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ATTENTION all M7 fans: interesting videos.....

post #1 of 38
1/12/13 at 8:05am
Thread Starter 
It's usually told the riformulated YSL M7 (2nd version, with "3-transparent sides bottle") is the riformulated one, i.e. it contains no real Agarwood (Oud) oil.

These videos show clearly the famous "Agarwood oil dust" , in "reformulated" (year 2008) bottles.
This could explain why so many people affirm there is little o no difference between vintage and reformulated bottles: simply, the vintage (real-agarwood) juice has been poured in many 2nd version bottles.
It's important to say that most of reformulated bottles contain transparent (synthetic agarwood) juice: but we (a small number of M7 fans from all parts of Italy) have found an outstanding number of reformulated bottles WITH the agarwood dust.

As a preliminary result, all bottles with a 5-letters batch code ( for example H0EBB) are reformulated ones ; almost half of the number-batched bottles (for example 7JAB or 8CAA) are "vintage" ones. The other half of number-batched bottles has a perfectly transparent ("reformulated") juice.

We collected our bottles, did some tests, and shot some videos :
- first bottle http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIOGS31-ZQE
-another bottle http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwTjfofKO2Y
-a third bottle http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzdImo7A5bg
(Excuse for poor quality)

Check your "reformulated" bottle. You have to left quiet for 4-5 hours, then twist it, under a light.
We'd glad to know you opinion. and share your experience.
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post #2 of 38
1/12/13 at 8:21am
Are you under the impression that vintage M7 contains real oud oil?
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post #3 of 38
1/12/13 at 8:31am
I appreciate what you're doing and I think you might be onto something interesting here, but I have an original formulation bottle and there isn't any "agarwood oil dust" in mine... How would you interpret that?

To be honest, I'm pretty sure there's no real agarwood in any of the M7 formulations. It smells like synthetic agarwood (ie. synthetic oud) to me, similar to Byredo's Oud Accord fragrance.
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post #4 of 38
1/12/13 at 8:35am
Thread Starter 
I'm not a fanatic oud fan
However, Alberto Morillas is reportedly told M7 contains real oud, not so expensive, 10 years ago (2000-2001);
but apart this, suppose the "dust" is not oud oil: why there are so many differences from one bottle to another bottle? This is the question....
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post #5 of 38
1/12/13 at 8:39am
Interesting. I thought this post was BS so I checked my two bottles of vintage juice. One has stuff floating in it like in the video and the other does not. Neither reformulated bottle (five digit codes) has junk in it. Weird.
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post #6 of 38
1/12/13 at 8:50am
Thread Starter 
However that we call "dust", is NOT any junk: it's oil.
The precipitation towards the bottom is typical of oil drops.
If not Agarwood oil, it's a sort of oil, undiluted in alcohol, maybe due to too-high concentration. .
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post #7 of 38
1/12/13 at 8:53am
Mmmmhh
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post #8 of 38
1/12/13 at 8:56am
Whichever form - it's a nice scent.
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post #9 of 38
1/12/13 at 9:39am
I have a vintage bottle and nothing is floating around in it.
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post #10 of 38
1/12/13 at 12:13pm
Mine ( 50 ml and half empty ) is from 2008 and I couldn't see anything.
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post #11 of 38
1/12/13 at 12:36pm
Shouldn't oil float to the top of an ethaol/water mixture?

And, I have a vintage bottle from 2006, nothing settles in the bottom, haven't touched it for weeks.
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post #12 of 38
1/12/13 at 1:01pm
I own multiple bottles of every variant of M7:

M7 Vintage
M7 reformulation
M7 Oud Absolu
M7 Fresh

And none of them seem to contain any significant trace of real Oud oil. The bitter, dark, deep, poisonous element in the original formula, that I find absent in other formulas, seems to be real mandrake root. Even the vintage balms and vintage body wash contain it....but that bitter, poisonous smelling accord is missing in every other variant of M7.
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post #13 of 38
1/12/13 at 1:56pm
Very interesting! I have a 7CAA batch from 2007 and there is stuff floating around on the bottom. I think we have a mystery here on our hands guys, somebody call Shaggy and Scoobie and the rest of the gang!
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post #14 of 38
1/12/13 at 2:08pm
Whatever it is, I zimply will not believe that the dusty stuff is oil. Oil simply does not sink to the bottom of alcohol and does not behave like dust in solution. This is some other substance but certainly not oil. Not sure what it is and to be honest, I don't really care. The juice smells fine.
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post #15 of 38
1/12/13 at 2:21pm
I have two bottles of vintage M7 and love the juice. However, I cannot observe any amount of floating oil or agarwood in either bottle.
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post #16 of 38
1/12/13 at 2:46pm
True oud / aloeswood is very expensive I feel no version or M7 ever real contained the real stuff. Oils droplets can be found in fragrance that are old and starting to separate ...I don't think that is oud you are seeing. MY friends and I call it "smeck" it's. good way to check if a scent is going bad.
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post #17 of 38
1/12/13 at 3:20pm
i once saw a bottle of diptyque's vetyverio with dust floating in - the SA said that because too much light has been exposed, that the scent is giving away, i also had mugler's angel which had floaters in it.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by scentimus View Post

True oud / aloeswood is very expensive I feel no version or M7 ever real contained the real stuff. Oils droplets can be found in fragrance that are old and starting to separate ...I don't think that is oud you are seeing. MY friends and I call it "smeck" it's. good way to check if a scent is going bad.

exactly.
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post #18 of 38
1/12/13 at 4:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by benzganesh View Post

i once saw a bottle of diptyque's vetyverio with dust floating in - the SA said that because too much light has been exposed, that the scent is giving away, i also had mugler's angel which had floaters in it.

I've been told the same thing and anything floating in a bottle isn't good unless it's a worm or gold flakes.
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post #19 of 38
1/12/13 at 6:12pm
My vintage M7 bottle (all sides brown) has no floaters of any kind in it.
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post #20 of 38
1/12/13 at 7:31pm
I suspect it's some kind of chemical precipitate, and would look like tiny crystals, if seen under high magnification.

Can't remember where the other thread was on this topic. There was some speculation that one of the purposes of the maceration process was to allow new crystalline compounds that form as a result of mixing the original ingredients together to precipitate out and settle to the bottom of the flask. After a few weeks, the clear liquid is drawn off, leaving these precipitated compounds at the bottom. If the maceration was rushed, some of the very end parts of the crystallization process could later take place in the bottle, leaving some crystals there as well.

All just speculation of course.
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post #21 of 38
1/12/13 at 8:30pm
anyone else enjoyed the beat of the music?
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post #22 of 38
1/13/13 at 4:42am
My vintage bottle with reformulated juice from 2006. also has that funky dust Interesting, but I also doubt it is a proof of oud or any other note...
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post #23 of 38
1/13/13 at 6:37am
someone at YSL was sick that day and sneezed into that batch....
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post #24 of 38
1/21/13 at 3:00am
Thread Starter 
some more videos about the "so-called" real agarwood in suspension:

M7 produced in summer 2008 (batch 8GAA) : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_7n7Q5y7os
M7 Fresh, the flanker, batch 4148 (May 2004) : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_tDZLqFoWsg
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post #25 of 38
1/21/13 at 3:56am
great research & info ...
well done Andre
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post #26 of 38
1/21/13 at 4:59pm
50ml 8CAA exhibiting floaters much like the videos.

What's the evidence that floaters = 'real' agarwood dust/oil again?
Wouldn't it stand to reason that all or maybe even most 'real' oud/agarwood fragrances, not just vintage M7, have this floating dust?
hmmm
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post #27 of 38
1/21/13 at 5:02pm
I love M7 but doubt that it ever contained agarwood oil as shown in the video. It would cost a small fortune for the YSL to do that.
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post #28 of 38
1/22/13 at 7:39am
Thread Starter 
This is the "M7 legendary tale" (please note I am not trying to convince you about it, but only to explain various point of view):

Around year 2000 YSL bought an huge amount of agarwood oil at discounted price (we don't know anything about its quality and grade, only that there were low prices in these years) , and asked to Firmenich (one of the biggest aromachemicals factories) to prepare a synthetic agarwood oil in order to "sweeten" the harsh, brutal smell of natural oil.
When Firmenich succeeded in preparing the sweet "Synth 10760 E" molecule (you can google it) , then the production of M7 started (september 2002), using real agarwood oil PLUS the sweet synthetic oud "10760E".
At a certain point, the natural agarwood oil ended, and YSL used only the synthetic oud, that's why the "reformulated" bottles smells so much sweeter than before. After the discontinuation of M7 (mid-2009) in the same year of the boom of oud fragrances, YSL affirmed that, in previous years, they have used real oud in M7, and the domonstration is the "dust", "mist", "floaters", "precipitate" you can find in many bottles.

This is the "legend", and I am only trying to understand more about it, even with Basenote readers' help. Maybe some of you can approach YSL or Firmenich and ask some questions!

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Quote:
Originally Posted by totaldominasian View Post

Just got a vintage one off eBay. How do I tell the date of manufacture? I see a 5 number code on the bottom, but no letter.


for bottles from 2001 to 2010 simply go to http://checkcosmetic.net/ and check the code.
However if you see only 5 numbers and no letters, it's from 2002 to 2004 for sure .
Congratulations, a real vintage one!
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post #29 of 38
1/23/13 at 9:55am
Just got a vintage one off eBay. How do I tell the date of manufacture? I see a 5 number code on the bottom, but no letter.
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post #30 of 38
1/24/13 at 11:59pm
Thread Starter 
How all things started: the big amount of precipitates ("dust") in older bottles. Here is the beginning about all "real agarwood or not?" hypothesis.
This bottle is batched "30871" (March 2003)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wY9pOMT1BZQ
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post #31 of 38
1/25/13 at 12:17am
My bottle of vintage M7 does have floating dust in it. For most people claiming that theirs doesn't, I would say that it is more difficult to see the particles in vintage bottles simply because they are not fully transparent. I had to place my bottle against a direct light to be able to see it.

Real agarwood or not, the only other bottle I have seen this with is Aramis JHL reformulated.
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post #32 of 38
1/25/13 at 2:22am
Well, well....just checked my vintage bottle and yep there's sediment.....who would have thought. Still not sure it's anything to do with real oud though. I enjoy real oud oil occasionally and it doesn't have sediment so I don't see why M7 should.
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post #33 of 38
1/26/13 at 2:17pm
Thread Starter 
An inusual clip. A frend of mine and I with our bottles of "reformulated" M7 -with identical batch 8CAA- bought in different places at different times.
Same "dust precipitate" pattern? Not at all.
Comparison between bottles at:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XzWEfe6_MQo
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post #34 of 38
1/26/13 at 11:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrè Moreau View Post

An inusual clip. A frend of mine and I with our bottles of "reformulated" M7 -with identical batch 8CAA- bought in different places at different times.

Nice video, great music

But do they smell different?
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post #35 of 38
1/27/13 at 1:13am
My vintage bottle doesn't have any precipitates in it. But how do I tell the year of manufacture?
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post #36 of 38
1/27/13 at 2:29am
Quote:
Originally Posted by totaldominasian View Post

My vintage bottle doesn't have any precipitates in it. But how do I tell the year of manufacture?

Insert the batch number on this website: checkcosmetic.net
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post #37 of 38
1/27/13 at 2:34am
Didn't work
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post #38 of 38
2/5/13 at 12:15am
Thread Starter 
Here another video : two bottles year 2008. Here you can see real differences.
First batched '8GAA' and the other 'HOEAA'
bottles with all-letters batches (without numbers, and with a small sticker) seem to be considered the really reformulated ones.
you can clearly see it at min 2.15
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBqBKizi2tk
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Basenotes › Basenotes Forums › Fragrance Discussion › Male Fragrance Discussion › ATTENTION all M7 fans: interesting videos.....