Sorry, but i just need to vent for a second...

Wow, I wasn't interested in Bang until now. You've totally put me on to this fragrance! Without this post I never would have given it a glance. I mean - steak? Really!? Cool.

Sometimes, the more strange a scent is, the more popular it becomes on BN. Often times, the more ordinary a scent is, the less popular it is on BN

One thing to keep in mind is a lot of BNers have sniffed hundreds, if not thousands of other fragrances. So when they sniff something like Bleu, that borrows or resembles a ton of other frags they may have smelled over the years they their can be a lot of hatred (disappointment) pointed towards the frag.

I would suggest checking out Dullah and Redneck Perfumisto. They share similar interests in frags with you and I and their posts are always well written with great detail. I may not always agree with their opinions but they are a good starting point in finding other frags you might like.

For older members here it often is: the weirder, the better

One possible conclusion would be to appreciate both as - bosh? While the Chanel has been a rough disapointment in that and the Jacobs is expectedly so.

Bosh should read as generic, dispensable, of no interest, not even worth the tester, not living up the hype. There are hundreds of fragrance releases a year, so why bother with that screechy Chanel issue any more? It may even be the late coming best in a row of generic oh so manly sharp and fresh de-odorants, but having smelt all its multi tens of predecessors, what shalls? I need no plastic masquerade of my own very peculiar but worthwile bodily odors. If somebody else does, it is forgiven, though.

I've felt this way before too, Jonny. Around here, sometimes the weird gets praised more than the wonderful, especially if the wonderful happens to be mainstream in any way.

Now, that's not to say I don't love it here. I do! I just make it a point to speak my mind about any fragrance I come across, even when my opinion is definitely against the masses (like my quiet admiration for Davidoff Adventure, for instance). One other thing I like to do is hop over to Fragrantica and see what the general opinion of a scent is there. It's really interesting to me because they have a completely different vibe there, and sometimes have their own 'group think' that can be the polar opposite of the general consensus here on BN. Bang, for instance, has 6 votes each of "Love", "Like" and "Dislike" over on Fragrantica. A lot of the reviews there pan it, too.

My only complaint, if I can call it that, with BN, is that it seems like fragrances are automatically more respected and more liked by a large number of users here if the fragrances are very spicy, woody, incense-laded or oriental. It sometimes feels like a number of mediocre/highly synthetic/poorly blended heavy frags get a lot of love while some really greatly blended modern/fresh/aquatic scents get completely overlooked simply because of their (lack of?) pedigree.

If you really love a scent though and think it's not getting enough respect, try to open the eyes of others to its virtues. That's what BN is all about and we can always use more of that kind of talk around here. It can really work, too. I kind of spearheaded the Versace PH movement back when I had found it and fallen in love with it, and it seemed as though that brought out a lot of others who were silently admiring it, against the BN-tide.

Besides, it's always nice to see more positive oriented threads (this is why I love X!) than negative ones. (advice I should listen to myself )

Hmmm...? I was under the impression that Chanel Bleu had more than its fair share of admirers and even won over quite a few initial sceptics... But I do agree that expectations are understandably higher for such an esteemed house as Chanel. I think if you love a fragrance, you should share & spread some of that love around here...but I'd avoid doing it at the expense of another fragrance release especially when they are no real basis for comparison other than their release dates.

It is perfectly alright to love something that is roundly dissed by experienced members. Sometimes experience does get in the way of simple enjoyment...of smelling 'nice'.

Just love what you love , it doesnt matter what anyone else thinks

I have received several compliments when wearing Bang. But maybe the people were just hungry at the time.

True words written here. Any critics must not bash those who love a fragrance for what ever reason. And as far as I've seen nobody has been assigned a bad taste or someting for buying Blue of Chanel.

Mr Polge himself defined the new issue of the house of Chanel as intentionally generic in the tradition of barbershop style scents. If I got him right it is addressed to generic businessmen that want to smell of something generic when leaving the toilet in a public jet airplane (his words, really!). Mr. Polge analyzes the situation further, that male fragrance has it's roots in after shave. So, even the attitude of the new release is completely revealed: being not extraordinary despite being a Chanel and so showing extraordinary understatement not at least as coming from France grin:

I'm very clear on this issue.

I really like Bang - even though I hate the name and the bottle. I like peppery fragrances and this is like a lighter version of Cacharel pour homme.

Neither is it a girl repellent, in fact women seem to really like it.

However, Bleu de Chanel is Polge's darkest hour. Chanel had the opportunity to create something special with this fragrance and have created the bastard cousin of the equally appalling Champion by Davidoff, which smells remarkably similar.

Bleu De Chanel is so safe I'm surprised it doesn't come with a three point safety harness and built-in airbags. It's derivative, dull and unimaginative.

Bang at least doesn't smell like every other designer fragrance on the market.

Bleu de Chanel simply put, is mainstream mundane mediocrity.

I like Bleu.

Ah, such is the wondrous diversity of Basenotes ;-)

johnny 19 you get the prize for best post of the week. Bang (aka Bust) is a joke. It is nothing more than a bad ripoff of Terre d Hermes and for the life of me and I can't understand why anyone doesn't see that. I did two skin tests with it. The first time I tested it opposite Blue which was a mistake because couldn't get a clear scent, though I was liking it (or what I thought was it) then. The next day when I used a sample on its own I couldn't believe it. It was just TdH watered down. Not only that it vanished on my skin in an hour or two. Damn, and I almost bought a bottle of it. Luckily I went with Bleu and glad to have done so.

BTW Coty makes Bang, and I needn't say anymore about that.

Very well said from an intelligent man. Just enjoy what you enjoy.

I really don't understand the original posters whole "rant". Bleu has been smelled by more people. It likely has more people enjoying it as well. Chanel is also a larger brand in perfume than Jacobs is. When was the last time Jacobs released a scent for men ? When a thread discusses everyones favorite fragrance house, I don't think I have ever seen Marc Jacobs ever poster. Chanel has to live with the higher expectations.

Also, johnny, you may not like Bang, but that doesn't mean other guys can't like it.

I get a kick out of you taking one response from one guy and saying it represents Basenotes.

If sillage and longevity aren't a problem which it shouldn't be then yes it would because it will certainly be a unique scent.

I don't even understand why anyone has a desire to sample these kinds of frag. Really, it wastes time that I'd rather spend smelling something that I know I like !

I could whip up a custom batch of that for you if you're interested. I'd sell it to you for the same price as Bleu - $79 for 100ml.

I can say that there are a lot of different reasons as to why both scents are not in the same league.

Chanel is a house that has a very strong branch on perfumery, dating back years and years, uses top ingredients and generally tries to stay both commercially viable and at the same time generating quality products for fragrance lovers.
The tremendous expectation for one of Chanel's upcoming scents is almost unparalleled and pales the competition easily.

Marc Jacobs on the other hand is a fresh designer house that has basically no history dating back enough for the house to make any kind of expectation for a new scent.

Virtually all of Marc Jacobs scents have been neither ground breaking and/or controversial, and most being very safe and going with the current markets. So the expectation on a new scent by MJ is near to null (let alone that one being either interesting or original).

I agree that Bang has not being slammed as it should be but the fragrance is not a step down on a house that has many fans or many good fragrances, as opposed to Chanel.

Now, why do I think Bang "has not being slammed as it should be"? Because I think that Bang is a simple -and i agree with you- black pepper fragrance that doesn't offer much, other than black pepper. Layering? almost non existent. Potency? strong, but do you want your pepper to smell for hours? At the most, it is a good scent for layering experiments of our own.

Another point is (and I have said it before but I think it needs to be said again) that Bang is a poor rendition of a classic, better scent from a house that has come up with strong offerings over the years.
Which house? Caron. Which scent? Poivre.
Poivre is everything Bang is not.

Bang is as of now, one of MJ's best offerings both in simplicity, longevity and truthfulness to a simple note: pepper.
So, in short, it is a point up for the fragrance branch of the house.

That is not the case for Bleu de Chanel.
Expectation, unoriginality and lack of guts have sinked Chanel's credibility among some fragrance lovers.

cheers

Hey jonny, first of all, its normal that with that many of us as here on BN every scent has admireres and opponents.
For many people here, especially those who post lots and own incredible numbers of frags attraction towards the other sex is indeed not even a factor taken into account for judging a new scent whereas creativity, uniqueness and daringness is. Heavily.
Without any arrogance intended at all I'm more than curious if/how your taste will change after say a year of constant sniffing and sharing of thoughts here. I would bet a bottle of bang that you will find yourself drawn more and more towards edgy, different scents and repeatedly smelling similar scent at every new launch will get increasingly frustrating. Or you might stay with those scent that you already have now. But then I dont think that the enthusiasm for this hobby will keep.
I can absolutely appreciate Bleu for what it is but for me thats not enough anymore.
Maybe like if you get into painting for some great scenery drawings. You might stop then and there completely fullfilled with art that most people with perceive as beautifull. But due to constant contact to art and its many forms you might as well find yourself drawn to more abstract paintings such as Picasso etc. the more the taste specialises (I dont say Improve!) the harder to satisfy it get's.
And I dont think there's a community in the world with more specialised, hard-to-please experts in perfumery than BN.
plus I think the supporters (of Bleu) just dont speak up as loud as the opponents.

I always regarded this "pros" and "cons" arguments as a mechanism of social networking: in communities such as this one, popularity depend to a great extent to what prominent members of the community say and how convincing are these arguments for the laymen. In the case of scents, you have to add the attraction of the scent's brandname, its distribution and pricing policies as well as the way it is being promoted and advertised. Many other members will follow suggestions and reviews, only to realize that the scents being the object of raving reviews just don't fit their expectations.

Just check out fragances being recently released that are the focus of discussions... months later you will find them offered in the sales thread - I am thinking of Encre Noire.

Arguments on Bang being not so good as Blue, or Blue not being as good as Bang? Well, I don't care much about those. Now, I do apreciate Jonny's mentioning that Bang is linear while Blue is complex.

I wonder that the secret lies in leaving opinions away and centering reviews in technical aspects. The point is that limits between these two approaches can be quite opaque.

Both are just - whatevers.

Bleu smells awesome for the first 15-20 minutes. If it just stayed like that, it'd be a winner. But by an hour later it is GONE. You'd have a stronger scent on you from scented bath soap or Bath&Bodyworks lotion than from this 'cologne'. It's just one sliver beyond smelling like absolutely nothing from an hour on. You'd have to hit yourself with it every hour to keep it smelling good. And you know what - they'll sell a trillion of them this holiday season, because it's safe, and subtle, etc. etc.

BANG - What an awesome bottle. That bottle rocks. The fragrance in it had me excited - at first. But after wearing the sample for a couple days, I realized - there are only TWO times a year I would wear this fragrance: Thanksgiving dinner with family, and Christmas dinner, with family. Anywhere else with anyone else, forget about it. To sum up what BANG is similar to - remember years ago all those green Christmas Tree air freshners you hang in your car? BANG has captured this wonderful essense, and put it in a smashingly nice bottle.

I think the only reason these two are being argued together or vs. each other in these posts is because if you walk into any Nordstrom's - the SA's are all over you in an instant trying to peddle this crap, and there's big instore displays for both, literally side by side. The fragrances themselves have nothing whatsoever to do with each other though IMO.

Duh - have you not got it yet? It's all down to personal preference. I like Bang, you don't, so what? Get over it.

Honestly I have to say I completely agree with OP on every point 100%.

"Sometimes"?

Having bought Bleu, and just biding my time before I buy Bang, I'm happy to admit that I love both. They're both awesome in their own way.

I'll take the steak analogy further. Bleu is kind of like chicken nuggets prepared by a French chef using the same treatment he used wonderfully on pheasant. Once I get past the crunchy clichés - and my own reaction to it as cliché - I realize that Nuggets Bleu is actually more interesting to me than the pheasant was.

Bang is like an outrageous blackened pepper-steak in a mod downtown restaurant that has most folks high-tailing it back to the 'burbs. Admittedly, it's so "BN-approved non-cliché" that it's cliché, and it does mimic a bunch of BN faves mercilessly, but it does so VERY nicely.

BTW, the SA at Macy's today told me that Bang is doing VERY well. I'm really pleased to hear that, because it means that stronger and more BN-ish fragrances are potentially coming back into style.

this is why i am bitter with most designer companies the scents all smell the same, are too safe, not made with attention to detail and are not unique at all.

I don't understand all of the love for Bleu.....I don't understand the dis-like for Bang.....There are times that none of this makes any sense to me at all.....I go to the counter and spray the scent that I'm looking for at that time.....I make my own decision.....There is no review that can make me love or hate something that I've sampled myself.....I make the decision.....I make the purchase or I decide not to make the purchase.....Nothing will ever change that.....ever!!!
Gary

Why did Chanel release Bleu at the beginning of the fall? It seemed to my nose that this is clearly a spring/summer scent. Why release a fresh aquatic-ish in the fall?

Easy - say it with me - CHRISTMASSSS

^ LOL SO true. Plant it on the women's counter..... beat Acqua di Gio to the punch..... I think you have it pegged.

It seems like Armani is already fighting back. Guess what was on the MEN'S counter at Macy's today? ACQUA DI GIOIA - the new feminine. Two can play that game!

I love bleu de chanel. I bought a 3.4 ounce and its my signature scent for a while! I originally was going in to buy chanel allure sport but got bleu instead because its more pleasant to me

I think the majority of BN aren't into "weird" fragrances. We just don't like boring ones. Sure, a lot of the new fragrances being released aren't bad at all. They smell nice. Almost like pop music. The songs sound alright, but nothing out of the ordinary. It's all about fads. You can have your Buckcherry and your Hinder, I will stick to my Flica.



If you want to find something that will really resonate with you, you need to look. BN helps with that though and can help make the search considerably shorter. You need to sample, sample, sample and try everything you can. When it comes down to it we're here to discuss fragrances, not argue over them. We may disagree, but that's great! Taste is a beautiful thing! It's what reminds us that we're all completely different.

No offense to anyone, but people are biased, we're all guilty of it. Yes Bleu gets criticized for being generic (and as much as I'm disappointed with it, I'd still rate it a neutral), while in this age, anything that is "different" or not safe/conventional gets a few extra points. I think people are mistaken something being different or unique from being actually excellent and creative, those words are not synonyms.

take Sécrétions Magnifiques for example, some people are giving it positive feedback just due to the fact it's different, risky, and straight up not appealing to the average nose. It's just a vile fragrance no matter how you put it, MKK is an example of something unsafe done very well. But oh well, people are going to be biased toward anything that says "non-conformist" and vise versa.

Well I own both Bleu and Bang, and I enjoy them both. Bang might be a little bit edgier of the two, but I think Bleu is the superior scent. Yes, originally I wrote Bleu off as too derivative and lackluster. But I've come around, I basically think of Bleu as the last word on designer aquatics now. I mean, it's the best designer aquatic I know of (and I don't know that I'd even consider it an entirely aquatic frag). It's just a versatile, quality, pleasant scent that might take a while to appreciate due to its understatement and its similarities with other, better known fragrances. I can understand why some wouldn't care for it, but I think it's gotten more of a drubbing here than it deserves. It's not a dazzling scent, in fact it tries to be just the opposite. Sometimes you just want to smell good without necessarily drawing attention to yourself. That's what Bleu is good at, and I think there is a place for this type of fragrance.

I don't want to sound like an ass, but why is this such a difficult concept to grasp? If you saw a movie, would you want to go see the same movie again, just with a different name? Not to mention spend money on it? And, please, if you say yes, then I don't know what else to tell you. I, like many others, appreciate something that deviates from the center, from every other thing out there, something that pushes fragrance in an unexpected direction. That's not to say that attractiveness is thrown away, far from it, it must be attractive and well-made, but please, don't rehash what House ABC released last year, just because it was successful.

...and they call me "Off-Scenter."

I can't say Redneck Perfumisto took the words out of my mouth because I never would have thought of describing these two fragrances in such terms ... but this pretty much sums up my feelings exactly. (Aside from making me really, really hungry.)

As it happens, Bang was my SOTD today. Oddly, I like smelling like a steak, especially on a slightly hung over Monday morning at work.

I think these reactions from people are more about fulfilling expectations than how great the fragrances are.

People have high expectations of Chanel. We need our heroes and champions to look up to and Chanel almost always delivers. But this was a let down. Chanel has huge tradition of excellence innovation and style for fragrance as well as fashion. This is the house of Cuir de Russie, No. 5, Pour Monsieur, 28 La Pausa, Sycomore, No. 19 and No. 22 etc, etc. So people expected more from Chanel. Bleu is nice. But I have never gotten excited when putting it on. Bleu is not a creative scent - it is derivative of things that already exist - too many to mention.

Nobody expected much from Marc Jacobs - his last few scents were yawns. But then Bang - it is fresh and creatively different from most of what is out there. Bang may not be that great ten years from now, but it is certainly a new fresh wood scent idea and he deserves some credit for being creative. Bang out performed expectations and we are impressed!

Another thing I sense from many of these responses is that Bleu was released at the wrong time in the cycle of what's being put out by other companies. The market is flooded with "fresh, sexy, and clean" scents, and companies are churning out fresh aquatic sporty flankers like crazy. Doesn't matter how well constructed Bleu may or may not be, it still falls into this genre that is wayyyyy overdone right now.

That's so true.

I'm pretty much one of the snobby BNers who don't like scents like Bleu, and I'll admit it. It doesn't mean that I'm right and anyone else is wrong - we just have different tastes.

I think of it like movies. Every summer, there's a glut of big explosion movies. Excessive CGI, the bad dialogue, the one-dimensional characters, the tacked-on romantic sub-plot. We've seen a million of them. Sure, some are better than others, and every once in a while one comes along that's actually decent, but they're interchangeable and predictable and they're intended as mindless entertainment. And that's fine. And some people enjoy them on a deeper level, too, studying the effects and the direction and treat them as art, even though they're really more just commerce.

Then, there are the snooty art films. They're meant to be dissected and studied and picked apart. They have very limited appeal compared to the blockbuster explosion movies, but they're there to appeal to people who are into that sort of thing. If you love really getting deep into a movie and really giving it some real thought, there are movies that are meant for that, while explosion movies really aren't.

Basenotes, as opposed to other fragrance forums, tends to be the hangout of the art-house types, when it comes to scents. Many of the people here have smelled and know thousands of scents, have studied perfumery and raw materials, and have long since figured out that hundreds of them smell basically the same, and just don't get that excited when another woody amber/bergamot/calone scent comes out.

Again, no one is better. It's just a different way of looking at things, and yes, it means that sometimes some of us give high marks to something just for being different.

A significant portion of senior basenoters are not open minded enough to appreciate a mainstream release.

This lack of broad mindedness is disguised as "enhanced appreciation".

Actually, Bang is more about the vetiver for me. I haven't found a vetiver I don't like, unless it's one of those vetiver fragrances for non-vetiver fans :P

This is a matter of taste, and I find it in bad taste to slag off other members values and opinions.

Sure, my wardrobe isn't that hardcore or loaded, but I've been here for almost 3 years now (wow, that long since my 1st bottle, huh?). If I learned anything here, I learned to stick with what I feel fits how I dress, talk, walk, and present myself. I try not to overpay for particular types of compositions and I know what's worth the money. I've smelled a lot of things and I've got quite a bit on my plate to sample, but I've gotten lazy since my last expedition in the fragrance counter. I just read Basenotes to get a gist of what notes I'm looking for and various views on how a fragrance is interpreted. I stopped being do dependent on whether or not people liked something I'm looking into. I used to get a little discouraged when members would scoff at something I like, but that's their prerogative. At the end of the day, I'm spraying that stuff on myself.

As far as Bang and Bleu de Chanel. I briefly smelled both a couple weeks back. Bang isn't my style. It's great for an old school traditionalist who wants a tiny bit of flare, but wants to stay hip with the kids by saying he's rockin' Marc Jacobs. Bleu de Chanel just smells good. That's about it. Pinpointing the pluses and quality out of this one seems to require more wears to get past what you'd typically find at every common fragrance counter. Quite a lot of people don't have that kind of patience nor do they think it should be necessary to take that many wears to see it. I think both fragrances are classy in their own ways, but they both pull that off differently. I'll give Bang some credit for pulling off the black pepper vibe better than Burberry The Beat, but that's just me. As for Coty being behind Marc Jacob fragrances, I could care less who makes it as long as it's decent. I just think Chanel's Bleu de Chanel is Platinum Egoiste 2.0 to me (in terms of how it's marketed), if anything. Great for folks who liked the newer Chanel stuff and stuff like YSL L'Homme. It's great for gals looking to buy their significant other a bottle of something nice.

If you don't feel like seeing where some people are coming from when it comes to opinions, it's best to just ignore it then. Saves you a lot of grief, believe me. LOL

I agree to a certain extent, but then again not completely. IMO, I wouldn't liken the Basenotes forum to art-house film. I think even that is a bit to deep into a niche that many Basenoters don't delve. If that was the case, you'd see the super-niche houses like Sonoma Scent Studios and any number of other micro-houses being talked about relentlessly, and that's just not the case. Maybe viewing us through the eyes of a mainstream consumer, would paint us in that light, but in all honesty, I think we are much more similar to a general movie forum. The mainstream consumer wouldn't likely seek out message boards to discuss movies, but there are those out there that seek a deeper appreciation of the art, be it mainstream or not. Personally, I fall into a category somewhere between those two extremes of the mindless popcorn flick and the film that makes all the festival rounds. I'm a bit of a simpleton, I enjoy being entertained, but I appreciate that it be done well. Thus, it leads me to Basenotes where I can seek out those that may have slipped through the cracks of the mainstream for whatever reason, and (though I may be off base with this), feel that many others on BN may have a similar view.

At this point in sales it will be the new age ADG very soon. SOOOOOOOO many people around here are wearing like its Issey Miyake. Its ordinary but nice but way too popular.

And there it is!

It would be nice if we could judge scents in a vacuum, but the fact is, we do judge new releases on context and expectations.

Bleu did not meet many of our expectations of Chanel (mine included - plus I might be sensitive to some aromachemical in it), and was released in the context of impatience with me-too fresh scents. Bang beat our expectations and took advantage of the same context that has worked against Bleu, even though the scent may or may not be "objectively" (as if that's even possible) better.

lol your spot on i used to like spicy fragrances until i got le male and man now i just can`t stand spicy fragrances and marc jacobs bang is just spice through out all the notes nothing special

and yeah i would have to agree bleu de chanel is definitly underated it`s one of my most complimented fragrances right now