Basenote accord project

You are SO far beyond me I hesitate to respond... I can't add much, but I'm intrigued by what you're shooting for.

You can get the rectified birch tar oil and Cade oil at this site:

http://www.theeyeofnewt.com/

I haven't smelled unrectified birch tar oil so don't know if the phenolic component is less or more in the rectified, but rectified IS the way you want to go for fragrances.

A floral fragrance note that is supposed to go well with the smokey Birch tar is Cananga flower, but I don't have personal experience with it, so can't verify that.

Copaiba Balsam EO has a strong coumarin (hay) note in it, and is inexpensive as far as EO's go. I love this fragrance on its own, it's quite wonderful, but in a blend it's been a little difficult for me to meld in because of its balsam and hay quality. In a masculine accord it might work very well, though, for that slightly sweet, musty note.

Let me know what you end up with.
Kathy

So nice to see someone else interested in crafting their own fragrances. It's a lot more difficult to do than one would think after you get past the simple-combination phase. I think as you do, that the natural fragrances are best, but ran into the same problems - they don't open up quite like a fragrance with aldehydes, etc.
That's a problem shared by all natural perfumers to my knowledge. I think Lorenzo Villoresi has a fairly healthy compromise, based on the article about him on Basenotes.
I didn't realize you're in Australia - that makes the sharing of resource information more difficult but not the formulations, thank goodness. It's too bad we're not aiming for the same type of fragrance - I think our sharing would be more focused, but you sound like you have a lot of general knowledge about the process, which is what I'm still struggling with.
Have you tried the CO2's? I got Ginger CO2 from Eden Botanicals (another US firm, though I think they're excellent and economical - and one of the few EO retailers that offer SAMPLES of everything!) and it's very fresh and expansive. To my mind it's superior to ginger EO. I would like to try some more CO2's and see how they work in a blend.
If Cananga is anything like Ylang-Ylang it would be a difficult floral to control (I have that problem with Ylang all the time). So have you smelled Cananga? Is it similar to Ylang?
Somewhere, I believe I have a formula for an old time leather accord, based on natural products. I'll look for it - if I find it I'll let you know. I believe it is for the tobacco-leather as opposed to the floral-leather.
Yes, the rectified Birch Tar is MUCH easier to deal with. What base are you using - alcohol or oil? I'm sure you know, as I found out by miserable experience, that the resins can only be used in an alcohol base.
The cade oil is used very often in the leather accord, as it is in the Cuir de Russie by Chanel.
Where did you get Orris concrete? I haven't found a supplier - that must have been outrageously expensive. That might make a nice soft, rounded filler for the leather, subtle and intimate. I've never smelled real orris- I'm trying to imagine what sort of notes might be lurking there to bring out. That might prove an interesting combination - not exactly floral, but definitely softening and powdered.

A quick note - I have a wedding to prepare for.

I'm going to say a blasphemous thing...
What do you think of using actual perfumes in your mixes?
If you don't mind, check out this blog:

http://bananafishleaves.blogspot.com...n-leather.html

It is an interesting commentary about the Demeter line of leathers. The author's comment that she was anxious to try the Leather with their Wild Violet is following your line of thinking. Violet, of course, is very similar to, and supported by, orris.

I received a bottle of Lancome Aromatonic for a present, and find it annoying for some reason. But it's a green fragrance, so I kept it to use as a green note in my personal formulations, green being difficult to produce with EOs.

Am looking for the leather recipe. More later.

I've actually had some reasonable success by using Gendarme as a "base" for my experiments. So far nothing has turned out smelling like a passable cologne BUT they weren't as awful as they were when I didnt use it

most current attempt.

4 drops grapefruit

2 Muguet

1 Violette

2 Rosemary

1 Cardamom

3 Musk

approx 2 ML Gendarme

any suggestions? you guys seem way more knowledgeable than I am, Im just stabbing in the dark hoping for something to turn out.

My Oils "wardrobe"

Jasmine
Verbena
Oak moss
Vetiver
Grapefruit
Rosemary
Sweet Orange
Musk
Violette
Vanilla
Cedar Leaf
Lemon
Bergamot
Rosewood
Basilic
Cadramom
Ylang Ylang
Lavender
Patchouli
Sandalwood
Muguet
Ambergris

I'm pretty sure most of them are natural because theyre mostly essential oils with the exception of jasmine verbena violette and vanilla. Im pretty sure the ambergris is natural, it says natural on it (maybe we dont have that anti whaling import law in canada?).


I really dont know where to get any info on perfumery... ive searched the net and there isnt too much. I dont even know what an accord is (other than a dependable honda) . Even sites like chapters and indigo dont have much to offer as far as litterature goes. Where should I look to learn ?

I go to school at the university of ottawa, where I live, unfortunatley nothing there... could you maybe give me the names of some books you found usefull so I could look them up in online bookstores or try to order them ?

french books are okay as well I can understand it pretty well

I'm sorry it's taken a while to get back to you Yutori - actually the wedding wasn't mine, but a nephew's. To let you know, I'm not always consistently on the internet, as my primary residence is off the power grid, so if I don't respond for a while, it's because I don't have access.
I've been looking for that leather accord formula, and am concerned that I might have written it in a book I sent to the used book dealer. I hope not! I'll be very upset if that's the case.

For Czesc: the two natural perfumery books I started with were, as Yutori said, frustratingly limited, but I learned a great deal nevertheless. They were:

"Natural Perfumes: Simple Aromatherapy Recipes" by Mindy Green
"Perfumes, Splashes and Colgnes: Discovering and Crafting Your Personal Fragrances" Nancy Booth

This is where I got most of my information regarding crafting perfume. The first is good in that she has you make up the basic accords, as Yutori recommended. She also has you make up 15 classic 3-note combos, so you get an idea of the potential. I found the last exercise to be more helpful than I thought it would. It also shows you what your nose prefers. The most intriguing recipe was a chocolate scent created entirely with eo's (no chocolate fragrance), in which chamomile figures prominently. At first it is a wretched smelling mess, but after two weeks, voila... there it is - the chocolate note.
The second book straddles the fence between natural and synthetic perfumery, but gives you all sorts of basic recipes in the basic families. She also delves into the commercial realm a little more, discussing retail fragrances in a basic way.

Yutori, I'm unable to help much on a leather accord. I know it is based on the chypre accord, which is why your leather is tending in that direction. They always list bergamot in that accord - is it present in yours? While a top note, it is important also as a modifier and seems it would provide expansion, which you seek.
I have not understood the complex chemistry involved in blending. Many times a recipe will say to blend in the order given. While that should not matter logically, it seems to anyway. The citrus are supposed to be top notes, among the most ephemeral, yet I produced a fragrance last month where the orange eo was dominant in the final drydown, and long-lasting. And that was in competition with strong contenders, such as Frankincense, Myrrh and Vetiver. The orange was one of the first ingredients I mixed into a base maceration of Devil's Club oil I made. It was not a wise way to proceed, but I had experimented with this fragrance before, came up with a 'recipe', and from that recipe just started adding the eo's together indiscriminately. Did the order enhance the longevity of the orange note? I'm not sure - I'm still trying to puzzle it out. I know some commercial formulations have orange in the drydown, but I always assumed they used artificial enhancement. It may be that when you blend several eo's together and let them meld a bit, a bond is formed that goes beyond the simple top, mid and base note concept, and allows a top note to still have an active presence in the base. That is why I feel the bergamot may be an important part of the leather formula. What are your thoughts on that?
I know from making the basic 3-note combos mentioned in the book above, I didn't care for the ones involving carrot eo. I just didn't like its carroty, oily presence, but after about a month the carrot note melded with the other two, submerged, and became a musty pleasing counterpoint. But it took so long! I feel the same way about geranium eo, and it too takes almost as long to meld into a harmonious single note with its neighbors. Those two seem to take the longest to my nose. I don't care for either of them as a standout note in a fragrance, and was very sensitive to their presence until they yielded their individual identity.
Please let me know how your accord proceeds, and your thoughts on melding notes.
Also, have you checked out the online perfumery schools? Do you know much about them or heard how they might be?
Kathy

there's a guy in Thailand who runs online short courses.

http://www.perfumersworld.com/

He also gives out on his site a quite nifty bit of free software, which is probably quite useful as you can add formulae and other data to it (it already has a fair bit of data in it by way of ingreds)

Yutori check your email, :exclamation
but as for florals for your accord, ...lavender??? and def I would go for the Clary Sage as well.

Yutori-
The basic leather recipe I mentioned seems to be on walkabout with my book - I don't know if it will ever return to me. The one below is the only other leather one I have at present, and you may already have it.

LEATHER MUSK
18 drops light musk fragrance oil
12 drops vanilla
10 drops dark musk fragrance oil
2 drops virginia cedarwood
2 drops sweet orange
1 drop lemon
1 drop vetiver
5 drops clove
25 drops cade (10%)

I haven't tried this formula - I don't know if it's traditional or a fanciful interpretation. It does not mention the order to blend. I would have more confidence in it's leather note if it had been called Musk Leather instead of Leather Musk. I would also feel comfortable in reducing the musk.
I may have used the term maceration incorrectly - I soaked the bark of the Devil's Club root (Opopanax horridus in the ginseng family) in Jojoba oil for a month, leaching out the fragrance notes. When it was as strong as I desired, I strained it through a jelly bag to produce a scented oil. The bark color did leach into the oil, but I didn't consider that a negative - it produced an amber color on completion. It was into this base I added my eo's.
The reason I used this plant is that it has a heady, earthy, woodsy aroma in the forest, one of my favorite fragrances since I was a girl. The maceration smells very similar to the fresh plant. But it does have it's downside - you are reduced to making only oil perfumes with it, and it's active agents continue to bubble in the oil even after straining (it was used by the indigenous peoples as their primary treatment for external and internal infections, and also for it's spiritual properties, which are considered powerful). I purchased a small home distiller on ebay, and am looking forward to trying to distill the eo to get rid of the bubbling tendency (not attractive in a fragrance). I don't know how copious or sparse it will be at this point. I can send some of the maceration along to you if you'd like, or some eo (hopefully) later. Just PM me with your address.
I have been hoping to come up with several marketable local fragrances to sell in tourist shops under the banner of 'Alaskan fragrances'. I sampled a line several years ago in a gift shop, and was disappointed at how mediocre, synthetic and entirely unmemorable they were. But I thought the idea was good, so I've been working with blends for a little less than a year. I love fragrances, am fascinated by their ability to evoke, but my nose is unskilled and untrained, which is why I initially started investigating commercial fragrances, at which point I fell in love with them in general. When I get the fragrance right I will know it - I have a vision of it I'm just not sure how to get there.
I agree - it would be deeply satisfying to have a small niche perfumery, creating devastatingly evocative fragrances, a calling worthy of a lifetime, but it seems so far beyond anything I'll ever be able to do, because the business end of it is so huge and industrial, and complex. What with its heavy dependence on the chemical industry, it is very similar to an herbalist producing herbal products for the health food market as opposed to the giant pharmaceutical industry.
I really do think if one is serious about pursuing it as a profession, one has to bite the bullet, get the professional training, and then decide at that point which direction you want to go. So I don't feel I will go any further than marketing a local line (if that far).
I've been mulling over using whale oil as a fixative. Where I live seal and whale hunting used to be practised on a regular basis, and after hunting season, you had to throw your clothes away. No amount of washing would remove that iron-willed oil. There are several old drums of whale blubber/oil sitting back in the woods, and I always avoided them because they smelled like a fish cannery or worse. That smell has dissipated in recent years - I've heard it mellows when left for years, according to Yupik tradition. I'm thinking of going back and popping the lid on one, to see what the final product is. These oils have absolutely unparalled staying powers, but I don't read that the whale OIL was used in perfumery (ambergris isn't oil, but it also takes long aging to dissipate it's initially rank odor). Have you heard anything to the contrary? If it takes 25 years for whale oil to lose it's overpowering fragrance, perhaps it was abandoned in preference to more amenable substances. But maybe after all these years, it has become usable. Anyway, I'm mulling it over.
Lastly, the site I drool over most: http://www.profumo.it/perfume/home_english.htm

I just tried to make the leather accord with certain variations because of availability, i replaced cedarwood with rosewood and ommitted cade because I dont know what it is. Also, cloves became ambergris because I want a sweeter leather, and I tuned down the musk as you suggested. Could you please post some other accords? Just a few, so I can make a couple and see where this is going.

Cade oil is probably the most essential for a leather accord - it is the distillation of pine/juniper tar, and is strong and smoky. What you will get without it may be nice, but I can't imagine it will be a leather accord. Let me know what it ends up smelling like.
These recipes actually aren't accords, and are supposed to be stand-alone fragrances, but I think you could use them in the same way as an accord, as a starting point, because there isn't a lot of complexity in them.

AUTUMN
16 drops vanilla
8 drops sweet orange
2 drops clary sage
2 drops myrrh
2 drops vetiver
1 drop allspice
1 drop bay rum (pimenta)

CONIFER (masculine, woodsy-conifer, fresh herbal top)
8 drops oakmoss(10%)
6 drops cedarwood
6 drops juniper
6 drops petitgrain
3 drops anise
2 drops vetiver

BURNT VANILLA (dark, smoky, balsamic vanilla)
15 drops vanilla
2 drops balsam peru
2 drops patchouli
2 drops vetiver
1 drop virginia cedarwood
1 drop frankincense
1 drop labdanum
1 drop dark musk fragrance oil

FOREST (slightly sweet, woodsy-pine, masculine)
4 drops balsam peru
6 drops atlas cedarwood
6 drops patchouli
6 drops pine needle

SMOKE (earthy, slight herbaceous topnote, woody base)
8 drops sandalwood
6 drops atlas cedarwood
6 drops juniper
4 drops frankincense
4 drops myrrh
2 drops black pepper
2 drops pine needle

VERBENA LAUREL (spicy, sharp-sweet citrus top, woody bottom)
8 drops bay laurel
8 drops bergamot
5 drops virginia cedarwood
5 drops clary sage
4 drops rosewood
2 drops verbena
1 drop roman chamomile

SPICE (spicy, warm, sensual)
10 drops atlas cedarwood
8 drops sandalwood
6 drops lavender
4 drops coriander
2 drops frankincense

MASCULINE LAVENDER
14 drops lavender
5 drops sandalwood
4 drops atlas cedarwood
4 drops ginger
2 drops vetiver

thanks, this will really help me along I think. I think im going to have to grab a few more oils before I can make these. With regards to the cade oil do you think I could replace it with cedar tar ? I have alot of that, but its extremely strong - i dont know how it would go...

Also, has anyone taken a look at the chemicals on the www.perfumersworld.com website? they have a list of "chemical" fragrance oils for sale. The prices dont seem too bad? should I try and experiment with a few of these?

Hello Flathorn, Yutori, Czesc, S2Love:

Has anyone come across 'leather'?

Recently tried an 'incense'. Myrrh, frankincense, birch tar oil. Result: fair. Matter of adjusting the proportions.

Still haven't been able to make a satisfactory fabric softener. Well, not actually a fabric softener but something to put in the dryer to scent the clothes. Dampening a washcloth with straight formula before I further cut it with alcohol to make EDP, cologne or add to unscented soap, shampoo, conditioner, laundry detergent bases. Haven't tried it on anything but white loads. Any suggestions?

Czesc: Yes, I have doctored commercial frags. That is how I found Basenotes; I was frustrated that the only cologne I had ever worn had been irrepairably altered by its new manufacturer. My most amusing experiment was adding lime EO to make a 'summer version' of that same cologne for which the citrus-y type had been long discontinued. I was too naive to understand that it threw off the balance. Live and learn.

Tony

Here'a 'Russian Leather' from Gattefosse

Pyrogenous essence of Cedar 50
Wood complex 125
Clary sage oil 50
Bergamot oil 50
cinnamic alcohol 100
Geranyl acetate 70
Benzyl acetate 50
Isoeugenol 50
Eugenol 50
Terpineol 25
Geraniol 75
Citronellol 40
Ethyl vanillin 45
artificial amber 60
resinodour labdanum 130
musk ambrette 40
conc. castoreum 10
conc. civet 15

You could always substitute naturals for the synths (eg clove for eugenol, etc) if that's what you prefer.
I have various for Spanish Leather, too: the main characteristic of which seems to have been a lot of civet.

do you know where I can get any good books by Gattefosse? whats the title of this one that you got the Russian Leather formula from?

Hey guys, I'm a new member at basenotes and I'm pretty into fragrance blending. I use almost exclusively pure essential oils, and have a nice array of oils right now. Now, I'm not an expert, but I have a fair bit of experience, and I really look forward to chatting with other people that are into scent blending!

Yutori: If you're looking for florals to bring out or round out your leather, I would suggest labdanum/cistus/rock rose (call it what you will). It's a very nice floral that can be very feminine and delicate, but when blended with stronger and more masculine notes like leather, it wraps around quite nicely. Also, there's a balsamic tang to cistus that works I think quite beautifully with leather notes. Also, I find orange flower to be the ultimate unisex floral. Add a little sweetness with vanilla, benzoin, or other florals, and it's a lovely feminine fragrance. Add just a bit to sandalwood or musks and it is soooo sexyman 2-3 drops of orange flower with 7-8 sandalwood is a great scent for men, especially with a drop of ginger and/or cinnamon! And I think this would work very well as a sexy spicy addition to your leather.

Flathorn: You were talking about making a fragrance that had a lingering orange drydown. That sounds quite wonderful! While I've never done it before (must go home and try it now!), the theory works. Several oils, and I'm sure some synthetic compounds as well although I'm not very familiar with them, act as fixatives in blends. Most of them are considered basenotes on their own, but can be added at any point really to provide a fixative function. Valerian and vetiver are two examples of good fixatives, and patchouli is a fairly good one as well, especially for middle and top notes. I like using a drop of fixative or so for each layer, top heart and base.

Hope this helps!

~Silver

I find it funny how we share information so freely, when I use to think of perfumery, I always though of it as... like a secret alchemy where all formulas were kept under lock and key. welcome to globalization!

Thanks so much S2L!

Now, to decipher a few of those synthetics in the formula - I *think* I have enough literature to do so, or information on the Perfumer's World website and others.
By all means, give the Spanish Leather if you have it - it will be a good database for those looking. I agree with Czesc - there's an inordinate amount of secrecy surrounding perfumery, though I understand why it has to be.
[smiley=tongue.gif]

I've heard of Gattefosse's book, but didn't think it was obtainable. Good stuff!

You *do* have a fair amount of experience. It's so nice to have others give you the benefit of it.
That's a good idea to add the fixative to *each layer*. When I make some Devil's Club eo, I'm going to mix the eo's in a more traditional order this time - bases first, then heart notes, and finally top notes. If it does make a difference, I consider it a valuable lesson. I didn't consider D.C. might have fixative properties, and influenced the first eo's I mixed with it.
So glad to have you around!

Kathy

Awww...*blushes*

I hope it turns out well for you! Perfume blending is just so much fun.

~Silk

czesc, flathorn, I got the Gattefosse book out of a library- it's quite old. The details are:
"Formulary of Perfumery and Cosmetology" a transation by A.R.I.C. of the original french edition of Formulaire de Parfumerieet de Cosmetologie by R.M.Gattefosse
This translation is published by Leonard Hill Ltd, London in 1957, but I guess the original french version is older still. He cites several other authors in ging his formulae, including Felix Cola, and W.A Poucher. I got Poucher's out too _volumes 1 and 2 are all perfumery and vol 3 is other cosmetics.

Poucher's is fantastic, and I believe is still in print, but expensive !!! (saw it on amazon). These old perfumery books are rare as hen's teeth, but still worth searching for second hand on Amazon I think. ALso Amazon has a couple of modern ones which look really good:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...04604?v=glance
and
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...books&st=*

the first one looks great for price, and also you can 'search inside the book', for a limited number of pages. I would say get a screen capture program on your computer before you do as you can't save the images of pages any other way.

BTW I have found Poucher's in more than one library so that's a start if you can't buy.

OK the Spanish Leathers are from another book, which gives tables of several formulae at once so you can compare them and see what they have in common.
They all have a lot of Tinc Castoreum, (50-270 parts per 1000, seems to be major in all formulae, average 250 pp 1K))
Tonquin Musk, Civet abs, Sandalwood, Bergamot, Neroli, Orange Flower, Rose Oil, Musks Ambrette & Ketone, Tonka Abs, Coumarin,
and they all have rect Birch Tar oil but in tiny quantities 3-5 parts per 1000.

the following ingreds vary across the formulae
Patchouli, Jasmine,Cassia, Orris, Methyl Ionone special, Tolu, Styrax,Peru, Vanilla, vanillin, Ylang, Vetivert,Vet acetate, Clove, Mace lemon, Lavender, Petitgrain, Clary, Estragon, Verbena, various aldehydes, Opoponax, Guaiacwood, Amyl salicylate, Heliotropin, and only one has Oakmoss, 10 pp 1000.

Silk - The Spanish Leather does seem to have more animalic notes. It's great to have both formulae - I can't wait until weekend to try them *both*! I'm a real pig about things I love to do, and go overboard. Thanks so much.
A question - Do you know any fragrances that has the Spanish Leath. in it? I just tried Chanel's "Cuir de Russie" last week and was extremely disappointed (to say the least) when it turned to cow patties on my skin. The most tortuous part was when I opened the sample and the first 10 seconds on my skin, it had a wonderful sexy, smooth, leathery note I could fall in love with. I don't know which note turned on my skin - I assume castoreum or civet. But I've never had that strong a cow dung note before, and have worn perfumes with castoreum and civet, so I really don't know. The Spanish leather has *more* of the animalics, so I'm both curious and apprehensive.
I'd love to be able to create that sexy leather of C. de R. without the dry heaves.
I hope my library has copies of Gattefosse, but am not confident it does - it's not that big or old.
The P.H. Pybus book on Amazon 'The Chemistry of Fragrances' comes with a positive Amazon review by Luca Turin! That's good enough for me.
The Caulkin one, 'Perfumery: Practice and Principles' sounds wonderful, but the price does make me wince a little.
I've been eyeing the Perfume Makers website since I found it yesterday. I'm seriously considering buying his book, but it's a lot of money, and the rhetoric has a bit of the hard sell, so I'm still just looking. He says you're assured of success, and I don't know that I trust that.... but I *am* curious about the free perfume. I may not be able to resist seeing what sort of stuff they came up with.

-Kathy-

Actually I should have said the Spanish Leather formulae were given as "Peau d'Espagne" in that book. It mentions that they are "now out of favour", being older types (not that that would put ME off LOL)
if you do a google search on Peau d-Espagne you will find versions (colognes) Â*were made by Houbigant, Roger& Gallet and others, late 19th C and early 20th C. The idea seems to have come from this stuff, which was used to fragrance writing paper, gloves, etc.

Peau d-Espagne, or Spanish Skin.
Is merely highly-perfumed leather. Take of oil of rose, neroli, and santal, each 1/2 oz.; oil of lavender, verbena, bergamot, each 1/4 oz.; oil of cloves and cinnamon, each 2 drs. In this dissolve 2 oz. of gum benzoin; in this steep good pieces of waste leather for a day or two, and dry it over a line. Prepare a paste by rubbing in a mortar 1 dr. of civet with 1 dr. of grain musk, and enough gum tragacanth mucilage to give a proper consistence. The leather is cut up into pieces about 4 inches square; two of these are pasted together with the above paste, placed between 2 pieces of paper, weighted or pressed until dry. It may then be inclosed in silk or satin. It gives off its odor for years; is much used for perfuming paper.

this thread gets the most traffic so I might as well ask here, does anyone know where I can get tuberose EO ?

Libertynatural.com

On the sidebark, click on Bulk ingredients -> absolutes and there will be two tuberoses, one from india and one from egypt. The egyptian is slightly cheaper, but both are quite expensive. Of course, it gets cheaper as you buy more, but the egyptian tuberose for example is $13 for 2.3 mls, and the indian is about $16 for the same amount. However, I doubt you'll find them for less than liberty sells...for the same quality oils, they're quite cheap! One thing to keep in mind: they sell in bulk. You don't have to buy a lot of each oil, but if you buy less than $50 total, there's a surcharge of like $15. It's not hard to buy more than $50 from them though, they have just about every EO or absolute or CO2 distilled you could want! They also have carriers oils, bottles, and distillate waters (also known as hydrosols)

Naturesgift.com also sells it. They're a much more customer friendly site, but pretty darn expensive! They also have less selection. They only sell one tuberose absolute, from morroco, at $60 per ml! I honestly do not think there's much of a difference in quality at all, Of the oils I have tried from both places, I find them on average to be of equal quality. I personally find liberty's orange flower absolute to be superior. But then again I have not tried naturesgift's tuberose, and I'm currently out of liberty's.

~Silk

absolutes are much stronger than EO's right? how would I dilute it back down to EO strength so I could use it in my blends (im only using EO's and I want to keep track of how much im using for the formulas)

To be honest you're thinking about it in the wrong way.

Absolutes will capture the fragrance better than an EO. Certain organic solvents are used that best preserve the fragrant molecules. EO's, the other hand, are soley from steam distillation. More molecules are lost this way. That's why you get hydrosols, which is the water left from that steam distillation, that smell nice and have their own properties.

Most valuable and expensive substances will be extracted using solvents, giving absolutes. They're worth it! Sometimes, other things like vanilla that are less expensive will be as well to produce stronger scents for perfumers. But most of the times, it's expensive florals, like rose, tuberose, jasmine, lotus, orange flower, and osmanthus. In fact, you'd be hardpressed to find many of these in EO form. The most notable exceptions wold be rose and orange flower, or as in it's EO form it's more often called neroli. These are available for the theraputic value of the natural and whole product, without solvents. Those looking for the theraputic use of such oils, especially if they're to be taken internally!, should get EO's, whereas the perfumer should definitely choose the absolute.

Alright, now about strength. Each oil naturally has it's own differences in strength. For example, ginger or cinnamon EO will be soooo much stronger than even the strongest jasmine absolute...use sparringly! There is a difference in strength btwn rose absolute and rose EO, but it's not even double the strength. It depends on the specific plant, the batch, the distiller, and the supplier, but I'd say an absolute is on average 20-30% stronger than its EO counterpart. There's no need to dilute, really. Just remember how many drops, and remember that it was the absolute you used. For most high end florals, I highly doubt you'll ever use EO's anyway, and I recommend that if you have a choice that you don't.

Good luck, and happy mixing!
~Silk

Wow, that seems insanely expensive. Im trying to work a rose blend into another blend which is loosely based on that first leather note you gave. "Musky leather" i think it was called. How much of this Rose absolute should I be using?

also... does anyone have any good forumlas for a "tea note" ?

Can you help me start my own nose adventure? I have just bought some eo and I am trying to create my first perfumes. I put some drops of some of them into dark bottles, waited for a week and checked what they smelled like (on blotters). Some seem promising, some horrible.
What should I do next? Can I now add some more drops to the same bottles to try to make the first versions sound better? Will the time that passed between the moment of original mixing and the moment of adding new drops change the smell of the final recipe? If so, should I perhaps start every new attempt in a brand new bottle?! (That would cost much, for I am certainly not a perfume genius and the attempts will be numerous).
How long should I wait until the mixture is ready? When can I mix it with alcohol?

Another question - I would like to create some feminine, flowery fragrance - but rose, jasmin, neroli and iris are at the moment too expensive materials for me. Are there any inexpensive nice flower eo? I do have ylang ylang and I do have geranium (the latter I do not particularly like as a flower fragrance - what should I link it with?).

Thanks for your patience for the perfumer baby!
Ola

For the leather note you might want to incorporate a little castoreum tincture with birch tar, its the classic leather base. Tincture or tincture kits can be purchased from profumo.it. Alternatively, there seem to be a fair few Americans (not sure about Scandinavians and Russians) on the posts here - is beaver hunting popular? Â*

Re canaga oil: it is the same plant as Ylang Ylang as far as I am aware. The principle difference is that Essensial Oil of Ylang Ylang is a fractionated product (types 1-3 being the least to most volatile oils Â*- all 3 are mixtures of the same chemical components, but in differing proportions. The 3 different oils are not entirely different chemicals, the process is not that accurate - unlike commercial petrochemical fractionation) Canaga is not fractionated but a straight steam extraction whole shabbang.

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year :-*

Just noticed I'd inadvertently skipped loads of posts that make mine unnecessary, still an opportunity to wish all you fellow voluptuaries season's greetings. :

Hello all, anyone ever tried costus root for leathery note?