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Bitter Green Spring or fall vetiver

post #1 of 64
2/23/12 at 8:28pm
Thread Starter 
Guys, I'd like your suggestions for a great vetiver fragrance.

It should be great for the spring and good for fall too
and it should be bitter greens, nothing sweet! btw im 21

merci
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post #2 of 64
2/23/12 at 8:30pm
Guerlain Vetiver
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post #3 of 64
2/23/12 at 8:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by 10dadeo View Post

Guys, I'd like your suggestions for a great vetiver fragrance.

It should be great for the spring and good for fall too
and it should be bitter greens, nothing sweet! btw im 21

merci


If you're looking for a vetiver with some modern charm Fat electrician may be what you're looking for. It utilizes a very root-y haitian vetiver, which has some dirty aspects to it as well. Don't get me wrong, it isn't "dirty" per say, it just has a very "body oder" feel to it.
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post #4 of 64
2/23/12 at 9:07pm
My two favorites, at opposite ends of the spectrum, are Sycomore (with a hint of woods and smoke), and Vetiver extraordinaire (light, freshest). Both resultely green and fresh, with no hint of sweetness whatsoever.

cacio
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post #5 of 64
2/23/12 at 10:03pm
Vetiver by Dior
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post #6 of 64
2/23/12 at 10:13pm
The problem with vetiver is that it always will have some smokiness aspect attached to it, that's vetiver.
Unless you go for a fake vetiver as such Creed Original Vetiver which IMO is a nice fragrance however does not resembles a based vetiver fragrance at all.
If you want something fresh, clean for the spring I would recommend you another fragrances (Sorry they are not vetiver based fragrances)

- Annick Goutal - L'eau d'hadrien (fresh and green but not bitter)
- Sisley - Eau du campagne - The Epitome of the greenish;
- Frederic Malle - Bois D'Orage or French Lover (It is like walking in a forest after the rain)
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post #7 of 64
2/23/12 at 10:23pm
Givenchy Vetyver is a green non-sweet vetiver. It has an almost celery like greenness , so might be just what you are looking for. Similar to Guerlain but without the tobacco or soap. Similar to Tom Ford Grey Vetiver but less synthetic smelling. This is my favourite "green" scent, and I believe it was Monsiour Givenchy's signature scent. As a bonus - it is relatively inexpensive!
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post #8 of 64
2/23/12 at 10:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by 10dadeo View Post

Guys, I'd like your suggestions for a great vetiver fragrance.

It should be great for the spring and good for fall too
and it should be bitter greens, nothing sweet! btw im 21

merci

I never came across a 'bitter' vetiver. And only few would fit the 'green'. Reiterated, there is vetiver, the natural extract and as a chemical derivative vetiveryl acetate. Different chemicals, different smells. First: Givenchy - Vetyver, second Guerlain - Vetiver. Nearly no resemblance!

As 'green' and 'bitter' too I would suggest Paco Rabanne - Metal. It is woody and fresh in a polite way. The 'bitter green' comes from galbanum which is widely known exactly for that. This ingredient was big in the 7ties as far as I know.

edit: as it has been recommended - the Givenchy is not 'green' but develops into a strong nutty affair, hence its 'brown'. The natural sparkle of the root oil is enhanced by aldehydes. Very strong stuff, particularly for the wearer ;-)
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post #9 of 64
2/23/12 at 10:45pm
Speaking of brown and nutty - Hermes Vetiver Tonka is a vetiver and hazelnutty affair. Hmmm - a bit sweet though.... Someone mentioned Sycomore too - to me this is brown, a little smoky, and very nice.

And for bitter, Tom Ford Grey vetiver is pretty bitter for a vetiver IMHO.

Really, I would sample the Givenchy at least
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post #10 of 64
2/23/12 at 11:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by cacio View Post

My two favorites, at opposite ends of the spectrum, are Sycomore (with a hint of woods and smoke), and Vetiver extraordinaire (light, freshest). Both resultely green and fresh, with no hint of sweetness whatsoever.

cacio

+1. I adore Sycomore but it's not green and fresh for me but always very very smoky. VE on the other hand is very green and crisp.
I loved Guerlain Vetiver too of the late 90s but supposedly it's not as good now.
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post #11 of 64
2/23/12 at 11:30pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by cacio View Post

My two favorites, at opposite ends of the spectrum, are Sycomore (with a hint of woods and smoke), and Vetiver extraordinaire (light, freshest). Both resultely green and fresh, with no hint of sweetness whatsoever.

cacio

When I read the title of the thread, these were the two fragrances that immediately came to mind. Couldn't agree more, cacio.
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post #12 of 64
2/23/12 at 11:31pm
Sorry, double post.
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post #13 of 64
2/23/12 at 11:38pm
I find a degree of sweetness in both Guerlain Vetiver and Sycomore (not much though). Both are superb. The Givenchy is drier, as is Encre Noire which is quite bitter and smoky. Vetiver Extraordinaire is dry and green but I seem to have difficulty smelling it after an hour.

For your criteria, I'd suggest the Givenchy.
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post #14 of 64
2/24/12 at 1:46am
For a green try Vetiver Extraordinaire. I feels like some of the green grass blades were also incorporated along with the vetiver root into the perfume.

Another all round green vetiver is Esprit du Roi.

For bitter try Grey Vetiver. The bitterness comes from the grapefruit.
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post #15 of 64
2/24/12 at 1:53am
I agree with hedonist on Vetiver Extraordinaire for a very green vetiver.
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post #16 of 64
2/24/12 at 2:18am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Hunter View Post

I agree with hedonist on Vetiver Extraordinaire for a very green vetiver.

I don't want to pick on You. But would You have a clue why I could be asking, what in particular makes the fragrance 'very green'?

I myself was after 'green' vetivers but never got one. Reason: vetiver doesn't seem to be 'green' to me by first principles! If there is any resemblance to something I already know, this would be a) nuts b) licorice c) fresh dug out grass roots. None of these smells 'green'. I doubt 'green' is the correct tag for natural oriented vetiver (Givenchy). The derivative vetiveryl acetate (Guerlain, consecutively many 'fresh' frags up to today) smells just chemical to me, neither 'green' nor 'buzzing' and not 'edgy' ... whatever. Its just what it is: vetiveryl acetate!
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post #17 of 64
2/24/12 at 2:22am
If budget is not an issue go for Vetiver Extraordinaire or Sycomore! Otherwise I'd suggest Comme Des Garcons Vettiveru as one of the best bang for the buck.
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post #18 of 64
2/24/12 at 2:26am
One unsung vetiver is Monotheme's Vetiver Bourbon. Bitter and rooty, tempered on top with citrus.
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post #19 of 64
2/24/12 at 3:04am
My gem vetiver is Vetiver Extraordinaire by Malle. A smooth,elegant, delicate (admitting vetiver can be "delicate") texture, almost leathery glove sensation... ok for spring, ok for all seasons, no sweet, a wonderful bitter orange in the top.A bit of salt and pepper and yes, it's a green vetiver too!

My second one is Sel de Vetiver by The Different Company, a very masculine scent, whiskey and a bright smell of iodine marine, salty and dry..

A nice and modern interpretation can be Vetiver Dance by Tauer, a joyous solar and colorful scent, that plays down our bitter root, not a "pure" vetiver, it appears and disappears, indeed we have a Vetiver Dance!
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post #20 of 64
2/24/12 at 3:44am
So, @10dadeo - what do you make of all that? Things clearer for you now? lol
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post #21 of 64
2/24/12 at 4:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by WildThingy View Post

I don't want to pick on You. But would You have a clue why I could be asking, what in particular makes the fragrance 'very green'?

I myself was after 'green' vetivers but never got one. Reason: vetiver doesn't seem to be 'green' to me by first principles! If there is any resemblance to something I already know, this would be a) nuts b) licorice c) fresh dug out grass roots. None of these smells 'green'. I doubt 'green' is the correct tag for natural oriented vetiver (Givenchy). The derivative vetiveryl acetate (Guerlain, consecutively many 'fresh' frags up to today) smells just chemical to me, neither 'green' nor 'buzzing' and not 'edgy' ... whatever. Its just what it is: vetiveryl acetate!

Yes normally Vetiver smells rooty. Astringent in nature.
Vetiver Extraordinaire is certainly the greenest Vetiver.
By green I mean it smells like the liquid from freshly cut stem or blade of grass.
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post #22 of 64
2/24/12 at 4:44am
It hasn't been mentioned yet, but Racine is a wonderful citrus-vetiver that dries down to a beautiful dry, grassy vetiver.
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post #23 of 64
2/24/12 at 4:49am
Farmacia SS Anunziata's Vetyver Incenso, maybe.
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post #24 of 64
2/24/12 at 4:57am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nasenmann View Post

Farmacia SS Anunziata's Vetyver Incenso, maybe.

How could I have missed this one? Can you please describe it Nasenmann?
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post #25 of 64
2/24/12 at 5:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by alfarom View Post

How could I have missed this one? Can you please describe it Nasenmann?

Unfortunately I have only sniffed it briefly yet. It starts off very citrusy, not unlike current Guerlain Vetiver but better (less shrill). Then it gets more woody although the vetiver note itself is more of the grassy variety, imo. Then the frankincense comes into play, which adds an interesting counterpart but doesn't get dominant either, instead the fragrance is more on the light and airy side but not summery (for lack of a better description) - it's not heavy or a sillage bomb but it's also not overly youthful or joking around either. There something elegantly spicy in the base too. In fact, I'd say it's pretty well balanced on multiple levels - sampling recommended.
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post #26 of 64
2/24/12 at 5:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by alfarom View Post

Otherwise I'd suggest Comme Des Garcons Vettiveru as one of the best bang for the buck.

I'll second that!
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post #27 of 64
2/24/12 at 5:27am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nasenmann View Post

Unfortunately I have only sniffed it briefly yet. It starts off very citrusy, not unlike current Guerlain Vetiver but better (less shrill). Then it gets more woody although the vetiver note itself is more of the grassy variety, imo. Then the frankincense comes into play, which adds an interesting counterpart but doesn't get dominant either, instead the fragrance is more on the light and airy side but not summery (for lack of a better description) - it's not heavy or a sillage bomb but it's also not overly youthful or joking around either. In fact, I'd say it's pretty well balanced on multiple levels.

Sounds interesting. I'm wondering how it compares to fragrances such as French Lover, CDG2Man or even Bois D'Encens...anyone?
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post #28 of 64
2/24/12 at 5:32am
Malle VE
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post #29 of 64
2/24/12 at 5:35am
It's not very close to French Lover and CdG2Man, don't know about Bois D'Encens. In terms of "texture" it maybe comparable with French Lover sans the raspiness of pepper. Nothing waxy in sight but the incense is also in 2 Man. There's something elegantly spicy in the heart/basenotes that reminds me of Vetiver Extraordinaire's topnotes but the vetiver in Vetyver Incenso is thankfully less dominant and high pitched.
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post #30 of 64
2/24/12 at 5:39am
I agree. It's a good modern citrus/vetiver that has bitterness and no sweetness.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hedonist222 View Post


For bitter try Grey Vetiver. The bitterness comes from the grapefruit.
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post #31 of 64
2/24/12 at 5:49am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nasenmann View Post

It's not very close to French Lover and CdG2Man, don't know about Bois D'Encens. In terms of "texture" it maybe comparable with French Lover sans the raspiness of pepper. Nothing waxy in sight but the incense is also in 2 Man. There's something elegantly spicy in the heart/basenotes that reminds me of Vetiver Extraordinaire's topnotes but the vetiver in Vetyver Incenso is thankfully less dominant and high pitched.

Hmmmm....perplex. I actually find the VE's "high-pitched" aspect to be the best part of the fragrance. I have to try the SS Annunziata Thanks Nasenmann.
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post #32 of 64
2/24/12 at 5:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by alfarom View Post

Hmmmm....perplex. I actually find the VE's "high-pitched" aspect to be the best part of the fragrance.

It stings the nose... too much. But I always had a ambivalent relation with vetiver, there's a good number of vetiver-prominent fragarances that I loath but on the other hand there are also some that I consider absolute masterpieces.
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post #33 of 64
2/24/12 at 5:58am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nasenmann View Post

It stings the nose... too much.


LOL! I'm a freak, I know
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post #34 of 64
2/24/12 at 6:06am
A cheap and good one: L'Occitane Vetyver.
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post #35 of 64
2/24/12 at 6:08am
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloud atlas View Post

It hasn't been mentioned yet, but Racine is a wonderful citrus-vetiver that dries down to a beautiful dry, grassy vetiver.

Good choice.
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post #36 of 64
2/24/12 at 6:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nasenmann View Post

.......

BTW, we need more of your presence on the boards Nasenmann!
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post #37 of 64
2/24/12 at 6:13am
Agree w/ Vetiver Extraordinaire - very green, fresh, dry, grassy take on vetiver.

I find Guerlain Vetiver to be pretty fresh and green, but not too sweet (and I am not generally a fan of sweet scents).
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post #38 of 64
2/24/12 at 7:43am
Quote:
Originally Posted by alfarom View Post

BTW, we need more of your presence on the boards Nasenmann!

Thanks for the kindness but Basenotes already is my most visited forum and I don't want to end like "that which has no life".
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post #39 of 64
2/24/12 at 8:12am
...Bitter Green = Polo(original); fresh green = Eau de Campagne(Sisley); green vetiver - Vetiver(Guerlain)
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post #40 of 64
2/24/12 at 8:18am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nasenmann View Post

Thanks for the kindness but Basenotes already is my most visited forum and I don't want to end like "that which has no life".


LMAO! I will chain you here!
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post #41 of 64
2/24/12 at 9:13am
. none
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post #42 of 64
2/24/12 at 9:29am
Quote:
Originally Posted by hedonist222 View Post

... the greenest Vetiver.
By green I mean it smells like the liquid from freshly cut stem or blade of grass.

I never had a vetiver with that quality, except maybe a pseudo vetiver which comprises vetiveryl acetate. And of course other ingredients to evoke the idea of greenery.

Vetiveryl acetate doesn't smell 'green' by its own, but perfumers agreed to use its tickling vibe only in 'fresh', hence grassy and/or hesperidic concoctions. And of course the marketing propagated the association of that chemical with 'green' as an opposite to dusty, stuffy, sweet.

I think the quest for a 'green' and natural vetiver is a lost cause - the most 'fresh' one I ever had was from India, Himalayan. To find 'bitter' and 'green' the same time from vetiver *something* is a desperate challenge in my book. I personally gave up on that. What I think is worthwhile to watch with vetiver is an issue which arises from the persitance of the material on skin: (a) don't let the acetate become too one dimensional, hence cold and (b) avoid natural vetivers that become too dense, hence stuffy in the drydown.
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post #43 of 64
2/24/12 at 10:14am
Coincidentally I just smelled pure vetiver essential oil from Haiti.

It is 95% like smelling Vetiver Extraotdinaire.

Green.
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post #44 of 64
2/24/12 at 10:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by hednic View Post

Vetiver by Dior

I quite like this one, thinking of picking up a bottle for summer.
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post #45 of 64
2/24/12 at 11:17am
Quote:
Originally Posted by hedonist222 View Post

Coincidentally I just smelled pure vetiver essential oil from Haiti.

It is 95% like smelling Vetiver Extraotdinaire.

Green.

You have acsses to incredible essential oils, man! If I'm not mistaken Haitian vetiver oil is the best vetiver oil.
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post #46 of 64
2/24/12 at 11:23am
Quote:
Originally Posted by hedonist222 View Post

Coincidentally I just smelled pure vetiver essential oil from Haiti.

It is 95% like smelling Vetiver Extraotdinaire.

Green.

How could a smell possibly have a - color?! By association alone, I assume. The associations of us are different. Vetiver from Java is considered licorice salty 'dirt', Haitian is to many people on the fresh nutty side. You may look up the 'single notes'-thread and other related stuff:

http://www.basenotes.net/threads/231...Khus-Khus-Khus
http://ayalasmellyblog.blogspot.com/...i-vetiver.html
http://www.basenotes.net/threads/255...f-Mother-Earth

The 'green' is more or less a minor addition to a more nutty root / dry earth aroma - if any!

I wonder why some posts in the recent past referred to vetiver as being decidedly 'green' which is, reiterated, not true for the original material - just in case a color to scent relation makes sense at all ...

its soooh greeeen! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSFg3pAprdg

no offenses, guys ;-)
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post #47 of 64
2/24/12 at 11:38am
IMO it doesnt get more bitter (and also green but more emphasis on bitter) than "Tauer Pentachord Verdant"
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post #48 of 64
2/24/12 at 12:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by moore View Post

You have acsses to incredible essential oils, man! If I'm not mistaken Haitian vetiver oil is the best vetiver oil.

Thanks. Dubai is pretty nifty in old world specialties.
Best is really subjective. For example Cacio likes both Sycomore and vetiver Extraordinaire. Apparently both vetiver types appeal to him.

I ,on the other hand, am more fond of Indian Ocean vetiver.

Heres the best part. Maybe there are third and fourth type vetivers that we aren't aware of because they're not popular in modern perfumery.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WildThingy View Post

How could a smell possibly have a - color?! By association alone, I assume. The associations of us are different. Vetiver from Java is considered licorice salty 'dirt', Haitian is to many people on the fresh nutty side. You may look up the 'single notes'-thread and other related stuff:

http://www.basenotes.net/threads/231...Khus-Khus-Khus
http://ayalasmellyblog.blogspot.com/...i-vetiver.html
http://www.basenotes.net/threads/255...f-Mother-Earth

The 'green' is more or less a minor addition to a more nutty root / dry earth aroma - if any!

I wonder why some posts in the recent past referred to vetiver as being decidedly 'green' which is, reiterated, not true for the original material - just in case a color to scent relation makes sense at all ...

its soooh greeeen! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSFg3pAprdg

no offenses, guys ;-)

How could a smell have a color? Dunno go ask yourself a few posts up. First you said Only a few fit the green perspective then you contradict yourself a few hours later saying a vetiver cannot be green.

Haitian vetiver smells green whereas indian ocean vetiver doesn't.
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post #49 of 64
2/24/12 at 12:41pm
I covered a lot of bitter greens in my long thread where I was looking for animalic in there as well. A lot of them were not animalic and had tons of vetiver.

http://www.basenotes.net/threads/277...Green-Animalic
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post #50 of 64
2/24/12 at 12:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by WildThingy View Post

How could a smell possibly have a - color?! By association alone, I assume. The associations of us are different. Vetiver from Java is considered licorice salty 'dirt', Haitian is to many people on the fresh nutty side. You may look up the 'single notes'-thread and other related stuff:

http://www.basenotes.net/threads/231...Khus-Khus-Khus
http://ayalasmellyblog.blogspot.com/...i-vetiver.html
http://www.basenotes.net/threads/255...f-Mother-Earth

The 'green' is more or less a minor addition to a more nutty root / dry earth aroma - if any!

I wonder why some posts in the recent past referred to vetiver as being decidedly 'green' which is, reiterated, not true for the original material - just in case a color to scent relation makes sense at all ...

its soooh greeeen! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSFg3pAprdg

no offenses, guys ;-)

This is called synesthesia...
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post #51 of 64
2/24/12 at 1:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hedonist222 View Post

How could a smell have a color? Dunno go ask yourself a few posts up. First you said Only a few fit the green perspective then you contradict yourself a few hours later saying a vetiver cannot be green.
Haitian vetiver smells green whereas indian ocean vetiver doesn't.


noh - it is as much 'green' as the 5th symphony of Beethoven. Or 'red'. The color concept has no grounds. There is no 'synesthesia' so far. And it would be - just in the very rare case it is given - totally subjective. The relation of fragrance to color is arbitrary from person to person, except for instance people think - by agreement - of vetiver in general as 'green'. Or they think so of vetiveryl acetate. Many perfumistas don't know the difference, though.

Few fit the green tag: vetiveryl acetate centered frags like Guerlains due to the vibe of the chemical involved. Natural oriented frags appear to be fresh nutty (Hawai - e/g Givenchy. L.T.Piver) or on the other hand salty dirty (Java - e/g Yosh, Malle).

Nonetheless, as long as 'green' doesn't apply to any fragrant concoction by principle observations, You may use this term arbitrarily as You will.
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post #52 of 64
2/24/12 at 1:16pm
double
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post #53 of 64
2/24/12 at 1:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hedonist222 View Post

How could a smell have a color? Dunno go ask yourself a few posts up. First you said Only a few fit the green perspective then you contradict yourself a few hours later saying a vetiver cannot be green.
Haitian vetiver smells green whereas indian ocean vetiver doesn't.


noh - it is as much 'green' as the 5th symphony of Beethoven. Or 'red'. The color concept has no grounds. There is no 'synesthesia' so far. And it would be - just in the very rare case it is given - totally subjective. The relation of fragrance to color is arbitrary from person to person, except for instance people think - by agreement - of vetiver in general as 'green'. Or they think so of vetiveryl acetate. Many perfumistas don't know the difference, though.

Few fit the green tag: vetiveryl acetate centered frags like Guerlains due to the vibe of the chemical involved and hence its 'fresh' rendition. Natural oriented frags appear to be fresh nutty (Hawai - e/g Givenchy. L.T.Piver) or on the other hand salty dirty (Java - e/g Yosh, Malle).
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post #54 of 64
2/24/12 at 1:35pm
Ok, WildThingy, you're right. Vetiver isn't a green note. Enough said.
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post #55 of 64
2/24/12 at 3:03pm
I have several types of vetiver essential oil and agree that they are predominantly earthy (ie brown) in character, with a vegetal (green) tint at most.
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post #56 of 64
2/24/12 at 3:23pm
Well this thread has been a lot of fun, but let's get serious: How can this frag not smell green?
C'mon - green juice, green bottle, green rim on lid, and green box!

Admit defeat WildThingy!!!




Furthermore, I'm GREEN with envy that Nasenmann can have a quick sniff of Farmacia SS Anunziata's Vetyver Incenso and identify multiple layers from initial to drydown, and compare to a variety of other vetiver frags!!!!

Gosh, when I sniff Carlo Corinto, I just get bug spray - and to be perfectly honest - the box smells like cardboard!!!

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post #57 of 64
2/24/12 at 6:57pm
David Beckham (original)

You may enjoy this. It's a dark, bold vetiver. Not that lemony type of vetiver, as this is more dry, earthy, etc. To color correlate it, I'd pick brown as opposed to the "green" I get with many vetiver's that go for that fresher style. Anyways, this scent has a strong and noticeable vetiver note, it's also inexpensive. But to me, it felt a bit one-dimensional and even "old manish". I dunno if this is what you're looking for or not.
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post #58 of 64
2/24/12 at 10:50pm
Perfumery is art, and as such it is subject to interpretation,which is personal, therefore smells IMO do have a color and there are no rules to link smells / colors , (it depends pretty much on the beholder).
IMO Frech Lover is a green fragrance, as Samsara will be orange/reddish, if I am asked the reason, why do I connect in my brains smells / colors, I honestly would not know how to answer this question.
As mentioned above, such interpretations are subject to single and individual opinions.
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post #59 of 64
2/24/12 at 11:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by moore View Post

Ok, WildThingy, you're right. Vetiver isn't a green note. Enough said.

Not exactly. The OP is looking for a 'green' vetiver which is 'bitter' too. How to find appropriate recommendations?
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post #60 of 64
2/25/12 at 12:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonoanimoes View Post

Perfumery is art, and as such it is subject to interpretation,which is personal, therefore smells IMO do have a color and there are no rules to link smells / colors , (it depends pretty much on the beholder).
... interpretations are subject to single and individual opinions.

Art is fundamentally about communication. Please tell me otherwise, if I'm wrong. But if it is so, the interpretation of a piece of art can not be arbitrary.

In the case of perfume the 'piece of art' includes the presentation, example given:



which is undoubtedly 'green', hence I have to defeat! In general perfume is design, not art. Perfumery is the trial to find a new shape for a product with specific purposes - make people feel they smell 'good' - whatever that means. In that it resembles tailoring. It makes - at best - people communicate with each other by predefined codes. It doesn't have a message in its own, though.

edit: correction:

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