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Green-Metallic Rose Accord with chemicals. How to build it???

post #1 of 8
3/31/12 at 7:06am
Thread Starter 
I want to build a rose accord just with chemicals. But I dont want the dried-smoky-petals one. I want the green-metallic one, like when you open and sniff a bottle of rose otto. SUGESTIONS? thanks.
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post #2 of 8
4/1/12 at 1:45am
Depends what access to chemicals you have. You need PEA, Citronellol and Geraniol. Ionones, and damascones. Then if you can get it a material called Rosalva. Also Rosascene. Can't remember who males these, but they have the metallic note you are after. Green metallic means Triplal, or iso Cyclocitral. That is just for starters, and off my head. No doubt others will suggest more; eh Chris?
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post #3 of 8
4/1/12 at 9:24am
Those are all good suggestions David and not a whole lot to add. I know Rosalva as Trepanol or Decylenic alchohol it is made by IFF but I buy mine from Hekserij, the others are widely available other than the Rosascene which I dont have or know. You probably also want some Eugenol, Linalool, Nerol and a little Citral - again all widely available.

Another material you could consider would be rose oxide, which is in Bulgarian rose otto and, curiously, also in Gewurtztraminer wine, which was what caused me to buy some.

Looking at the Rose Base in my Curtis & Williams, they also suggest C11 enic, C8 and C12 lauric and I can see that including the aldehydes would help make it more sharp and metallic, the C12 in particular.

As modifiers they suggest iso-Butyle phenyl acetate, Phenylpropyl alcohol, Geranyl butyrate, Phenylethyl butyrate and Trichloromethylphenylcarbinyl acetate. However Ive not tried any of those in a rose accord myself.

Other options include pre-made rose bases, such as Dorina SA E or Rose Givco 217. Perfumers Apprentice has this Rose Accord on offer (either pre-made or you can make your own from their formula):

Peonile - 40
dimethyl Benzyl Carbinyl Acetate - 30
Geranyl Acetate - 25
Phenyl Ethyl Phenyl Acetate - 20
Citronellol - 20
Undecavertol - 6
Phenyl Ethyl Acetate - 5
Rose Oxide - 3
Damascone Delta - 2

and I dont think Id have come up with Peonile if I hadnt just looked that up, so thats a bit of learning for me too.
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post #4 of 8
4/1/12 at 12:17pm
here's a blurb from gielen aromatics, a dutch site that lists constituents of natural oils and so on. google translate did the job for me,

Monoterpenes: limonene, myrcene, a-and b-pinene. Olen monoterpenes: geraniol 20%, octanol, terpinen-4-ol, citronellol 34-55%, 30-40% nerol, linalool, eugenol. Aromatic alcohols: phenylethylalcohol 1%. Sesquiterpenische alcohols: farnesol, hexanol, terpenic esters 2.5-6%, citronelllylacetate, geranyl acetate, nerylacetaat. Phenols and phenol methyl ethers: methyl ether 1% eugenol, methyleugenol, ethanol, methylheptenon, carvone. Acids: Rose oxide 10%. Aldehydes: cinnamaldehyden, benzaldehyde, decanal, geranial, heptanal, octanal, neral, Sulfur-containing compounds: a-and b-damascenon, ionone and many trace constituents. Most of the trace components are not to reproduce in a laboratory. Rose oil is often adulterated with palmarosa and geranium oil.

you can find the entire entry on rose damascene here:
http://www.gielenaroma.nl/index.php?page=rosa-damascena

very interesting site.

if you have any translation problems, feel free to ask me. dutch is my primary language.
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post #5 of 8
4/2/12 at 12:48am
A couple more synthetics- Cressanther and Anther. Both from Givaudan (I think). Both sharp green and floral.
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post #6 of 8
4/9/12 at 10:31am
Thread Starter 
Thank you all ! I have a question: when working with synthetics , after mixing them do I have to leave it some days in order to mature as well as when we work with natural essential oils?
thanks again and sorry for my english
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post #7 of 8
4/9/12 at 11:04am
I think a few days maturation is good for all fragrances no matter what is in them.
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post #8 of 8
4/10/12 at 11:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Ruskin View Post

I think a few days maturation is good for all fragrances no matter what is in them.

^Agreed.^

However there isnt any advantage in ageing the dilutions before they are blended - actually I dont see much point in this with most naturals either, but it certainly isnt necessary with synthetics.
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