Calling the exercise Gurus...

For one thing, you can't target the areas at which fat are burned, which is annoying as there are areas where fat is predominantly stored! Cardio is a good way to go if lifting heavy weights would cause you discomfort. Building muscle mass also helps, as each pound of muscle burns another 50 calories a day just for maintenance, really. As your legs are your biggest muscle group, they're the ideal place to build muscle. Bicycling would be a safe bet in my opinion.

if you can find a gym that teaches Muay Thai or Kickboxing, it'll torch the fat off you if you eat properly...

Two lbs a week should be no problem and you'll tone up fast.

Swimming is the best if you need something really low impact.

What's your diet look like?

Ballet!~

It may not be fun but I suggest HIIT, or high intensity interval training along with weight lifting so you can lose fat and maintain the muscle you have. A good example of a HIIT workout is to sprint all out for 20 secs and then rest 10 secs then repeat 8 times. It doesn't sound like much but trust me it isnt fun.

That would be a good base and then you can start running intervals of 50m and resting for 30secs. Once you get a bit more wind in your lungs you can start increasing the distance of the interval and dereasing rest period.

The main reaosn I suggest HIIT instead of conventional LSD, long slow distance, running is that it has been shown to increase your metabolism throughout the day and burn fat even after you stop working. On the other hand with LSD the minute you stop working out so does the fat burning.

If you want any more info I'd be glad to help so just hit me up with a PM.

I agree with thaifighter's recommendation.

I lost a ton of weight (around my midsection, but really...all over) from starting a boxing class at my gym twice a week, supplimenting it with a resistance exercise one day a week also = 3 days of exercise.

In addition, I watched what I ate keeping it high in protein, good fats and good carbohydrates. The diet plan I did religiously years ago (The Zone) taught me a lot about balancing protein, carbs and fat in each and every meal I ate. There's others (South Beach Diet, blah blah blah) but it's mostly about eating LESS and working out MORE.

Other tips for losing:

- Drink atleast 8-10 glasses of water a day - MORE if you start boxing
- Stop eating after 8:00 at night - this is REALLY hard to do, but it really helps you burn fat
- 5 to 6 small meals thru the day instead of 3 meals a day
- Get a workout partner
- Give yourself a goal - if you do X work out X times a week for 1 month, you can buy a new bottle of some fragrance you've been wanting. If you don't meet your goal, you can't buy the fragrance.
- Get atleast 8 hours sleep - if you're boxing this should be easy, cause you'll be exhausted.
- When in public, walk. Take stairs, not elevators. Park in the farthest parking spot when you go to a store, so you have to walk.

Good luck Dimitri!

I'm no excersize guru...but I would like to suggest something I personally find important.

As you begin your excersize program (after the initial soreness of wakeing up sleepy muscles) observe your body's health and strength improving. Take time to appreciate the benefits of excersize...like how it makes you feel good, sleep better, have more energy throughout the day, gain strength, etc....

You will certainly feel the effects of your efforts before you see them. I've been working on the old bod now for about 8 weeks, and I feel terrific ~ and ~ am starting to look better too! Whatever routine you adopt, stay with it, you can only improve!

I used to run but now due to increasing problems with my asthma I am unable to. Now I am really into spinning. I totally lose track of time while I am in spinning class so it is like running in that respect. I do not believe anyone can successfully lose weight with out some type of weight training program. Lucky for you your a man so with a few diet modifications, some type of cardio and weight training you should be able to drop weight quickly.

A lot of good advice given. The last thing I'd mention is to really watch the diet. You're going to be eating more to replace some of the calories you burn while working out. Diet is the key to losing weight, while exercise is the key to getting in shape (those two do not always come as a pair, sadly.)

Get a George Foreman indoor grill if you don't have one (or something similar) so that you can quickly and easily cook up things like boneless skinless chicken breasts, turkey burgers, etc. And get rid of the junk food in the house. If it's not there, you can't eat it. All the working out in the world will not show results if you dont' watch your diet too - sure, you'll feel better, and you WILL be in better shape, but that doesn't mean you can't still have a layer of fat covering it all.

Yes, well I saw some photos of myself in a bathing suit in Maui not long ago, and the vision was even more horrible than usual. So...

In an effort to trim down by 15 lbs or so, I'm reducing my intake to 1000 cal. below my daily caloric needs. That degree of calorie reduction leads to an approximate weight loss of 2 lbs per week. I've also gone back to biking for at least an hour every day, which burns an addiitonal 400 - 500 calories. So far it's 3 weeks and 7 pounds. Once I get down to my desired weight, I'll begin to alternate between biking and the gym to maintain my muscle mass.

Here are some of my tricks for keeping the calories down:

Several small meals per day. I don't allow myself to get ravenous at any point, since that gets me to overeating.

Log my caloric intake daily.

Eat two stalks of celery before I eat anything else at lunchtime.

Limit snacks to fruit or raw vegetables.

Measure out quantities of food, and put a portion in a bowl or on a plate. If I start to eat anything out of the bag or the box, I'm likely as not to keep eating until the package is empty. If I still want more after I finish my portion, I have to take the effort to refill the plate, and that in turn reminds me of just how much I'm eating.

Use a small plate, so it looks like I'm getting a larger portion (This only works if, like me, you're somewhat idiotic.)

Cut my food into small pieces, which makes me eat more slowly.

Pull out that picture of myself in the bathing suit. It's usually enough to shame me into exercise or abstinence from food.

This is all really excellent advice. I wouldn't call myself an exercise guru, but I have worked out all my life (ran track, played soccer, and swam on the school team) and maintained pretty good shape. The key is simple, eating right (no high fructose corn syrups, hydrogenated oils, "bad carbs", etc.) and maintaining a regular workout/cardio routine. Like noted above, you can't target fat loss in certain areas, but if you focus on building muscle, while at the same time eating foods that 1) promote muscle growth and 2) won't instantly turn into fat, you will lose weight and look and (more importantly) feel great. It won't happen overnight, but with patience and dedication you will succeed.

My favorite exercises are running, swimming, cycling, yoga (yes!), soccer, and good old fashioned jump rope.

Good luck!!

Totally agree, CardioKickboxing is the way to go, 3x per week, 45 min per session, should be good, be CONSISTENT., and as mikeperez23 stated, water, water, and more water. I am a guru

Qualified instructor here (though that wasn't the career path I chose in the end, admittedly).

www.crossfit.com - all the fitness programme you'll ever need. Read the FAQs and sign up for the forums - lots of very nice and helpful people there (though a few are a bit cult-ish in their enthusiasm).

Diet - fat is not the enemy. Eat as naturally as possible - meat (preferably grass-fed and free range, or game), fish, vegetables, some fruit, nuts (not peanuts - they're legumes), and eggs, good oils like olive, walnut, flax. Avoid grains (especially wheat), cereals, sugar, starches and anything containing a lot of additives. Also alcohol, until you have reached your target. Maybe one "cheat" meal a week is OK (and it's easter so I'll let you off if you have some chocolate.)
If you stick with this you'll have no need to count calories.

http://www.calorieking.com/

Remember that calories are only one part that you need to pay attention to - more importantly, look for fat content, protein content and/or the carbohydrates you're eating are 'good' carbohydrates. Good luck.

There's some good info here. I agree that 3x a week 45-hr is great. If you can work your way up to every day, all the better.

Just be sure that when you are doing any sort of striking when you are first starting out that you pay attention to strict punching form so you don't get injured. Form first, then speed, then power. It takes awhile for the support muscles in your forearms to learn to brace your wrists properly for impact. Good hand wraps and proper wrapping techniques are a must if you are going to hit the heavy bags or thai pads as a new boxer.

On your off days, if there is a lap pool available, that can help work out the knots in all the new muscles you are going to find.

Just so you know I am with you 100%. I just started the induction phase in Atkins www.atkins.com and I'm going to go for 6 weeks cutting to lose about 20 lbs, then 6 weeks heavy lifting to gain it back, but as lean tissue instead of fat and then go back and cut the 20 lbs again in another 6 weeks.

My goal is to shed 20 lbs and 8% off my body fat by end of summer. Dunno if I can still do that now that I'm in my late 30's, but I'm going to give it my best!

Oh ya, one last thing...

sex...

lots and lots of sex...

tell the wife if she wants ya looking good on vacation, she's gonna have to hold up her end. :bounce:

Best advice in the thread

Yeah Dimitri - you might want to use this picture below as a target goal!

If it wasnt for the costiochondritis I would definitely recommend wrestling as that was the hardest and most rewarding sport ive ever competed in. If you want to you can literally lose 12 pound in a 3 hour practice. Problem is this is mostly water weight and people usually put half of it right back on after when they drink water. Boxing would be another good choice as you are constantly moving, throwing and receiving punches will also expel a large amount of energy.

Protein would be a big help (I lived off boiled chicken and salsa when I was competing)

5-6 small meals a day (Oats in the morning are great for energy and great for your health without the sugar and milk)

Milk supposedly helps to boost your metabolism, though I'm not sure if that's specifically referring to one type of milk. I can't imagine skim milk being bad for you, in any regard.

I have never heard of legumes (or in this case peanuts, as that was the one mentioned) being bad for you, at least any more so than any other potent source of protein and fat. They (again, peanuts) would not be something you'd want to eat if you're trying to lose weight, though.

Along those lines of legumes, I can't imagine them being bad at all for losing weight. They're generally large sources of protein and fiber. I wouldn't say they'd do anything good for losing weight or training up, but I couldn't see how they'd be bad for it either.

Well here's the thing Dimitri...

Legumes tend to be (overall) high in protein and fiber and low in fat (which is a good thing) but also tend to be just equally as high in carbohydrates (which is NOT a good thing in excess). So, of course, you can't compare legumes to white tuna fish meat, or skinless chicken breast, etc. Since legumes bring a vegetable based protein to the table but also bring carbohydrates. Now - not ALL carbohydrates are bad. If you start doing intense exercising (like the boxing I recommended) you're gonna NEED carbohydrates. In addition, legumes (as a carb) are WAY BETTER than potato chips, candy, white bread, etc. They are better because they have more fiber, less fat, less sodium and they will FILL UP YOUR STOMACH more.

Hopefully I answered your question.

In regards to Milk...

Milk is great for gaining weight. If I am in a situation where I am trying to pack on some pounds, I'll drink a gallon a day spread out over the course of the day.

for losing weight, I'd avoid it like the plague. If you are following a low-carb diet and crave milk, cream can be cut with water to make milk and it will work well for you.

I've dropped 10 lbs and two inches off my waistline since I started dieting 10 days ago. I have four more days before I can start taking in a significant amt of carbs again. Although, at the rate I am going, I may extend that out another week and see if I can't tank another 10 before I start to lift heavy and bulk back up again.

How is your progress Dmitri?

Have you had any luck finding a gym and a workout program?

Variety is important in the long run.

A few years ago, I followed a daily, gym-free regime of jogging, light weight training and lunges etc. The routine intensified over time, but I was still doing the same kinds of stuff. Eventually, my body refused to go with me in the morning!

How are you doing Dmitri? Any progress?

Dimitri, I don't know where you run but one thing I do if I run outdoors on the common (a common is a large open area which is more wild than a park, plus parks are usually fenced in - commons aren't - just in case people aren't familiar with the term) is that I'll throw in some exercises along the way. If I come to a low rail, wall or log I'll drop down and do some press-ups on it. I might do step-ups or bench dips on a bench, or body rows on a railing (see: http://www.davedraper.com/pmwiki/pmw...mWiki/BodyRows )
I might do some sprints up a small hill or slope, or walking lunges along a stretch of path. I don't ever stop moving - the jogging parts are the recovery. It's tough but a good workout.

There are dangers to doing just cardio. I really recommend reading a blog called Mark's Daily Apple - it's written by a former triathlete who really knows his stuff, and also makes entertaining reading. This article is quite an eye opener: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/case-against-cardio/

Cardio is good in moderation, but it's best mixed up with strength training (you don't have to get in the gym - you can do an outdoor workout like the one I've suggested) or other forms of exercise.
Interval training is absolutely the best way to burn fat - sprints with periods of recovery (slow jogging, for instance) and so forth.

Ultimately, the best exercise is the one that you can stick with. But variety is the spice of life, after all.

Good Morning Dmitri!!!

Good to hear from you and it sounds like you are doing very well yourself. Check back in here regularly! Having to report to others on your progress, is a major incentive to keep hard at it!

I am on day 22. I have lost about 17 lbs total (weighed in at 258 from 275). I am sure I will pick up about 5-6 as I replete my glycogen stores after being on low carb for 3 weeks at less than 20g carbs a day. I think realistically I've shed 8lbs fat and 2 lbs lean mass.

I am going back into the gym today to start lifting again. I am working one day on, one day off with cardio in the form of hill sprints, jump rope, and speed/heavy bag work on my off days. I'm switching my diet gradually to a 40/40/20 protein/carbs/fat diet with complex carbs throughout the day except right before and after my heavy lifting where I'll need the fast energy from simple sugars.

I've planed out my meals through the week to be about 700 calories short of what my body requires and hope to shed another lb-1.5lbs a week for ten weeks bringing me down to about 250-253 solid.

Keep up the hard work! The rewards are worth it!

I must agree with Indiscreet - strength (resistance) training burns some many more calories while you're performing it, as well as after you finish it - the results are so dramatically different than just cardio alone. I always laugh a little when I go to the gym and see those people who walk for hours and hours on the treadmill and they are at the same weight all of the time. Of course, this is better than no exercise, but to me it's such a waste of time. Me, I'd rather do the least possible exercise for the maximum results. This leaves more time for me to be on Basenotes.

amen mike, the mitochondria of muscle tissue is the furnace that burns fat. The more you have, and the harder you work it the faster you'll burn off the blubber.

Good article Indiscreet, I think I'll walk a few miles after training for a warm-down (except on legs day, at which point I'll crawl whimpering to my car)

Yup, you see a lot of girls at the gym who spend all their time on the cross trainer or treadmill and are "skinny fat" - they don't weigh much but they have no muscle tone so their bodyfat is actually high for their weight. It's more prevalent in women than men because men are naturally more muscular, but also a lot of women are afraid to lift weight because they somehow imagine that they will turn into Arnie. (Which is bull - I can deadlift 250lbs and I still have only 12 inch arms, much to my chagrin).

I run quite a bit, by the way - but I lift seriously as well. Ultimately, what looks better to you - a marathon runner or a sprinter? I think we all know the answer to that.

I was going to start my own thread for this, but it might be a bit redundant, so I apologize for kind of hijacking this thread...

I need to get on a serious regimine as well.

I am already very fit, barely an ounce of fat on my body. I am relatively strong for being as thin as I am as well.

However, I really need to get my upper body decked out, and here's why-

In about 2 1/2 months, I'll be performing the Grand Pas de Deux of Le Corsaire (a ballet in which I dance with a girl) on stage, in front of thousands of people...with no shirt! Here's a video: http://youtube.com/watch?v=R_4hGdmDZL8 (just a sidenote: This will be about 8 months after doing my first plie, tendu, etc. [starting ballet] - I don't know if this impresses you, but it sure impresses me!)

I can already do all the lifts and leaps, so the strength isn't really as much as an issue as the fact that I'll be performing shirtless. I guess this might be kind of egotistical, but I really want to look good when I'm out there. This is a large fitness goal for me; I do have the option of wearing a shirt...

I'm only a tiny bit thinner than the guy in the video, but I have a feeling I wouldn't look quite as good on stage...

So here are my objectives:
Get my upper body decked out to the maximum extent that time will allow for (2 1/2 months)
Remain as light as possible (I am 6'1" and weight 173 lbs)
Build my endurance and energy

My challenges:
My metabolism is freakin' insane. I will most likely have to double or triple the amount of food I eat.
Putting on muscle in my upper body without becoming top-heavy
Time

So my regimine should differ from all of these weight loss/fat burning techniques... which is what it seems everyone else on earth has to contend with. I don't need to get as big as that guy pictured in the water, just even out my proportions to match my (now) muscular legs.

Here is my current routine-

Ballet:
5-6 days a week, 1-3 hours per day (this obviously takes care of the legs)

Yoga or Pilates:
1-3 days a week, 1 hour per day

Weights:
4-5 days a week, 1 hour per day

5 sets of 10 reps INCLINE PRESS (140 lbs)
3 sets of 10 reps DECLINE PRESS (90 lbs)
5 sets of 10 reps LAT PULL DOWN (120 lbs)
3 sets of 10 reps REVERSE FLY (upper back) (60 lbs)
5 sets of 10 reps BICEP CURL (25 lbs)
5 sets of 10 reps TRICEP PRESS (110 lbs)
3 sets of 10 reps SHOULDER EXTENSIONS (30 lbs)
3 sets of 25 reps SHOULDER SHRUGS (130 lbs)
3 sets of 10 reps AB-LEG RAISES
3 sets of 10 reps BACK EXTENSIONS

Stretching:
3-5 days a week, 30 mins per day, usually in a hot tub.


Diet:
I try to eat as much protein as I can, but a lot of the time, I don't eat as well as I should because I'm either not very hungry, have something to go do, or am not appetized by the stuff in my fridge. I'm probably getting about 100 - 130 grams of protein a day. I eat lots of power bars (32 g protein) and HAVE the milkshake stuff, (but got tired of it a couple months ago) and try to eat chicken or steak at least a few days a week. I also try not to eat foods that I can tell are very fatty or offer little or no nutritional value, but of course I am not as disciplined as I could be with this.

If I had a sure-fire routine that I could just keep repeating, I'm sure I could stick to it. (faced with this shirtless endeavor coming up!) In the mean time, it is just kind of "I'll do the best I know how to"... but I'm sure it could be better. I don't know much about nutrition other than what I've said...

Please help. I promise I'll do what you tell me if you can promise it will help!

First day back in the gym working my legs today after a long layoff, they feel like jello. Scent, here's a routine that took me from just fit to big. It's a powerhouse for packing on lean mass. I'll just give you the gist of it.

One day on, one day off. Btwn 12 and 15 sets a day starting with the large muscle groups and working down.

Day 1: Chest, biceps
Bench presses \t3 sets \t6- 8 reps
Incline bench presses \t2 sets \t6- 8 reps
Dips with added weights \t2 sets \t8-10 reps
Barbell curls \t3 sets \t6-10 reps
Dumbbell curls \t2 sets \t6-10 reps

Day 3: Thighs
Squats \t3 sets \t6-10 reps
Leg presses \t2 sets \t8-10 reps
Leg curls \t2 sets \t8-10 reps

Day 5: Shoulder, triceps
Presses behind neck \t3 sets \t6- 8 reps
Upright row \t2 sets \t8-10 reps
Side laterals \t2 sets \t8-10 reps
Lying triceps presses \t3 sets \t6-10 reps
Triceps pulley pushdown \t2 sets \t8-10 reps

Day 7: Back. calves
Chins with added weight \t3 sets \t8-10 reps
Lat pull to neck \t2 sets \t8-10 reps
Barbell bent-over row \t2 sets \t6-10 reps
Seated cable row \t2 sets \t6-10 reps
Standing calf raise \t3 sets \t8-12 reps
Seated calf raise \t2 sets \t8-12 reps

This works out to training each body part once a week. You will have to lift heavy to grow.

If you take your bodyweight and multiply by 12, that should give you a decent idea of what your maintainance calories should be. Yours will likely be higher as a dancer. I usually eat about 1000-1500 calories a day higher when I'm trying to put on some size. I eat in a 40/45/15 protein/carbs/fat split (that's percentages of total calories, not grams).

If you keep it at just 700-1000 over, you should be able to pack on some nice new muscle without putting on much weight in 10 weeks.

The only last general thing I could advise you is to keep a careful watch on your level of soreness and energy. Dancing is very challenging physically and my concern is that you might overtrain and that can lead to injuries or a waste of time and energy in the gym. GL.

I like your calorie intake advice. That would mean that I should shoot for about 3000 calories. Do you think I might even want to go higher, given my super-fast metabolism?

The weight lifting routine you've suggested looks to be a reduction from what I'm already doing...(7-10 of those excercises I had listed per session) When I finish my sets, I'm pretty much tapped out, so if I increase the weight, I can't go TOO much bigger - but I'm thinking I should go as big as possible, eh?

So should I reduce or stick with my current stuff? I thought you would have told me to go even bigger. I feel like I could be doing more. My routine only takes 30-45 minutes as it is, so I figured I should be spending twice that much in the gym if I want to look like the guy in the bowflex commercial...

Could you explain that 40/45/15 thing again too?

Thanks!

40/45/15 are percentages of total calories 40% protein 45% carbs and 15% fats. MAKE SURE you look at it from a calories perspective and NOT in grams per serving. Fat has 9 calories per gram and carbs and protein have only 4. You should plan your meals to be 6 per day and divide up your target calories evenly. One of those meals should be post-workout and should include carbs and protein. preferably a minimum of 40g of protein. This is where the weightgainer shake really does some good for you. As far as the additional calories are concerned, you can start with more and taper down. I was shooting for 10 good lbs in 10 weeks because anything more might affect your balance and movement. Only your scale and your mirror can really tell you what you should be doing.

AS far as the exercises, in this case, less is more. Overtraining is the most common reason that I know of that people fail to achieve their goals in the gym. Your muscles will be triggered to grow when they experience heavy weight that works them to exhaustion and then they receive sufficient rest and nutrition that will allow growth to happen. Fewer reps and heavier weights=more mass.

This regimen targets specific muscle groups to work diretly and then gives them a full week off to recover and grow. You do these sets using slow movements and STRICT form. I try my best to keep my muscles under load for a full minute in each set and typically do a 2 second movement on the part of the rep that forces the muscle to contract and 4 seconds on the part that forces the muscle to extend. You then rest 3-4 minutes between sets. WHile you are resting, stretch the body parts you are working. This gives the muscles a chance to bring their ATP levels back up to working levels and allows you to work the muscles harder for longer.

You'll want to do one set of ten of each exercise with no or minimal weight on the bar as a warm-up to get the blood flowing into the muscle group you are working.

that's all I can think of atm. If I can think of anything else, I'll post it in here and if you have any more questions, just ask.

with any luck ironlady can weigh in here to see if there's anything I've missed. Gotta give her props for being a female and popping 250lb deadlifts.

oh yeah, SLEEP. Get plenty of it! Your body does most of it's growing while you are sleeping so be sure not to shortchange yourself there.

I hit 190 pounds last june and worked my way down to 160 by September. I did this by doing a lot of cardio (elliptical mostly, switched to a treadmill or ran outside once a week) and some weight lifting. I ate mostly salad and tried to cut out soda.

However, I've since gone back up to 170 and am getting a gut. My diet has gone to hell with fast food at least once a day. I started doing cardio again and I'm trying to find healthy foods that I can stick with. A favorite right now is strawberry spinach salad.

I really recommend a workout/diet buddy. If you push them to keep up the regime then they'll push you back....hopefully.

Good luck to us both and everyone else!

I don't think I was lifting enough weight until now.

I tried maxing out a couple of groups per day and I can feel and see it working better. I'm going to do this for a couple of weeks and then switch it up again somehow.

I guess my previous routine was just keeping me really fit, but now I seem to be getting bigger.

Le Corsaire, here I come!

you have to lift progressively heavier weights to force your muscles to grow in response to the stress.

You body enjoys something called homeostasis which the short definition of it is "I don't want to change".

If you work with weights heavy enough to fail on your last rep in the program I laid out for you, you WILL grow. (or any other workable schema)

There's nothing wrong with working to stay fit, but if you want to get bigger you have to challenge yourself continuously.

Switching up is a great idea. Every 8 weeks I rework my routine with new exercises that force the muscles to endure new stresses from different angles and movements.

If you pm me an email address. I have some spread sheets you can print out that serve as a log book for your progress.

They are set for the routine I gave you, but you can change the fields to whatever exercises you are doing. They are great for tracking progress.

How is your diet?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As for my own results, I am back on 40/40/20, eating 300-500 cal per day sub-maintainance and off the low carb.

I have picked up 4 lbs as my glycogen stores replenished (expected) and have since lost 1. I hope to lose 1 a week for the next 12 weeks and then level off...

How is everyone else doing?

Is there anything that is the equivalent to the opposite of an appetite suppressant? (I wouldn't imagine such a product enjoying much of a market in fat-ass USA...)

I simply don't have the appetite to eat 3000 calories! 2000 is hard enough!

And 175 grams of protein is what, like: 2 powerbars, 2 protein shakes, a meaty lunch and a meaty dinner? That's tough!

Where in the hell did I get this metabolism and how do I bottle and sell it?!

Name your price, I will buy it!!!


Also, I'm not certain of the nutritional breakdown of this product, but there is a drink called ENSURE that you might want to check out. (some people like the taste - and some people think it's gross )

There sure is, it's a killer buzz too, but it's illegal...

fruit juice helps a lot for the calories. I pound back a LOT of v8 over the course of a day. skim milk and lowfat milk helps too, esp given that protein is the hardest part to pack in as you pointed out.

Ensure is also some weighty stuff, I have a friend who is a professional BB and he wakes up every morning at 3am to pound two of those down and goes right back to sleep.

and wow, I can't BELIEVE I forgot this one....

Creatine!

GO to the health food store and buy the bulk Creatine monohydrate. Mix a 5g scoop (heaping teaspoon) of that with some fruit juice an hour before you work out! That stuff will put 3-5 lbs on you and make your muscles look much fuller just by itself. It's almost all water weight, but it's water weight in your muscle tissue and it looks good.

That should run you about 20 bucks for a kilogram of it that should last you 6 months easy. (don't let the salesidiot talk you into buying the expensive stuff, it's no better than the generic)

You can learn a bit more about it here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creatine_supplements

Scentrosonic, take multivitamines. I do, and since I take them I crave eating more. :P

Creatine is indeed good times! There was a week a few months ago where I was completely bored, and decided to put all my nutritional supplements to use. Which meant:

1. A scoop of creatine in water before I worked out.

2. A "milkshake" of sorts, consisting of 6 cups of milk, a big scoop of weight gain powder, and two of my protein powder. I drank that throughout the day.

Then doing pullups and pushups for a while, nothing completely insane, maybe 3 x 6-8 on pullups and 5 x 30-40 on the pushups. After just a few days of that craziness, I looked noticeably stronger. Of course, appearances are deceiving!

hugh: check out my post in the pushups thread in this column, you'll do infinitely more good for yourself following that routine than hitting 40-50 pushup sets...

Dmitri...

I'm calling ya out man!!!

Scentronic too!

How are you guys doing toward your goals?!?!?!?

I am still a solid 265 lbs, but I am dropping fat like mad. My initial measurements were 42" waist and 52" chest and shoulders.

I am now 38" waist and 52" chest and shoulders. The 52" looks a LOT more impressive.

I have 2" more to drop off my waist and I'll be getting close.

How is everyone else doing?