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Question about Terre D'Hermés parfum...is it really a parfum?

post #1 of 33
11/12/10 at 2:39am
Thread Starter 
First of all compliments for the beautiful forum, this is my first topic and i have a question.

I just bought Terre D'Hermés parfum version, now i have also EDT version. Well...from a parfum I expect a much greater longevity than EDT...much much more (it' a parfum, neither EDP, but parfum!).
Instead I have the exact same longevity/lasting power of EDT. It's very strange to me so the question: Terre D'Hermés parfum is really a parfum? O is it simply an EDT revisited and rebranded as parfum to highlight the differences with EDT??!

Also, alcool volume in EDT is 78% in parfum 79% (but maybe this has nothing to do).
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post #2 of 33
11/12/10 at 2:49am
Terre d'Hermès parfum really is a parfum. You don't always get greater longevity from a parfum, but you get a different interpretation which usually is richer and more focused on the heart and base, and not so much on the top.
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post #3 of 33
11/12/10 at 3:13am
Terre d'Hermes Parfum is really a parfum. Not on the preconceived notion of a parfum. A parfum always makes you think of fragrances that last ages and leaves a bigger sillage trail. This is a myth. In fact, a parfum is more close to skin in general, and more rich in the details and with a better quality of the materials involved. Terre d'Hermes parfum lasted longer on me, something like 12-15 hours, and it was richer, less iso e super, and more of patchouli and woods, much more focused, as tott said, on the heart and base.
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post #4 of 33
11/12/10 at 3:18am
^ What they said.

Btw, welcome to Basenotes, Vinfer!
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post #5 of 33
11/12/10 at 3:22am
Looks like the difference are only at the quality of the ingredients of the piramid notes.
I asked this too, i learned the lesson, lol.
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post #6 of 33
11/12/10 at 3:23am
Quote:
Originally Posted by d4N13L View Post

Looks like the difference are only at the quality of the ingredients of the piramid notes.
I asked this too, i learned the lesson, lol.

The scent is different too, it`s more woody, and the patchouli in this one has something salty which terre d'hermes doesn't have. They have the same structure, but different accents on its notes
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post #7 of 33
11/12/10 at 3:27am
Quote:
Originally Posted by rickbr View Post

The scent is different too, it`s more woody, and the patchouli in this one has something salty which terre d'hermes doesn't have. They have the same structure, but different accents on its notes

Not learned the entire lesson yet =)
Maybe now!!
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post #8 of 33
11/12/10 at 4:00am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rickbr View Post

Terre d'Hermes Parfum is really a parfum. Not on the preconceived notion of a parfum. A parfum always makes you think of fragrances that last ages and leaves a bigger sillage trail. This is a myth. In fact, a parfum is more close to skin in general, and more rich in the details and with a better quality of the materials involved. Terre d'Hermes parfum lasted longer on me, something like 12-15 hours, and it was richer, less iso e super, and more of patchouli and woods, much more focused, as tott said, on the heart and base.

Yes i know it, i know that an EDP is focalised more on heart notes and parfum more on base notes and know that you can get less sillage fom a parfum.
But I was expecting just more longevity.

And yes, TdH parfum is more woody, green, wet and acrid...and i prefer it.
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post #9 of 33
11/12/10 at 4:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinfer View Post

Yes i know it, i know that an EDP is focalised more on heart notes and parfum more on base notes and know that you can get less sillage fom a parfum.
But I was expecting just more longevity.

And yes, TdH parfum is more woody, green, wet and acrid...and i prefer it.

Well, they don`t always last so longer, even in the parfum version =/ But it seems that it differs from skin to skin. I have the parfum version of must pour femme de cartier, and while is much more richer, intense, but close to skin, the longevity is not so strong on me.
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post #10 of 33
11/12/10 at 5:15am
RickBR - I suppose you prefer the parfum, then? Or the brighter ruggedness of the EDT? I hear with Terre d'Hermes there's hardly a difference, but then again never done a side by side comparison myself.

The Non Blonde gives a good review of each through her website (google 'The Non Blonde + Terre d'Hermes)
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post #11 of 33
11/12/10 at 5:23am
I used to have the notion that "parfum" meant more longevity and projection. I've actually found the parfum of TDH to have less projection. It's description is "a new density" which describes it exactly. The parfum is just a brick wall version of TDH; the notes are more potent, and its more of a punch and less aromatic. Its kinda like a wall of smell as opposed to a cloud
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post #12 of 33
11/12/10 at 5:55am
Quote:
Originally Posted by rickbr View Post

Terre d'Hermes Parfum is really a parfum. Not on the preconceived notion of a parfum. A parfum always makes you think of fragrances that last ages and leaves a bigger sillage trail. This is a myth. In fact, a parfum is more close to skin in general, and more rich in the details and with a better quality of the materials involved. Terre d'Hermes parfum lasted longer on me, something like 12-15 hours, and it was richer, less iso e super, and more of patchouli and woods, much more focused, as tott said, on the heart and base.

Better quality materials?

The Hermes EDT is $105 for 3.3 ounces, not $70 that most designers price 3.3 ounces. Where is that extra money going if not for better quality?
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post #13 of 33
11/12/10 at 7:02am
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldSchoolCharm View Post

Better quality materials?

The Hermes EDT is $105 for 3.3 ounces, not $70 that most designers price 3.3 ounces. Where is that extra money going if not for better quality?

Well. if you hadn`t noticed, the parfum version has less iso e super, which is quite a cheap material, and more woods and patchouli. It does sound richer, even that if the richness is achieved with more expensive synthetic chemicals involved. And Hermes fragrances were never cheap, but they aren`t trend follower too.
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post #14 of 33
11/12/10 at 7:03am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike84 View Post

RickBR - I suppose you prefer the parfum, then? Or the brighter ruggedness of the EDT? I hear with Terre d'Hermes there's hardly a difference, but then again never done a side by side comparison myself.

The Non Blonde gives a good review of each through her website (google 'The Non Blonde + Terre d'Hermes)

I confess that i like both, but i prefer the EDT because i do like the citrus mineral aspect of it, which seems lost on the parfum version.
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post #15 of 33
11/12/10 at 7:24am
I find that I use much less of the parfum than the EDT. The parfum on me lasts much much longer than the EDT and is much more intense. 200ml should last a long time for me.
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post #16 of 33
11/12/10 at 7:29am
The original poster is correct in his estimation that the concentration on a pure parfum is almost always greater (less diluant) than with EDP and EDT. This is pretty standard. If he is reading more alcohol in the parfum than the EDT, that is unusual. It's very common to get less sillage from an extrait (parfum) yet better longevity (but not always).
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post #17 of 33
11/12/10 at 1:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrclmind View Post

The original poster is correct in his estimation that the concentration on a pure parfum is almost always greater (less diluant) than with EDP and EDT.

IIRC there is a slight overlap between the official concentration range of an EDP and an extrait. When a fragrance's concentration is around 20% it can either be marketed as an EDP or an extrait de parfum (aka parfum). It's all about marketing. The case of Terre d'Hermès also raised my interest in the parfum vs. EDP debate but for different reasons than the concentration issue. I was intrigued by the price. I found it very surprising that Hermès would sell a parfum in a 75 ml bottle for a price that is marginally more expansive than the EDT. Female fragrances that have an extrait version are way more expensive in extrait, and extrait is sold in bottles starting from as small as 7.5 ml. Habit Rouge l'Extrait costs 300 euros for 50 ml. That is the price of extrait, and Guerlain priced it exactly at the same level as its female counterparts in extrait versions (Shalimar, Mitsouko, l'Heure Bleue, ...). A 75 ml of TdH parfum should normally cost at least $ 500, based on the price of the classic Guerlain extraits. I remember an Hermès SA told me once that when JCE created TdH in parfum concentration, he wanted parfum owners to use it exactly the same way as they would spray the EDT, i.e. liberally. This is why Hermès probably went for the product we know today that has all the attributes of an EDP except the name (parfum).
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post #18 of 33
11/12/10 at 1:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reminiscent View Post

IIRC there is a slight overlap between the official concentration range of an EDP and an extrait. When a fragrance's concentration is around 20% it can either be marketed as an EDP or an extrait de parfum (aka parfum). It's all about marketing. The case of Terre d'Hermès also raised my interest in the parfum vs. EDP debate but for different reasons than the concentration issue. I was intrigued by the price. I found it very surprising that Hermès would sell a parfum in a 75 ml bottle for a price that is marginally more expansive than the EDT. Female fragrances that have an extrait version are way more expensive in extrait, and extrait is sold in bottles starting from as small as 7.5 ml. Habit Rouge l'Extrait costs 300 euros for 50 ml. That is the price of extrait, and Guerlain priced it exactly at the same level as its female counterparts in extrait versions (Shalimar, Mitsouko, l'Heure Bleue, ...). A 75 ml of TdH parfum should normally cost at least $ 500, based on the price of the classic Guerlain extraits. I remember an Hermès SA told me once that when JCE created TdH in parfum concentration, he wanted parfum owners to use it exactly the same way as they would spray the EDT, i.e. liberally. This is why Hermès probably went for the product we know today that has all the attributes of an EDP except the name (parfum).

I've always felt the same about the parfum version - simply marketing.
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post #19 of 33
11/12/10 at 4:46pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reminiscent View Post

IIRC there is a slight overlap between the official concentration range of an EDP and an extrait. When a fragrance's concentration is around 20% it can either be marketed as an EDP or an extrait de parfum (aka parfum). It's all about marketing. The case of Terre d'Hermès also raised my interest in the parfum vs. EDP debate but for different reasons than the concentration issue. I was intrigued by the price. I found it very surprising that Hermès would sell a parfum in a 75 ml bottle for a price that is marginally more expansive than the EDT. Female fragrances that have an extrait version are way more expensive in extrait, and extrait is sold in bottles starting from as small as 7.5 ml. Habit Rouge l'Extrait costs 300 euros for 50 ml. That is the price of extrait, and Guerlain priced it exactly at the same level as its female counterparts in extrait versions (Shalimar, Mitsouko, l'Heure Bleue, ...). A 75 ml of TdH parfum should normally cost at least $ 500, based on the price of the classic Guerlain extraits. I remember an Hermès SA told me once that when JCE created TdH in parfum concentration, he wanted parfum owners to use it exactly the same way as they would spray the EDT, i.e. liberally. This is why Hermès probably went for the product we know today that has all the attributes of an EDP except the name (parfum).

So you're saying that this parfum is an EDP actually... bhe i agree...it's my same impression.
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post #20 of 33
11/12/10 at 4:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reminiscent View Post

IIRC there is a slight overlap between the official concentration range of an EDP and an extrait. When a fragrance's concentration is around 20% it can either be marketed as an EDP or an extrait de parfum (aka parfum). It's all about marketing. The case of Terre d'Hermès also raised my interest in the parfum vs. EDP debate but for different reasons than the concentration issue. I was intrigued by the price. I found it very surprising that Hermès would sell a parfum in a 75 ml bottle for a price that is marginally more expansive than the EDT. Female fragrances that have an extrait version are way more expensive in extrait, and extrait is sold in bottles starting from as small as 7.5 ml. Habit Rouge l'Extrait costs 300 euros for 50 ml. That is the price of extrait, and Guerlain priced it exactly at the same level as its female counterparts in extrait versions (Shalimar, Mitsouko, l'Heure Bleue, ...). A 75 ml of TdH parfum should normally cost at least $ 500, based on the price of the classic Guerlain extraits. I remember an Hermès SA told me once that when JCE created TdH in parfum concentration, he wanted parfum owners to use it exactly the same way as they would spray the EDT, i.e. liberally. This is why Hermès probably went for the product we know today that has all the attributes of an EDP except the name (parfum).

I understand that, however I understood the OP to say that the parfum was listing the difference in concentration to be only 1% between extrait and EDT, so his confusion was understood.
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post #21 of 33
11/12/10 at 8:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrclmind View Post

The original poster is correct in his estimation that the concentration on a pure parfum is almost always greater (less diluant) than with EDP and EDT. This is pretty standard. If he is reading more alcohol in the parfum than the EDT, that is unusual. It's very common to get less sillage from an extrait (parfum) yet better longevity (but not always).

The quantity of essential oil is higher in the parfums but the scent might be altogether different from the EDC and the EDT.

For instance, Habit Rouge had EDC, EDT, EDP and extrait versions. Each one is different, with the EDP and parfums much richer and with less sillage than the cologne and EDT (due to less alcohol an evaporation from the skin.)
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post #22 of 33
11/12/10 at 8:57pm
It is not shocking that most of you have more refined noses than I do, but I do not sense much difference between these two.
Compared to Guerlain extraits, it has less depth, IMHO. I LOVE Terre, and I was so excited and anxious to get my hands on 75ml of Parfum....many left to right arm direct comparisons have me wondering which was which after 30 minutes. The Parfum seems to skip the top and heads straight to the base, whereas the EdT topnotes linger a tad longer, but after 30 minutes it is a wash.

I think most people would be VERY hard pressed to correctly guess which one you were wearing.
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post #23 of 33
11/12/10 at 9:34pm
I agree with most of the observations discussed here. While I admire the depth in the parfum, it wears like an EDP and I often find myself missing the vibrancy of the EDT. So whenever I wear Terre d'Hermes, I layer them both. Works like a charm.
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post #24 of 33
11/13/10 at 4:14am
Quote:
Originally Posted by rickbr View Post

Well, they don`t always last so longer, even in the parfum version =/ But it seems that it differs from skin to skin. I have the parfum version of must pour femme de cartier, and while is much more richer, intense, but close to skin, the longevity is not so strong on me.

You're so right about it varying between people. I get much better longevity from the TdH parfum because of skin characteristics. Less projection and sillage, but longer, and greater overall longevity. On cloth, the greater longevity of the parfum seems even more apparent to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diamondflame View Post

I agree with most of the observations discussed here. While I admire the depth in the parfum, it wears like an EDP and I often find myself missing the vibrancy of the EDT. So whenever I wear Terre d'Hermes, I layer them both. Works like a charm.

YES! Wearing them together is awesome.
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post #25 of 33
11/13/10 at 7:57am
***
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post #26 of 33
11/13/10 at 8:07am
Thanks for the explanation, scentemental. And for dropping by. You have been sorely missed by many on BN.
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post #27 of 33
11/13/10 at 5:19pm
Thread Starter 
scentemental thanks for the explanations but this war clear to me.
The point of question was another:
The problem is not the sillage, the point is that I expected a little more longevity. Ok...Furthermore i think: very very strange that TdH parfum is so "cheap". Just look at all "parfum" on the market ... they are very expensive (!!).
So, again, I can not explain how it could be a "parfum" (considering the price). I think it is an EDP or EDT revisited.
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post #28 of 33
11/13/10 at 11:08pm
I own them both, and personally I prefer the Parfum. It is deeper, and longer lasting on me; however the composition is not glaringly different between the concentrations as it is in many other scents. For example Habit Rouge EDT, EDP and Extrait are much different from each other, as are the concentrations of L'Instant de Guerlain pour Homme.

Regarding price, many extraits contain large quantities of very expensive materials, but TdH may be mostly less expensive aromachemicals, and botanicals that are not as precious. I doubt there are large amounts of floral absolutes in this parfum for instance.
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post #29 of 33
11/19/10 at 7:48am
Welcome Vinfer! I agree with you, I would expect a parfum to have a much lower percentage of alcohol than an EDT. A one percent difference just doesn't cut it. In general, I expect less sillage, more complexity and much more longevity from a parfum. The industry could do better to set and follow less vague standards for terms relating to concentration for new releases. Calling what you bought a parfum was misleading.
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post #30 of 33
11/19/10 at 9:02am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrclmind View Post

I own them both, and personally I prefer the Parfum. It is deeper, and longer lasting on me; however the composition is not glaringly different between the concentrations as it is in many other scents. For example Habit Rouge EDT, EDP and Extrait are much different from each other, as are the concentrations of L'Instant de Guerlain pour Homme.

Regarding price, many extraits contain large quantities of very expensive materials, but TdH may be mostly less expensive aromachemicals, and botanicals that are not as precious. I doubt there are large amounts of floral absolutes in this parfum for instance.

It really makes sense what you said, and would explain why is not a so expensive parfum. But it`s hard to judge the price of it inside the male`s section, since there is only it and Habit Rouge Extrait as examples of male parfums (please anyone correct me if there is another male pure parfum)
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post #31 of 33
11/19/10 at 9:03am
I believe l'impact de Caron is parfum.
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post #32 of 33
11/19/10 at 3:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrclmind View Post

I believe l'impact de Caron is parfum.

It seems that you have better memory at this time than me. You're absolutely right, l'imnpact de Caron is pure parfum too. It's similar to Terre d'Hermes pure parfum in style, adding complexity, but keeping the overall balance of the fragrance. I also reminded that, while it had a stronger longevity on skin, like terre d'hermes it had a moderate sillage.
From the pure parfums that i have tried until today, the only too that stood out in both terms of sillage and longevity were Le Baiser du Dragon and Kingdom. But then, they are already very strong at edp versions.
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post #33 of 33
11/19/10 at 3:27pm
Pure parfum often has less sillage than EDP and EDT... at least in my experience... longevity is often better and it can be a more pure interpretation by the parfumeur of the concept of the fragrance in question. The materials used are often higher calibre too, but not always. I think people often misunderstand and believe that extrait will be more powerful than other concentrations, but that is not always the case.
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