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Heritage question

post #1 of 44
5/6/10 at 3:47pm
Thread Starter 
Is the picture of the Guerlain Heritage bottle in the Directory the original release ?
Seems like the original release is a 4.2oz splash bottle ? Did it only came that way?

So, any Heritage released in the smaller,wider bottle is the original formulation ?

Thanks
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post #2 of 44
5/7/10 at 2:28pm
Thread Starter 
Nobody has an answer or opinion on this ?
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post #3 of 44
5/7/10 at 2:38pm
http://www.basenotes.net/threads/237...EDP?highlight=
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post #4 of 44
5/7/10 at 3:29pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by neal View Post

http://www.basenotes.net/threads/237...EDP?highlight=

Thank you for the link, but there is no answer in that to my question.
I'm aware of all the different releases of the longer, smaller bottle.
I need info on the shorter,bulkier bottle (see pic)
LL
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post #5 of 44
5/7/10 at 3:42pm
There used to be splash bottles like yours and spray bottles which were tall and thin. At some point they stopped making the splash, I think one or two packaging changes ago. It is not necessarily very old, but it is not the most recent version or the one before that, I think.
Mr G will have more specific information, I suspect.
There have been half a dozen heritage threads in the last few years and I'm pretty sure you question is covered in one.
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post #6 of 44
5/7/10 at 6:04pm
Thread Starter 
A lot of older posts on this subject are about the different EDT and EDP formulations.
Hardly any info on the shorter,wider bottle...
I'm just assuming that this shorter,wider bottle is the first original release of Heritage ? And that anything released in this bottle is the original formulation ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by hirch_duckfinder View Post

There used to be splash bottles like yours and spray bottles which were tall and thin. At some point they stopped making the splash, I think one or two packaging changes ago. It is not necessarily very old, but it is not the most recent version or the one before that, I think.
Mr G will have more specific information, I suspect.
There have been half a dozen heritage threads in the last few years and I'm pretty sure you question is covered in one.
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post #7 of 44
5/8/10 at 4:50am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaggy1 View Post

A lot of older posts on this subject are about the different EDT and EDP formulations.
Hardly any info on the shorter,wider bottle...
I'm just assuming that this shorter,wider bottle is the first original release of Heritage ? And that anything released in this bottle is the original formulation ?


No, as I said , they made the short splash bottle and the thin spray bottles from the start and for quite some time. Fairly recently they discontinued the splash. Not sure exactly when. So, as I said, splash bottle is not new but not necessarilly very old, though it could be.
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post #8 of 44
5/8/10 at 5:23am
Yes, according to the Guerlain bottle bible, the 100 ml atomizer bottle was made already in April 1992.
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post #9 of 44
5/8/10 at 6:44am
I think its better to look at the BOX that the squat splash bottle comes in, to acquaint yourself with whether it's original or 'new'. Do you have a pic of the box Snaggy1?
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post #10 of 44
5/8/10 at 8:29am
Thread Starter 
This is not exactly the easiest topic in the world, due to the various reformulations/different packaging over the last +/- 20 years, so bear with me...

There was no picture of the box for that shorter,wider bottle. So, I don't what kind of formulation it is (in the meantime that bottle has been sold,so I guess we'll never know...).
I'm aware of the different boxes that the Heritage bottles come in, to determine what formulation it is.

From a previous post, thanks to Scentemental, there are 3 or possible 4 formulations :

1. original vintage formulation (1992) in the deeper red, "classic" Guerlain packaging
2. 1st reformulation, I suspect sometime in the late 1990s (when LVMH took over Guerlain) with the box like the one pictured above but with out IFRA listings
3. 2nd reformulation, with the box like the one pictured above but with IFRA listings (c. 2002)
4. current reformulation (c. 2008?); although, I am not sure how much or if at all #4 differs from #3 not having tried it yet. I suspect that it does. Perhaps someone else can chime in.

Since we are all talking about the longer,thinner bottles in all formulations, I just automatically assumed that this shorter,wider bottle was the original formulation. Thank you, Duckfinder for letting me know that this is not always the case...

Back to my research again...
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post #11 of 44
5/9/10 at 7:34am
Thread Starter 
And, people with some knowledge on the different formulations/packaging of Heritage, feel free to leave your opinions on here...
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post #12 of 44
5/9/10 at 8:26am

As far as I can remember, I've never seen the more squarish splash bottle in anything but the original, deeper red, "classic" Guerlain packaging. Typically, and especially so before this last decade, on first release of a fragrance, there was usually a wide array of sizes available along with the option of splash or spray and, typically, when a fragrance was reformulated--more often than not as a cost cutting measure--the choice of bottles was mostly limited to the standard 3.4 oz/100 ml spray, sometimes a 1.7oz/50 ml spray as a means of reducing production costs. Packaging in such cases is almost always of cheaper quality and almost always more simplified as is the printing. This is, incidentally, a fairly certain way to spot reformulations via packaging changes. I can't imagine Guerlain reformulating Héritage and keeping the option of a splash bottle. I think it is safe to assume that splash bottles of Héritage EDT are original vintage formulation. As always, I stand to be corrected.

scentemental


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post #13 of 44
5/9/10 at 6:49pm
I don't know about the edt versions, but I know that the new Heritage edp and the old one are different. I have already had the new edp and when i used i got very disappointed since when i tried it i tried the old one. THe new one has something that seems chemical, plastic on my skin, while the old one seems more sweet and intense.
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post #14 of 44
5/10/10 at 8:57am
I've followed with interest this thread and want to add by posing a question:
does the batch number on the box and bottle tell us something about date production?

I bought a Heritage 50ml bottle from a e-tailer who touted it as vintage. To me it didn't make much difference since
I had nothing to compare it with. On the box and under the bottle is the batch no. 2F01.
The box includes copyright date of 1996. The ingredients listed are pre-IFRA style, alcohol, fragrance, water and colors. (see attachments) But the box is the later box (not the latest with the line from the top center).
The bottle looks contemporary too.

Is this the first reformulation? Or yesterday's reformulation?

At any rate, I like what Luca Turin calls its "huge brass chord".




Attachment 5666Attachment 5665Attachment 5664Attachment 5667
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post #15 of 44
5/10/10 at 12:07pm
Well, all things are relative. That batch code means 2002. But I'd say that 2002 is pretty vintage. It definitely has got oakmoss which was listed on the side until at least 2006.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdemetre View Post

I've followed with interest this thread and want to add by posing a question:
does the batch number on the box and bottle tell us something about date production?

I bought a Heritage 50ml bottle from a e-tailer who touted it as vintage. To me it didn't make much difference since
I had nothing to compare it with. On the box and under the bottle is the batch no. 2F01.
The box includes copyright date of 1996. The ingredients listed are pre-IFRA style, alcohol, fragrance, water and colors. (see attachments) But the box is the later box (not the latest with the line from the top center).
The bottle looks contemporary too.

Is this the first reformulation? Or yesterday's reformulation?

At any rate, I like what Luca Turin calls its "huge brass chord".




Attachment 5666Attachment 5665Attachment 5664Attachment 5667
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post #16 of 44
5/10/10 at 12:27pm
Thread Starter 
Would it be safe to say that the picture here enclosed, is the original Heritage formulation ?

jdemetre, I will check my bottles and see what kind batch # we are talking about.
LL
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post #17 of 44
5/10/10 at 12:32pm
Thread Starter 
Mr G, can you please explain to me how a batch # 2F01 means that bottle is from 2002 ?
Just trying to understand....

Thank you



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. G View Post

Well, all things are relative. That batch code means 2002. But I'd say that 2002 is pretty vintage. It definitely has got oakmoss which was listed on the side until at least 2006.
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post #18 of 44
5/10/10 at 1:03pm
In 2000, Guerlain replaced a rather complex batch code system (undecipherable letters and numbers) with a simple one where the first number is the year of juice production. This year, 2010, the code starts with a zero.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaggy1 View Post

Mr G, can you please explain to me how a batch # 2F01 means that bottle is from 2002 ?
Just trying to understand....

Thank you
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post #19 of 44
5/10/10 at 1:13pm
The Guerlain "bottle bible" lists two glass makers of the Héritage bottle, and further that one of them stopped making the splash bottles in 1997. However, it doesn't say anything about the other maker's time frame, but it could suggest that the splash was discontinued in 1997.

For your pictured Héritage: One way of estimate the relative vintage of a Guerlain is the box design. That design is pre-1996. In 1996, the boxes got a new look with the name written at the top of the box in a gold rectangle.


1996 design


Pre-1996 design

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaggy1 View Post

Would it be safe to say that the picture here enclosed, is the original Heritage formulation ?

jdemetre, I will check my bottles and see what kind batch # we are talking about.
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post #20 of 44
5/10/10 at 1:19pm
MR G, do you know if the EDP version was reformulated too?
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post #21 of 44
5/10/10 at 2:04pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rickbr View Post

MR G, do you know if the EDP version was reformulated too?

Yes, it was.
For the EDP, there is 1 original and at least 1 reformulation.
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post #22 of 44
5/10/10 at 2:05pm
Thread Starter 
When there are IFRA listings on the box, does that mean that Heritage bottle is newer than boxes without IFRA listings ?
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post #23 of 44
5/10/10 at 4:28pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaggy1 View Post

When there are IFRA listings on the box, does that mean that Heritage bottle is newer than boxes without IFRA listings ?

OK,,, so I checked my Heritage bottles for the batch # and the year that it was released.
According to Scentimental, there are 4 possible versions/formulations of Heritage.

In the picture are my 4 Heritage bottles.
Starting with the original formulation on the left, with the maroon packaging (did not find a batch # on this bottle).
Second from left is the reformulation (with batch #2F01), released in 2002 and no IFRA list on the box. From this version on, the color of the box is more orange instead maroon like the original release.
Third bottle, with batch #6K01, released in 2006 and with IFRA list on the side of the box.
Fourth bottle is the current formulation.

Hopefully Scentimental or Dr G, or anybody who is knowledgeable on this subject, can correct or confirm this.
Thank you Scentimental, Dr G and Duckfinder for your input/previous posts on this subject.


LL
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post #24 of 44
5/10/10 at 5:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaggy1 View Post

OK,,, so I checked my Heritage bottles for the batch # and the year that it was released.
According to Scentimental, there are 4 possible versions/formulations of Heritage.

In the picture are my 4 Heritage bottles.
Starting with the original formulation on the left, with the maroon packaging (did not find a batch # on this bottle).
Second from left is the reformulation (with batch #2F01), released in 2002 and no IFRA list on the box. From this version on, the color of the box is more orange instead maroon like the original release.
Third bottle, with batch #6K01, released in 2006 and with IFRA list on the side of the box.
Fourth bottle is the current formulation.

Hopefully Scentimental or Dr G, or anybody who is knowledgeable on this subject, can correct or confirm this.
Thank you Scentimental, Dr G and Duckfinder for your input/previous posts on this subject.


Snaggy, you really love Heritage! I'm my opinion is one of the best classic quiet fragrance, rich in its details but never overpowering. What differences do you detect between each version?

On that bottle you showed at the begining, Guerlain launched a beautiful limited edition, with signed and numered bottles. Have you already saw that?
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post #25 of 44
5/10/10 at 6:17pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rickbr View Post

On that bottle you showed at the begining, Guerlain launched a beautiful limited edition, with signed and numered bottles. Have you already saw that?

No, I never saw that Limited Edition bottle.
There is no doubt that Heritage is my fave fragrance.
Makes me feel like a Million Dollars!
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post #26 of 44
5/11/10 at 4:35am
The demand to perfume manufacturers to list potential allergens on the boxes came in the middle of and parallel to reformulation and redesigning, so the listing on the box can be different while the juice itself is the same. It's very complex indeed!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaggy1 View Post

When there are IFRA listings on the box, does that mean that Heritage bottle is newer than boxes without IFRA listings ?
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post #27 of 44
5/11/10 at 8:47pm
Snaggy1, your pictures and detailed assessment of Heritage EdT is great. Thanks - I've always wanted to do this research myself and never got around to it.

I've never smelled 'vintage' EdT, only the current juice. I like it, but my heart belongs to the vintage EdP which is just glorious stuff and I hope to own a bottle one-of-these-days.
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post #28 of 44
5/12/10 at 12:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaggy1 View Post

No, I never saw that Limited Edition bottle.
There is no doubt that Heritage is my fave fragrance.
Makes me feel like a Million Dollars!

Here's a snap of mine. Nr 699 of 4000. This signed 125ml EDT edition was not offered for sale - but given as press/media gifts at the time of its launch.

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post #29 of 44
5/12/10 at 4:35am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeperez23 View Post

Snaggy1, your pictures and detailed assessment of Heritage EdT is great. Thanks - I've always wanted to do this research myself and never got around to it.

I've never smelled 'vintage' EdT, only the current juice. I like it, but my heart belongs to the vintage EdP which is just glorious stuff and I hope to own a bottle one-of-these-days.

Thank you, Mikeperez23! I appreciate your comment a lot!
Talking about the EDP, I received a bottle of vintage EDP 2 days ago. Still have to try it out, but I'm sure it will be superb!
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post #30 of 44
5/12/10 at 8:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaggy1 View Post

Thank you, Mikeperez23! I appreciate your comment a lot!
Talking about the EDP, I received a bottle of vintage EDP 2 days ago. Still have to try it out, but I'm sure it will be superb!

You're welcome. Always happy to see a newbie who appreciates the artistry and achievements of the house of Guerlain.

I am wearing the very last of my decant of the vintage EdP as my SOTD. When I sprayed it on this morning, the first thing I notice is a very prominent sandalwood note, right off the bat. Maybe in the vintage juice Guerlain used real Mysore sandalwood (?). It's a bit more 'meaty' than the sharp radiance of the EdT. It's a tiny detail, but it's what makes it click for me.
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post #31 of 44
5/12/10 at 9:35am
^^^
I agree completely Mike, I also notice a very high quality sandalwood note from top to bottom in the vintage (1996 orange box) EDP that I don't smell in the vintage (1996 orange box) EDT, although I think there must be sandalwood in the EDT too, but it's very pronounced in the EDP.
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post #32 of 44
5/12/10 at 10:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeperez23 View Post

You're welcome. Always happy to see a newbie who appreciates the artistry and achievements of the house of Guerlain.

I am wearing the very last of my decant of the vintage EdP as my SOTD. When I sprayed it on this morning, the first thing I notice is a very prominent sandalwood note, right off the bat. Maybe in the vintage juice Guerlain used real Mysore sandalwood (?). It's a bit more 'meaty' than the sharp radiance of the EdT. It's a tiny detail, but it's what makes it click for me.

So now it makes sense why while i didn`t dectect so significant differences between the old edp and the new edp, i found the vintage edp richer and more natural...
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post #33 of 44
5/12/10 at 2:13pm
rickbr - you can find a HUGE amount of information on the differences between Heritage vintage and new Eau de Parfum, and the differences in the bottles / boxes/ caps on Indie_Guy's thread from last year here: http://www.basenotes.net/threads/238...view?p=1657251
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post #34 of 44
5/12/10 at 4:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeperez23 View Post

rickbr - you can find a HUGE amount of information on the differences between Heritage vintage and new Eau de Parfum, and the differences in the bottles / boxes/ caps on Indie_Guy's thread from last year here: http://www.basenotes.net/threads/238...view?p=1657251

Thanks for the link Mike!
I discovered that I have the first reformulation of Heritage, since my bottle is the 75ml refill. It has a slightly different opening from the first edp that I bought, but is much better than the recent one, which I weared one time and couldn't wear again because of the strange opening
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post #35 of 44
5/15/10 at 4:32pm
Thread Starter 
The mystery continues...

2 vintage bottles of Heritage...
One of them has a batch # (ZK 2CA 2) on the bottom and on the side of the box, the other doesn't.
The only difference is that the box with the batch # is more of a matte box than the other one, which is a glossy box.
LL
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post #36 of 44
8/10/10 at 12:32pm
I guess the questions have been answered, so i wanted tot add that there's also a newer bottle, rectangular shaped, of the 75 ml Héritage, with golden "framing" on the actual bottle, different from the "regular" bottle. The shape is similar to that of the L'arsene lupin bottles but golden framed, golden normal heritage juice, and round bulkier cap. I think it's limited ed as well.
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post #37 of 44
8/10/10 at 1:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by castorpollux View Post

I guess the questions have been answered, so i wanted to add that there's also a newer bottle, rectangular shaped, of the 75 ml Héritage, with golden "framing" on the actual bottle, different from the "regular" bottle. The shape is similar to that of the L'arsene lupin bottles but golden framed, golden normal heritage juice, and round bulkier cap. I think it's limited ed as well.

Can you post a link?
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post #38 of 44
8/11/10 at 2:52pm
Thread Starter 
Castorpollux,, can you post a link please, so we can "see" what that new design is ?
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post #39 of 44
8/11/10 at 3:12pm
you can head over to monsieurguerlain's site, a fellow basenoter and he has many bottle galleries, i believe he has one pic over there

the link is here:
http://monsieurguerlain2.blogspot.co...ollection.html

His site is great so make sure to contact him and thank him too!

cheers

note: he was on Basenotes a long time ago but i don't know if he's still active or if he canceled his account, he posted the link to his website ages ago.
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post #40 of 44
8/11/10 at 3:48pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by castorpollux View Post

you can head over to monsieurguerlain's site, a fellow basenoter and he has many bottle galleries, i believe he has one pic over there

the link is here:
http://monsieurguerlain2.blogspot.co...ollection.html

His site is great so make sure to contact him and thank him too!

cheers

note: he was on Basenotes a long time ago but i don't know if he's still active or if he canceled his account, he posted the link to his website ages ago.

Thank you for the link. However, these bottles are not new designs. As a matter of fact, those are the original bottles (EDT and EDP) that were used, to release Heritage. I'm also thinking that the right bottle (the longer smaller one with the gold frame) was a refill bottle.
Feel free to correct me, if I'm mistaken.
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post #41 of 44
8/11/10 at 4:06pm
you might want to ask Mr.Guerlain about his bottle of course, he's a nice guy so he'll help you out.

cheers!
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post #42 of 44
8/11/10 at 10:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by castorpollux View Post

you can head over to monsieurguerlain's site, a fellow basenoter and he has many bottle galleries, i believe he has one pic over there

the link is here:
http://monsieurguerlain2.blogspot.co...ollection.html

His site is great so make sure to contact him and thank him too!

cheers

note: he was on Basenotes a long time ago but i don't know if he's still active or if he canceled his account, he posted the link to his website ages ago.

Mr. G is on vacation and will most likely be back posting on BN soon.
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post #43 of 44
8/12/10 at 8:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by castorpollux View Post

I guess the questions have been answered, so i wanted tot add that there's also a newer bottle, rectangular shaped, of the 75 ml Héritage, with golden "framing" on the actual bottle, different from the "regular" bottle. The shape is similar to that of the L'arsene lupin bottles but golden framed, golden normal heritage juice, and round bulkier cap. I think it's limited ed as well.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think that is a new bottle as one of the vintage EdP versions used to come in that gold-framed bottle. I recently saw it on either Scentemental or Xmen's sale thread.
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post #44 of 44
8/12/10 at 2:06pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by manicboy View Post

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think that is a new bottle as one of the vintage EdP versions used to come in that gold-framed bottle. I recently saw it on either Scentemental or Xmen's sale thread.

Right,,, that's what I said in Post #40
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