Slumberhouse: A Warning

Thanks for the info.

Ah. I wanted to sample Pear + Olive. Can't seem to find any UK stockists though.

Thats too bad...I actually taught the price for a 50ml bottle was awesome!

Doesn't it seem like all houses are increasing their prices?

I'm sorry to hear that, but it seemed inevitable due to the combination of expensive ingredients and all of the recent acclaim. My guess is that they'll all be $150 (the current price of Pear + Olive). We'll see.

Weren't these quite a bit cheaper about a year ago? I seem to recall 30ml bottles being around 70 dollars or less... am I completely wrong?

Still, no surprise the price is rising, since it would get their products to fall in line, cost-wise, with most other niche lines.

So, do we start the boycott now?

Thanks for the warning. I was contemplating ordering a sampler pack and just did. Hopefully I'll be able to put in an order before the prices go up.

Let the guy make a profit, he's making some good stuff.

what ^^^^ he says! Josh is one of the most generous individuals around. Time for him to to make some profit.

i have tested only 3 of their frags including Pear and olive and they smell so natural, that i was surprised .....last time i tried such natural perfumes was from profumo.it...and maybe remotely Lush....

i prefer they increase prices then decrease value of ingredients and leave prices the same, this way its playing an honest game...and its up to you to decide what you want

ya, kinda lame.

From this interview: http://notablescents.net/2012/04/27/...-slumberhouse/

Rume, Vikt, and Grev all discontinued! I really enjoy my bottle of Rume (and Jeke & Norne).

On topic: As much as I love getting a good deal on a good fragrance, I'd support a price increase for Slumberhouse. Quality, unique scents. Great service.

I think I'll use this thread/twitter feed as an excuse to jump on a bottle of Pear + Olive tomorrow, which has been on my FBW list for a while.

That's interesting. When I was placing my order for samples they were all listed, but checking now, all gone. Shame.

Email Slumberhouse directly - they don't have the three frags listed on the site but will invoice you for what you want.

They're only available in this manner.

But is there a point in getting samples of something that's discontinued? I'm betting they'll send out what is currently available.

Oh I meant full bottles are the ones available by private arrangement.

I got given samples of the three discontinued frags when I bought a bottle of Ore a few weeks ago.
I'm seriously considering getting a bottle of Vikt.

Ah, I see. Well, I guess it'll depend on what I get sent. I'm sure something can be worked out one way or another.

Very few frags listed on his site now, so I suspect some new ones are in the works.

Plus moving to a studio in Portland's artsy Pearl District ( rather than making the stuff at home, I think ) is a reasonable step up too.

I certainly can't blame him for seeing what the market will bear, price-wise. The amount of stir his things have caused warrants that, I feel.

Really great to see how things have moved ahead for him though, and I imagine its been a bit of a surprise for him as well. :-)

I have no real issues with this and still support him fully. I think most who love his fragrances should since he is just the one person who takes such pride in what he does. At least they are extraits now, so compared to Nassomato, they are still cheaper.

I haven't received any samples yet, but a price increase just means the quality will have to match up to the price point for me.

the cap thing is "hmmm".....

While I agree with your point about the caps (I'm a bloke that loves a good fragrance bottle cap, and the ones on Slumberhouse bottles are very good) I've got to disagree with some of your points.
I'll try not to sound like a rabid Slumberhouse fanboy here, but please forgive me if I sound too much like a shill. I'll also try not to put words in your mouth, or Josh's.

Regarding the reformulation, are there any fragrance houses, independent or otherwise, that reformulate only after having gone through an extensive consultation process with their consumers?

Surely this approach to reformulation (and the regularly changing product lines) give credence to Josh's assertions that Slumberhouse is an outlet for his creativity. How boring would it be to create 6 scents that people like, never change them, and spend the rest of your days just mixing up the same formulas? I think a consistent, methodical approach like that would signal that he's treating it more like a business than a creative project. Besides, then we'd be criticising him for simply treading water.

Obviously the ideal situation would be for Josh to constantly expand his range of frags, while still having the older ones available for purchase, but again, if this is a side-project, he simply may not have the time.

As for the 'higher price, lower volume', I'd like to see a side-by-side comparison between the old and new formulations. If the strength and longevity are dramatically increased, then there's no harm done, as I see it.
I must say I don't really dig the marbles in the bottle thing, though.

Concerning the discontinuation of his fragrances, at least Josh has the decency to tell us (twitter, mailing list, website) that they're being discontinued, thus giving people a chance to stock up on the fragrances they love. Who else does that? Certainly no mainstream perfumer does - we rely on word of mouth, stock levels at department stores, and speculation from disinterested SAs. Similarly with reformulations - the companies swear that the fragrances haven't been reformulated, so we jump on here and swear that they have been.

Yes, we consumers are indeed vital to Slumberhouse's life as a perfumery, but not to the point where we should be able to totally dictate what Josh does.
There is a delicate balance between having power as consumers, and being grateful that Josh is putting out the fragrances he is.

We shouldn't kiss his @ss in deference and reverence* and be happy with whatever he does, but simultaneously we shouldn't presume that his "fans and customers" have become partners in the business.

May I suggest raising your concerns with Josh directly? He may give you some inside info on new or rereleased fragrances, or at least give you his reasons for what he does.

*my post may sound like I'm doing just that, however :S

I believe I did read your posts properly - you began the thread by informing many people of the price rises, and maintained that you were merely bringing the price rises to our attention. I liked that you quoted Josh so extensively in one of your posts, so that people can be well-informed.

You then, as you say, raised a number of issues for discussion. Your post (#28) employed hyperbole and rhetoric that made it clear you were moving from objective informer to subjective critic. This is when I responded with my own post, to put forward a contrasting point of view to yours.
I'm not saying any or all of your points are without merit, only that I feel differently to you in regard to some of them.

Nobody is above criticism, I agree, but by failing to acknowledge any points I've raised (even dismissing them as ill-informed or ignorant, stating that I didn't read your posts properly) couldn't it be said that you're failing to facilitate the discussion you say you want?

I'm sorry that you feel that dissecting my response is a waste of your time - I know my post came across as overly-reverent, but like you said, nobody's perfect (not even Jacques Polge).
Consider it me playing devil's advocate if need be, but you pride yourself on voicing your opinion, and so I've voiced mine.

Just as you 'say what you see fit', I hope the same liberty is granted to the rest of us.

I got this announcement during intermission of Thomas Ades' "Powder Her Face" and the combined events made me feel really, really gay!

- - - Updated - - -

I have yet to get my hands on anything by Slumberhouse. I purchased 6 samples a couple weeks ago, and am still waiting for them to arrive. I like that it is a one man operation, and after reading the large update by email newsletter subscription the other night, I can totally sympathize. It's a one man band. If he is not in love with making something, he would become a slave to his customers, since he literally does every aspect of the operation. It's like when a one-man-kitchen takes a dish off the menu, or changes it slightly -- it's not a slap in the face of the customers, it's just the way of the world. You received joy for what you paid for in the past, but unfortunately it cannot be available forever. Things get eliminated everywhere, sadly.

If his fragrances are high-quality, and everybody else but him is charging much higher prices, why doesn't he deserve to make a buck? Happy wife, happy husband, happy children, happy dog, happy cat, happy home. Rather than being happy for receiving high-quality products for a low price for awhile, it's almost unfair to expect that advantage to last forever. Everything fades.

I hate bottle caps, I like the bottom of the new bottles, I like the laser-etching of the new bottles, and I like the glass marbles!

I think you've summed up very well why this line is not for you. Slumberhouse is not meant to inspire "consumer confidence." In fact, I would go as far as to say that a feeling of nothing-is-grounded and everything-is-changing fuels the entire concept. Sometimes you see people in an amusement park look at a ride and just know it will make them sick. This seems to be you looking at Slumberhouse from the outside. Ça suffit.

I have jumped on many times, and some of the most treasured bottles in my collection are ones that you are dismissing as "drafts." I don't see them as such. They are beautiful, ephemeral things that I grabbed hold of as they passed. Life is like this. I've made my peace with the fact that, esp. in the world of fragrance, nothing lasts forever.

If it's consumer rights and safety and constancy you want, I think you will only find frustration.

no comment.

Let's see....We don't want to see frags ever change or be reformulated, and we don't want to see their prices go up.

Oh ! I know how to deal with those frustrations : Let's single out a little guy like Josh, who actually dares to be honest about these things, and have him be the one we dump on.

I mean really.

no comment again

Oh yeah, following them on Twitter allowed me to get bottles of both Ore and Vikt.

Rume is really growing on me, too, but not enough to overlook the acrid opening.

Think I'll take my money and buy Nasomatto instead. I was thinking about exploring this line, but the guy that runs it seems like he doesn't know what he's doing. I've heard the "It's a passion of mine and I'm not in it to make money" a million times over. Sounds like he's trying to justify paying extra for less and getting nothing but fluff in return. No thanks buddy!

A couple weeks ago? How long does it actually take to get some samples? I placed an order last week...what kind of wait am I in for?

no comment again again. Hopefully a mod can just delete all of this.

Yeah, I've heard some really good things about his fragrances. His methods and reasoning seem odd, but if that's what he needs to do to stay in business then more power to him. I'll take your advice and check back later to see if he can live up to the expectations of an improved product.

I found the update to extrait de parfum a very good update, and, of course, the price would go up too.

BUT the discontinuation is almost incomprehensible. He dont like Rume anymore so we just go to fkng hell and its it?
And who love the fragrance, like me and 3 or 4 friends that ive sent a sample and bought a bottle?

I was so excited to get Rume even stronger, in extrait de parfum...
What a different way to run business, or non business with some higher profits now, or whatever...

no comment again again again

Well, hoping for the best then...

There comes a point when people have divergent views in any civilized discussion about fragrance that you have to "agree to disagree." That point passed about halfway through this thread. In response to whether Slumberhouse is legitimate or how "mistaken" I am, how could I possibly agree to something that would have deprived me of some of my favorite scents? Pear+Olive is possibly my favorite scent of all time. Your continued nattering on about how illegitimate and mistaken everyone else is goes well beyond making a decision for yourself and stating your point of view. Simply put, you are not the one who decides ultimately. Time and the general momentum of opinion will either hold up Slumberhouse or tear it down. In the meantime, while we're all sitting around having a discussion, what exactly is the point of posting over and over again not just your opinion but how wrong you think everyone else is? It's a bit...uncivilized.

For me, I don't love every change that happens in this line. My ideal tobacco scent was the second iteration of Jeke. I much prefer it over the third (and now fourth?) because it was drier and less honeyed. But that's life. I'm not entitled to get the same thing every time. This is a person who is running his business much as I expect he runs his life--in the moment. By the way, it is a perfectly legitimate concept to consider the business side of the house as much a part of the concept as the compositions. You don't have to like it, but it's legitimate. It reminds me of art collectives that formed in order to create works that existed separately from the name of any single artist/creator, which was a pretty radical (and for some disconcerting) re-thinking of the business of visual art. Again, you don't have to agree that it's successful but to declare the entire concept illegitimate is pretty high and mighty.

Either you're willing to go along for the ride or you're not. Simple as that.

- - - Updated - - -


You may know Josh "considerably well," but I would be careful about putting words in his mouth. I do not have any such knowledge, but I cringed when I read that he didn't post the announcement on the site because of reactions like Trebor's. I would be shocked if that were the case.

It is also perfectly legitimate for anyone to question the success of someone's business concept. It's not just about whether someone is passionate or not or whether they started on Etsy and that makes them sympathetic. In fact, really, why should I care about that at all? Either the juice speaks to me or it doesn't. And being a fan of this line requires a certain diligence so that something wonderful doesn't pass you by, so frankly the ante is upped in terms of how much I expect to be rewarded. On this matter, I have to say that I agree with Trebor. All these qualities that I'm sure makes Josh a great friend to you are not necessarily a rationale for why we should spend money on the scents. They have to stand on their own.

You're right. I'll delete everything I posted (which will still show up in quotes unfortunately) and stop mentioning him or what he says, or anything about any of his fragrances ever again. Lately I feel like I can't do anything right, and I'm wondering if this is even worth it anymore. Life sucks.

It's not all that bad, and I think it's fine to continue posting about Slumberhouse. I recently was gifted a ridiculously nice bottle of an O'Driù scent as a thank you for hosting a little event here around one of their fragrances, and it left me in a quandary about whether I could continue posting on BN about O'Driù and be unbiased. I think I can, but I decided that I would just add a little disclaimer when necessary to indicate that I had accepted a gift. I think introducing your comments with a note that you are friends with the perfumer is sufficient to give everyone else the correct context for your remarks. It would be unfortunate not to hear your comments at all. I for one enjoy reading them.

Nor do I.

....

i love the vehemence!

- - - Updated - - -

i am not claiming credibility. but i am allowed to have preferences. i do not like bottle caps, because it's another thing to have to juggle, and with a young puppy always at my heels, i hate the anxiety of dropping the bottle because i'm holding the cap... and i do think the aesthetic of the bottom of the new bottles is rather beautiful, as is the laser etching... irrespective of what's inside the bottles, which I've yet to smell...

Received my samples today. I think Josh sent along his entire line. Any ideas on which one(s) I should start with?

It sort of depends on your style. Personally, I went in order of how they are presented on the main page of the website. However, if you got Sova, that would be a great starting point for you (as it was for me). I went on to Norne after that I think (bucking the aforementioned trend).

What did he send you? It varies (well, everyone gets the in production ones, but he will generally send extras).

I got my samples yesterday. I tried one spray here, one spray there, one spray here, one spray there, and I couldn't sleep until just a couple hours before work. After a long night at the opera (PARSIFAL), somehow I couldn't even think of resting. I love the "carnal delight" inherent in the fragrances. It's almost simplistic, forcibly restrained, but unrelenting in respective obsessiveness.

And today -- during work, during lunch, during dinner, I've been huffing-and-puffing... I found myself growing closer and closer to Pear Olive, I found myself finding the intensity of Norne rather calming (not to mention spectacularly scintillating), and Sova is growing on me slowly but surely... The others will have to wait for awhile...