Basenotes › Basenotes Forums › Fragrance Discussion › Male Fragrance Discussion › MFD Archive › Bond No. 9: Your thaughts on Price vs. Quality...
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Bond No. 9: Your thaughts on Price vs. Quality...

post #1 of 31
12/14/08 at 8:45pm
Thread Starter 
I'm interested in everyone's thoughts regarding this house.
Regardless of any talk of plagarism...
Or bias regarding likes/dislikes of particular scents...

...Strictly as a matter of assessing ingredient quality...

Am I alone in thinking that the house, overall and on average, does not deliver a product worthy of it's price range ?

Most Bond fragrances are a step above average designer/mainstream scents, especially when it comes to proportions and blending. However, the overarching feel to the line, imho, is still very very synthetic, two dimensional, and lacking upper shelf quality.

The house seems to only have one "house note" to me, it is their sweetener.
Whereas Serge Lutens Sweetness could be rightly compared to a natural Honey/Molasses type, Creeds being a lightly sweetened cream icing, Maitre's/L'Artisan's sweetener a deep & purified vanilla bourbon...
...Bond seems to use a very transparent sweetener, the comparison to Corn Syrup comes to mind.
Or worse yet nutrasweet/splenda.

I am not opposed to the use of synthetics at all, but the mastery of some of the best houses seems to be using just enough natural essences to conceal the stable/reliable synthetic twin essence, until the next stage of the fragrance hits.

I have been very unimpressed with this house, and would like to know your opinions, especially if you feel I am missing an important aspect/detail of this house's work...
Reply
Reply

Features on Basenotes

Basenotes Reader Awards 2013 - Finalists Announced.
Petals Falling From The Sky - A Report From The Cote d'Azur's Bataille De Fleurs
Greatest Hits: Annick Menardo
post #2 of 31
12/14/08 at 9:08pm
i have sampled over 8-10 bonds and the only one which i found acceptable was Riverside drive. i'm yet to sample Hamptons, Wall Street, ChinaTown and Silver factory...so..i still have some hopes pinned on this line...as for other i tried...they were all passable (read:boring). i wud hold on to my designers real tight....(some tht i tried are central park, byrant park, chez bond, litte italy etc.)
Reply
Reply
post #3 of 31
12/14/08 at 9:14pm
I would agree that there is something missing. I find Bonds to be interesting, novel, and creative, as well as classy and just plain good-smelling. I agree completely with what you say about being a cut above mainstream designer. But all of that said, I find that their scents don't evolve very much. They're like a singer or an instrumentalist holding a very beautiful note or notes for a long time, and simply fading to silence. I won't say one-dimensional, because they are often subtle and complex. But they don't change very much on my skin. And they do have a "Bond" accord that you either take or leave, but you're gonna get it in every scent. I happen to love it - my lucky break.

Other houses seem to handle evolution better. A few do it too much. Therein lies what I like about Bond - if I find a scent that I like, I generally count on liking it for the duration on my skin. In contrast, at the other extreme, a few Neil Morris scents change dramatically - possibly even into a different scent that I'm not fond of. I prefer a scent that "sticks to its guns", as they say.

If Bonds were any weaker, I would definitely say they aren't worth the money. But I find that because they are fairly strong and long-lasting for me, and don't require very many sprays, they are acceptably priced. Just barely.
Reply
Reply
post #4 of 31
12/14/08 at 9:15pm
With the exception of some, I agree with you. I've sampled Wall Street, Hamptons and New Haarlem and I thought they were worthy of their price range, although I don't really agree with Bond No.9's pricing.
Reply
Reply
post #5 of 31
12/14/08 at 9:50pm
Very very synthetic? Dullah, you are being a bit harsh there. Bond No. 9 frags are well made with most using good quality ingredients although the overall composition might be uninspired.

I have tried most of them, and there doesn't seem to be a "Bond house accord"; it could be because their niche focus isn't as unilateral as say Lutens marrakech inspiration or the Montale aoud bombs (the "fragrance of nyc" is just marketing hype..Rahme is all over the place with Andy Warhol, Boca Raton, etc). Can anyone tell me what links Wall Street, Chinatown or Silver Factory? These could be from different houses! Another reason for this could be that many different noses compose Bond fragrances. And ofcourse there's that lack of inspiration thing...it doesn't help that Rahme is (nowadays) more focused on fancy bottles and glitzy holiday packaging (and Bond no. 9 T-shirts? Wha??).

I wouldn't mind owning some Bonds like Little Italy, Wall Street, etc. although I should say that the last 4-5 releases have been very mediocre (Saks 5th ave for him and her, Union square, Bryant Park, etc.) and you rightly criticize them..
Reply
Reply
post #6 of 31
12/14/08 at 10:05pm
Bond is not a house you come to for:
Subtlety
Originality
or Value
That said, the blinged out bottles and loud opening notes of the fragrance line-up that Ms Rahme has hobbled together isn't all that bad. Yes, more than half are real duds, but, a very nice handful of gems are there, too.
The price seems to be inline with similar houses, ie.: Creed.
What they need to do is start offering 30ml sizes for around $70.
Reply
Reply
post #7 of 31
12/14/08 at 10:20pm
Hmmm....I may be in the minority, but I really like this house, overall. Yes, some of their frags are mediocre, but I don't expect any house to hit a home run every time. I LOVE Nuits de Noho, Coney Island, New Haarlem, and Chinatown. I like So New York and several others. In terms of price, I think their prices are comparable to most niche lines, no? One thing I love about some of their frags is the lasting power. 2 or three sprays of Coney Island and I' m done for the whole day! There aren't that many fragrances that I adore that have that kind of longevity, so to me, the cost per ml is quite economical because of the staying power. ^_^
Reply
Reply
post #8 of 31
12/14/08 at 11:13pm
I think it is a remarkable achievement that Laurice Rahmé was able to start this company five years ago from absolutely nothing.

I like several of the Bond No. 9 fragrances, and two of them (New Haarlem and Silver Factory) have even made it to my top ten.
.
Reply
Reply
post #9 of 31
12/14/08 at 11:24pm
What lizzie_j and Ruggles said.
I think they do not target the same consumers as Creed, SL, L'Artisan or MPG. This is not the house to look for a spicy oriental, an ambery fragrance or a rich leather. I think their fragrances are more youthful and urban than the previously mentioned houses (with the exception of some Millesimes by creed) and they do not pretend anything different. Are they over priced? Probably (yes, like most perfumes). Are they worth the value? well that is an individual judgement. In my book, their fragrances go anywhere from 1 star to 5. Average could be 3.5
Reply
Reply
post #10 of 31
12/14/08 at 11:44pm
I've had the opportunity to try all the Bonds during a vacation at which I was staying next to a Saks (they love pushing Bond). I wouldn't go so far as to say there's a 'house accord', but there is a striking similarity in the hearts and bases of quite a few fragrances. There's definitely a 'vibe' that connects many. Off the top of my head I'd say Coney Island, Little Italy, Wall Street, Hamptons and a couple others I'm not remembering all have a closely related citrus accord.

That said, the quality is good across the line and if you like the scents I don't think they're particularly overpriced in the world of niche. There are deals to be had here and there with some retailers and on eBay, and they do sell minis for $40. You do get top-notch customer service and they do things like send random free samples and organize recycling drives.

What's missing from the line are a few fragrances that stand out as being really bold and different.... they all seem to be just a bit muted, as though they're on the verge of being daring but aren't quite there. New Haarlem, HOT Always, and Silver Factory are among their most unique entities, and even those aren't 'out there' in any sense of the word.
Reply
Reply
post #11 of 31
12/14/08 at 11:56pm
I'm going to have to get around to sampling some Bond scents soon. I would generally agree with what you said when it comes to (most of) Montale's offerings though.
Reply
Reply
post #12 of 31
12/15/08 at 12:07am
Thread Starter 
^^Yes bbBD, I'd say that the transparency of the entire compositions (including nearly all the bases), and the linear & synthetic(though well-blended) nature, especially of the shared sweetener, are the link/identity of the house.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lizzie_j View Post

Hmmm....I may be in the minority, but I really like this house, overall. Yes, some of their frags are mediocre, but I don't expect any house to hit a home run every time. I LOVE Nuits de Noho, Coney Island, New Haarlem, and Chinatown. In terms of price, I think their prices are ^_^

As consolation, I think the general "style" of the house is best suited for girls my age (mid-20's) and younger. The 2 best for this being Scent of Peace and Coney Island, both very fresh and cute.

Wall Street is one that, while I do like it, really surprised me. It is far far closer to Sean John Unforgivable than it could ever be to MI, and it is sweeter than them both, with more orange soda.

But I acknowledge and respect Laurice's hustle, because as Rockford said, she built this from nothing (can of worms, I know) 5 years ago, and is doing very very well.

But I still can't get past how synthetic and synthetically sweet the line is for the $$$
Reply
Reply
post #13 of 31
12/15/08 at 12:18am
Bond No9 is waaaaaay overrated for what it can offer.
To my mind, the majority are knockoffs of existing scents, and all are vastly overpriced at that.
Reply
Reply
post #14 of 31
12/15/08 at 12:32am
The whole philosophy of the line is based not on loving perfume but on loving stuff that is expensive and chic. That doesn't mean they can't churn out a decent perfume every once in a while, oreven a really good one, just as Malle, whose vision is entirely different can turn out something mediocre here and there. Ms. Rahme learned her marketing lesson from Creed and applied it to a different target group, but essentially she's like that house, but without its impressive back-catalogue of good fragrances. A good businesswomen for sure, but does she care whether she's selling glitzy flacons or gold-encrusted toilet seats?
Reply
Reply
post #15 of 31
12/15/08 at 12:45am
Thread Starter 
^I'm not sure either. LOL
In her defense, didn't she work in marketing for a length? She excelled at this.
I don't fault her for anything more than ingredient/sweetener quality across a line.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dimitri View Post

Bond No9 is waaaaaay overrated for what it can offer.
To my mind, the majority are knockoffs of existing scents, and all are vastly overpriced at that.

Bond's "Saks 5th men", jacked, of all things, N-18 by Pal Zileri? *makes cross-eyed face*
And the qualities the N-18 had became no more realistic, just corn-syrup-sweeter.
As a consumer, the quality of the knock-off is more important than the actual act.
Apologies to those active in the industry, but if one jacks and improves greatly upon a heart note/theme, I forgive. (and often buy)
Reply
Reply
post #16 of 31
12/15/08 at 1:23am
The case for plagiarism is a weak one, because everyone is copying everyone else anyway.
So to revert to the main focus of your question: are they worth their price?
If we take that strictly to the quality of the essences used, I don't see much difference with other brands: most houses use the same ingredients by the same manufacturing companies anyway.
If we take it to the artistry employed and the diversity of scents, then it all depends on particular scents: some are much nicer and much more well-thought out than others (New Haarlem and Silver Factory are very good, so is Chinatown; although I personally I am not crazy for the latter,; while Chelsea Flowers and some others are rather boring....)

I believe much of the price on the Bonds goes for the glamorous packaging that is indeed very luxe. The Swarovski ones glam it up especially.
I agree that smaller bottles would be perfect, but I seem to think that they do offer some kind of "refill" service or "fill a smaller bottle" at the boutiques? Not 100% sure about that as I never purchased from there in situ.
Reply
Reply
post #17 of 31
12/15/08 at 4:05am
So far i have only been impressed by Silver Factory.

But this one impressed me A LOT, and i absolutely love it.
Reply
Reply
post #18 of 31
12/15/08 at 4:55am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockford View Post

I think it is a remarkable achievement that Laurice Rahmé was able to start this company five years ago from absolutely nothing.

I like several of the Bond No. 9 fragrances, and two of them (New Haarlem and Silver Factory) have even made it to my top ten.
.

I agree, the home run hitter's that line's like SL and montale has are there, and the Bond basher's agree, but the flanker's don't make the entire line unacceptable.
Bleecker Street, Wall Street, West Side, Silver Factory, Chinatown, Lexington Avenue, and New Haarlem are by far some of my favorites.
Reply
Reply
post #19 of 31
12/15/08 at 5:03am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roc_Xel View Post

So far i have only been impressed by Silver Factory.

But this one impressed me A LOT, and i absolutely love it.

I agree, Silver Factory is the only one I own. I got it at a great price off eBay.

My wife's favorite is Saks Fifth Avenue for Her.
Reply
Reply
post #20 of 31
12/15/08 at 6:37am
I think the only two that impressed me enough to purchase were Bleeker and Riverside

The one nice thing about bonds you can get them really cheap on ebay
Reply
Reply
post #21 of 31
12/15/08 at 7:07am
Here's my take on Bond. At first I was quite aprehensive to the brand as a whole, none really impressed me enough to warrant a purchase ( New Haarlem was the closest), but as I have fallen farther and farther down the proverbial rabbit hole, that is this obsession, I have come back to Bond, and have truly begun to appreciate them for what they are. Bond fragrances speak to me. I, am a young, "urbane" guy who just likes to smell good. I appreciate the art of fragrance as much as anyone else, and intend to buy/try all that this world has to offer, but sometimes you want to just smell good. That's what designer scents are, they don't challenge the wearer's mind, they are what they are, designed to smell good. The problem with designer scents, to me at least, are the "general" lack of quality and originalty, constant clone after clone, off the factory line and onto your Sephora shelf. What Bond no. 9 seems to do for me is take the general theme of designer, the simple, young, smell-good attitude, and sort of "spruce" it up, make it slightly more 3-dimensional, higher quality, bigger WOW factor. They are for the most part easily approachable and easy to "get", they seem to straddle the line of niche and designer, and for me thats where I feel most comfortable.
Reply
Reply
post #22 of 31
12/15/08 at 7:47am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockford View Post

I think it is a remarkable achievement that Laurice Rahmé was able to start this company five years ago from absolutely nothing.
.

I agree.

Bond No. 9 is like Creed for the chic.

They smell and "feel" pretty run-of-the-mill IMO. I'd say New Haarlem and Silver Factory are the duo that have the most attitude. (and are also two in the line that caught my attention the most) Oh, and Bleecker Street plus Nuits de NoHo just smell great.

Nevertheless, I think they are both overrated and overpriced. A grand applause to the marketing team though!
Reply
Reply
post #23 of 31
12/15/08 at 9:07am
I've always been pretty simplistic regarding this hobby and despite my forays into niche and sprees of niche samples and all I have yet to be so impressed that it makes me think many are so much better than some designers. When I first tried Bond at Saks I was so impressed. The customer service was top notch, the scents were nice and different to me and I was excited. However once I sat down and over time tried 8-9 samples I realized that there weren't many that stood out me and the drydowns weren't near as impressive as the inital bursts. So overall i just don't think that the price is right for what I found to be a nice niche company. I can see $90-$100 but not $195
Reply
Reply
post #24 of 31
12/18/08 at 4:40am
At full price, Bond no 9 fragrances do appear to be overpriced but if they can be bought at more realistic price of around $130 for a 3.4oz bottle, I am quite happy with what I get.

Most bonds that I have tried have excellent longevity and projection. Yes, some of them do appear to have been 'highly inspired' by a lot of existing fragrances (read Creed) but that is not something that turns me off. Strange as it may sound, but they give value to me. If I spend US$120 buying a 4oz Creed Millesime Imperial and I can't seem to get any longevity from it, It makes better sense for me to buy a 3.4oz Bond Wall Street because that is something that replaces Creed MI for me and it does the job so much better. Wall Street lasts for ages on me. I can smell it the next morning. Bond Eau de New York is another favourite from this house. Beautiful Orange blossom and a great summer weather fragrance that lasts and lasts. Bond Hamptons is another beauty if someone wants a fragrance close to Creed SMW and a fragrance thats got life and isn't dead in an hour's time after being sprayed. Riverside Drive is another beauty from this house.

So yeah....at around US$130 bonds are amazing value and I perceive their quality to be much better than most other expensive fragrances (including Creed) and bond fragrances do best what fragrances are meant to do...they last long with very good projection and make you smell great as well..
Reply
Reply
post #25 of 31
12/18/08 at 5:37am
They have a few decent ones, imo (Eau d' New York, New Haarlem, and Creed-copies Chez Bond and Wall Street) but for the most part, they are boring, muddy, seriously overpriced, overhyped, and tacky.

"Muddy" is my favorite of the above words to describe Bond. Too much confusion and vague misdirection in the blends. Nothing resolute to present itself. No discernible character.

Not to mention the money-hungry bitch that runs it. (which is why I'd never buy from them in the first place) Remember when she tried to sue that perfumer for creating a scent called "Peace on Earth" because it used the word "peace", which apparently, she feels she has the exclusive rights to?! Does that sound like someone who's making perfume for the sake of artistry? Disgusting.
Reply
Reply
post #26 of 31
12/18/08 at 6:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by gupts View Post

At full price, Bond no 9 fragrances do appear to be overpriced but if they can be bought at more realistic price of around $130 for a 3.4oz bottle, I am quite happy with what I get.

Most bonds that I have tried have excellent longevity and projection. Yes, some of them do appear to have been 'highly inspired' by a lot of existing fragrances (read Creed) but that is not something that turns me off. Strange as it may sound, but they give value to me. If I spend US$120 buying a 4oz Creed Millesime Imperial and I can't seem to get any longevity from it, It makes better sense for me to buy a 3.4oz Bond Wall Street because that is something that replaces Creed MI for me and it does the job so much better. Wall Street lasts for ages on me. I can smell it the next morning. Bond Eau de New York is another favourite from this house. Beautiful Orange blossom and a great summer weather fragrance that lasts and lasts. Bond Hamptons is another beauty if someone wants a fragrance close to Creed SMW and a fragrance thats got life and isn't dead in an hour's time after being sprayed. Riverside Drive is another beauty from this house.

So yeah....at around US$130 bonds are amazing value and I perceive their quality to be much better than most other expensive fragrances (including Creed) and bond fragrances do best what fragrances are meant to do...they last long with very good projection and make you smell great as well..

Gupts, I'm pretty sure that Bond frags are in a slightly lower price bracket than Creed. I think a 4 oz Creed it US$250 and a 2.7 oz is US$210.00, where as Bond is 3.4oz for 198.00 and 1.7 oz. is US$140.00. Both Creed sizes are priced at over US$2/ml while the larger sized Bond is priced at below 2/ml. I may be focussing on the wrong part of your comment, but if for this arguments sake we consider Creed and Bond to have similar quality, then the price issue should either be irrelevant or weighted in favor of the Bonds.

On a side note. If you are getting 4 oz Creeds for 130.00 I wouldn't trust em'. For the sake of argument we should consider price at full retail value.
Reply
Reply
post #27 of 31
12/18/08 at 6:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtgprox05 View Post

Gupts, I'm pretty sure that Bond frags are in a slightly lower price bracket than Creed. I think a 4 oz Creed it US$250 and a 2.7 oz is US$210.00, where as Bond is 3.4oz for 198.00 and 1.7 oz. is US$140.00. Both Creed sizes are priced at over US$2/ml while the larger sized Bond is priced at below 2/ml. I may be focussing on the wrong part of your comment, but if for this arguments sake we consider Creed and Bond to have similar quality, then the price issue should either be irrelevant or weighted in favor of the Bonds.

On a side note. If you are getting 4 oz Creeds for 130.00 I wouldn't trust em'. For the sake of argument we should consider price at full retail value.

I agree that we should perhaps consider their 'recommended retail price' when making a decision about which is more cost effective but I'd still like to use the 'alternate pricing' at which these fragrances can be bought from ebay or other online retailers at discounted prices. I am not sure how many people here really pay 'full retail prices' for most of the fragrances they buy, but I generally buy them online at substantially low prices than their 'recommended retail'.

I'd however disagree with you, if you were to tell me that all 4oz Creeds that can be bought online for a little over US$120 are fakes. If you know how to source your stuff really well and you are patient then its not as difficult as it seems.
Reply
Reply
post #28 of 31
12/18/08 at 6:34am
Quote:
Originally Posted by gupts View Post

I agree that we should perhaps consider their 'recommended retail price' when making a decision about which is more cost effective but I'd still like to use the 'alternate pricing' at which these fragrances can be bought from ebay or other online retailers at discounted prices. I am not sure how many people here really pay 'full retail prices' for most of the fragrances they buy, but I generally buy them online at substantially low prices than their 'recommended retail'.

I'd however disagree with you, if you were to tell me that all 4oz Creeds that can be bought online for a little over US$120 are fakes. If you know how to source your stuff really well and you are patient then its not as difficult as it seems.

I agree, I didn't really write what I wanted to say correctly. You CAN get fresh, real, Creed for that price, I just wanted to say to be wary. But, on a site like scentiments or fragrancenet you can get a good many Bond for similar prices as Creed. I'm not as familiar with ebay prices as some so I can't speak for there. I have yet to purchase either a Bond or Creed at a discounted price, I'm just to nervous, and would rather shell out the extra 40-50 dollars to insure myself of the utmost freshness, but I intend to buy one sooner or later.
Reply
Reply
post #29 of 31
12/18/08 at 6:40am
So far I haven´t been terribly impressed with Bond offering. I like my perfumes to smell nice but not something you encounter on every street corner, and I imagien you could smell Bond on every street corner if it wasn´t for the price.

I like Lutens more probably because of its warmth and depth while I find that Bond often lack that almost syrupy feeling Lutens have.

I do have chinatown through swapping and I have a decant of saks fifth but I think that might be wrong because I thought the sample smelled different. :S
Reply
Reply
post #30 of 31
12/18/08 at 7:49am
Boring, uninspired, cloying, redundant and overpriced is my opinion of Bond.
Reply
Reply
post #31 of 31
12/18/08 at 11:24am
I own a few Bonds and for the most part I feel its style (or should I say packaging) over substance. Its sad when I find myself wanting to buy a Bond more for the bottle than for the juice. Also I took my time sampling this line and most of them smelled too strong or too synthetic at first. I am not sure if this had to do with the high percentage of oils or what but it turned me off to them for the longest. Eventually I did buy one and now they smell good to me so maybe my nose has become less sensitive.

Also I've only bought one Bond at retail. The rest of them I got on ebay for great prices. I dont think I would pay full retail for ANY Bond.

To be fair, Chinatown is probably their best offering (I might pay retail for that one). Amazing stuff IMO. I didn't care for any of the Creed clones though. I still want a bottle of B9 Brooklyn regardless of what the juice smells like.
Reply
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: MFD Archive

Features on Basenotes

Basenotes Reader Awards 2013 - Finalists Announced.
Petals Falling From The Sky - A Report From The Cote d'Azur's Bataille De Fleurs
Greatest Hits: Annick Menardo
Basenotes › Basenotes Forums › Fragrance Discussion › Male Fragrance Discussion › MFD Archive › Bond No. 9: Your thaughts on Price vs. Quality...