Note Identification Project - Please Join In!

The Note Identification Project

Welcome to another zany experiment.

In early June, you are invited to explore fragrance notes with us.

Those of you who wish to do so, obtain raw materials (natural or synthetic), and post your impressions for everyone to discuss.

Here is my list:



Bergamot
Neroli
Mandarin
Orange
Pink Grapefruit
Lime
Lemongrass

Juniper Berry
Lavendar
Spearmint
Virginia Cedar

Orange Blossom
Rose de Mai
Rose
Rose (synthetic)
Jasmine Grandiflora
Jasmine Sambac

Champaca
Genet/Broom
Linden Blossom
Geranium
Tuberose

Galbanum
Atlas Cedar
Orris Root
Clary Sage
Vetiver
Patchouli

Violet Leaf
Oakmoss
Oakmoss (synthetic)
Mate
Tobacco
Oud
Hay

Fennel
Galangal
Cardamom
Cinnamon Leaf
Clove Bud

Methyl laitone (synthetic, creamy)
Nectaryl (synthetic peach/apricot)

Myrrh (tincture)
Opoponax (tincture)
Olibanum (tincture)
Copal (tincture)
Pine Resin (tincture)

Civet (synthetic)
Castoreum (synthetic)
Ambrettolide (synthetic musk)
Habanolide (synthetic musk)
Velvione (synthetic musk)

Javanol (synthetic sandalwood)
Sandalore (synthetic sandalwood)

Vanilla
Ethyl vanillin (synthetic)
Vanillin (synthetic)

Peru Balsam
Tolu Balsam (synthetic)
Siam Benzoin
Labdanum




I lack these: Ambrette Seed, Angelica, Basil, Beeswax, Blackcurrent, Boronia, Cassie, Chamomile, Coriander, Hyssop, Hyacinth, Kewda, Lemon, Lotus, Osmanthus, Petitgrain, Rosemary, Rosewood, Spikenard, Ylang Ylang, and many others.

So, grab some. Get on board. Who knows where we'll go?

I'm so excited! I've got company!
Sure, use whatever you have. Essential oils or perfume oils--it doesn't matter. Naturals or synthetics--it doesn't matter. Spice cabinet, flower garden--anything you have.
As long as you can name the note and describe it (pull out your thesaurus, it's time for the adjective challenge) or compare it to something else, you're in the game.

Let's discuss:

What notes do you like? We're used to talking about what perfume compositions we like, but this will help us pinpoint why we are drawn to certain perfumes or olfactory families.

Why do you think perfumers these particular notes? (Because they are salty, bitter, fresh; they balance out the florals, adds sweetness, open up the fragrance.)

About dilution, yes, I'm going to dilute mine in Everclear in perfume vials. I think 10% should be enough of a dilution. Some can be smelled full strength.

However, if you plan to put them on skin, they need to follow some rules:

This is a list of essential oils from the Good Scents Company. Click on each one, and it will give you a reference sheet with the recommended maximum amount for each oil. Example:
recommendation for ambrette seed oil usage levels up to :
\t0.5000 % in the fragrance concentrate.

http://www.thegoodscentscompany.com/essentlx.html


I might give in and start later this month, but this week is definitely too busy. Besides, we need to give people time to accumulate some samples. Thanks.

Yep. There's the jojoba school and the alcohol school.
People seem to prefer one or the other. The only problem with jojoba is that absolutes and resins will not dissolve in it.

Otherwise it is wonderful stuff, and I use it every day. Far better than any other product for moisturinzing skin and occasionally conditioning hair. Some people have even replaced it for furniture polish to get away from petroleum products. But I digress.

Get those old essential oils out, people. They have a shelf life and are going to go bad if you don't use them. We are going to have a good time.

Nah, they dissolve in a matter of days. Not completely, but who cares? It's good enough LIB.


Easy! I suppose a hot water bath would speed it up, too.

I'm using Everclear. Only $5 for a flask from the liquor store.
It should be 190 proof, but if it isn't, don't worry.
We're not striving for perfection, here. We're not perfumers.
Every day, ordinary people steep flowers and plants in alcohol to extract their scent, which is not particularly long-lived, nor is it a commercially viable product. That's not the point.
The point is, we love scent. We love to experiment. We love to learn. And we love to share.
We will accomplish all of these things.
For example: I made resin tinctures. They were sticky and unsuitable to wear as fragrance--unless I want to turn into human flypaper--but they did allow me to fully experience the fragrance of the resin by itself, without other notes of perfume, and (most importantly) without burning them as incense. I am not a fan of smoky scents. By crushing the resin and dissolving it, I was able to spread it out and smell it by itself. Prior to that, I was left puzzling as to, "What is this myrrh note in Etro Sandalo?" I had to mentally tease the note out of the fragrance by eliminating all the notes that I knew, "It's not that orange note, it's not that honey, it's not that cinnamon..." I got tired of that routine, went out and bought some actual myrrh, opoponax, copal, olibanum, siam benzoin, and pine resins. They were inexpensive. I ground them up and smelled the dust, I dissolved them in alcohol, I burned them, I did everything I could to learn what they smell like.
I had fun. So I got some essential oils, and I plan to do the same with them--dilute, sniff, mix, drag Kumquat into it (as usual) and have a good laugh. The results might make interesting reading, so I'm going to do it live, here on the forum.
Too bad I can't get some synthetic components, too. They seem to be sold in bulk only. Maybe some of the DIY board members can chime in and talk about what their synthetics smell like.

Yes, I do know this site. Thanks for reminding me.
I think I'll order some of her synthetics. Those are exactly the small samples that I'm looking for.
I'll try some of the animalics--civit, musk, castoreum, leather--and perhaps some peach, some ozone, some marine. All the things I can't get in naturals.
Great!

Thanks, dcampen, for the tip on fixative.
In addition, I think most of the natural essential oils will benefit from being put into a sweet, diffusive base, like musk or sandalwood.
Which of the many listed on PerfumersApprentice do you like?
jillsy, just get some jojoba oil and use that instead of alcohol.

I think jojoba is lovely. If I didn't have absolutes, I would use that instead. It's just that you have to pick one or the other--alcohol or jojoba--and alcohol works with both essential oils and absolutes, but jojoba doesn't dissolve some things.

Thanks for the recommendations, dcampen.

My goal is to get some synthetic florals, too, and compare them to the naturals, see how close they come to eachother in terms of aroma, and puzzle over each one's contribution to perfumery. Plus, I'll try a few animalics, florals, fruits, woods, etc.

I'm not going into the perfumery business, so I won't buy the basic building blocks (damascones, aldehydes, hedione, etc.) I'll just get the pre-made synthetic accords. (Although I am curious about how every chemical smells, the investment in time and money would be too great.)

Anyone who has anything, join in. Say why this ingredient has pleased you or disappointed you, if it worked for you or not.

LIB, welcome aboard. I appreciate anyone here playing this game with us. It's all light-hearted, lots of laughs involved. Positive and negative opinions encouraged, but no flaming.

Absolutely!I couldn't have put it better.
That is the reason why I'm doing this. I don't know how things are supposed to smell! So, here's this all-natural, expensive rose absolute, and it smells like apple pie, and here is this cheap synthetic, and it smells like a fresh rose, except that it also smells like bathroom deodorant and....
See what I mean?
So, yes, lets' talk about all that on this thread.

I just ordered some synthetics and updated the list of materials that I have at the top of this thread.

Yes, indeed.
Take several obsessed perfumistas (perfumistos), add perfume making kits, and what do you get?
We will see...
I think we should pass around our experiments afterwards.

Is everybody ready?
Please post your finalized lists of notes.
Mine are posted at the top of this thread--please scroll up to the top to see my list.
They are categorized this way:

Citrusy
Minty, campherous
Sweet floral
Non-sweet floral
Green, diffusive
Green, heavy
Spice
Fuity or Milky
Animalic
Sandalwood
Vanilla
Sweet resin

Let me know when to start the party.

P.S. ScultureofSoul, I know exactly what you are talking about. The more I know, the less sense the note pyramids make. With synthetics (a.k.a. modern perfumery) the only thing that matters is the intent of the perfumer and the chemists. Molecules can be tailor-made to combine characteristics that don't exist in nature. If I smell a grapefruit, and someone else smells an apple, it doesn't matter who is right and who is wrong. When used to balk at the idea of an accord called "tactile woods." I wanted to know: Was it a cedar accord? Or sandalwood? Or vetiver? Now I have accepted that names do not apply to man-made aromas. In fact, it is the newest, most original, most unique aromas that the perfumers wait for the chemists to make, so that they can buy them and put them into the newest, most original, most unique fragrances.

This is great.
You people are impressive.
Those of you with ingredients are well-prepared.
And those of you without are using actual substances--very resourceful.
So, let's get this party started.

I defer to the dcampen to correct me if I'm wrong on the following advice:

Basic Procedure:

1. Dilute each ingredient with your choice alcohol (Everclear, perfumer's alcohol, or the like) or jojoba oil until it reaches a level that is comfortable to smell--usually 10% or less. The concentrates are usually too strong.

(If you have "perfume oils" that are intended for use on the skin, you can skip this step. Essential oils, absolutes, concretes, and aromachemicals need to be diluted.)

If you intend to use this substance on your skin, please refer to the safety data posted online by The Good Scents Company for maximum percentage to be used in fragrance.
I have gone back and edited my list (refer to top of thread) showing the maximum recommended percentage of each ingredient for use in fragrance.

If you only intend to dip a test strip into the substance and smell it, you can exceed the maximum percentage for use in fragrance, but don't forget to dilute it down to a safe level before you get it on your skin.

2. I am putting your lists into Excel Spread Sheet to determine which notes we have in common.

3. I'll give you the rest of the day to do your dilutions.

4. Start writing down your impressions while you are doing this.

5. Categorize your notes. Suggest your categories in this thread. This will give me an idea of what you are most interested in talking about first.


P.S. I love that crazy, combined aroma that I am getting from the whole mass of mine, together. I think it smells spicy and earthy.

How about Rose and Jasmine - The Heart of Perfumeryfor our first notes?

Why are rose and jasmine called "the heart of perfumery?'
I think it is because they are the sweetest ingredients in my natural palate, except for labdanum and vanilla. And they are clear, offering room for other aromas in their headspace. (To be sure, there are other sweet ingredients--but many are thick and complicated, difficult to pair with other notes.)
Their position, squarely in the middle of the pyramid, causes them to have average duration, neither disappearing nor overlasting other accords.

Of the two, jasmine is far sweeter. Rose tends to be woody and spicy in addition to being sweet.

Rose is a note that people feel strongly about. Some men avoid it because they consider it to be feminine (in our culture). Some people avoid it because they consider it to be "soapy," but I believe that is due to its historical overuse in soaps, lotions, and more recently, bathroom spray.

I have three types of rose scent:

Rose Absolute - Rosa damascena, Egypt - A natural rose absolute. This does not smell like a live rose. Certainly it smells like rose, with a velvety sweetness but, to me, there is a bit of a fermented quality like wine, and a strong component of fruit and spice, like apple and cinnamon.

Rose de Mai Absolute - Rosa centifolia, Egypt - Personally, I like this better than the damascena. It has a greenness, like a tea rose, and more spiciness. Seems livlier than the damascena, but probably would not mix as well with other notes and therefore not be as useful in actual perfumery.

Rose Accord - synthetic, Givaudan - Intensely rosy. Lacks the woody harshness of natural absolute, as though it had been excised with a knife. Incredibly fruitier. Better sillage. Lasts longer. However, it presents itself in a one-dimensional, solid manner, not wavering from sweet to woody as you inhale, the way the natural presented itself.

Just to mention, I don't think any of these smell like live roses, not even the synthetic, which surprises me. All of them lack the cool, gentle caress of real roses. They are edgier, sharper. They smell hotter and drier. Also this makes me respect all the perfumers who create rose perfumes. For example, all the variations of Les Parfums de Rosine. They breathe life into this accord.

Jasmine is one of my all-time favorites, naturally sweet beyond belief, clear and mixable with other notes. I tried to get a synthetic jasmine accord, but it failed to show up with the rest of my order. As I remember from past experience, it is easy to make a horrible jasmine accord--with off-notes in abundance. Sometimes itpicks up a penetrating anise note, sometimes it smells volatile and sulfuric.

I have three natural jasmines to discuss:

Jasmine Grandiflora Absolute - Jasminum grandiflora, Egypt - This is my favorite of the three. Strong, penetrating, rich and fruity. Smells like a floral version of Juicy Fruit chewing gum. Has a bit of an indolic note, but nothing off-putting, only warm and a tad bit fecal. This could be a perfume all by itself. I find it eminently wearable. It is my favorite of the three.

Jasmine Grandiflora Absolute - Jasminum grandiflora, India - A weaker version of the above. Not as sweet, nor as heady, but still pretty.

Jasmine Sambac Absolute - Jasminum sambac, India - Opens on a greener note but settles into a heavier floral quality. This is more indolic than the grandiflora, and I find that it has a bit of a salty, fleshy quality. It, too, is truly beautiful and could stand on its own as a perfume. It has a more singular fruitiness than the grandiflora, as though the fruit note is focused on one fruit, not tutti-fruiti like the grandiflora.

I have never smelled live jasmine flowers. I cannot tell you if any of these approximate the aroma.

When I combine the rose and jasmine accords together, something interesting happens. They are no longer easily identifiable as rose or jasmine, but come across as a floral bouquet. Especially agreeable are the rose damascena and jasmine sambac together, as though the pairing forms the basis for many floral accords.

Interstingly, I don't think the synthetic rose pairs as well with the natural jasmine as the natural rose absolutes. It falls flat. By itself, it is very pretty, but it doesn't combine well with either of these jasmines.

And I cannot see why anyone would even seek a synthetic jasmine accord when the naturals are so drop-dead gorgeous. Except, that is, to save money. So, if it is at all possible, look for natural jasmine in a perfume. Absolutely gorgeous.

And this, friends, is why they are called the "heart of perfumery."

In addition, I would like to report on some:
Problems and Solutions
1. What I bought as "sample" or "tiny sample" size does not lend itself to easy dilution. The sample is too small to pour out and suck up into a dropper. Many of my dilutions, therefore, will not be accurate enough to use on the skin. Rather, they will be for test strips only.

2. I didn't wear gloves the first time I tried this, any my fingers became distractingly fragrant. Next time, I will put them on so that I can take them off and have fragrance-free hands.

3. Coffee filters, cut up, make great, inexpensive test strips.

Yes, banana! That's it. I said Juicy Fruit gum, but I get the banana aroma, too.
And yes, smoky. Uh-huh. That's what I picked up as "volatile" like something that can burn, even a bit sulfurous.

And LIB, go ahead a mix. That's part of this experiment. I already mixed the jasmine grandiflora and the rose damascena. And I'm going to try lemon with rose, and geranium with rose and a whole bunch of other things as soon as I get through smelling the notes alone. But if you're ready now, go to it.

So, whisperingleaves and LIB, all three of us agree that rose undergoes a "fermented" effect when processed. I can understand how the heat from distillation would cause this, but I truly believed that the synthetic would escape the same fate and smell realistic. Not so. Although it smelled less woody and fermented, it in no way approached the freshness of a real flower. In fact, the rose centifolia absolute came the closest to approximating "fresh," even though it was far off. So, how do perfumers make realistic rose approximations?

dcampen? Any input?