I was advised by 2 different post offices that frags could be shipped ground but not by air(priority).
post #61 of 146
2/19/13 at 4:57pm
Basenotes › Basenotes Forums › Fragrance Discussion › Male Fragrance Discussion › USPS' Perfume Crackdown March 1; No Air/Priority Shipments
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USPS' Perfume Crackdown March 1; No Air/Priority Shipments - Page 2
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2/19/13 at 5:05pm
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@ Paul P - UPS have their own cargo planes, I think. Maybe others do too.
If u buy from overseas, definitely best to check the carrier at present - some independent ones have 'hazardous goods' licences so can ship using own transport from start to finish. Generally, only large businesses will be using these as the price for 'contract' customers is reasonable, but not for private ones. Just because someone in the U.K. is an internet business doesn't mean they have sorted this out right now as we were given no notice.
Sorry, don't know your regs - someone else may?
Some larger U.K. sellers, such as Ormond Jayne, have already made arrangements.
Sorry not to be more helpful - situation is still developing.
If u buy from overseas, definitely best to check the carrier at present - some independent ones have 'hazardous goods' licences so can ship using own transport from start to finish. Generally, only large businesses will be using these as the price for 'contract' customers is reasonable, but not for private ones. Just because someone in the U.K. is an internet business doesn't mean they have sorted this out right now as we were given no notice.
Sorry, don't know your regs - someone else may?
Some larger U.K. sellers, such as Ormond Jayne, have already made arrangements.
Sorry not to be more helpful - situation is still developing.
post #63 of 146
2/19/13 at 5:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by dampier 
In accordance with international aviation regulations, the U.S. Postal Service will commence a public information campaign on Mar. 1 to remind postal customers that shipments of perfume and other alcohol-based cosmetics are hazardous and cannot be shipped through the U.S. mail.
In accordance with international aviation regulations, the U.S. Postal Service will commence a public information campaign on Mar. 1 to remind postal customers that shipments of perfume and other alcohol-based cosmetics are hazardous and cannot be shipped through the U.S. mail.
Quote:
Originally Posted by david
It is a TOTAL, (worldwide) ban and includes LAND and SEA shipping. ALL METHODS OF SHIPMENT.
The enforcement came from the UNIVERSAL POSTAL UNION, not as some people think the Civil Aviation Authorities. This is not about perfumes/alcohol being carried on planes ~ it is about all forms of shipping perfumes/alcohol. The ban also includes lithium batteries and, (of all things!) nail varnish ???????..............
This planet has become pathetic.
It is a TOTAL, (worldwide) ban and includes LAND and SEA shipping. ALL METHODS OF SHIPMENT.
The enforcement came from the UNIVERSAL POSTAL UNION, not as some people think the Civil Aviation Authorities. This is not about perfumes/alcohol being carried on planes ~ it is about all forms of shipping perfumes/alcohol. The ban also includes lithium batteries and, (of all things!) nail varnish ???????..............
This planet has become pathetic.
The thread's title and people's interpretation seems to be off. Barclaydetolly's long post was more helpful. March first is just their information campaign, says nothing about enforcement. If they're going to be enforcing rules as strictly as they are right now, we'll all be fine.
As to anyone believing it is illegal for USPS to open your package, that's also mistaken. Postal inspectors are authorized to open mail with on a warrant issued with a finding of probable cause.
https://postalinspectors.uspis.gov/contactUs/faq.aspx
As for what constitutes probable cause is a more ambiguous matter.
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2/19/13 at 5:25pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul P
David,
thanks for all your posts on this topic. I'd be keen to read some more on this. Can you provide actual URL's for the Universal Postal Union where this is discussed ? I've tried looking at their website, but can't find anything.
Thanks
David,
thanks for all your posts on this topic. I'd be keen to read some more on this. Can you provide actual URL's for the Universal Postal Union where this is discussed ? I've tried looking at their website, but can't find anything.
Thanks
Hi Paul,
I got all of my information via the UK press office of the Civil Aviation Authorities. I phoned the press office, (you can google to find their number ~ or alternatively write to them) The guy I spoke to was very helpful and extremely knowledgable. He explained to me that this regulation has come from the UPU. He also told me that the International Civil Aviation Authorities do not like the regulation, ( I am assuming because aircraft make a lot of revenue from transporting packages) and that the UK postal service, (Royal Mail) are fighting the regulation for the same reason. The Royal Mail want the alcohol limit, currently at 24 percent, lifted, (obviously to be able to ship perfume).
I really hope everyone investgates this issue and I think as many members as possible should contact the press on all levels including newspapers, radio and television.
The Universal Postal Union has deliberately kept this very quiet...so as not to create a fuss.
.....that's probably the reason you are not finding any direct information there.
post #65 of 146
2/19/13 at 5:28pm
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post #66 of 146
2/19/13 at 5:30pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lpp
@ Paul P - UPS have their own cargo planes, I think. Maybe others do too.
If u buy from overseas, definitely best to check the carrier at present - some independent ones have 'hazardous goods' licences so can ship using own transport from start to finish. Generally, only large businesses will be using these as the price for 'contract' customers is reasonable, but not for private ones. Just because someone in the U.K. is an internet business doesn't mean they have sorted this out right now as we were given no notice.
Sorry, don't know your regs - someone else may?
Some larger U.K. sellers, such as Ormond Jayne, have already made arrangements.
Sorry not to be more helpful - situation is still developing.
@ Paul P - UPS have their own cargo planes, I think. Maybe others do too.
If u buy from overseas, definitely best to check the carrier at present - some independent ones have 'hazardous goods' licences so can ship using own transport from start to finish. Generally, only large businesses will be using these as the price for 'contract' customers is reasonable, but not for private ones. Just because someone in the U.K. is an internet business doesn't mean they have sorted this out right now as we were given no notice.
Sorry, don't know your regs - someone else may?
Some larger U.K. sellers, such as Ormond Jayne, have already made arrangements.
Sorry not to be more helpful - situation is still developing.
Hey Lyn,
thanks for that. Must be pretty late in the UK now.
You are absolutely correct - I never would have imagined it, but UPS do have their own planes - UPS airlines - and after reading your post, I did a little research, and Fedex has their own fleet as well. So why are Fedex and USP not worried about shipping perfume ? Probably because they're sensible.
Honestly, this whole situation represents safety measures taken to ridiculous extremes - who ever heard of a plane exploding because of cologne ?
- - - Updated - - -
Quote:
Originally Posted by david
Hi Paul,
I got all of my information via the UK press office of the Civil Aviation Authorities. I phoned the press office, (you can google to find their number ~ or alternatively write to them) The guy I spoke to was very helpful and extremely knowledgable. He explained to me that this regulation has come from the UPU. He also told me that the International Civil Aviation Authorities do not like the regulation, ( I am assuming because aircraft make a lot of revenue from transporting packages) and that the UK postal service, (Royal Mail) are fighting the regulation for the same reason. The Royal Mail want the alcohol limit, currently at 24 percent, lifted, (obviously to be able to ship perfume).
I really hope everyone investgates this issue and I think as many members as possible should contact the press on all levels including newspapers, radio and television.
The Universal Postal Union has deliberately kept this very quiet...so as not to create a fuss.
.....that's probably the reason you are not finding any direct information there.
Hi Paul,
I got all of my information via the UK press office of the Civil Aviation Authorities. I phoned the press office, (you can google to find their number ~ or alternatively write to them) The guy I spoke to was very helpful and extremely knowledgable. He explained to me that this regulation has come from the UPU. He also told me that the International Civil Aviation Authorities do not like the regulation, ( I am assuming because aircraft make a lot of revenue from transporting packages) and that the UK postal service, (Royal Mail) are fighting the regulation for the same reason. The Royal Mail want the alcohol limit, currently at 24 percent, lifted, (obviously to be able to ship perfume).
I really hope everyone investgates this issue and I think as many members as possible should contact the press on all levels including newspapers, radio and television.
The Universal Postal Union has deliberately kept this very quiet...so as not to create a fuss.
.....that's probably the reason you are not finding any direct information there.
David,
many thanks for getting back to me - appreciate your time. Let's hope this all gets sorted out in our favour soon.
As an aside, how much would UPS or Fedex charge to ship one bottle of cologne ? $100 AUD ??
post #67 of 146
2/19/13 at 5:34pm
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Paul,
Nobody - see stats earlier!
http://planecrashinfo.com/cause.htm
At present, shippers with 'hazardous goods' licences are o.k. as they've paid to train their staff to comply with the new regs.
Unfortunately, they are few, hopefully others will follow.
Yes, it's late, but I'm nocturnal
Did a UPS quote about 50 miles, U.K., the other day & it was about £85 hazardous goods, private client.
Contract clients way cheaper.
Nobody - see stats earlier!
http://planecrashinfo.com/cause.htm
At present, shippers with 'hazardous goods' licences are o.k. as they've paid to train their staff to comply with the new regs.
Unfortunately, they are few, hopefully others will follow.
Yes, it's late, but I'm nocturnal
Did a UPS quote about 50 miles, U.K., the other day & it was about £85 hazardous goods, private client.
Contract clients way cheaper.
post #68 of 146
2/19/13 at 5:44pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul P
I apologise if my post on this sounds confused - it is because I myself am confused. I use Australia as an example, but what I write could be applied to all countries.
If we assume that these measures will now be rigorously enforced, then as a private buyer, I cannot buy any fragrances from overseas, unless they are shipped by a private company like UPS or Fedex ? Is this correct ?
I can still buy fragrances from sellers in Australia, as long as they adhere to the Australia Post policy for dangerous goods, which AFAICT, simply means transport by land only ?
But Fedex and UPS don't have their own airlines, or their own shipping company - they must ship their fragrances on the same planes etc. that USPS / Royal Mail uses - is this right ? If so, then why can UPS / Fedex use this system and not USPS /Royal Mail etc.? Do UPS and others have special boxes that they use ? Do they wrap their fragrances in fire retardant blankets ? If so, why can't the government postal services also adopt these methods ?
As an aside, I found this on eBay Australia, which was updated in Jan 2013.
http://reviews.ebay.com.au/Perfumes-...00000001392191
I apologise if my post on this sounds confused - it is because I myself am confused. I use Australia as an example, but what I write could be applied to all countries.
If we assume that these measures will now be rigorously enforced, then as a private buyer, I cannot buy any fragrances from overseas, unless they are shipped by a private company like UPS or Fedex ? Is this correct ?
I can still buy fragrances from sellers in Australia, as long as they adhere to the Australia Post policy for dangerous goods, which AFAICT, simply means transport by land only ?
But Fedex and UPS don't have their own airlines, or their own shipping company - they must ship their fragrances on the same planes etc. that USPS / Royal Mail uses - is this right ? If so, then why can UPS / Fedex use this system and not USPS /Royal Mail etc.? Do UPS and others have special boxes that they use ? Do they wrap their fragrances in fire retardant blankets ? If so, why can't the government postal services also adopt these methods ?
As an aside, I found this on eBay Australia, which was updated in Jan 2013.
http://reviews.ebay.com.au/Perfumes-...00000001392191
Paul, I think this has a lot to do with terrorists trying to send liquid bombs disguised as fragrances through the various shipping systems. Certainly the authorities cannot cope with controlling the multitude of parcels being sent, so their solution is to shift the whole thing to private sector specialist services that will control every single parcel that goes through their hands. I must add here that this is my individual theory. I have no definite evidence regarding WHY these enforcements have been put in place.
post #69 of 146
2/19/13 at 6:01pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lpp
Paul,
Nobody - see stats earlier!
http://planecrashinfo.com/cause.htm
At present, shippers with 'hazardous goods' licences are o.k. as they've paid to train their staff to comply with the new regs.
Unfortunately, they are few, hopefully others will follow.
Yes, it's late, but I'm nocturnal
Did a UPS quote about 50 miles, U.K., the other day & it was about £85 hazardous goods, private client.
Contract clients way cheaper.
Paul,
Nobody - see stats earlier!
http://planecrashinfo.com/cause.htm
At present, shippers with 'hazardous goods' licences are o.k. as they've paid to train their staff to comply with the new regs.
Unfortunately, they are few, hopefully others will follow.
Yes, it's late, but I'm nocturnal
Did a UPS quote about 50 miles, U.K., the other day & it was about £85 hazardous goods, private client.
Contract clients way cheaper.
thanks for that Lyn.
I just did a mock calculation on UPS - from LA to Sydney, 1 pound weight, 10 x 10 x 5 inches size, $100 USD value - estimate is about $145 USD !!!!
- - - Updated - - -
Quote:
Originally Posted by david
Paul, I think this has a lot to do with terrorists trying to send liquid bombs disguised as fragrances through the various shipping systems. Certainly the authorities cannot cope with controlling the multitude of parcels being sent, so their solution is to shift the whole thing to private sector specialist services that will control every single parcel that goes through their hands. I must add here that this is my individual theory. I have no definite evidence regarding WHY these enforcements have been put in place.
Paul, I think this has a lot to do with terrorists trying to send liquid bombs disguised as fragrances through the various shipping systems. Certainly the authorities cannot cope with controlling the multitude of parcels being sent, so their solution is to shift the whole thing to private sector specialist services that will control every single parcel that goes through their hands. I must add here that this is my individual theory. I have no definite evidence regarding WHY these enforcements have been put in place.
David, it does sound like a plausible theory to me. But really, who knows ?
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2/19/13 at 6:09pm
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post #71 of 146
2/19/13 at 6:34pm
That's the govt for ya. Too many regulations..who knows what's next, lol, maybe they will be like the TSA. Lol, post office workers seem to be on break ALL the time at my p.o. Lol, a while back..there's this super long line that goes out the door. What do they do? All of them go to IHOP for bfast, no joke..the whole office leaves, everyone in the back and front leave, except for one lone person in front, who is, of course, slow. I was like, really? What job allows everyone to go to IHOP? Like didn't you just start your shift? lol. I was thinking, where are they going for lunch? Chilis? Does anyone ever work here? LOL. I come out and one of the ladies going to IHOP comes out dancing like Elaine from Seinfield, saying, "Goin to IHOP, ya!". I am like..um..I am sure everyone left in that long line is happy for ya. There's only one person usually cause someone is on break..or sometimes the whole office, lol. Oh, and they don't close till 5..but they lock the doors at 4:30? So, IHOP, plus breaks, lunch, early close..not a bad job! lol.
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2/19/13 at 6:45pm
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Originally Posted by kalli
That's the govt for ya. Too many regulations..who knows what's next, lol, maybe they will be like the TSA. Lol, post office workers seem to be on break ALL the time at my p.o. Lol, a while back..there's this super long line that goes out the door. What do they do? All of them go to IHOP for bfast, no joke..the whole office leaves, everyone in the back and front leave, except for one lone person in front, who is, of course, slow. I was like, really? What job allows everyone to go to IHOP? Like didn't you just start your shift? lol. I was thinking, where are they going for lunch? Chilis? Does anyone ever work here? LOL. I come out and one of the ladies going to IHOP comes out dancing like Elaine from Seinfield, saying, "Goin to IHOP, ya!". I am like..um..I am sure everyone left in that long line is happy for ya. There's only one person usually cause someone is on break..or sometimes the whole office, lol. Oh, and they don't close till 5..but they lock the doors at 4:30? So, IHOP, plus breaks, lunch, early close..not a bad job! lol.
That's the govt for ya. Too many regulations..who knows what's next, lol, maybe they will be like the TSA. Lol, post office workers seem to be on break ALL the time at my p.o. Lol, a while back..there's this super long line that goes out the door. What do they do? All of them go to IHOP for bfast, no joke..the whole office leaves, everyone in the back and front leave, except for one lone person in front, who is, of course, slow. I was like, really? What job allows everyone to go to IHOP? Like didn't you just start your shift? lol. I was thinking, where are they going for lunch? Chilis? Does anyone ever work here? LOL. I come out and one of the ladies going to IHOP comes out dancing like Elaine from Seinfield, saying, "Goin to IHOP, ya!". I am like..um..I am sure everyone left in that long line is happy for ya. There's only one person usually cause someone is on break..or sometimes the whole office, lol. Oh, and they don't close till 5..but they lock the doors at 4:30? So, IHOP, plus breaks, lunch, early close..not a bad job! lol.
Can't blame them for being excited about IHOP. Seriously
post #73 of 146
2/19/13 at 6:47pm
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Originally Posted by kalli
That's the govt for ya. Too many regulations..who knows what's next, lol, maybe they will be like the TSA. Lol, post office workers seem to be on break ALL the time at my p.o. Lol, a while back..there's this super long line that goes out the door. What do they do? All of them go to IHOP for bfast, no joke..the whole office leaves, everyone in the back and front leave, except for one lone person in front, who is, of course, slow. I was like, really? What job allows everyone to go to IHOP? Like didn't you just start your shift? lol. I was thinking, where are they going for lunch? Chilis? Does anyone ever work here? LOL. I come out and one of the ladies going to IHOP comes out dancing like Elaine from Seinfield, saying, "Goin to IHOP, ya!". I am like..um..I am sure everyone left in that long line is happy for ya. There's only one person usually cause someone is on break..or sometimes the whole office, lol. Oh, and they don't close till 5..but they lock the doors at 4:30? So, IHOP, plus breaks, lunch, early close..not a bad job! lol.
That's the govt for ya. Too many regulations..who knows what's next, lol, maybe they will be like the TSA. Lol, post office workers seem to be on break ALL the time at my p.o. Lol, a while back..there's this super long line that goes out the door. What do they do? All of them go to IHOP for bfast, no joke..the whole office leaves, everyone in the back and front leave, except for one lone person in front, who is, of course, slow. I was like, really? What job allows everyone to go to IHOP? Like didn't you just start your shift? lol. I was thinking, where are they going for lunch? Chilis? Does anyone ever work here? LOL. I come out and one of the ladies going to IHOP comes out dancing like Elaine from Seinfield, saying, "Goin to IHOP, ya!". I am like..um..I am sure everyone left in that long line is happy for ya. There's only one person usually cause someone is on break..or sometimes the whole office, lol. Oh, and they don't close till 5..but they lock the doors at 4:30? So, IHOP, plus breaks, lunch, early close..not a bad job! lol.
Each person will of course have different stories / experiences - my personal experience with Australia Post has been great - over more than 30 years I've had to deal with them. And I could not fault any of them - the mailmen, the package delivery guys, the staff in dozens and dozens of post offices I've dealt with. Can't fault any of them. never lost a letter or package, staff generally helpful. Really, all great.
From me - big up for the guys and gals at Australia Post.
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2/19/13 at 8:05pm
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Originally Posted by silentrich
By law they can't open your package and if they do it better be for a really good reason otherwise that $100 bottle of fragrance is going to turn into a $100,000 lawsuit.
By law they can't open your package and if they do it better be for a really good reason otherwise that $100 bottle of fragrance is going to turn into a $100,000 lawsuit.
Which law is this? The reason why I ask, is because when I shipped textbooks via USPS Media Mail, the USPS employee would regularly tell me that they randomly open Media Mail shipments to ensure they're truly textbooks (and not some other item trying to pass through with the cheaper Media Mail rate). Various USPS employees would routinely tell me this when accepting Media Mail packages.
- - - Updated - - -
Quote:
Originally Posted by null set
As to anyone believing it is illegal for USPS to open your package, that's also mistaken. Postal inspectors are authorized to open mail with on a warrant issued with a finding of probable cause.
https://postalinspectors.uspis.gov/contactUs/faq.aspx
As for what constitutes probable cause is a more ambiguous matter.
As to anyone believing it is illegal for USPS to open your package, that's also mistaken. Postal inspectors are authorized to open mail with on a warrant issued with a finding of probable cause.
https://postalinspectors.uspis.gov/contactUs/faq.aspx
As for what constitutes probable cause is a more ambiguous matter.
Yep, exactly my experience when I used to ship textbooks via USPS Media Mail.
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2/19/13 at 8:51pm
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Originally Posted by CaliDude
Which law is this? The reason why I ask, is because when I shipped textbooks via USPS Media Mail, the USPS employee would regularly tell me that they randomly open Media Mail shipments to ensure they're truly textbooks (and not some other item trying to pass through with the cheaper Media Mail rate). Various USPS employees would routinely tell me this when accepting Media Mail packages.
Which law is this? The reason why I ask, is because when I shipped textbooks via USPS Media Mail, the USPS employee would regularly tell me that they randomly open Media Mail shipments to ensure they're truly textbooks (and not some other item trying to pass through with the cheaper Media Mail rate). Various USPS employees would routinely tell me this when accepting Media Mail packages.
It's the 4th amendment and the USPS is a government agency so they have to follow those laws. Who's to say that box they think is a fragrance isn't a letter with sensitive information such as SS#, birth dates, Credit card information, or things of a private nature. Now imagine having to explain to a lawyer how one of your employees used this information to buy pizza's for everyone at lunch. Same reason you never send cash in the mail.
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2/19/13 at 9:08pm
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2/19/13 at 9:24pm
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Originally Posted by silentrich
It's the 4th amendment and the USPS is a government agency so they have to follow those laws. Who's to say that box they think is a fragrance isn't a letter with sensitive information such as SS#, birth dates, Credit card information, or things of a private nature. Now imagine having to explain to a lawyer how one of your employees used this information to buy pizza's for everyone at lunch. Same reason you never send cash in the mail.
It's the 4th amendment and the USPS is a government agency so they have to follow those laws. Who's to say that box they think is a fragrance isn't a letter with sensitive information such as SS#, birth dates, Credit card information, or things of a private nature. Now imagine having to explain to a lawyer how one of your employees used this information to buy pizza's for everyone at lunch. Same reason you never send cash in the mail.
I understand, but USPS employees have regularly told me that, per standard practice, they may open Media Mail packages to ensure the contents abide by the Media Male packaging rules (e.g. must be a text book). So not sure how they're able to skirt around the 4th amendment. If they do it for Media Mail, I'm sure they have some rule out there that will allow them to open other types of packages.
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2/19/13 at 9:35pm
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Originally Posted by CaliDude
I understand, but USPS employees have regularly told me that, per standard practice, they may open Media Mail packages to ensure the contents abide by the Media Male packaging rules (e.g. must be a text book). So not sure how they're able to skirt around the 4th amendment. If they do it for Media Mail, I'm sure they have some rule out there that will allow them to open other types of packages.
I understand, but USPS employees have regularly told me that, per standard practice, they may open Media Mail packages to ensure the contents abide by the Media Male packaging rules (e.g. must be a text book). So not sure how they're able to skirt around the 4th amendment. If they do it for Media Mail, I'm sure they have some rule out there that will allow them to open other types of packages.
With Media Mail they can, they've actually opened at least one of my packages. Not sure about other types of mail, but because media mail is so specific with what you can send (and will save you a lot of money if it's heavy books that you're sending), USPS probably expects abuse.
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2/19/13 at 9:38pm
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Originally Posted by NYCBoomBoom
With Media Mail they can, they've actually opened at least one of my packages. Not sure about other types of mail, but because media mail is so specific with what you can send (and will save you a lot of money if it's heavy books that you're sending), USPS probably expects abuse.
With Media Mail they can, they've actually opened at least one of my packages. Not sure about other types of mail, but because media mail is so specific with what you can send (and will save you a lot of money if it's heavy books that you're sending), USPS probably expects abuse.
Yep that's it. It's because media mail specifies what kind of mail it is.
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2/20/13 at 12:02am
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Originally Posted by Grungevig
The most interesting situation to me is the ability (at present) to purchase postage online, including for flat-rate priority mail. This option altogether eliminates the need to visit the post office, talk to a clerk even a mail carrier, or answer any questions about the package's contents.
The most interesting situation to me is the ability (at present) to purchase postage online, including for flat-rate priority mail. This option altogether eliminates the need to visit the post office, talk to a clerk even a mail carrier, or answer any questions about the package's contents.
***Finally starts using Stamps dot com***
post #81 of 146
2/20/13 at 12:55am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stuigi
Shipping perfumes from the US to Canada is now a problem as ground shipments are no longer allowed. As everything is now by air any "used cosmetics" or other similar labels are now being met with specific questions from the postal clerks.
Shipping perfumes from the US to Canada is now a problem as ground shipments are no longer allowed. As everything is now by air any "used cosmetics" or other similar labels are now being met with specific questions from the postal clerks.
Thanks for that!
post #82 of 146
2/20/13 at 3:26am
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Clearly, if leakage was a big problem, instead of banning the shipping of perfumes, why not just make a requirement that special zip lock bags be used that would contain any leak?
Shouldn't be that difficult. When I look at Ebay they have bags that you put your cameras in, so that you can shoot underwater.
Cheers,
Renato
Shouldn't be that difficult. When I look at Ebay they have bags that you put your cameras in, so that you can shoot underwater.
Cheers,
Renato
post #83 of 146
2/20/13 at 8:33am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaliDude
I understand, but USPS employees have regularly told me that, per standard practice, they may open Media Mail packages to ensure the contents abide by the Media Male packaging rules (e.g. must be a text book). So not sure how they're able to skirt around the 4th amendment. If they do it for Media Mail, I'm sure they have some rule out there that will allow them to open other types of packages.
I understand, but USPS employees have regularly told me that, per standard practice, they may open Media Mail packages to ensure the contents abide by the Media Male packaging rules (e.g. must be a text book). So not sure how they're able to skirt around the 4th amendment. If they do it for Media Mail, I'm sure they have some rule out there that will allow them to open other types of packages.
I hate to rain on anyone's parade, but here is some information about the status in the United States. I'm not offering legal advice, but just saying you should realize a few things. None of this applies internationally, and I don't presume to know any of those rules.
Without going into specifics (you could write a very lengthy law review article on the subject), suffice to say:
1. Postal inspectors can open any piece of mail, media or not, upon probable cause without a warrant, if they believe that it contains a hazardous substance. And believe it or not there was a presidential directive a few years ago that indicated the feds believe even probable cause is unnecessary, and only reasonable suspicion or less may be required. If you think that's illegal, you're probably right -- but do you want to be the one to have to spend thousands of dollars to prove it, when the government has a very large team of lawyers who would be glad to argue that it's perfectly legal?
2. As a matter of federal criminal law, Title 18 of the United States Code, Section 1716, provides that knowingly mailing a hazardous substance in violation of postal restrictions (which you are presumed to know) is a crime. And one of the restrictions is that you can't ship perfume by any means other than surface transportation. If a postal inspector decided to open a priority package you've sent, and if it contains perfume, will they prosecute you? Maybe the chance is one in a million, or one in ten million. But again, do you want to take that chance?
3. Not giving legal advice here, just making sure everybody realizes the facts.
post #84 of 146
2/20/13 at 9:21am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barclaydetolly
I hate to rain on anyone's parade, but here is some information about the status in the United States. I'm not offering legal advice, but just saying you should realize a few things. None of this applies internationally, and I don't presume to know any of those rules.
Without going into specifics (you could write a very lengthy law review article on the subject), suffice to say
I hate to rain on anyone's parade, but here is some information about the status in the United States. I'm not offering legal advice, but just saying you should realize a few things. None of this applies internationally, and I don't presume to know any of those rules.
Without going into specifics (you could write a very lengthy law review article on the subject), suffice to say
Thanks barclaydetolly. I agree. It has always been my understanding & experience that USPS can, pretty much, freely open up any package they want as long as they have suspicions.
post #85 of 146
2/20/13 at 11:06am
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2013 Universal Postal Union rules and regs can be found in this publication:
http://www.upu.int/en/activities/par...st-manual.html
http://www.upu.int/en/activities/par...st-manual.html
post #86 of 146
2/20/13 at 12:49pm
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post #87 of 146
2/20/13 at 12:50pm
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post #88 of 146
2/20/13 at 1:11pm
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post #89 of 146
2/20/13 at 2:09pm
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Just had a letter saying I have breached sending regulations on hazardous materials. They very generously said they would take no action this time but have "disposed of the package accordingly" Thank you Royal fucking Mail, why couldn't'you have just sent my package back to me by land seeing as it hadn't even left the country? BAstards!,,
post #90 of 146
2/20/13 at 3:08pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYCBoomBoom
So if any planes go down over the US in the coming day(s), we'll know who to blame?
So if any planes go down over the US in the coming day(s), we'll know who to blame?
You ever seen the movie Castaway with Tom Hanks? Yep, that was my doing. Knew I should have used bubblewrap.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juanderer
But, unless I've missed something, the regulation is not new.
But, unless I've missed something, the regulation is not new.
It's not new it's just being reiterated.
post #91 of 146
2/20/13 at 3:41pm
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post #92 of 146
2/20/13 at 7:37pm
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post #93 of 146
2/21/13 at 12:30am
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I'm not sure, but it looks like perfume low hazard, but you can mail it in small quantities if it is packaged, labled, and shipped correctly.
http://pe.usps.com/text/pub52/pub52apxa.htm
http://pe.usps.com/text/pub52/pub52apxa.htm
post #94 of 146
2/21/13 at 2:05am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indianwells
Just had a letter saying I have breached sending regulations on hazardous materials. They very generously said they would take no action this time but have "disposed of the package accordingly" Thank you Royal fucking Mail, why couldn't'you have just sent my package back to me by land seeing as it hadn't even left the country? BAstards!,,
Just had a letter saying I have breached sending regulations on hazardous materials. They very generously said they would take no action this time but have "disposed of the package accordingly" Thank you Royal fucking Mail, why couldn't'you have just sent my package back to me by land seeing as it hadn't even left the country? BAstards!,,Did you state what was inside it???
I am not sure about doing decant swaps and so on right now for fear of having parcels and contents destroyed like this. I would rather use an alternative courier if there is one available in the UK.
post #95 of 146
2/21/13 at 5:21am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew_B.
I'm not sure, but it looks like perfume low hazard, but you can mail it in small quantities if it is packaged, labled, and shipped correctly.
http://pe.usps.com/text/pub52/pub52apxa.htm
I'm not sure, but it looks like perfume low hazard, but you can mail it in small quantities if it is packaged, labled, and shipped correctly.
http://pe.usps.com/text/pub52/pub52apxa.htm
If you tell the truth:
Through USPS. Domestic Ground is ok if properly labelled, etc.; Domestic Air is prohibited. International is prohibited.
Private carriers will ship Domestic Ground, Domestic Air, and International. Rates may be startling.
If you lie or deceive through omission:
Any carrier might be willing to accept your package as non-hazmat, sort it as non-hazmat, and ship it as non-hazmat, at non-hazmat prices. Will it get to its desination? Does any insurance become null/void if it is carried as non-hazmat but determined to have been mis-labelled by the mailer?
post #96 of 146
2/21/13 at 5:52am
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post #97 of 146
2/21/13 at 6:01am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian_Towers
What if a package containing perfume breaks because of bad treatment and spills all over other customers stuff...
BAN PERFUME, IS DANGEROUS!
What if a package containing perfume breaks because of bad treatment and spills all over other customers stuff...
BAN PERFUME, IS DANGEROUS!
Please don't read any righteous indignation into this...
Yes, at the international level it is considered a hazardous material / dangerous good. It is a flammable liquid, mostly ethanol, with a flashpoint around 70F. If it is not handled properly (visual labelling, positioning in the cargo hold, etc.) then it may help make a bad situation worse where fire is involved during transport.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kbe
With all the disasters fragrance sent via US mail has caused* no wonder!
*Google search using "fragrance US mail fire explosion" or "alcohol US mail fire explosion" or "perfume US mail fire explosion" or "cologne US mail fire explosion = 0 of any relevance
Does anyone have a documented incident to share?
With all the disasters fragrance sent via US mail has caused* no wonder!
*Google search using "fragrance US mail fire explosion" or "alcohol US mail fire explosion" or "perfume US mail fire explosion" or "cologne US mail fire explosion = 0 of any relevance
Does anyone have a documented incident to share?
http://www.airportwatch.org.uk/?page_id=3259 offers up some news stories related to air cargo plane accidents.
A few of these fires were presumably started by lithium batteries (geez, you think they have anything to do with the new/modified rules regarding lithium batteries?)... yet when the subject is perfume it really does not matter what ignites a fire, the point is that fires that break out in cargo holds will only be more trouble if unlabelled flammable materials are on board as well.
If perfume is not properly labelled, it will be sorted and cargo'd in a position as if it were non-hazardous. It will not show up as hazardous materials on any manifests. If a plane should go down because of a cargo fire, perhaps the first responders in the plane might be witness to perfume and other flammable liquids unmarked as flammable accelerating the fire, but the crash investigators and the carrier may be in the dark and not be in a good position to provide useful feedback that might be helpful in preventing recurrence in other flights.
post #98 of 146
2/21/13 at 8:31am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indianwells
Just had a letter saying I have breached sending regulations on hazardous materials. They very generously said they would take no action this time but have "disposed of the package accordingly" Thank you Royal fucking Mail, why couldn't'you have just sent my package back to me by land seeing as it hadn't even left the country? BAstards!,,
Just had a letter saying I have breached sending regulations on hazardous materials. They very generously said they would take no action this time but have "disposed of the package accordingly" Thank you Royal fucking Mail, why couldn't'you have just sent my package back to me by land seeing as it hadn't even left the country? BAstards!,,lt's reports like these that are really worrying.
indianwells, was your package destined for overseas or a UK address?
post #99 of 146
2/21/13 at 8:48am
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post #100 of 146
2/21/13 at 9:28am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teardrop
lt's reports like these that are really worrying.
indianwells, was your package destined for overseas or a UK address?
lt's reports like these that are really worrying.
indianwells, was your package destined for overseas or a UK address?
Hi teardrop, yes, it was for Austria. It hadn't left the UK though so they could have simply sent it back to me instead of destroying it. That's what really annoyed me. I wasn't asked in the post office what was in the package, I guess the staff are still coming up to speed. What really irritated me was in the letter they said "we will take no action on this occasion"!! Am I supposed to be bloody grateful?? As I said before, BASTARDS!
post #101 of 146
2/21/13 at 9:45am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indianwells
Hi teardrop, yes, it was for Austria. It hadn't left the UK though so they could have simply sent it back to me instead of destroying it. That's what really annoyed me. I wasn't asked in the post office what was in the package, I guess the staff are still coming up to speed. What really irritated me was in the letter they said "we will take no action on this occasion"!! Am I supposed to be bloody grateful?? As I said before, BASTARDS!
Hi teardrop, yes, it was for Austria. It hadn't left the UK though so they could have simply sent it back to me instead of destroying it. That's what really annoyed me. I wasn't asked in the post office what was in the package, I guess the staff are still coming up to speed. What really irritated me was in the letter they said "we will take no action on this occasion"!! Am I supposed to be bloody grateful?? As I said before, BASTARDS!
Thanks for the clarification, & you have my sympathy; l would be enraged by this, too! An absolutely disgraceful way to treat a customer. You would think that, at least until the message has got through to the general public, they would at least return the item to you with an explanation of the new rules. But to my knowledge there has been no publicity whatsoever about all this. The word "omnishambles" was surely invented to describe the Royal Mail. Perhaps it would indeed be better if they were sold off.
post #102 of 146
2/21/13 at 10:56am
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I think that there should be separate threads for different countries. This thread originally was talking about the US postal service, but now it's morphed into a general discussion of postal regulations worldwide. The problem is that there are different rules in different countries, and I'm sure all of us around the world will have different experiences.
post #103 of 146
2/21/13 at 12:14pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barclaydetolly
I think that there should be separate threads for different countries. This thread originally was talking about the US postal service, but now it's morphed into a general discussion of postal regulations worldwide. The problem is that there are different rules in different countries, and I'm sure all of us around the world will have different experiences.
I think that there should be separate threads for different countries. This thread originally was talking about the US postal service, but now it's morphed into a general discussion of postal regulations worldwide. The problem is that there are different rules in different countries, and I'm sure all of us around the world will have different experiences.
I agree Barclay. I will hold my hands up and apologies for me taking it off topic! I had just come back from a lengthy session in a bar in terminal 5 at Heathrow and was rather pissed off at the letter I had got that morning.
The good news is I am currently enjoying a bottle of Moretti in Florence and am looking forward to sampling the fragrance boutiques of this fantastic city tomorrow.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barclaydetolly
3. Retail perfumes are consumer goods that do indeed qualify as ORM-D, making them shippable by "surface transportation" to a domestic destination. Again, I've done the work for you. Scroll down to "perfumery products" and you find that while they are prohibited by air, there's a code showing that, if properly marked, they're shippable by ground:
http://pe.usps.com/text/pub52/pub52apxa.htm
For more information on ORM-D, you can consult the handy wikipedia entry, which even includes pictures of the designation:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ORM-D
Not trying to be critical, but seriously, there's a lot of bad information.
3. Retail perfumes are consumer goods that do indeed qualify as ORM-D, making them shippable by "surface transportation" to a domestic destination. Again, I've done the work for you. Scroll down to "perfumery products" and you find that while they are prohibited by air, there's a code showing that, if properly marked, they're shippable by ground:
http://pe.usps.com/text/pub52/pub52apxa.htm
For more information on ORM-D, you can consult the handy wikipedia entry, which even includes pictures of the designation:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ORM-D
Not trying to be critical, but seriously, there's a lot of bad information.
I contacted the local postmaster's office to get additional insight on this and learned why I had a problem shipping while this regulation would seem to give me a pass if I shipped by ground.
The distinction i got was that I am not a professional dealer shipping products suitable for retail sale. The ORM-D exception carries an important provision. The item must qualify as a consumer commodity, which means:
"Consumer commodity is a hazardous material that is packaged and distributed in a quantity and form intended or suitable for retail sale and designed for consumption by individuals for their personal care or household use purposes. This term can also include certain drugs or medicines."
The key word is "packaged." Decants do not pass the test evidently. They are not factory sealed in a retail box and that is why they were stopped. The sole discretion is granted to the postal clerk accepting packages handed to them. There is a ridiculous appeals process you and I cannot really engage in.
I think you are on the right track specifying ground shipment, but that excludes Priority Mail and may still be rejected on a whim. Remember, what is right seems to be open to interpretation by the person who either accepts your parcel for mailing or hands it back to you.
post #105 of 146
2/21/13 at 1:09pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dampier
I contacted the local postmaster's office to get additional insight on this and learned why I had a problem shipping while this regulation would seem to give me a pass if I shipped by ground.
The distinction i got was that I am not a professional dealer shipping products suitable for retail sale. The ORM-D exception carries an important provision. The item must qualify as a consumer commodity, which means:
"Consumer commodity is a hazardous material that is packaged and distributed in a quantity and form intended or suitable for retail sale and designed for consumption by individuals for their personal care or household use purposes. This term can also include certain drugs or medicines."
The key word is "packaged." Decants do not pass the test evidently. They are not factory sealed in a retail box and that is why they were stopped. The sole discretion is granted to the postal clerk accepting packages handed to them. There is a ridiculous appeals process you and I cannot really engage in.
I think you are on the right track specifying ground shipment, but that excludes Priority Mail and may still be rejected on a whim. Remember, what is right seems to be open to interpretation by the person who either accepts your parcel for mailing or hands it back to you.
I contacted the local postmaster's office to get additional insight on this and learned why I had a problem shipping while this regulation would seem to give me a pass if I shipped by ground.
The distinction i got was that I am not a professional dealer shipping products suitable for retail sale. The ORM-D exception carries an important provision. The item must qualify as a consumer commodity, which means:
"Consumer commodity is a hazardous material that is packaged and distributed in a quantity and form intended or suitable for retail sale and designed for consumption by individuals for their personal care or household use purposes. This term can also include certain drugs or medicines."
The key word is "packaged." Decants do not pass the test evidently. They are not factory sealed in a retail box and that is why they were stopped. The sole discretion is granted to the postal clerk accepting packages handed to them. There is a ridiculous appeals process you and I cannot really engage in.
I think you are on the right track specifying ground shipment, but that excludes Priority Mail and may still be rejected on a whim. Remember, what is right seems to be open to interpretation by the person who either accepts your parcel for mailing or hands it back to you.
The bright side is, at least from what I've read and experienced, USPS isn't nearly as messed up as Royal Mail in that they won't just destroy the package and then notify the sender after the fact. I don't know how I'd be able to handle that, that is just flat out wrong. At least with USPS, there's due process and a regard for other people's property.
post #106 of 146
2/21/13 at 1:09pm
It's so lame..the regulations are so incredibly lame.
So, if one orders fume on Ebay or whatever..it will be destroyed? Talking about USPS here. Or if sold from an outside country, destroyed? It's ridiculous. I've shipped UPS and Fed EX and they are really expensive. UPS isn't too bad I suppose, as long as it's samples one is shipping. To ship a bottle gets pretty darn pricey.
So, if one orders fume on Ebay or whatever..it will be destroyed? Talking about USPS here. Or if sold from an outside country, destroyed? It's ridiculous. I've shipped UPS and Fed EX and they are really expensive. UPS isn't too bad I suppose, as long as it's samples one is shipping. To ship a bottle gets pretty darn pricey.
post #107 of 146
2/21/13 at 4:42pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dampier
I contacted the local postmaster's office to get additional insight on this and learned why I had a problem shipping while this regulation would seem to give me a pass if I shipped by ground.
The distinction i got was that I am not a professional dealer shipping products suitable for retail sale. The ORM-D exception carries an important provision. The item must qualify as a consumer commodity, which means:
"Consumer commodity is a hazardous material that is packaged and distributed in a quantity and form intended or suitable for retail sale and designed for consumption by individuals for their personal care or household use purposes. This term can also include certain drugs or medicines."
The key word is "packaged." Decants do not pass the test evidently. They are not factory sealed in a retail box and that is why they were stopped. The sole discretion is granted to the postal clerk accepting packages handed to them. There is a ridiculous appeals process you and I cannot really engage in.
I think you are on the right track specifying ground shipment, but that excludes Priority Mail and may still be rejected on a whim. Remember, what is right seems to be open to interpretation by the person who either accepts your parcel for mailing or hands it back to you.
I contacted the local postmaster's office to get additional insight on this and learned why I had a problem shipping while this regulation would seem to give me a pass if I shipped by ground.
The distinction i got was that I am not a professional dealer shipping products suitable for retail sale. The ORM-D exception carries an important provision. The item must qualify as a consumer commodity, which means:
"Consumer commodity is a hazardous material that is packaged and distributed in a quantity and form intended or suitable for retail sale and designed for consumption by individuals for their personal care or household use purposes. This term can also include certain drugs or medicines."
The key word is "packaged." Decants do not pass the test evidently. They are not factory sealed in a retail box and that is why they were stopped. The sole discretion is granted to the postal clerk accepting packages handed to them. There is a ridiculous appeals process you and I cannot really engage in.
I think you are on the right track specifying ground shipment, but that excludes Priority Mail and may still be rejected on a whim. Remember, what is right seems to be open to interpretation by the person who either accepts your parcel for mailing or hands it back to you.
Yes, that's about what I'd expect. A decant probably won't satisfy the standards, though it seems to me that's arguable. Priority mail is absolutely out, no ambiguity there.
I don't think the intent is to have clerks exercise judgment here. From what I can tell, they're trained to ask simply whether you're shipping perfume. If you say yes, you'll be told that surface mail is the only option. I am fairly certain they won't open a package, if you're shipping ground (though, as I've pointed out before, there's nothing stopping them from doing so).
By the way, if the USPS were to open a priority package and find perfume, it would have the right to confiscate it. Since it's a crime to ship perfume by any means other than ground -- a federal crime punishable by up to a year in jail -- the USPS could absolutely keep it as evidence. Will they? No clue.
- - - Updated - - -
Quote:
Originally Posted by kalli
It's so lame..the regulations are so incredibly lame.
So, if one orders fume on Ebay or whatever..it will be destroyed? Talking about USPS here. Or if sold from an outside country, destroyed? It's ridiculous. I've shipped UPS and Fed EX and they are really expensive. UPS isn't too bad I suppose, as long as it's samples one is shipping. To ship a bottle gets pretty darn pricey.
It's so lame..the regulations are so incredibly lame.
So, if one orders fume on Ebay or whatever..it will be destroyed? Talking about USPS here. Or if sold from an outside country, destroyed? It's ridiculous. I've shipped UPS and Fed EX and they are really expensive. UPS isn't too bad I suppose, as long as it's samples one is shipping. To ship a bottle gets pretty darn pricey.
If you order perfume from a domestic seller on Ebay, and the seller ships to a United States address by priority mail (or by any means other than surface transportation) using the United States Postal Service, the seller is violating the law. Unfortunately, it seems that simple. And the USPS would have the right to confiscate and potentially destroy the perfume, which is evidence of a crime. I'd expect the chances to be pretty low that this would happen, but who knows?
post #108 of 146
2/21/13 at 5:05pm
post #109 of 146
2/21/13 at 6:25pm
- silentrich
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Like I said earlier. I sent 10 fragrances USPS Priority with absolutely no problems. So far I've heard a lot of paranoia and theory's, but no evidence that proves the USPS will open a priority package. Unless it busts all over the place they're not going to open it up and even then they probably won't open it. Let's not forget that around Christmas all those videos came out with the UPS and USPS carrier's throwing packages around and shattering what was inside. If they'll destroy a computer monitor or expensive item, do you really think they give a crap about a bottle of fragrance?
post #110 of 146
2/21/13 at 6:49pm
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If I am asked by a postal employee if anything in my package is hazardous I can truthfully state "no" as I do not believe that shipping perfume/cologne the way I package it is hazardous. Now, if asked if I am shipping anything considered hazardous by the USPS then I face the dilemma of either lying or telling the truth, but again, I do not think that perfume/cologne etc is any more hazardous to enhancing a fire already started than the paper/cardboard the shipment is packaged in.
In my opinion banning shipment of fragrance by post is ridiculous and should elicit a terminal dose of civil disobedience by any and all so encumbered by such ridiculous rules.
In my opinion banning shipment of fragrance by post is ridiculous and should elicit a terminal dose of civil disobedience by any and all so encumbered by such ridiculous rules.
post #111 of 146
2/21/13 at 10:00pm
- barclaydetolly
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silentrich
Like I said earlier. I sent 10 fragrances USPS Priority with absolutely no problems. So far I've heard a lot of paranoia and theory's, but no evidence that proves the USPS will open a priority package. Unless it busts all over the place they're not going to open it up and even then they probably won't open it. Let's not forget that around Christmas all those videos came out with the UPS and USPS carrier's throwing packages around and shattering what was inside. If they'll destroy a computer monitor or expensive item, do you really think they give a crap about a bottle of fragrance?
Like I said earlier. I sent 10 fragrances USPS Priority with absolutely no problems. So far I've heard a lot of paranoia and theory's, but no evidence that proves the USPS will open a priority package. Unless it busts all over the place they're not going to open it up and even then they probably won't open it. Let's not forget that around Christmas all those videos came out with the UPS and USPS carrier's throwing packages around and shattering what was inside. If they'll destroy a computer monitor or expensive item, do you really think they give a crap about a bottle of fragrance?
Well, it's not really paranoia. Nobody is saying that roving bands of postal inspectors will tackle you in the street and haul you off to Guantanamo Bay if you send some Dior Homme by priority mail to a person that buys it in your sales thread. Nor will they eagerly rip open random packages to see if you're sending a bottle of Chergui by First Class Mail.
The reality is that the chance of anyone getting into trouble by shipping perfume by a means other than surface mail appears very, very slim. I think we all know that.
And I think we all know that many basenoters will lie when asked whether they're shipping perfume in order to ship by priority or First Class Mail.
On the other hand, it can't be denied that the post office has taken a renewed interest in the subject. And there's no way around the fact that if you ship perfume by anything other than surface mail, you are breaking the law.
What you choose to do with that information is up to you. Personally, I'm going to answer truthfully and ship by surface mail if I sell any colognes, but it's certainly not my place to judge anybody that behaves otherwise.
And as always, I'm not giving legal advice, just information.
post #112 of 146
2/22/13 at 1:26am
- Andrew_B.
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post #113 of 146
2/22/13 at 1:54am
I've only just become aware of this and it certainly is disappointing. I have to question the timing of this sudden urgency to rigorously enforce what look to be long standing regulations.
Given that postal carriers routinely use commercial airline flights for shipping purposes and the recent global grounding of the Boeing 787 Dreamliner fleet due to cargo hold fires. Is this coincidental?
Given that postal carriers routinely use commercial airline flights for shipping purposes and the recent global grounding of the Boeing 787 Dreamliner fleet due to cargo hold fires. Is this coincidental?
post #114 of 146
2/22/13 at 4:43am
- KeLLsTar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indianwells
Hi teardrop, yes, it was for Austria. It hadn't left the UK though so they could have simply sent it back to me instead of destroying it. That's what really annoyed me. I wasn't asked in the post office what was in the package, I guess the staff are still coming up to speed. What really irritated me was in the letter they said "we will take no action on this occasion"!! Am I supposed to be bloody grateful?? As I said before, BASTARDS!
Hi teardrop, yes, it was for Austria. It hadn't left the UK though so they could have simply sent it back to me instead of destroying it. That's what really annoyed me. I wasn't asked in the post office what was in the package, I guess the staff are still coming up to speed. What really irritated me was in the letter they said "we will take no action on this occasion"!! Am I supposed to be bloody grateful?? As I said before, BASTARDS!
How horrible
I agree that they could have just returned the package to you. You had paid for international postage after all. I don't trust "destroyed" either. For all you know they could have put it in their pockets.
post #115 of 146
2/22/13 at 4:48am
- mumsy
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post #116 of 146
2/22/13 at 4:49am
- KeLLsTar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew_B.
I don't have the link, but I read on an ebay forum that it's possible to ship overseas by boat. This avoids the whole "air flight" thing. I just don't have any details on how to do this, or where it stands now.
I don't have the link, but I read on an ebay forum that it's possible to ship overseas by boat. This avoids the whole "air flight" thing. I just don't have any details on how to do this, or where it stands now.
I don't want to wait 2-3 months for a package arriving by boat. It's 2013 not 1883.
post #117 of 146
2/22/13 at 8:53am
- silentrich
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barclaydetolly
Well, it's not really paranoia. Nobody is saying that roving bands of postal inspectors will tackle you in the street and haul you off to Guantanamo Bay if you send some Dior Homme by priority mail to a person that buys it in your sales thread. Nor will they eagerly rip open random packages to see if you're sending a bottle of Chergui by First Class Mail.
The reality is that the chance of anyone getting into trouble by shipping perfume by a means other than surface mail appears very, very slim. I think we all know that.
And I think we all know that many basenoters will lie when asked whether they're shipping perfume in order to ship by priority or First Class Mail.
On the other hand, it can't be denied that the post office has taken a renewed interest in the subject. And there's no way around the fact that if you ship perfume by anything other than surface mail, you are breaking the law.
What you choose to do with that information is up to you. Personally, I'm going to answer truthfully and ship by surface mail if I sell any colognes, but it's certainly not my place to judge anybody that behaves otherwise.
And as always, I'm not giving legal advice, just information.
Well, it's not really paranoia. Nobody is saying that roving bands of postal inspectors will tackle you in the street and haul you off to Guantanamo Bay if you send some Dior Homme by priority mail to a person that buys it in your sales thread. Nor will they eagerly rip open random packages to see if you're sending a bottle of Chergui by First Class Mail.
The reality is that the chance of anyone getting into trouble by shipping perfume by a means other than surface mail appears very, very slim. I think we all know that.
And I think we all know that many basenoters will lie when asked whether they're shipping perfume in order to ship by priority or First Class Mail.
On the other hand, it can't be denied that the post office has taken a renewed interest in the subject. And there's no way around the fact that if you ship perfume by anything other than surface mail, you are breaking the law.
What you choose to do with that information is up to you. Personally, I'm going to answer truthfully and ship by surface mail if I sell any colognes, but it's certainly not my place to judge anybody that behaves otherwise.
And as always, I'm not giving legal advice, just information.
I agree about the morale decision. If people feel uncomfortable having to lie then by all means do what you feel is right. My point is don't make a decision based out of fear because a guideline tells you that you might be the 1 out of 1,000,000 packages that get's checked. As far as it being illegal so is going 1 mile over the speed limit. Now if I were shipping cocaine via Priority mail I probably would want to get a lawyer for that one.
post #118 of 146
2/27/13 at 8:11pm
- Whitefluffy
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Hello everyone!
I just had to share my nightmarish UPS experience today. Yes, you read it right: UPS, not USPS. Usually I shipped perfumes from home by printing USPS Priority Mail shipping label online and with very light heart checking the "I agree to not shipping hazardous materials" check box. Whenever I had to ship anything fragrance related by showing up in person at USPS, I would always lie with light heart as well.
But this time was different: I sold extremely valuable/expensive/exclusive perfume. I will not divulge the identity of perfume, I will only say that someone paid several hundred hard earned $$$ for this. And so I felt obliged to ship it UPS Ground and be upfront honest about the contents of the package, lest it was destroyed or confiscated. Because if it was, it would have been absolutely disastrous. Enter UPS
I showed up like a good girl at their office and asked to ship my package. The girl at the counter went through the whole checkout process until the manager came up and asked me what was in the box. As I said, I was tempted to conceal the true nature of contents but in this situation I could not afford it. When I told her that it was a fragrance, her eyes widened and she stepped back like I was carrying a bomb. "You mean, it's a perfume?" she asked in incredulous voice. I said "Yes, it's a perfume" in quite annoyed voice. "We can't take it" was her reply. "What? I did ask to ship it by ground, are you kidding me?"
Anyhoo, she was quick to point to me to the other UPS location in town. What is the difference between this UPS location and the other one? I asked. She just batted her eyelashes to me and said with the straight face "They ship dangerous stuff there, like guns."
I had no choice but to drive to that other location. Once I walked in I asked straight up if they could ship a fragrance. The gentleman there seemed nice (at first) and asked how many bottles were in the package. There was only one. He did take it grudgingly saying something like "Oh, one bottle, it shouldn't be too much trouble..." Then he bombarded me with questions: is there was anything else in the package, if there was only one bottle in fact, if that bottle was safe and secure. At one point I thought he will demand that I opened the package.
It finally got shipped, but I came home feeling awfully. I grew up in the Soviet Union and this treatment at the privately owned shipping company was not worlds away from the way I was treated in some governmental facilities back there. To be honest I am now afraid to buy or sell anything on Ebay if the shipping of fragrance will be such an issue. I am thoroughly bummed, that's all I can say.
I just had to share my nightmarish UPS experience today. Yes, you read it right: UPS, not USPS. Usually I shipped perfumes from home by printing USPS Priority Mail shipping label online and with very light heart checking the "I agree to not shipping hazardous materials" check box. Whenever I had to ship anything fragrance related by showing up in person at USPS, I would always lie with light heart as well.
But this time was different: I sold extremely valuable/expensive/exclusive perfume. I will not divulge the identity of perfume, I will only say that someone paid several hundred hard earned $$$ for this. And so I felt obliged to ship it UPS Ground and be upfront honest about the contents of the package, lest it was destroyed or confiscated. Because if it was, it would have been absolutely disastrous. Enter UPS
I showed up like a good girl at their office and asked to ship my package. The girl at the counter went through the whole checkout process until the manager came up and asked me what was in the box. As I said, I was tempted to conceal the true nature of contents but in this situation I could not afford it. When I told her that it was a fragrance, her eyes widened and she stepped back like I was carrying a bomb. "You mean, it's a perfume?" she asked in incredulous voice. I said "Yes, it's a perfume" in quite annoyed voice. "We can't take it" was her reply. "What? I did ask to ship it by ground, are you kidding me?"
Anyhoo, she was quick to point to me to the other UPS location in town. What is the difference between this UPS location and the other one? I asked. She just batted her eyelashes to me and said with the straight face "They ship dangerous stuff there, like guns."
I had no choice but to drive to that other location. Once I walked in I asked straight up if they could ship a fragrance. The gentleman there seemed nice (at first) and asked how many bottles were in the package. There was only one. He did take it grudgingly saying something like "Oh, one bottle, it shouldn't be too much trouble..." Then he bombarded me with questions: is there was anything else in the package, if there was only one bottle in fact, if that bottle was safe and secure. At one point I thought he will demand that I opened the package.
It finally got shipped, but I came home feeling awfully. I grew up in the Soviet Union and this treatment at the privately owned shipping company was not worlds away from the way I was treated in some governmental facilities back there. To be honest I am now afraid to buy or sell anything on Ebay if the shipping of fragrance will be such an issue. I am thoroughly bummed, that's all I can say.
post #119 of 146
2/27/13 at 8:19pm
- barclaydetolly
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitefluffy
Hello everyone!
I just had to share my nightmarish UPS experience today. Yes, you read it right: UPS, not USPS. Usually I shipped perfumes from home by printing Priority mail shipping label online and with very light heart checked the "I agree to not shipping hazardous materials checkbox." Whenever I had to ship anything fragrance related by showing up in person at USPS, I would always lie with light heart as well.
But this time was different: I sold extremely valuable/expensive/exclusive perfume. I will not divulge the identity of perfume, I will only say that someone paid several hundred hard earned $$$ for this. And so I felt obliged to ship it UPS Ground and be upfront honest about the contents of the package, lest it was destroyed or confiscated. Because if it was, it would have been absolutely disastrous. Enter UPS
I showed up like a good girl at their office and asked to ship my package. The girl at the counter went through the whole checkout process until the manager came up and asked me what was in the box. As I said, I was tempted to conceal the true nature of contents but in this situation I could not afford it. When I told her that it was a fragrance, her eyes widened and she stepped back like I was carrying a bomb. "You mean, it's a perfume?" she asked in incredulous voice. I said "Yes, it's a perfume" in quite annoyed voice. "We can't take it" was her reply. "What? I did ask to ship it by ground, are you kidding me?"
Anyhoo, she was quick to point to me to the other UPS location in town. What is the difference between this UPS location and the other one? I asked. She just batted her eyelashes to me and said with the straight face "They can ship dangerous stuff there, like guns."
I had no choice but to drive to that other location. Once I walked, in I asked straight up if they could ship a fragrance. The gentleman there seemed nice and asked how many bottles were in the package. There was only one. He did take it grudgingly saying something like "Oh, one bottle, it shouldn't be too much trouble..." Then he bombarded me with questions: is there was anything else in the package, if there was only one bottle in fact, if that bottle was safe and secure. At one point I thought he will demand that I opened the package.
It finally got shipped, but I came home feeling awfully. I grew up in the Soviet Union and this treatment at the privately owned shipping company was not worlds away from the way I was treated in some governmental facilities back there. TO be honest I now afraid to buy or sell anything on Ebay, if the shipping of fragrance will be such an issue. I am thoroughly bummed, that's all I can say.
Hello everyone!
I just had to share my nightmarish UPS experience today. Yes, you read it right: UPS, not USPS. Usually I shipped perfumes from home by printing Priority mail shipping label online and with very light heart checked the "I agree to not shipping hazardous materials checkbox." Whenever I had to ship anything fragrance related by showing up in person at USPS, I would always lie with light heart as well.
But this time was different: I sold extremely valuable/expensive/exclusive perfume. I will not divulge the identity of perfume, I will only say that someone paid several hundred hard earned $$$ for this. And so I felt obliged to ship it UPS Ground and be upfront honest about the contents of the package, lest it was destroyed or confiscated. Because if it was, it would have been absolutely disastrous. Enter UPS
I showed up like a good girl at their office and asked to ship my package. The girl at the counter went through the whole checkout process until the manager came up and asked me what was in the box. As I said, I was tempted to conceal the true nature of contents but in this situation I could not afford it. When I told her that it was a fragrance, her eyes widened and she stepped back like I was carrying a bomb. "You mean, it's a perfume?" she asked in incredulous voice. I said "Yes, it's a perfume" in quite annoyed voice. "We can't take it" was her reply. "What? I did ask to ship it by ground, are you kidding me?"
Anyhoo, she was quick to point to me to the other UPS location in town. What is the difference between this UPS location and the other one? I asked. She just batted her eyelashes to me and said with the straight face "They can ship dangerous stuff there, like guns."
I had no choice but to drive to that other location. Once I walked, in I asked straight up if they could ship a fragrance. The gentleman there seemed nice and asked how many bottles were in the package. There was only one. He did take it grudgingly saying something like "Oh, one bottle, it shouldn't be too much trouble..." Then he bombarded me with questions: is there was anything else in the package, if there was only one bottle in fact, if that bottle was safe and secure. At one point I thought he will demand that I opened the package.
It finally got shipped, but I came home feeling awfully. I grew up in the Soviet Union and this treatment at the privately owned shipping company was not worlds away from the way I was treated in some governmental facilities back there. TO be honest I now afraid to buy or sell anything on Ebay, if the shipping of fragrance will be such an issue. I am thoroughly bummed, that's all I can say.
Boy, that's awful. If it's any consolation, I shipped out some cologne last week by US Mail ground/surface mail (whatever they're calling it). When I said it was cologne, they didn't bat an eye. I think the clerk asked if it was securely packaged, and I said yes, but that was about it.
By the way, that was a good point about them asking if it was just one bottle. I think the new USPS policy says you have to ship individually -- no shipping two colognes in one box -- but I could be wrong, and frankly I'm too tired tonight to look it up.
If anyone knows, it would be great if you could fill us in about that issue.
post #120 of 146
2/27/13 at 8:48pm
- NYCBoomBoom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitefluffy
It finally got shipped, but I came home feeling awfully. I grew up in the Soviet Union and this treatment at the privately owned shipping company was not worlds away from the way I was treated in some governmental facilities back there. To be honest I am now afraid to buy or sell anything on Ebay if the shipping of fragrance will be such an issue. I am thoroughly bummed, that's all I can say.
It finally got shipped, but I came home feeling awfully. I grew up in the Soviet Union and this treatment at the privately owned shipping company was not worlds away from the way I was treated in some governmental facilities back there. To be honest I am now afraid to buy or sell anything on Ebay if the shipping of fragrance will be such an issue. I am thoroughly bummed, that's all I can say.
No need to be so quick with the "nightmare" comparisons. I shipped out a fragrance last week via USPS (disclosing what I was shipping), no problems were had and it arrived safe and sound a day earlier than expected!
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