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Reformulations ~ Which are acceptable ? Which are not ?

post #1 of 30
2/5/13 at 5:54am
Thread Starter 
Presumably, when houses carry out reformulations on fragrances they try to keep them as close to the original version as possible. I am also assuming that some reformulations take place to save costs, (eg synthetic neroli replacing the real thing etc,) which of course has a more dramatic effect on the end result.
To my nose there are many fragrances where the reformulation is barely detectable. Dior Homme Intense is one and I sometimes wonder if these differences are exaggerated out of proportion here on basenotes ??
There are certain cases, such as the classic women's Dolce and Gabbana, (the one with the red plastic cap) where I can detect a drastic change. The new version with a darker red packaging has little to do with the original. The wonderful central apple/cherry tobacco accord is just a faint echo of what it used to be.
I'm hoping this thread will get a lot of feedback to find out if members can agree upon which reformulations are minimal and which are more drastic ~ as a guideline for us all.
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post #2 of 30
2/5/13 at 5:56am
Dior Homme Intense. I could have done with or without the iris note.
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post #3 of 30
2/5/13 at 6:04am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sjg3839 View Post

Dior Homme Intense. I could have done with or without the iris note.

Does this mean in effect you find the changes minimal ? or, although there is a notable difference you enjoy both versions ?
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post #4 of 30
2/5/13 at 6:47am
Ungaro III was ruined when it was reformulated, but either way - vintage or new - I get zero longevity from it.
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post #5 of 30
2/5/13 at 6:51am
What about Etro scents? After new packaging and size (50ml), I heard most of them had been reformulated. Any comment about this? In concret my faves Gomma, Vetiver and Messe de Minuit...
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post #6 of 30
2/5/13 at 6:57am
it depends on marketing I presume..Tuscany vintage was the real stuff, the reformulation is watered down Azzaro ph...on the other hand Red for Men vintage it's a bit more dense but EA did a great job and the reformulation is just a bit toned down version of the original by Giorgio BH
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post #7 of 30
2/5/13 at 7:07am
Dior and Caron feminines are often cited as examples of bad reformulations. Masculines, perhaps because they were always cheaper or made use of less forbidden materials, have survived better, on average. Still, examples abound. For instance, mossy citruses have been destroyed: New York, Eau d'Hadrien, Chanel pm, Eau Sauvage. They lack the depth of the original, and even the oily citrus (especially Eau d'Hadrien). O de Lancome has shifted in an interesting way, and I still like it: instead of thick, long lasting citrus and moss, it goes into a sort of green herbal phase that's still very enjoyable.

cacio
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post #8 of 30
2/5/13 at 7:16am
I find the changes minimal. The cocoa was replaced with a pear note which IMO is not too detectable. I enjoy both versions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by david View Post

Does this mean in effect you find the changes minimal ? or, although there is a notable difference you enjoy both versions ?
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post #9 of 30
2/5/13 at 7:17am
DHI acceptable

D&G pH not accaptable
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post #10 of 30
2/5/13 at 7:18am
I do find that I like both vintage Mitsouko as well as the reformulation although they open very differently.
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post #11 of 30
2/5/13 at 7:19am
two examples , just yesterday....
Paris by Yves Saint Laurent reformulation, a complete disaster; Pour un homme de Caron, on the contrary has been really a good job.
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post #12 of 30
2/5/13 at 7:45am
Gengis Khan reformulation - acceptable
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post #13 of 30
2/5/13 at 7:50am
Both Fahrenheit and Givenchy Gentleman are good after reformulation. Dunhill Edition not so much.
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post #14 of 30
2/5/13 at 7:57am
fahrenheit 2012

unacceptable

they took one of the greatest designers of all time and made it into horse manure
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post #15 of 30
2/5/13 at 8:25am
Dhi is great after reformulation. Smell is almost the same and longevity/projection is indistinguishable.
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post #16 of 30
2/5/13 at 8:29am
Quote:
Originally Posted by noirdrakkar View Post

fahrenheit 2012

unacceptable

they took one of the greatest designers of all time and made it into horse manure

I agree
Joop! How could they tame the beast like that :-(
Tsar totally unacceptable.

Dior Homme and Intense well done.
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post #17 of 30
2/5/13 at 10:50am
Thread Starter 
What about M7 ? I have the older bottle with the red sides and the newer one, (clear sides). I can't detect a great deal of change between the two ?
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post #18 of 30
2/5/13 at 11:13am
I have yet to find a reformulation that is "acceptable". I can deal with them I suppose, but I'd hardly consider paying the same price for something less as being "acceptable".

It's like ordering an 8oz filet mignon and receiving a 6oz sirloin. Sure, I like sirloin, and I'd eat it, and probably think it was good enough. But if I expected the 8oz filet mignon, received a 6oz sirloin, and was told by the restaurant's manager that; the two are basically the same thing (or in the case of the fragrance industry, just deny that there's been any change at all), their restaurant will no longer serve filet mignon, and I'm still expected to pay the same price as an 8oz filet for a cheaper smaller cut... Whether I enjoyed the sirloin or not, I'd hardly consider that "acceptable".

And that's comparing steak to steak.

With reformulations like D&G Pour Homme, it would be like ordering a steak and receiving chicken nuggets.
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post #19 of 30
2/5/13 at 11:34am
I like the latest (second) reformulation of Dior Homme Intense, as it is not as sweet and not as loud (opening) as the vintage formulation.

The first reformulation of YSL M7 is not that bad. It's not as heavy and not as sweet as the vintage formulation, which makes it more versatile. It all comes down to personal preference.

The first reformulation of D&G Pour Homme is a mess -- its notes are sharp and badly blended. I heard that the latest (second) reformulation is even worse.
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post #20 of 30
2/5/13 at 12:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewHaarlem View Post

The first formulation of D&G Pour Homme is a mess -- its notes are sharp and badly blended. I heard that the latest (second) reformulation is even worse.

I smelled the most recent one in December. Absolute train wreck.
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post #21 of 30
2/5/13 at 2:21pm
a bit sweeter in the reformulated one, but only for a while (15 min to half-an-hour); then, in the drydown: identical.

Quote:
Originally Posted by david View Post

What about M7 ? I have the older bottle with the red sides and the newer one, (clear sides). I can't detect a great deal of change between the two ?
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post #22 of 30
2/5/13 at 3:47pm
To be honest.. reformulations don't bug me at all. Dior Homme to the reformulated version.. I found little differences. Fahrenheit was a big loss though, but the current version is still good juice. Polo, Drakkar, and some other classics, still smell classic in my eyes, in their current formulations.

What pisses me off, is discontinuing awesome fragrances. Like Gucci Envy, Kenzo: A Time for Peace, D&G By, Gucci pH I and II, Pure Malt, Pure Havane, or limiting them making them hard to find. The list goes on and on.
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post #23 of 30
2/5/13 at 3:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Hunter View Post

Both Fahrenheit and Givenchy Gentleman are good after reformulation. Dunhill Edition not so much.

Not sure about this. I have doubts about Fahrenheit but don't know the different versions well enough. Givenchy Gentleman I think is now a good easy to wear scent but the magic of the vintage is gone.
Paco Rabanne is pretty much universally seen as a pale imitation of what it was.
Kouros still seems OK, at least up to last year when I lat tried a spray from a recent bottle.
Dior Homme and DHI are think are fine.
I imagine that almost any scent that has been around for more than fifteen years will not be compared favourably with it's vintage version.
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post #24 of 30
2/5/13 at 4:12pm
Polo green - unacceptable

Van Cleef & Arpels PH - very acceptable
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post #25 of 30
2/5/13 at 4:29pm
I agree with The_Cologneist. The reformulations are not as bothersome as companies discontinuing some of there best products.
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post #26 of 30
2/5/13 at 4:43pm
The 3 that scare me the most are D&G Homme, Armani Homme and Kouros.
Even though im not really a fan of Kouros my uncle who passed away had a really old bottle in his wardrobe which i remember the smell of very well! I recently caught a guy spraying the upto date version after god knows how many reformulations and just though omg what has it turned into now! Its like some citric overpowering mess. I can see why so many people would hate it but also not understand what it really should smell like.
As for Armani its just a lot weaker really, i remember it being a bit of a bomb with a huge lemon and oakmoss hit but its just a lot calmer now.

What they did to D&G, everyone knows the score with that.
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post #27 of 30
2/5/13 at 5:36pm
The D&G PH reformulation is a pity. Glad I found a vintage bottle!
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post #28 of 30
2/5/13 at 5:52pm
Don't expect 99% agreement on anything here! LOL. Only you can decide what works for you. If a BNer seems to have similar perceptions then you should pay more attention to what he or she has to say, IMO, or if a person describes the scent in great detail. Don't think in terms of a "house" because it's more about who controls the license to the brand in most cases with designer scents. You might want to go to the Crystal Flacon site and find people who are selling samples of the vintage and new formulations so for a small amount of money you can figure it out for yourself.
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post #29 of 30
2/9/13 at 7:58pm
Patchouli 24.

Le Labo announced the reformulation, stated it'd be undetectable. And they were right.

Good on them.

This is how other perfume houses should operate.
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post #30 of 30
2/9/13 at 8:07pm
Fahrenheit unacceptable
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