where I will end up, but all I'm thinking about these days in the world of perfume is rose.

    This little journey will be recorded in this thread, in the hope that it will spark a conversation. That's something I've missed. So muchdigital communication has taken on the pace ofsocial media -shallow one liners andpetty flame wars over nothing much. I want to slow things down,dive deep, exchange carefullyconsidered thoughts, and learn something here. Join me please.

    (thanks to Kevin)

    post #2 of 53

    So many dark or dirty roses to try - Rosam, Rossy de Palma, Dirty Rose, Ottoman Rose, Rose Poivree, Cordovan Rose.

    You're going to have fun discovering that rose needn't be a light, powdery scent, and can get down and dirty with the best of em.

    It's my favourite note for a reason.

    I wonder exactly when rose ceased being a scent worn by men (as I understand it once was) and was instead handed entirely over to the feminine domain.

    post #3 of 53
    Thread Starter 
    I have a long list, and I'm sure it's going to get longer before it gets shorter. Thanks for the suggestions, Tim.

    I don't want to put you on the spot, but how dominant is the rose in the compositions of those, and how do they embellish the rose? I know I'll like a lot of dark and dirty roses.

    I'm not sure if I'll like clean powdery ones too. Who knows? I never really gave any of them a chance before. I'm not ruling anything out just yet, and don't intend to leave any stone unturned.

    I can shop my collection for some, and my sample bins for a few more. I'm also starting to order decants and blind buying some perfumes that seem to have a good price/risk ratio.

    There is at least one place where the men never gave up rose - the Arabian peninsula. I'm going to be wearing perfume like an Arab. With passion, as a friend likes to say.
    post #4 of 53

    With the exception of the Cordovan Rose, those all have rose front and centre, but interpret the flower in various dark, deep ways in which you expressed an interest in your post.

    Rossy de Palma is the lightest of that lot, but that's not to say it's light by any stretch. It is probably the one that leans most feminine (along with Rose Poivree), but I sure as hell have no problem wearing it.

    It's not dark and heavy like the frags blended with heavy woods and oud, but I certainly wouldn't compare it to the light, girly floral fragrances that so many people associate with rose. The drydown has something astringent/sharp to it; my nose isn't good enough to identify what it is, but it certainly keeps the wearer from getting too comfortable.

    I haven't had much time with Rose Poivree (only during my amazing visit to Aedes), but I remember that it has a bit of stank to it, which I like. It may be more than a bit, as I don't smell an especially strong stank even from MKK.

    I wouldn't describe it as incredibly dark, in fact the rose is rather fresh and natural, but the other notes adds a dirtiness to the rose that I think you might like.

    Ottoman Rose is one I recently tested (as it just came out and I had access to it). A copy and paste of my initial thoughts are:

    The saffron at the beginning immediately tells you that this is something exotic and unfamiliar (at least, to people not used to saffron in fragrances) and sets the tone for what I think will be the most challenging fragrance for usual C&E shoppers.
    No powder, lots of rich rose and dark spice, greenery, a little fruit and some heavy woods feature here, and if I were to compare this to anything, it would be the wonderful work of Paul Kiler in his Dirty Rose.

    The leather and woods in the drydown give this the heavy feel I was hoping for in Assam Oud.
    The base gives off a sharp, almost metallic, feel for an hour or so, before the leather kicks back in and smooths everything out until it fades.

    Dirty Rose is the most earthen of the lot, but despite the name it doesn't have lots of stank to it. It DOES, however, have a strange semi-sweet smell to it, like you're drinking some lovely rose and blackcurrant liqueur (I know there's no blackcurrant in there, but there's a juiciness that reminds me of this Latvian blackcurrant spirit called Black Balsam). It's really something special, and apparently he's considering bringing out the version of it that he was commissioned to make - with aoud and lots of dirty musk.

    At almost the other end of the spectrum, Cordovan Rose is quite dry. Like everything else of Liz Zorn's, it's challenging at first instance (and not just when you look at the price of anything more than a sample), but the more you try it the more you appreciate its depth and the ingredients used. This stuff is a lovely leather fragrance with an dry rose note - the dirtiness and darkness comes from the leather, which overpowers the rose to a certain degree. Since leather is one of my other favourite notes, my dwindling sample vial gets a hefty sniff every now and then.

    Rosam is something else. It boggles the mind that black aoud is the gold standard by which rose/aoud fragrances are judged. This has a much less abrasive (and yes, quieter) aoud than Montale's biting offerings, allowing the rose to shine through a lot more. The rose is deep and rich, like the blood-red petals of a rose just starting to wilt. Even if you can't sniff out all the fragrances listed, get a vial of this stuff. It's deep, rich and smooth - an absolute delight for a fan of dark rose scents.

    Of those I only have a full bottle of Rossy de Palma, but Rosam and Dirty Rose are among my next purchases.

    post #5 of 53
    My only gripe with the otherwise divine Une Rose is the ghastly amount of ISO E SUPER.


    Once you smell it, you can't unsmell it.
    post #6 of 53
    Paestum Rose - eau d'italie

    It's not as rose centric as Une Rose but it's a very special rose perfume.
    post #7 of 53
    My favorite so far is Montale's Highness Rose Parfum. Have yet to find anything I personally am more enamored with as fr as rose goes.
    post #8 of 53
    My fav is Mon Nom Est Rouge by Majda Bekkali - dark, dusty, metallic , boozy rose
    post #9 of 53

    In general, I am not a big fan of most rose perfumes either, but sometimes it works well, especially in combination with other materials. I also often fail to detect rose in many perfume where it's supposedly used - for instance, like you, I don't find Egoiste rosy at all.

    Apart from the rose oud combos, I sometimes also go for the neon roses of the 80s, the big damascones. Few survive, there's Estee Lauder Knowing. In vintage, Sinan and Montana Parfum de peau. And then the near mythical Nombre Noir.

    I own and like Rosam, but to me the interesting part is that it has a very mineral rendition of oud that feels almost uncomfortable. As for Rose poivree, Tania Sanchez claims it has been reformulated, with the vintage smelling far dirtier. For a touch of dirt, more a raspy, vegetal dirt, I like Twill Rose by Rosine.

    cacio

    post #10 of 53
    Other dark roses:

    rose de nuit serge lutens

    Rose en noir - Miller Harris : Briefly smelled this today. Opening was dark.
    post #11 of 53
    I lived at the top of Parnell in Auckland for while, around 1978/79, and some evenings would stroll down a side street that had an open air botanical garden - not that big, but well curated and full of interesting stuff. It was dusk, probably late summer, and I stopped to sniff the roses. I don't remember the botanical names but there was one that looked like the deep burgundy maroon one you feature above for Une Rose, and it completely floored me. It was THE rose. Dark, deep, a little dusky and shadowy, like it was withholding secret information about the elemental universe from me but not at all in a spiteful way, it was also offering an invitation, or at least throwing out a good natured challenge - how can you possibly express an experience like that in words?

    Anyway - to this day I have never smelled anything quite like it and while I have never had any great desire to actually smell like a rose, I have kept an eye out these last few years to see if any of the various fragrances we see discussed here 'measure up' so to speak.

    The first one that spoke to me was C&S 88. For some reason this stuck me immediately as 'dark', masculine and very English. It had some of the gravitas of THE Parnell rose, and I still enjoy wearing it very, very occasionally. It seems to be a black tie evening thing . . .

    And then I came across Une Rose. This one had life - it reached out of the nozzle, still damp with dew and straining to pull away from the soil. I was with a friend and we opted to buy one of the travel sets - she kept a couple, one is enough for me - it's there when I need to relive that burst of vital energy.

    There's one I remember Luca Turin describing as an angry Carmen reborn in New Jersey (or something similar) but I can't remember which one - must go back and have a look sometime.

    I bought Lyric Man & Woman when they turned up - Man has a slightly less austere Brit thing than 88 but retains the dressed for an evening mood, but Woman is quite special. It takes the idea of rose in another direction entirely that I really enjoy - 'jammy' makes sense, but not overly so, but it's sexy, compelling stuff. I had been discussing rose with a friend, the former Head of Fragrance at Guerlain here, over coffee after trying Nahema and Chamade Extrait and handed her Lyric Woman - it was really something to see her eyes open wide and her face light up. I must get around to trying the Extrait at some point.

    The coup de grace of that particular afternoon was Homage. I bought one of the earlier ones in the smaller white box and it qualifies as my 'transcendent rose'. One whiff and it's an azure sky streaked with a pinkish rose tinge . . . no words can do it justice.

    All that said, I don't think you need to necessarily track down the more exotic niche offerings to get a blast that moves you. A few years ago I was with some Sufi friends who visit Turkey every year or so and they passed around a simple bottle of rose water they had brought back from the trip to freshen up before meditation or zikr, a rose eau de cologne basically, and it was absolutely delightful - lighter, fresher, 'dewier' than the ones above, but a garden appeared on cue and you just felt like smiling and taking a deep breath, so mission accomplished.

    I have probably learnt more about roses from this fragrance world than from actually smelling the real things, which is sorta sad, but there you go. Look forward to others thoughts and suggestions . . .
    Edited by mr. reasonable - 10/19/13 at 12:16pm
    post #12 of 53
    Thread Starter 

    Thanks for the comments and suggestions everyone!

    Generally speaking, I'm not interested in what your favorite rose is (no offense ;-) ).

    I'm interested in why you loveit. You don't have to be a professional critic or have a nose like a gas chromatograph - I'm not and I don't.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by timdoeswellView Post

    Dirty Rose is the most earthen of the lot, but despite the name it doesn't have lots of stank to it. It DOES, however, have a strange semi-sweet smell to it, like you're drinking some lovely rose and blackcurrant liqueur (I know there's no blackcurrant in there, but there's a juiciness that reminds me of this Latvian blackcurrant spirit called Black Balsam). It's really something special, and apparently he's considering bringing out the version of it that he was commissioned to make - with aoud and lots of dirty musk.

    You've got me interested in this now. I've seen Paul active on these boards, and have considered ordering a set of samples. I've hesitated because many times indie perfumers sound great to me, but then end up just not working for me. Also, I hate dealing with vials.

    I think I'll get a spray mini of this one. I wonder if he'll sell me one of the dirtier version. I should ask.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by hedonist222View Post

    My only gripe with the otherwise divine Une Rose is the ghastly amount of ISO E SUPER.


    Once you smell it, you can't unsmell it.

    Oh no! You're killing the love! And I don't the have the sampleanymore.

    It's ok. I need to go back to get another sample anyway. I wasn't going drop $330 on a bottle after one sniff on my hand. I'm not even very sure about what I wrote above because I wrote it from memory a couple of days later. Ididn't think to take notes while I was sniffing late at night.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hednicView Post

    My favorite so far is Montale's Highness Rose Parfum. Have yet to find anything I personally am more enamored with as fr as rose goes.

    This is a Paris exclusive? What doesit smelllike?

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cacioView Post

    Apart from the rose oud combos, I sometimes also go for the neon roses of the 80s, the big damascones. Few survive, there's Estee Lauder Knowing. In vintage, Sinan and Montana Parfum de peau. And then the near mythical Nombre Noir.

    I've started reading up on some of these. I have my eye on a bottle of Knowing, and I just picked up a vintageUngaro Diva on thecheap. I don't even want to know about Nombre Noir. If it turnedout to be my holy grail rose, I'd be crushed. Better not to know.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted bytimdoeswellView Post

    Rosamis something else. It boggles the mind that black aoud is the gold standard by which rose/aoud fragrances are judged. This has a much less abrasive (and yes, quieter) aoud than Montale's biting offerings, allowing the rose to shine through a lot more. The rose is deep and rich, like the blood-red petals of a rose juclass="

    10/19/13 at 12:06am

    rubegon said:



    Reincarnation

    I don't care about rose.

    Sure, I like some rose things, like Egoïste, and ... well Egoïste anyway. But comeon ... that doesn't really count. I didn't even notice it had rose in it until Redneck Perfumisto called it "a rose in a sandalwood box" or something like that.

    I once gave away a new-to-me blind-bought vintage bottle of Van Cleef and Arpels pour Homme after spraying it once.


    I have so many Guerlains, but which one do I almost never touch? That's right - Nahema.


    I knowit's supposed to be the queen of the flowers. I guess it's the most important material in all of perfumery, it's regal, beautiful, etc., etc.


    Whatever.

    I still don't care.

    I feel like I should, like I'm not a real perfumisto if I don't love rose.

    But I really just don't.


    Of course, that's not true.

    That was true upuntil about a week ago.

    I posted in a thread about rose perfumes that got off on a chypre tangent. I offered to send the OP some chypre samples as a sort of crash course.

    Just a few days before that, I had picked up a bottle of Dans Tes Bras at Saks. Either I looked like I have a lot of money to spend, or I was just verycharming - I don't know because both sound hugelyimplausible. Anyway,Iended up with nearly a full set of Frederic Malle samples, including Une Rose.


    I had been meaning to test the Malleline, so this a very nice surprise. I wasn't that interested in the rose one, or course, so I put it in the little pack of chypre samples. But I didn't want to let it go without trying it. I sprayed the back of my hand first.


    I was paying some attention, because I wanted to have some idea what it was like.

    I honestly think I hadnever really tested a rose perfume before. They are such a cliche, so stereotypically feminine - girly or matronly.

    I had written off the whole genre. No, not even. You have to first consider something before you can reject it. I had never even thoughtabout rose perfumes.

    This was a quick test just for the sake of thoroughness.


    It was beautiful. Une Rose is a soliflor, but not like most. This rose is not crisp, fresh and green. It's not clean and soapy like I imagine rose perfumes to be (probably because a lot of soap is "rose"-scented). Une Rose isheavy, dense and lush, dark and earthy. No lightness or fruit. Just a rich red rose in damp dark earth.

    It has a "truffle accord", which I guess is what creates the earthy/rooty effect that grounds therose. Geranium and wine dregs? Ok, sure - whatever. I'm not going to try to break this down. Firstly, because I can't (though I'd be very happy to read thethoughts of someonewho can), and secondly, because I'm happy experiencing this perfume as a whole thing.


    The rose used isrosa centifolia,Rose de Maior, less glamorously, cabbage rose,which looks like this


    But Une Rose smells like this


    Here's a short video of Fléchier talking about Une Rose. He is not the most fluid and engaging speaker, but he says it all through the juice in that bottle.


    The blurb from EdP Frederic Malle's web site:

    UNE ROSE
    ITS CREATOR: EDOUARD FLÉCHIER
    Singular like a skin’s perfume, Edouard Fléchier’s Une Rose marries the voluptuousness of the flower to the carnal depth of a truffle accord. A fruit and honey burst of Turkish rose absolute is punctuated with geranium and wine dregs. Vetiver, patchouli and castoreum create the link between the skin and the vegetal fragrance of the flower. Une Rose seems to emanate from the skin, the intoxicating, earthy aroma of a garden rose pulled from the ground with its roots - that's Une Rose. A master’s rose.



    It was like a switch flipped in my head. The rose is the queen of the flowers, and I'm ready to swear fealty.

    I'm going down a red velvetyrabbit hole. Not sure where I will end up, but all I'm thinking about these days in the world of perfume is rose.

    This little journey will be recorded in this thread, in the hope that it will spark a conversation. That's something I've missed. So muchdigital communication has taken on the pace ofsocial media -shallow one liners andpetty flame wars over nothing much. I want to slow things down,dive deep, exchange carefullyconsidered thoughts, and learn something here. Join me please.

    (thanks to Kevin)

    10/19/13 at 12:36am

    timdoeswell said:



    So many dark or dirty roses to try - Rosam, Rossy de Palma, Dirty Rose, Ottoman Rose, Rose Poivree, Cordovan Rose.

    You're going to have fun discovering that rose needn't be a light, powdery scent, and can get down and dirty with the best of em.

    It's my favourite note for a reason.

    I wonder exactly when rose ceased being a scent worn by men (as I understand it once was) and was instead handed entirely over to the feminine domain.

    10/19/13 at 12:59am

    rubegon said:



    I have a long list, and I'm sure it's going to get longer before it gets shorter. Thanks for the suggestions, Tim.

    I don't want to put you on the spot, but how dominant is the rose in the compositions of those, and how do they embellish the rose? I know I'll like a lot of dark and dirty roses.

    I'm not sure if I'll like clean powdery ones too. Who knows? I never really gave any of them a chance before. I'm not ruling anything out just yet, and don't intend to leave any stone unturned.

    I can shop my collection for some, and my sample bins for a few more. I'm also starting to order decants and blind buying some perfumes that seem to have a good price/risk ratio.

    There is at least one place where the men never gave up rose - the Arabian peninsula. I'm going to be wearing perfume like an Arab. With passion, as a friend likes to say.

    10/19/13 at 2:32am

    timdoeswell said:



    With the exception of the Cordovan Rose, those all have rose front and centre, but interpret the flower in various dark, deep ways in which you expressed an interest in your post.

    Rossy de Palma is the lightest of that lot, but that's not to say it's light by any stretch. It is probably the one that leans most feminine (along with Rose Poivree), but I sure as hell have no problem wearing it.

    It's not dark and heavy like the frags blended with heavy woods and oud, but I certainly wouldn't compare it to the light, girly floral fragrances that so many people associate with rose. The drydown has something astringent/sharp to it; my nose isn't good enough to identify what it is, but it certainly keeps the wearer from getting too comfortable.

    I haven't had much time with Rose Poivree (only during my amazing visit to Aedes), but I remember that it has a bit of stank to it, which I like. It may be more than a bit, as I don't smell an especially strong stank even from MKK.

    I wouldn't describe it as incredibly dark, in fact the rose is rather fresh and natural, but the other notes adds a dirtiness to the rose that I think you might like.

    Ottoman Rose is one I recently tested (as it just came out and I had access to it). A copy and paste of my initial thoughts are:

    The saffron at the beginning immediately tells you that this is something exotic and unfamiliar (at least, to people not used to saffron in fragrances) and sets the tone for what I think will be the most challenging fragrance for usual C&E shoppers.
    No powder, lots of rich rose and dark spice, greenery, a little fruit and some heavy woods feature here, and if I were to compare this to anything, it would be the wonderful work of Paul Kiler in his Dirty Rose.

    The leather and woods in the drydown give this the heavy feel I was hoping for in Assam Oud.
    The base gives off a sharp, almost metallic, feel for an hour or so, before the leather kicks back in and smooths everything out until it fades.

    Dirty Rose is the most earthen of the lot, but despite the name it doesn't have lots of stank to it. It DOES, however, have a strange semi-sweet smell to it, like you're drinking some lovely rose and blackcurrant liqueur (I know there's no blackcurrant in there, but there's a juiciness that reminds me of this Latvian blackcurrant spirit called Black Balsam). It's really something special, and apparently he's considering bringing out the version of it that he was commissioned to make - with aoud and lots of dirty musk.

    At almost the other end of the spectrum, Cordovan Rose is quite dry. Like everything else of Liz Zorn's, it's challenging at first instance (and not just when you look at the price of anything more than a sample), but the more you try it the more you appreciate its depth and the ingredients used. This stuff is a lovely leather fragrance with an dry rose note - the dirtiness and darkness comes from the leather, which overpowers the rose to a certain degree. Since leather is one of my other favourite notes, my dwindling sample vial gets a hefty sniff every now and then.

    Rosam is something else. It boggles the mind that black aoud is the gold standard by which rose/aoud fragrances are judged. This has a much less abrasive (and yes, quieter) aoud than Montale's biting offerings, allowing the rose to shine through a lot more. The rose is deep and rich, like the blood-red petals of a rose just starting to wilt. Even if you can't sniff out all the fragrances listed, get a vial of this stuff. It's deep, rich and smooth - an absolute delight for a fan of dark rose scents.

    Of those I only have a full bottle of Rossy de Palma, but Rosam and Dirty Rose are among my next purchases.

    10/19/13 at 3:36am

    hedonist222 said:



    My only gripe with the otherwise divine Une Rose is the ghastly amount of ISO E SUPER.


    Once you smell it, you can't unsmell it.

    10/19/13 at 3:40am

    hedonist222 said:



    Paestum Rose - eau d'italie

    It's not as rose centric as Une Rose but it's a very special rose perfume.

    10/19/13 at 4:18am

    hednic said:



    My favorite so far is Montale's Highness Rose Parfum. Have yet to find anything I personally am more enamored with as fr as rose goes.

    10/19/13 at 6:15am

    CapriDog said:



    My fav is Mon Nom Est Rouge by Majda Bekkali - dark, dusty, metallic , boozy rose

    10/19/13 at 7:21am

    cacio said:



    In general, I am not a big fan of most rose perfumes either, but sometimes it works well, especially in combination with other materials. I also often fail to detect rose in many perfume where it's supposedly used - for instance, like you, I don't find Egoiste rosy at all.

    Apart from the rose oud combos, I sometimes also go for the neon roses of the 80s, the big damascones. Few survive, there's Estee Lauder Knowing. In vintage, Sinan and Montana Parfum de peau. And then the near mythical Nombre Noir.

    I own and like Rosam, but to me the interesting part is that it has a very mineral rendition of oud that feels almost uncomfortable. As for Rose poivree, Tania Sanchez claims it has been reformulated, with the vintage smelling far dirtier. For a touch of dirt, more a raspy, vegetal dirt, I like Twill Rose by Rosine.

    cacio

    10/19/13 at 7:35am

    hedonist222 said:



    Other dark roses:

    rose de nuit serge lutens

    Rose en noir - Miller Harris : Briefly smelled this today. Opening was dark.

    10/19/13 at 11:35am

    mr. reasonable said:



    I lived at the top of Parnell in Auckland for while, around 1978/79, and some evenings would stroll down a side street that had an open air botanical garden - not that big, but well curated and full of interesting stuff. It was dusk, probably late summer, and I stopped to sniff the roses. I don't remember the botanical names but there was one that looked like the deep burgundy maroon one you feature above for Une Rose, and it completely floored me. It was THE rose. Dark, deep, a little dusky and shadowy, like it was withholding secret information about the elemental universe from me but not at all in a spiteful way, it was also offering an invitation, or at least throwing out a good natured challenge - how can you possibly express an experience like that in words?

    Anyway - to this day I have never smelled anything quite like it and while I have never had any great desire to actually smell like a rose, I have kept an eye out these last few years to see if any of the various fragrances we see discussed here 'measure up' so to speak.

    The first one that spoke to me was C&S 88. For some reason this stuck me immediately as 'dark', masculine and very English. It had some of the gravitas of THE Parnell rose, and I still enjoy wearing it very, very occasionally. It seems to be a black tie evening thing . . .

    And then I came across Une Rose. This one had life - it reached out of the nozzle, still damp with dew and straining to pull away from the soil. I was with a friend and we opted to buy one of the travel sets - she kept a couple, one is enough for me - it's there when I need to relive that burst of vital energy.

    There's one I remember Luca Turin describing as an angry Carmen reborn in New Jersey (or something similar) but I can't remember which one - must go back and have a look sometime.

    I bought Lyric Man & Woman when they turned up - Man has a slightly less austere Brit thing than 88 but retains the dressed for an evening mood, but Woman is quite special. It takes the idea of rose in another direction entirely that I really enjoy - 'jammy' makes sense, but not overly so, but it's sexy, compelling stuff. I had been discussing rose with a friend, the former Head of Fragrance at Guerlain here, over coffee after trying Nahema and Chamade Extrait and handed her Lyric Woman - it was really something to see her eyes open wide and her face light up. I must get around to trying the Extrait at some point.

    The coup de grace of that particular afternoon was Homage. I bought one of the earlier ones in the smaller white box and it qualifies as my 'transcendent rose'. One whiff and it's an azure sky streaked with a pinkish rose tinge . . . no words can do it justice.

    All that said, I don't think you need to necessarily track down the more exotic niche offerings to get a blast that moves you. A few years ago I was with some Sufi friends who visit Turkey every year or so and they passed around a simple bottle of rose water they had brought back from the trip to freshen up before meditation or zikr, a rose eau de cologne basically, and it was absolutely delightful - lighter, fresher, 'dewier' than the ones above, but a garden appeared on cue and you just felt like smiling and taking a deep breath, so mission accomplished.

    I have probably learnt more about roses from this fragrance world than from actually smelling the real things, which is sorta sad, but there you go. Look forward to others thoughts and suggestions . . .
    Edited by mr. reasonable - 10/19/13 at 12:16pm

    10/19/13 at 12:25pm

    rubegon said:



    Thanks for the comments and suggestions everyone!

    Generally speaking, I'm not interested in what your favorite rose is (no offense ;-) ).

    I'm interested in why you loveit. You don't have to be a professional critic or have a nose like a gas chromatograph - I'm not and I don't.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by timdoeswellView Post

    Dirty Rose is the most earthen of the lot, but despite the name it doesn't have lots of stank to it. It DOES, however, have a strange semi-sweet smell to it, like you're drinking some lovely rose and blackcurrant liqueur (I know there's no blackcurrant in there, but there's a juiciness that reminds me of this Latvian blackcurrant spirit called Black Balsam). It's really something special, and apparently he's considering bringing out the version of it that he was commissioned to make - with aoud and lots of dirty musk.

    You've got me interested in this now. I've seen Paul active on these boards, and have considered ordering a set of samples. I've hesitated because many times indie perfumers sound great to me, but then end up just not working for me. Also, I hate dealing with vials.

    I think I'll get a spray mini of this one. I wonder if he'll sell me one of the dirtier version. I should ask.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by hedonist222View Post

    My only gripe with the otherwise divine Une Rose is the ghastly amount of ISO E SUPER.


    Once you smell it, you can't unsmell it.

    Oh no! You're killing the love! And I don't the have the sampleanymore.

    It's ok. I need to go back to get another sample anyway. I wasn't going drop $330 on a bottle after one sniff on my hand. I'm not even very sure about what I wrote above because I wrote it from memory a couple of days later. Ididn't think to take notes while I was sniffing late at night.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hednicView Post

    My favorite so far is Montale's Highness Rose Parfum. Have yet to find anything I personally am more enamored with as fr as rose goes.

    This is a Paris exclusive? What doesit smelllike?

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cacioView Post

    Apart from the rose oud combos, I sometimes also go for the neon roses of the 80s, the big damascones. Few survive, there's Estee Lauder Knowing. In vintage, Sinan and Montana Parfum de peau. And then the near mythical Nombre Noir.

    I've started reading up on some of these. I have my eye on a bottle of Knowing, and I just picked up a vintageUngaro Diva on thecheap. I don't even want to know about Nombre Noir. If it turnedout to be my holy grail rose, I'd be crushed. Better not to know.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted bytimdoeswellView Post

    Rosamis something else. It boggles the mind that black aoud is the gold standard by which rose/aoud fragrances are judged. This has a much less abrasive (and yes, quieter) aoud than Montale's biting offerings, allowing the rose to shine through a lot more. The rose is deep and rich, like the blood-red petals of a rose juclass="