Cancer?

Can you post the link on Wikipedia?

Haha i asked an assistan to smell xtina's new fragrance he said it got recalled due to cancerous ingredients. I believed him at first...

I would say the risk is negligible. You're more likely to get cancer from sun exposure. Even then, you're more likely to die from a heart attack, and even then, you're still more likely to die in a car wreck. Live the life of the ataraxic. It's much more enjoyable.
- Rich

It is common medical knowledge that most, if not all, people who die of natural causes have cancer in some form. Get over it and enjoy your days.

How sick am I of people constantly worrying about the 'health risks' of fragrance, get over it. I have asthma, very bad asthma, and my attacks have not been brought on by fragrances. As a side note, almost all of my fragrances are older/vintage, which means they have lots of the supposed bad 'raw' materials in them; civet, musk, oppoponax, coumarin, etc...

I think people should worry more about the risk of skin cancer. Does everyone wear a healthy dollop of sunscreen 15 -30 daily, probably not, but they should.

For the love of all that is holy, can we not enjoy anything any longer?

I wish fragrance would be left well enough alone,; no reformulations, no 'bad' ingredient lists, just leave it alone.

I know this topic is awful (it is psychological terrorism), but I think it is important that the governmental agencies regulate what goes into the perfumes. The agencies should worry, so that us,customers, will not have to worry.

Lucius

.

Probably, but you have to die of something. Probably increases your risk of death as much as smoking 12 cigarettes in your lifetime.

My brother died of cancer last year and rarely wore any fragrances. As Joe Jackson sang, "everything gives you cancer, there's no cure and no answer".

My wife died of lung cancer two years ago, and all she did fragrance-wise was mist a little perfume (Jo Malone Lime Basil Mandarine, 24 Fauburg or Cristalle) and walk into the cloud. She didn't even do that every day. She did smoke a little bit before I met her: a couple when out for drinks with her pals, amounting to perhaps two packs a year. She started doing that at age 25 and stopped when she was 31 (when we met).

She died at the age of 42.

I will never understand why she got cancer at all - and especially why she got the particular type of cancer that she did. But I don't think it had anything to with her perfumes.

PS By the way, I have seen conflicting evidence about the use of chemicals in cosmetics and scents. A UK TV show recently presented pretty good evidence that they do affect you, while last week's (London) Sunday Times' Natural Health column seemed to acknowledge that you absorb so little through your skin that it really doesn't matter what you put on it.

While I'm sure it does increase one's chances slightly, there are many other things to worry more about. Someone who worries about cancer from perfume while carrying around and extra 30 or 40 pounds is being a bit ludicrous. You've got to get your priorities in order when it comes to what to worry about.

Hell, vegetable oil breaks down at frying temperatures into carcinogenic substances. Every time you eat something fried you're exposing yourself to far more carcinogens than in a sprits or two of perfume (which, when considering the dilution rate amounts to what.. 0.05 ml of actual chemicals or so?). I wouldn't worry about it too highly. I think if anything, the assault on the lungs, nose and brain can be more troublesome, especially when people overspray and are enveloped in a huge cloud of scent.

Indeed, all terrorism should be state sponsored.

You mean it isn't all ready?

Occasion for one of the biggest "Touchè!"s of all time.

The plasticizer chemicals called "pthalates" used to denature the alcohol in many perfumes are a real health concern, but not so much for cancer. They can "bio-accumulate", or build up in the body tissues over time and can potentially cause endocrine problems and male hormonal issues, especially in young children/babies. It would take a long time for that to happen, but it's still a concern.

Many fragrance companies are discontinuing the use of pthalates in their fragrances for that reason, just to be safe.

Andy Tauer and Le Labo are among the perfumeries that don't use pthalates due to the health concerns. L'Artisan is also starting to phase them out.

The scents I wear on a regular basis are pthalate free (I usually ask the companies), but I don't mind wearing any fragrance from a sample vial here and there.

scientists also say lipstick, diet coke, french fries, cell phones and sweetner give you cancer also....sooooo i guess everything in massive doses could cause cancer, but if one worries about every little thing, life would not be worth living. I would worry more about cigarette smoke than cologne or perfume.

It may seem that I'm singling you out here, but I promise, I'm not. I very much agree with your last two statements.

It's the red one that I disagree with.

Most sunblocks only partly block UVA rays. UVB rays are the cancer causing ones. Further, the body's natural protection from UVB rays is it's own natural melatonin, production of which is stimulated by UVA rays. UVA rays are the ones that cause sunburn, yes, but can only cause cancer through indirect chemical paths.

Moral of the story is this: Sunblock reduces your chances of getting sunburned. It lengthens the amount of time you can spend out in the sun (which increases your exposure to UVB, and hence increasing the probability of getting skin cancer), and decreases your exposure to UVA (Which decreases your production of melanin, hence increasing your exposure to UVB, which increases the probability of getting skin cancer).
Yes, I just said that sunblock increases the probability that you will get skin cancer. Stop worrying, people. You'll never figure out the right way to do it anyways.
- Rich

Well, when you look at the skin cancer rates for some tribes indigenous to africa who spend many hours in the sun.. and realize they are ridiculously low, you realize that sun exposure alone is not the primary or only factor. A catalyst, yes, but only that, unless you are getting severely burned on a regular basis.

Everything causes cancer. Everyone dies. If you're going to get cancer and die from something, it might as well be fragrance.

Well - as someone said (Can't recall)
"Despite thousands of years of research, and untold amounts of wealth spent, the survival rate for life sticks stubbornly at zero."

What a cheerful thread!

That quote might be Edward Norton in Fight Club.

So why worry

Fragrances contain dozens, if not hundreds, of ingredients. What specific ingredient concerns you?

I don't know if wearing cologne everyday can give you cancer, and frankly I don't care. As long as i'm not spraying fissioning U-235 all over myself, a bit of cologne won't give me cancer that easily, stepping out in sunlight without sunscreen and going in smokey atmospheres is probably 10x worse, so don't worry about it. And enjoy

Actually my mom worked at the Mass General Hospital in Boston for the past 25 years, and I have spoken with some of the top dermatologists about this; I worked in cosmetics and wanted fact as opposed to pr crap from the cosmetic co. Every doctor I spoke with said the same thing; using SPF daily reduces ones chance of skin cancer. Now the active ingredient in prescription, or doctor sold SPF, is Mexoryl SX; now available over the counter in the sunscreen from La Roche Posay's Anthelios line. I had also spoken to many clients of mine who had made it through a fight with melanoma, and they have to wear SPF 50 daily. I also knew 5 friends who went down to Australia, to study abroad, and they had to wear Bullfrog SPF 50++ daily. And melanin is not a defense, per se, it is the warning sign that the skin is becoming damaged.
My apologies to all for rambling on, but I do not want people to take lightly the importance of SPF. It is a very preventative measure to use daily to protect from skin cancer.

Just to clarify,
UVA rays are actually the rays that cause the breakdown of elastin and collagen in the skin, they cause premature aging and exacerbate free radical damage.
UVB rays are the rays that cause the production of melanin to increase, the lead to burning.
UVC rays are carcinogenic; they are sterilizing rays that can kill small organisms. They should be absorbed and neutralized by the ozone layer. But because of the diminished and compromised ozone layer these rays are now able to quite easily reach the earths surface, therefore causing skin cancers.
The only chemical that is known to block UVC rays is, Terephthalylidene Dicamphor Sulfonic Acid or under the trade name I mentioned prior, Mexoyl SX

So everyone please protect your skin, my aunt had skin cancer and it is most unpleasant.

I must respectfully disagree with some of these statements.

UVA cause melanin production, and the aging of skin as you mentioned. I was incorrect in stating they cause sunburn, furthermore, UVA is thought to be the cause of most cancer, not UVB. I know I stated the opposite, but I'm cleaning up my writing as we go along. Melanin is thought to be the body's natural protection against skin damage, though most doctors will agree that the best tan is no tan, as you are reducing your exposure to all UV rays, and that is the most effective way to reduce your chance of skin cancer. "epidemiologic studies indicate that pigmentation in humans with darker skin provides protection against melanoma" If you don't start out with dark skin, you're not going to get much help from melanin, studies suggest. http://www.nature.com/jid/journal/v1.../5600157a.html

UVB cause cancer, but are effectively stopped by most sunscreen, as this is the ray that causes sunburn, not UVA (which is what I said at first, doh!). UVB is responsible for the production of Vitamin D, a key nutrient in warding of cancer. http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...toryId=4681956. "This risk modelling, in which the UVB exposure plays an important role, appears to be accurate in the case of nonmelanoma skin cancers; however, for the less frequent, but most aggressive melanoma, it must be regarded with some reservations as other inducing factors, especially UVA radiation, should be considered."... "Moreover, UVA exposure may be increasing due to the use of UVB sunscreens with high protection factors and modern tanning equipments."

"In recent years, however, it has become apparent that a different form of ultraviolet light, called UVA, may be even more important in causing some skin disorders. Although experts still believe that UVB is responsible for much of the skin damage caused by sunlight -- especially sunburn -- UVA may be an important factor in photoaging and skin cancers. Most sunscreens do a good job blocking UVB, but fewer sunscreens filter out most of the UVA, so they do not help to prevent the beginnings of melanoma formation." http://healthlink.mcw.edu/article/964647970.html
"Most sunscreens do not protect the skin from the longer UVA wavelengths. And that may be critical to the creation of skin cancer."
"... But using sunscreen did not reduce the risk of developing melanoma or basal cell carcinoma."
" UVA in particular triggers the release of the brown pigment melanin from melanocytes; while UVB mostly triggers de novo production. This tan helps to block UV penetration and prevent damage to the vulnerable skin tissues deeper down."
It appears that the most dangerous form of skin cancer is caused by UVA exposure, and that you are more at risk if you spend longer amounts of time out in the sun, which happens if you are wearing sunscreen, rather than knowing your limits. The best tan is no tan... unless you're young and stupid. Like me. Scientists estimate that 1 in 7 Americans will have had skin cancer by the time they die. Yikes.
- Rich

lol should this topic be moved to Off Topic?

We seemed to have digressed from the topic of fragrance, and are now talking about sunscreen.

Speaking of sunscreen, I really like Creed Virgin Island Water and Bond No.9 Fire Island.

Ugh - where to start... or whether to start at all...

I'm not an oncologist, but I am a chemist, and I do worry sometimes about the daily application of chemicals on my skin, many of which have probably not been thoroughly tested for carcinogenicity. But as many have already stated, it's very difficult to establish a definite link between such things as long-term application of fragrance and cancer. Perhaps science will someday establish such links, but until then it's a crap shoot. In the end, it comes down to percentages, i.e. you may live x% longer if you play it safe in everything you do. Is it 5% or 50%?

I recently heard a routine by a clever stand-up comic who said that smoking may shorten your life, but at least it shortens the worst part of it.

The moral of the story? Less is more. Wear cologne in moderation.

And only wear Creed.

who knows... but... by applying too much sunscreen also may cause skin cancer...after all you are applying a chemical on your skin which doesn't even evaporate like a fragrance does

They are discontinuing use of pthalates because consumers are asking them to do so, safety has nothing to do with it.

The pthalate issue is so overstated. There's more estrogenic activity in a quart of soymilk than in a quart of Shalimar. I get a kick out of people who go all in a tizzy about pthalates and other "xenoestrogens", when by far the biggest source of dietary xenoestrogens (in both quantity and potency) are the soy isoflavones.

Pthalates are useful for the same reason that musks are, they are sticky yet odorless molecules that retard the evaporation of more volatile fragrance elements.

Reading some of these threads has reduced my lifespan.

TNMA

I don't eat soy for that reason either (it's vastly overeaten in the West -- traditionally, in the East, it's eaten in very small quantities... except by Buddhist monks who want to intentionally kill their libido). But the problem with pthalates is that they bio-accumulate, whereas soy isoflavones do not. The body has the means to digest and dispose of natural xenoestrogens, but not so much for chemical ones. They can build up in the body and cause an accumulated effect.

Safety does have something to do with why they're being removed from perfumes, by the way. Many pthalates are banned (or will be soon) by the European Union.

Perhaps it's overstated by some, but I'd rather not expose myself to many hormonal chemicals. Pthalates included.

"most people slap on a dab of perfume or cologne containing highly toxic cancer-causing chemicals. In a laboratory analysis, one popular perfume was found to contain more than forty chemicals classified as hazardous to the liver, and yet the FDA still does not require perfume manufacturers to warn consumers about the toxic chemicals found in their products."

http://www.naturalnews.com/001061.html

Before everyone jumps all over that reference, it was just one out of many.

For the collective brains out there that think / claim that "everything causes cancer" should have more information and less speculation. Also, most people do not die of cancer.

Hair dyes were known to cause cancer in animals years ago (this was actually discussed in my first year university course many moons ago by the professor) but there was no way to do the same kind of tests on humans because you can't use humans as test subjects.

It is through discussion and exploration that we learn, denial without any basis achieves nothing - oh wait, the earth is flat

Discuss


FYI A little know tidbit is cigarettes were actually recommended by some doctors in the 60's to pregnant women to calm their nerves.

I kinda feel depressed now...

This thread should have just stayed dead.

I'm all for being an informed consumer, but really dislike inflammatory, old (article is from 2004) news from unsupported, uncited sources with their own agenda.

This comes up all the time on cosmetics forums. Yes, ingredients in the products can have a negative effect on health. Yes, we're using them. But you have to look at a number of factors before you can even begin to link "OMG CHEMICALS" with "OMG DEATH". When JAMA or NEJM publishes a credible study that directly links wearing perfume with cancer causation, I'll begin to think about it more seriously.

If you want to worry about something, the air you breathe, the amount of exercise you get, and the food you eat have a bigger impact on overall health (or lack thereof).


I really think there are two kinds of people (to overly generalize an already overly generalized subject): those who think that the enjoyment of life is tantamount to an invitation to death; and those who enjoy life.

Getting cancer is something you are predisposed to at birth. Your DNA is either wired to get it or not regardless of your exposure to carcinogens.

I'll agree with Hoos - at least partly. There doesn't seem to be any credible scientific studies linking fragrance to cancer. You can also do a search of PubMed.gov for more info - it's a directory of hundreds of respected journals.

Of course, as someone else mentioned, we're talking about hundreds of substances that would need to be tested. At the moment, there seems to be little or nothing to worry about.

That said, I love the rationalization of some of the responses - it's like listening to a bunch of smokers: "Who cares if it may cause cancer - everything causes cancer and you could die any minute, so enjoy!" Yes, you can have my fragrance when you pry it from my cold, cancerous hands.Not that it causes cancer. That we know of.

Now excuse me while I freshen up with a spritz of Heritage.

The entry in Wikipedia that started this whole thread was nothing but unsubstantiated fear mongering and has now been removed from the Wikipedia Perfume entry.

Your skin is the 1st line of defense and provides innate immunity against pathogens. There are known chemicals that can cross this barrier and these are the ones you need to be afraid of. If in doubt, wear the fragrance on your clothes.

A half truth could be a full lie. Come off of it Mike . Honestly.

I feel OK about the cancer and perfume thing. I'll rely on education and knowldege, health journals, government reports and all. But otherwise, I would not get too paranoid about it. Just like with what you eat and drink.
I'm really more concerned about the lives of others ( around the globe ) than mine.

How right you are!

Still, in the interests of Science I found this link: http://www.facade.com/tarot/

Given the nature of the subject I chose The Lovecraft Deck to ask if fragrances are safe.

( If you don't know who H.P. Lovecraft was, he did die of cancer, though I doubt he ever used frags.)

Damn! If you REALLY don't know who he was, I'm sorely tempted to tell you that he wrote books on positive thinking---

In any case, behold The Answer (From a one card reading) :

" A sexy and exciting person, obsessed with style and outward appearance",

Clearly spot on, as this describes 90+% of Basenoters.

The augury continued with:

" Overconfident in their abilities, and foolhardy in their actions"

Yes, but no reference to medical side effects. However, the warning should be taken seriously: First of all, do NOT hit on hot babes when they are with their jealous husbands, even if you are wearing Green Irish Tweed.
Furthermore, do not spend your rent money on fragrances, even if they are Creeds.

Finally, a dire assesment:

" A hot temper and domineering nature, coupled with a love of false drama and all things theatrical."

The first part ( hot temper) warns us against Minotaure, Roma, Peau d' Espagna--in short, all fiery scents. Note that most are made by Spanish or Italian houses. There has been talk that Luca's book overly favors the subtle French houses. This may be why . . .

The second part (domineering nature) implores us to refrain from Vintage Tabarome, Dunhill '34, Penhaligon's Blenheim Bouquet and any other arrogant frag that leads us towards contempt for the Sephora/Shopping Mall/ Acqua crowd or otherwise kick plebeians with steel toed boots.

The final oracle (false drama and all things theatrical) puts a curse on MKK--and all of Serge Lutens. No cancer involved but may you find yourself in a duel ( sexy+foolhardy) with a jealous husband whom you felt slighted you (hot temper) by playing Russian Roulette in front of the wife ( How theatrical can you get?)

---------------

There, I hope I've added a couple of years to your lives.

And remember that, as a wise man once said,

" Live each day as if it were your 40th birthday. "

Cheers,

Mario