What's up at The Perfumed Court? - Page 3  

Yes, it has. I often check out the "one of a kind specials," and the page is now empty.

I think the concept is flawed. The business model is to decant perfumes and sell them. We, as the customers, don't know whether the decants contain the genuine fragrance until we receive delivery and open up the vial and sniff.

Then, why, Good Grief !, would a business owner flaunt a name on the shingle of the enterprise that plants doubts into the subconscious mind: "Surrender to Chance" Hah ! I want to know where my money is going and what I am buying.

Not even in the stock market would I "surrender to chance" - it would be a calculated risk depending on my risk tolerance.

Is this idea a sweet reference to Love, Passion and Surrender ? Nice, but ...

Well....STC's avatar on Facebook is the Honey Badger, so I suspect that means.....huh ?

The claim is that their site will open tomorrow, on Easter, so I guess we will just have to see.

Oh so true !. I firmly believe TPC was a victim of its own self created hype and misguided eliteism. From a business viewpoint, the original idea was good in providing decants and samples of rare or discontinued perfumes. The market was there and success should have easily followed . Provided of course, the owners of TPC kept their feet on the ground and followed the lessons of other more established online retailers. With that knowledge at hand, a stronger focus should have been placed on serious and prompt customer service, faster and more efficient order processing and delivery and most importantly pricing. They have failed to fully understand the concept of fully integrating these components to drive their business and ensure loyalty and patronage in the future.
What we got was a needlessly amateur approach to business bereft of long term focus for survival in the marketplace. I always had the inkling that they did this for a reason : perhaps to underline their intention to stay far removed from the nitty gritty of the world of business. A fanciful world of their own making. Like what kids do to create a world of fantasy in their backyards that the "adults" can and will never comprehend.
Before anybody starts to complain of unfairness toward TPC. I have spent hundreds of dollars in decants and samples over the past few years. I have a very keen idea as to all areas of how they conduct business. Everything from the overly dramatic annonucements of an employee taking ill " she is feeling rather under the weather at this time and has taken some well deserved rest" to the continual lack of proper standards in shipping " we understand that many items do not always get scanned prior to delivery" . Funny but true. I have the emails to prove it.
Plainly, the owners of TPC have to ask themselves the question: is this a bona fide business or just a halfhearted attempt at one?. If they pick the latter, then dont expect to survive for too long in the marketplace. That ostensibly genteel and "dignified" manner of doing business may be better suited to a perfume club with Sunday morning tea meets. For the rest of us, all we want is our perfume samples with no frills. Is that not we are paying for ?

Hrmm yeah cant argue with that but I guess they are hoping that most existing customers will know their history of providing authentic perfumes, via basenotes, ebay and TPC and it wont be an issue and for new clients well if they have a brain they will do their research and they will probably find threads here, MUA etc where authenticity, customer service and turn around times will be verified.

FragranceX, TPC, TPP all have dodgey looking websites, I know I did my research before I used any of them and thanks to helpful threads here et al, I got peace of mind and none of them have let me down yet.

The name seems pretty apt to me, just a romantic way of saying 'why not give it a shot?' which is what ordering decants of stuff to try is all about isn't it?

Sites up.

Not everything in the world has to be Walmart or Amazon.com, sheesh!

I doubt that selling hand-decanted fragrance is ever going to be a business plan that attracts hyper-efficient Wharton grads.

Business is business. Rent has to be paid. Walmart has the principle to never overstock inventory and keeps tabs as each item is sold. If you embrace chance, you set yourself up for failure.

Successful business people have the dogma: UNDER budget and AHEAD of schedule.

I think TPC has a potential headache on its hands - sampler packs. Surely these should have been removed? Try searching for 'Serge Lutens': hardly a fragrance by this house available but tons of sample packs with a Serge Lutens sample (or two) included...

Meh, I wouldn't make too much of the name, nor extrapolate too much on the philosophy. I'm sure they are not surrendering to chaos and that suitable planning and record keeping will be done. This is not a new line of work for the ladies, just a new venue.

After a first look at the new website: www.surrendertochance.com I have the impression that they are tooo nice. They try tooo hard to accommodate.

A serious flaw is that the INVENTORY TRACKING SYSTEM is not, as yet, up to par. That should have been in place as a fundamental tool, before opening shop.

One thing I don't like about surrendertochance is they're not offering 1.5ml spray decants. I don't like vials and 1.5ml sprays really gives me enough to decide if I'm interested in a full bottle purchase. Now they want to push me into a more expensive 2ml decant which now limits the variety to less choices for same amount of money. I hope they reconsider the 1.5ml as an option.

Not only that, there are no photos of the vials, sizes, decants like on the website www.theperfumedcourt.com

Instead, they reassure the potential customer that if he/she is disappointed about whatever they get shipped inside a plastic baggie, the customer should mail them a clear photo and support the claim like that.

WHY NOT PROVIDE PHOTOS - from the outset - so there is no "disappointment" . Too much fuss, too many loose ends.

Both sites are up. I don't understand. I'm guessing some of the ladies split from TPC to make their own site. Now there are two separate companies, and some of the frags supplied by these two women are no longer on TPC and will instead be on STC? Is that a correct assessment of the situation?

Now if I was the sole TPC proprietor I would have sent out an e-mail saying business as usual and maybe even advertising some special discounts (ideally that last longer than 8 hours, unlike most of their previous special offers).

Maybe the two Surrender to Chance women were the internet savvy ones (The facebook page rebranding certainly points to this) and poor old go-it-alone TPC lady can't even do a mail shot anymore!

******************
Emphasis added to your post.

How can you say these heavy words against a Basenotes member who is respected and liked ?!!

lol you seriously need to chill, that was hardly disrespectful and his comments on TPC's post split business practices are quite apt.

The same way you can nitpick and fault-find Patty and Lisa's new endeavor, who are also well-liked in the online perfume community.

such an ugly thread. basenotes at its worst.

Businesses come & go for many reasons.....I'll buy from whatever resource is available. Best of luck to both businesses.
Now, stanmar What I really want to know is where I can find one of these: "A perfume club with Sunday morning tea meets" Sounds divine!

Sadly, l agree with you.

Anyhoo, l've just taken the plunge & put in an order with them, using the coupon code kindly provided by petruccjic in the "coupons & discounts" thread. l will reserve judgement on their business practices, based on how my order is handled.
Personally l prefer the look of their website to that of TPC, & found it very easy to use. And l'm pretty sure that most of the critics will end up buying from them anyway.

Thanks for the heads up, going to place an order myself.

Sorry, these sites are a ripoff. I can't see how anyone would keep them in business. Paying $20 for 3 ml of anything is absurd.

Ought to be "Surrender Your Wallet", but if the split was amicable, I wish each party luck.

Blushes. Okay I don't think hippie etc. I just think Abba 'Take A Chance On Me' LOL

Had a nose round the newbies site and the prices are not back nor is shipping to the UK. Well the ones I looked at the prices seemed quite reasonable.

Same here.

Agreed.

I looked at Surrendertochance.com and I liked it. I'll definitely be using the new site at some stage. The website is easy to use ,navigate and much like The Perfumed Court. I was very tempted to get some of that rare Les Larmes Sacrees de Thebes parfum extrait ! The next time I want to order some samples, I will use Surrendertochance.com . The shipping is gratefully, reasonable too .

Not really the same. Ursula was merely pointing out aspects of the surrendertochance site/sample pictures, whereas this other user directly called someone "old" and "poor". Quite different. But I agree with the previous poster who said this thread is quickly turning ugly. I wish both new companies success. I also hope TPC considers lowing the shipping charge. With just 1 person/location now shipping out samples, 6 dollars is way too much. a 4x8 padded mailer filled with samples shouldn't cost more than 1.75-2.00 tops.

That this discussion turns "ugly" is a fact of life. On the one hand, we wish the new enterprise good luck, and consider the Good Will that the person who remains at The Perfumed Court has. That is why I defended the "old and poor" ...

We really want to have a source for decants so that we can pursue perfume hunting, sampling, on the path of discovery of beauty in perfumery. We are quite willing to go - just a little - out of our way - to support these decant shops so that they can remain in business.

But, when it comes to dishing out money ... it will always travel to the best deal. And there, the decant shops - old or new - are at a disadvantage. The savvy internet shopper knows how to break down pricing attached to milliliters, and then the item seems high.

Unless, of course, you want it bad enough and it is of such rarety that you cannot find it otherwise.

Otherwise, full bottles sold at a discount at on line shops which carry the genuine items, are money wise much more feasible.

So, this thread inadvertently turning "ugly" shows the duality between wanting to support a valiant enterprise that brings us a service and hard calculations when it comes to money.

Cameron, I aree. This is an ugly thread. Snarky.

Well the ugliness is not in terms of finding a good deal but in unflattering descriptors being applied to business owners. Calling any woman a "poor old lady" seems a bit disrespectful even if the intention was otherwise.

Exactly. There is way too much hyperbole and emphasis on the same. I am pretty sure the people who run STC have earned our trust. They seem to have been doing a decent job so far. Not sure what all the fuss is about. I don't think they meant it to be an exclusive club or introverted like someone mentioned. Nor are they saying you should "chance" your money with them. Its just a name.

This is quite a gross exageration. If you want to argue about prices being higher than you would like, at least have some fairness and accuracy. Which fragrance are you refering to in particular ? Many fragrances I want to try are $3-5. Which isn't bad, actually.

I like to use some guys on Crystal Flacon Forum, but if they don't have what I want to sample, I check the TPC. Not all of us live in stores with testers in abundance. Actually, alot of the private fragance shops in my city don't have testers for everything. Dept Shops only have classics and the latest releases. And some of us are not old and were not around for all the fragrances lauches.

Ugly thread, Debbie Downer speculation at its worst.

Partners buy each other out, break up, try new projects for all kinds of reasons. It's their business not ours. And all three of them have the right to make new choices for themselves anytime they want - its their life, not ours, and not ours to judge.

I'm glad there are more choices now. Good luck to all 3 ladies!

Oh don't be so ridiculously over-dramatic. If sides are being taken I am on hers, as a customer of TPC who has spent far more money on fragrance samples than is healthy. I am not calling her old or poor in the literal terms, just expressing my dismay at the breakup. I am sure she is neither old nor poor. In fact given the healthy markup per ml I would suspect, the later at least, is quite the opposite.

Although I will say that since this is just text it is hard to convey tone and intent.


Thank you, I'm glad someone took it the way it was intended.

And I see just this minute an e-mail has arrived from the original TPC!

I just received in my e-mail from The Perfumed Court the APRIL COURT REPORT with the April Promo Codes. Business as usual.

I wrote that five years ago and I still feel the same way. I'd just add that they (whoever they are, they still do it) have added, and continue to add hundreds and hundreds of more fragrances, many of which are extremely hard to acquire.

And try decanting on that scale. Most people couldn't deal with it for more than a month.

Well said ,Pluran .

I've been a customer of TPC for years, 'high' prices notwithstanding. There just isn't any competitive alternative is there?

A sampler/decant is just that - a sampler/decant. You need a picture of that? For what??

I've just placed my 1st order with STC - the pricing is on par with TPC's albeit with a marginally lower shipping charge. Let's see how it goes. I'm just disappointed TPC doesn't have promotional codes for April as I never find their 'business as usual' volume discounts attractive.

I admire all three of these women as well, and feel they have served as a useful resource for many of us.

The thing I worry about is if there is room for two companies doing exactly the same thing ?

It's a mean old world, of course, but I'd hate to see any of them get hurt, business-wise.

.

Do you really think Lisa Lawler, Patty White and Diane Weissman at The Perfumed Courst (TPC) were making serious money? I certainly don't. I would be surprised if they made minimum wage for the time they put into TPC. I have a masters degree in business administration (30 years ago - gosh) and one thing that that is clear to students of business is the unlikelihood of a business making money. I would guess TPC sellers squeaked by and just made enough to allow them to purchase and distribute inventory while creating an opportunity for the owners and their customer to experience a wide variety of fragrances. Among the three owners they had purchased thousands of bottles of fragrance - a very significant amount high end pure parfum, extrait and elite eau de parfum. The capitalization was very substantial.

I tried swapping samples on MUA and hated the time it took to decant and send out samples. I also hated reducing the volume in my bottles and putting oxyen into my precious bottles of fragrance. (I knew that introducing more oxygen into the bottles caused oxidation.)

I have purchased many samples from TPC. In the end, I saved money because I stopped buying full bottles as samples. After biting the bullet and paying to sample first first, I only spent money on full bottles that were "full bottle worthy" for me.

I am grateful to the owners for the good work they did. I suspect that conflicts around working together caused them to part ways, but imagine they are all honest and decent people. I wish the three ladies success in their ongoing endeavors. I will shop with both enterprises.

Actually his almost right...a 1ml sample of Black Afgano is around 30bucks. That's ridiculous.

Sure, if you break down the pricing into milliliters, then the items are high. But these enterprises are providing a service. I don't have to be stuck with a full bottle, if I can sort things out by sampling first.

If that is the case, then yeah, that is a high price. There are always gonna be particular fragrances that are quite high. I myself cannot afford more than the smallest sample of anything. It always has to be the smallest splash vial with me.

That being said, I think Pluran really hit the nail on the head. There is such a vast amont of fragrances to try. Fragrances that I would not be able to try otherwise. Yeah, I guess I would not be able to sample Black Afgano. But I am on Basenotes because I like fragrance. Not to dry-hump the latest fad ( Dior Homme Intense) or make out with some AMen flanker. I want to feel fragrance history and diversity. I think TPC gives me a nice chance at that. I also really appreciate off site decanters as well. Personally, decanting drives me crazy and I would go nuts if I had to do it often.

I placed another order with The Perfumed Court. Order processing was normal, e-mail confirmation. It was such a good deal, namely a holiday sale from CARON perfume extract urn, and a good price. I ordered a 5 ML vial of CARON - En Avion. That is extremely hard to get and a classic scent. This being only ONE ITEM, shipping was only $2.95.

That's good-- perhaps the competition has led to TPC's lowering its shipping as well? When I ordered only one decant from TPC (a few years ago) shipping was $5.95.

Here is the link to the shipping rates, it depends how many items.

http://theperfumedcourt.com/shipping.aspx

Selling decants is the kind of thing you do to support your habit, I doubt it's a path to riches.

Not to add fuel to the fire, but I just read through the latest TPC newsletter, and noticed this:

I registered at Basenotes just because I'm so confused about what's going on at TPC. I got an email earlier today asking me to do a chargeback for items I ordered (and received!). Email is as follows, my name and order number redacted. Anyone else receive this?

Dearest [name]

We regret to inform you that your recent Order [number] was affected by an unfortunate circumstance, which is detailed below. As a result, we may not have access to some of the items on this order and you will need to pursue reimbursement in full for these items (see instructions below).

If you have yet to receive ALL of the items in your order, we are asking you to please Dispute the Charge. Since we are not in control of the Merchant provider account or payment you have made, we cannot refund or dispute this on your behalf.

Please contact the appropriate entity (we have listed the two options below) and provide them with the following information:
[details redacted]

If you paid with a Credit Card, you should call the Customer Service number on the back of your card.

If you paid with PayPal, please login to your account and file a claim against your purchase for non-receipt or you can contact PayPal customer service directly (888-221-1161).

Incident Details -
Without warning, two of our previously trusted vendors left the The Perfumed Court and did not fulfill of all their orders for which they (NOT The Perfumed Court) received payment via your credit card or paypal payment. Understandably, due to this abrupt and unexpected change, The Perfumed Court is currently experiencing significant issues with order completion, shipping, and a severe backlog in our customer service department. Additionally, some of the fragrances ordered are not currently available at The Perfumed Court.

Please accept our most sincere apology for any inconvenience you may experience, and know that we are working diligently to ship all of the items that we possibly can. Please log into your account at www.theperfumedcourt.com and view your order status to learn how your order is affected.

We sincerely want The Perfumed Court to remain your preferred palace of fine fragrance samples. We are working furiously to acquire many of the items which we do not currently have in stock, and we have deactivated those items that are not available for us to acquire at this time. We will re-list these items as they become available to us.

Again, we apologize for this incident and any inconvenience to you as a result. We greatly appreciate your patronage and patience as we work to resolve and rectify these issues to the best of our ability.

Sincerely,
The Perfumed Court

To help you understand the status of your order and any action required by you, we have created three categories for your convenience:

Vendor Fail - Full Ship (We were able to complete your order from our own stock, although payment for some or all of the items on your order was not received by us. If you do not receive double the items you ordered, please dispute this charge.)

Vendor Fail - Partial Ship (We have shipped all items we currently have access to, but the remaining open items are not available to us at this time. You will need to pursue reimbursement for these items.)

Vendor Fail (We do not have access to the items on this order and you will need to pursue reimbursement in full.)

Gee whiz !
I am so very sorry about this ,Projects Watch. It sounds a bit alarming and confusing.

My apologies to flouris. Looks like you may have been on to something after all.

Yes, I had one today. Am a little concerned, not least because the wording of the email doesn't make it sound as though all parties involved (i.e. those still at TPC and those who left to form STC) are on terribly friendly terms and communication could prove to be problematic! Will contact the ladies at STC and see what they say. I don't really know what else to do at this juncture. Hopefully everything will be resolved quickly.

Anyone else?

i dont know what is happening with their site but i ordered a huge sample order, and it's been several days, havent received any shipping info yet (the other new site shipped their stuff fast though)

It is obviously an accounting issue - but, boy, what a mess. It will take a while to unravel all those loose ends.

At the time being, I have two recent orders - for just one item each - hanging, and I expect those simple orders to be filled in due time, probably in a delayed fashion. When they have been satisfactorily filled, I shall post that.

I still have a lot of confidence in The Perfumed Court, but will hold off ordering anything else, for the time being.

I don't get it ! If the woman received all items of the order and paid for it, then what is the fuss now ?

And just like that, my suspicions have been confirmed. For those two to receive payment then not ship is a terrible thing to do to customers, regardless of internal issues within their company. Surrender to Chance will not be getting any business from me. Speaks volumes about their lack of business ethics.

Projectswatch,

As I understand the email, if you received your entire order and no duplication, you don't have to do anything.

I had this email too and the wording was a little alarming. I emailed the ladies at STC and Patty got back to me within minutes, giving me the tracking details of the parcel TPC have listed as Unshipped.

My message to anyone who has had this email from TPC is not to worry, just send STC a quick email and I'm sure everything will be fine.