"OUD CARAVAN N° 1" NEW FRAGRANCE PROJECT

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Thanks for the info. The picture prompts a question for me: are you doing the fragrance as an attar rather than an alcohol-based spray? I don't necessarily have a preference, I'm just curious.

I'd be interested to smell the preliminary versions and possibly participate in the sampling group, but I don't know a lot about oud, and my nose isn't the best in the world. I don't mind too much if those factors rule me out - I'm happy to stand back and let more experienced noses give their input. I'll definitely look forward to sampling the finished product anyway, I'm sure it'll be great.

This is very exciting Profumo. I don't want to veer off the subject but I do have a question as well since you mention possibilities for a future Attar. Can a blend of essential oils in a base of sandalwood oil be considered an Attar too or does it have to go by the rules of ancient attars where the raw material was distilled directly into the sandalwood oil?

Thank you for the explanation Salaam.

I am sorry Salaam, but when I see the name of the perfume I feel a camel and the sand smell...

The picture in the 1st Post shows a bottle a burner and some lovely looking Oud chips.
Where are those Oud Chips from and what kind are they?

Eid Mubarak Profumo. Is the perfume you're working on will contain alcohol or is it in the form of Mukhalat without alcohol? and what has been your inspiration so far?

Salaam profumo, I have a question that I have also posted on the Oud Thread but have not received an answer and I was wondering if you can shed some light on the subject;
why synthetics oils remain distinctly different from natural ones even though the molecule structures of the synthetics match the natural ones? Is it because it is never a true match or is it because of the presence of other materials that are not or could not be duplicated in the synthetic form?

masstika- you got me curious too, this response is to your question by Christopher of whitelotusaromatics being shared here with his permission
if felt it would be beneficial or helpful:

Kind greetings!
The answer is not a simple one and requires a good background in chemistry to fully understand it but in a simple way one might say that natural aromatic molecules or isolates as they are sometimes called are optically active whereas the same molecule or isolate created in the laboratory are optically inactive.
If you are interested in that subject you can study it further on wikipedia and there are probably many other sources that can give you even more information.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optical_rotation


Another very interesting thing is that if you isolate a particular molecule from a natural botanical source for instance geraniol-
that geraniol molecule will display different aromatic characteristics due to the the source from which it is isolated like lemongrass, palmarosa, geranium etc. Even though the molecule itself appears substantially the same-the optical rotation and odor of that geraniol molecule will display different aromatic properties within certain parameters. Even the cost of that same natural molecule if one would be buying natural isolates could be hugely different. Within that natural aromatic molecule there are yet smaller particles called isomers that, at least in part influence the odor.
None of these things take place in a sythentic molecule produced in a laboratory because it is optically inactive(has no optical rotation)
What it all means is beyond me-but as you asked I have provided a reply up to the extent I am capable of replying.
Christopher

Sorry, I have to chime in because the above answer displays a fundamental misunderstanding of basic organic chemistry. Almost all molecules display some kind of optical rotation properties. This is not the simple reason why isolates or synthetic molecules might be inferior to natural essential oils. Frankly, I don't know the true reason, and maybe nobody does, but the most likely ones are the following two possibilities.

1. When a molecule is in its natural essential oil, there will be dozens if not hundreds of other molecules along with it that may influence how it smells, or how it interacts with other molecules in the fragrance mix. These cannot be duplicated completely perfectly in a synthetic mix. It is this complexity that is important.

2. When a molecule is synthesized there are ALWAYS side reaction products that will be mixed with the synthetic product, no matter how pure it may be. These may have an undesirable influence on the smell or on the interaction of the odourant on other molecules in the mix.

As for optical properties, i.e. whether the molecule is right or left-handed, or chair or boat enantiomer, etc. all this can now be controlled in modern synthetic chemistry processes, and the highest quality synthetic odour molecules are truly optically pure, and that's why they smell better and cost more. But even in these, which are all supposed to be left-handed for best smell, there will be impurities of the other right handed molecule to some small percentage. I suspect that in nature this would not happen.

But this is the key point: in Nature there are many mysteries that science has not discovered. The fact is, scientists do not know how the sense of smell really works. There are theories, but we don't truly know. If we did know, then we'd have smell machines, and smell copiers, and smell computers, smell transmitters, etc. But we don't know how it works in the same way we know how the eye and the ear work, so we have no iPods, or photographs for smell. Because we don't know exactly how smell works, there could be mysterious entities or factors in natural essences that influence the sense of smell, things that have not yet been discovered or understood by science, and these may be missed by purely synthetic fragrances, or even by natural isolates. I think it's this fundamental mystery of smell that makes the art and practice of natural perfumery so important, and why we should encourage and respect all natural perfumers.

Thank you organic and bshell and also Christopher for that fascinating responses. I would have thought though if they are able to manipulate the molecules in labs so they are all left handed couldn't they also get rid of the impurities on the right side?
I was actually thinking yesterday of the day when we will have Faxscent which will be capable of sending scents wirlessly around the world...huh one of those days:-)

I am very excited and hopeful for this ambitious project. Profumo, if I may ask - what aspect of oud are you aiming to capture and in what form (i.e. Initial sweet and gentle scent of burning chips? smokey full-bodied oudiness during the burn? Strong and bold opening of freshly applied oud oil? Mild afterglow of oud oil drydown? Or maybe all of the above or something else?)

Also, what oud regional profile is going to be at the centre stage? Many thanks in advance!

Edit: shoulda read the previous thread first which names Bengali oud as the star attraction

Hi, Profumo.
To respond to your post:
"Bloggers have been increasingly courting the industry for recognition (Fifis awards, seats in committees, invitations to events…) and some of them are losing sight of their original mission of promoting conscious consumerism."
I wasn’t aware the original mission of bloggers was to “promote conscious consurmerism” . Some may be courting recognition but certainly others, myself included, hope to share the exciting discovery of beautiful scents and to impart what makes them unique and glorious through their writing.

"About the perfume industry
The industry cannot anymore impose its own criterions and logic, the consumer is gradually gaining the power to impose his will to shape the products, and the refusal of the industry to compromise is digging a growing abyss between what the people really want and what the industry offers."
I agree with this. A couple of articles in the current “Perfume and Flavorist” magazine refer to this gap and suggest ways to narrow it.

I'm very enthusiastic about your project and consider it a privilege to be able to witness (with eyes and nose) Oud Caravan's development.

I'm very enthusiastic about your project and consider it a privilege to be allowed to witness (with eyes and nose) Oud Caravan's development.
"About philosophy of perfume
My philosophy as a natural perfumer is to produce “Real perfumes made for real people with real ingredients”.I am wondering what philosophy is behind “synthetic crap made for profits with deceptive marketing”
My guess is the “philosophy” behind mass market scents is that figuring out what smells good to the majority of people is the key to making big profits.

"About Indie perfumers
The new generation of perfumers are friendly, idealistic and passionate, the opposite of what a perfume corporation is."
I’ve met a number of “Indie perfumers” in person, including some who have been extremely successful. In addition to the above adjectives I would include inspired, committed, curious, adventurous, sincere, resourceful, creative and intrepid.

I'm very excited about your project, Profumo, and consider it a privilege to have the opportunity to witness (with eyes and nose) Oud Caravan's development.
Thanks, masstika, for your role in getting this group together.

I had the privilege to smell this fragrance, thank you Salaam.
I think this is a great project, with big potentiality and an high philosophic and spiritual power.
Oud Caravan is not one perfume with oud, it wll be The Oud Perfume.
This word was abused, oud and was only Oud sinth.
But Salaam make real the power of oud, very rare and high quality, and if a raw is linked to spititual, only the best have to be used.
I think the perfume is very interesting, very deep and rough, it is capable to speak with the inner side of me.
It's very strong and it's very powerful.
I love the way in wich oud is interpreted, but if I can suggest, for the second version, I think that Salaam could increase the animal side of fragrance.

Salaam, because I am very excited about your project and want to give it serious thought, I decided that I needed to know what a true oud really smelled like before I could weigh in on your fragrance. So I ordered two (very, very expensive) samples from Oriscent, as my understanding is that Oriscent is one of the few places that really offers true, unadulterated oud. I purchased a sample of Kyara Koutan (from Burma) and a sample of Borneo 3000, and I have been wearing them for a couple days now, along with your Oud Caravan. While Oriscent's Borneo 3000 is my favorite, I find that the Kyara Koutan more closely compares to your oud fragrance. (That said, though, they are still quite different scents.)

I hope you won't think I'm being too tough on you when I say that, while your fragrance definitely has the characteristics of oud in it being rustic, deep, leathery, peaty (or a hint of dried animal dung smell, which I mean as a sincere compliment), and is incredibly long lasting like a true oud should be, my biggest criticism would be that it doesn't *evolve* the way Kyara Koutan does (in fact, both KK and Borneo 3000 go through quite interesting evolutions of smell on the skin). Oud Caravan smells very linear compartively, and the thing I love about Kyara Koutan (which is a rather green oud scent), is that it starts off smelling quite bracing and metholated--like a pine tree, almost, with both the scent of the needles and the wood (and the sap too), but over time, it gets sweeter, a bit brighter and clearer, and it begins to have black tea facets to it that are just a beautiful thing to see emerge. And hours after that stage, it gets a bit more woody and soft and golden.

What I enjoy most about Oud Caravan, on the other hand, is that it's a very leathery oud, to my nose, and I do love leather. I just wish it wasn't quite so linear.

Hi, Profumo,
My sample arrived today. Many thanks to masstika for taking the time and making the effort to send it.
Oud Caravan enlists other ingredients to highlight and enhance the scent and character of the protagonist:
The top almost “menthol” note reminds me of tuberose but, in this context, is a nod to the ethereal vapors I associate most with Borneo oils. This volatile and clear “menthol” note reminds me of the ephemerality of existence and the need to transcend our limitations and worldly concerns.
Have you incorporated patchouli? A warm and vanillic herbal essence highlights the root-y, earthy tones of the composition. These notes are present in Meuroke oils I've sampled. This organic, grounded quality anchors the spiritual loftiness of oud to our natural world.
The leather note in Oud Caravan is subdued and supple. In some ouds, Laotian especially, the potency of this element can feel assaulting and smell raunchy. In Oud Caravan it is tamed, softened and feels warm and comforting. It makes me imagine shepherds who guide and protect their flocks. The leather note adds richness and majesty coupled with gentleness and tenderness.
The sweet, dry wood scent that surfaces somewhat later adds a backbone of stability, steadfastness and grandeur. It contributes a feeling of power that is firm yet tempered by grace.
The element I least like is the scent of bandaids; it incorporates an antiseptic, plastic-y sterility to what, IMHO, is an otherwise compelling and dignified perfume. Although the bandaid note fades shortly after application, to me it is antithetical to how I perceive the substance of the nature of oud. Is there a way to disguise it, or to transform it into something less medicinal? Also, I'm curious how a cleaner, less minty terpene note would smell. Lastly, since the perfume is called Oud CARAVAN, would you consider accentuating the spices? Cinnamon, cardamom, coriander splits and white pepper readily come to mind.
In response to Suzanne's comment, to my nose the perfume is not linear- it goes through distinct developmental stages, especially the first hour after application.
I look forward to seeing how your scent continues to develop and am excited to be participating in this creative endeavor. Thank you for the sample and for the experience, Profumo. If this is not the kind of comment you were hoping to elicit please let me know what type of feedback interests you.

You're welcome, Profumo. How we perceive scent is such a personal matter. I anticipate there will be as many different opinions as there are participants!

Thank you Profumo for inviting us to participate in this unique experiment of collective input into the creation of Caravan perfume. Before trying it on I was contemplating the name Caravan with it's hundred and hundred of camels barring salts and spices. I kept imagining the strong smell of camel dung and animal sweat and sweet spices. With that images in mind I swiped my arms, my beard and Mustache and sat back awaiting an assault of smells but nothing...there was nothing except for the sensation of the alcohol evaporating from my arms. couple of minutes later I began to discern high notes similar to the opening notes of the Borneo Ouds but now I am thinking that brilliance was maybe more like Yemeni Frankincense or Ambergris Those notes were light and fleeting and then there was silence. This version of the perfume does not have silage. I have to bring my arms up to my nose to smell the dry down which is like aromatic amber from smoked log of wood. Back way back you can see the Barnyard notes transformed into yellow haze. In my mind, Yellow or brown would be the color of this perfume. I don't sense any greenery. What I smell is an old gentle leather. This is not a Mukhalat in the common sense of Attars, there is no Bouquet here but rather a tweak on the Oud. Honestly this is the Most Oudy perfume I have smelled but it is not Oud Oil. This occupies a place between the west and the east. And I guess that is what a Caravan is; connecting between 2 realms. Haveing said that I would cautious that if this is an Arabian Line IMHO I would say it would have to start stronger and mellow deeper and have something to occupy that middle ground or what I call the silence of the dunes/ Empty Quarter. I would second Blue moon suggestion of more pronounced spices without losing the Oud. I always wondered why the Japanese never came with Aloeswood Oil even though they have developed a culture of Burning Aloeswood Incense. IMHO I would imagine that this perfume in it's current format would appeal greatly to Japanese aesthetics inclined cpeople.
Profumo, Can I decant a portion of it into a small spray vile and try it that was instead of the roll on?

I just opened my Oud Caravan and my first sense is: MALE. Animalistic, dung, sweat, leather, smoke. After applying it and letting it dry down, I am sensing more lightness, but still a very strong earthy, campfire smoke sensation. I keep bringing my wrist to my nose, or my scent strip to my nose as I have to bury myself next to the scent to get a full impact. I do like it better on the scent strip than on my skin. Perhaps because I am female? I, too, would love more spices--a lingering fragrance of animals and cinnamon and mysterious home spices once the caravan has passed by. Or a sense of travel. This caravan seems to be camped around the fire rather than en route from here to there. But to be honest, which is what you want, it takes me back to my high school trigonometry class where I had the bad fortune to sit immediately behind a girl who had equestrian class the hour before. Yes, as I resniff the scent strip and my wrist, it is definitely better without whatever my skin brings to the mix. On my skin I just smell animals.
Thank you for letting us participate in this wonderful project! I can't wait to smell to next iteration!

Okay, here it is, hours later. The perfume is almost gone. And it is intoxicating! It is the oud I crave! The animal scents and peat have fallen away leaving a delicious, sophisticated scent. Now I am in the tent with the mysterious cargo packed high. The camels are somewhere else. I would like to get to this experience sooner in the unfolding of the perfume, but it is beautiful.

I received my sample today. My first impressions are very good. This is definitely an Oud fragrance in all its might. After application on both a scent strip and on skin, the first whiff reminded me of castoreum tincture, but much sweeter. In fact, I can easily say that this Oud has a scent profile that is typical to your style of perfumes Salaam. I was briefly reminded of Tartar Leather and of Grezzo de Eleganza since this Oud offers a similar civet, castoreum, sweet wood and smoke scent that your other perfumes have.

As the minutes go by, and after brief hints of delicate floral notes, the scent becomes a bit dryer, woodier, and animalistic, but still maintaining the sweetness and "mystical" scent that is Oud. I also get a bit of spiciness as it dries but I'm unsure if adding more spice notes to it will be good or bad. Though I understand the reasoning by other commenters of adding more spice I feel that the focus of Oud Caravan is on the Oud itself and not the Caravan.

Every layer as the perfume dries is, to my opinion, very beautiful. This Oud truly offers what Oud is all about; smokey, woody, sweet, and wild but maintaing a spiritual softness to it. The only other feedback I can think of at this moment is that the initial opening is so incredibly sweet, woody, and sensual that I wish that note would last a bit longer. I keep finding myself opening the bottle just to get another whiff of that beautiful opening scene.

I will continue studying the perfume for a few more days and get back to you with more feedback if I think of something.

I am a latecomer this time due to family, but I have now ordered a little bottle and I shall wait my turn.

Salaam,

I wore Oud Caravan yesterday at work and am wearing it again right now. The opening is as beautiful as I mentioned in my previous post so I am sticking by that. My feedback is in regards to the dry down (after a few minutes on the skin or about 30 min to an hour on fabric). At this stage I feel that the ring has been tossed and the Rubi has been left alone. Though still beautiful because this Oud is great, all you are left with is the Rubi (the scent of Oud) and nothing else. This is of course not a bad thing per se, but since the final result wished is to achieve the ultimate Oud fragrance, or an Oud BETTER than Oud, I feel that the full quality of the ring (in other words the supporting essences) need to continue enhancing the main Oud scent in all stages of the perfume. I hope that we are giving you the feedback needed to reach this ultimate goal. I'm sure we are all ecstatic to continue participating in this wonderful project.

Salaam profumo, I would like to second Puente's point about the Rubi. I have put caravan on my right arm this morning around 8:30 AM. It's 5:50 PM now and I can smell the Oud clearly still on my arm. The interesting thing is that the Oud's opening note is still present as if I have just applied it. A hypothetical question for you Profumo and maybe it's a bit too early to ask it so I hope you won't mind but how would you maintain the scent profile once this patch of Oud Oil is finished. or do you intend to make this Fragrance as a limited run?

I'm glad to hear we are being of help to you Salaam. Masstika, my skin is funny in that it always brings out the deepest, darkest parts of a perfume. I think this is why I end up with the animal, sweat, and deep wood after only a few minutes and all of the top notes that I love so much when I first swipe are mostly or completely gone. I do get whiffs of the top notes again if I rub my wrist or some heat is applied to it, but it is only brief. I must have skin similar to spicelover because I get a similar effect.

One other thing Salaam, a few of my co-workers were interested in smelling the perfume so I let them smell it from the bottle. They all liked it! Some actually liked it a lot. It was a nice surprise considering that most westerners are completely unfamiliar with Oud and other deep oriental scents.

Salaam,

I would but unfortunately I do not have any samples of raw Oud left. I only had very tiny samples from Trygve's company and that was several months ago (I've used it all on myself since then). I do remember showing them to a few friends though. Some found them interesting but some found them too fecal or urine like in the raw. One sample was from India and the other from Laos. I personally liked the Laos one a lot. It was very leathery, like deep wood and castoreum.

To Puente: The point you make about "tossing the ring" to be left with only the ruby is exactly what I was worried about when Salaam proposed this project. I wrote about it here: http://www.basenotes.net/group.php?d...e=3&do=discuss where I give my own Oud perfume formula. This is just what happened when I tried to make a perfume from Oud. The oud us so powerful compared to every other raw ingredient in my collection, it can even be there the next day when everything else is gone. So yes, Salaam, please keep working on this and see if you can rise to this challenge and find something that is equally strong to sit with the "ruby" all the way till the next day.

bshell,

Oud is definitely very long lasting. The only other ingredients I've encountered that last as long are Benzoin and Labdanum. If you've ever tried AbdesSalaam's own Mecca Balsam you will find this to be true.

I'm sure AbdesSalaam is thinking up something great for his next iteration of Oud Caravan.

And don't forget oak moss. That's another tenacious one. And yes. I just *love* Mecca Balsam. But it does not last as long as my favourite oud oils.

Puente: There are some ouds that actually have spicy or herbal notes that are essential to their characters. Adding spices to the blend would, as you said, emphasize "Caravan" but it would also reference notes that are integral to ouds from particular geographic regions (many Cambodian ouds have notes of cinnamon and Indonesian oils often have notes of pepper and patchouli). I think I smell a hint of vanilla in this first iteration of the perfume. According to Wiki, vanilla's fame is attributable to the activity of spice merchants who traded between Basra and Baghdad. However is is also a note found in certain ouds, for example those from Borneo and Malinau.

Hi bluemoon,

Thank you for your comment. I agree, different Oud oils offer different essences, some more spicy, herbal, fecal, leathery, etc. With this first iteration of Oud Caravan, I can already smell a good amount of spice. Whether the spice notes are naturally part of this type of Oud Salaam is using or they are enhancements added by Salaam's masterful blending skills I don't know, but they are definitely there. In fact, one of my co-works that smelled the perfume mentioned that it was, in her own words, "really spicy", but she still liked it. This is why I was unsure if adding more spice will be good or bad. It may work wonders, or it may make the Oud Caravan smell too much like Indian Spice Market type perfumes.

I've received my sample today, thank you Profumo and masstika for the opportunity to try Oud Caravan!

My initial impressions on sniffing the bottle were "Wow, Profumo wasn't kidding when he said this fragrance would be primarily about oud..." The first thing to greet me was the familiar balsamic-resinous note of Indian oud with just a hint of barnyard. The barn element burned off within minutes and the spice component of Oud Caravan became more prominent, warming up and intensifying, and soon even eclipsing the oud. In the next few hours it was a game of cat and mouse between oud and spices, with either taking turns as the king of the hill. The drydown is a soft oud afterglow accentuated by warm and comforting spicy aura. Overall, this is a great fragrance owing its high quality to the real oud. It has a strong presence but does not feel overpowering or imposing to me, with a clearly discernible oud-y character, especially at the beginning and the end, it is engaging and exotic but not to the point of being weird.

Now, if I were to try and improve Oud Caravan, I wouldn't amp the spices, they are already quite present, instead I'd try to emphasize oud's vapoury character in the beginning, perhaps through careful use of nagarmotha and/or a hint of camphor or eucalyptus. But my main focus would be to attempt to enhance the woody quality which is found in most good quality pure oud oils but perhaps is too timid in Oud Caravan. To me the woodiness is one of the most attractive aspects of oud experience, be it burning the chips or wearing pure oils. It, together with balsamic and resinous mid notes, provides the bridge connecting oud's vapourous top with its mellow, heavy and dreamy base. I don't perceive much of this bridging quality in Oud Caravan, which to me decreases the fragrance's appeal. I smell bright oudy top notes and smooth spicy-oudy drydown but the mid-space remains somewhat vacuous, with spices trying to fill the void but lacking the depth and the complexity that only oud can provide IMHO. I am tempted to separate some of Oud Caravan into a sample vial, add a drop of a good Indian oud to it (AgarAura's Purana should fit in nicely) and see what happens.

Perhaps it is unfair to compare oud-based fragrance and pure oud oils, but knowing how high Profumo sets the bar - Oud Caravan has every potential to become a worthy rival to pure oils and hopefully this collective community feedback proves helpful in making it happen. I also recognize that my preferences are heavily skewed towards pure ouds so my impression of Oud Caravan is highly subjective. What I wrote above is just another point of view that I hope may be of interest to Profumo in his ambitious (and Herculean) task. I will wait most [im]patiently for the next iteration of Oud Caravan!

Today we had a Thanks Giving Luncheon in the office and I decided to recruit few of my co workers whom don't know about Oud. 3 of them were Latin american and one was american. The american Lady who's in her late forties (and who told me that the perfume Sicily by D&G was her favorite), her reaction was almost repulsion by the strength of the smell. she did not want to apply to her skin because she didn't like the animalic notes in it and said that she preferred floral smells or light amber or lilac. The other 3 gentlemen, 2 of them found it to be too strong and pungent. They could not articulate what is it that they don't like about it. I felt it was like a foreign language for them that they were perplexed by the new sounds and smells. It was nothing familiar to them. Compare that with the last gentleman who came from a very small town on the border between Panama and costa Rica. He had grown around farm animals and he said he actually liked the smell because it brought certain memories to him of burning wood at the end of the day in the farm and that he wouldn't hesitate to buy something like that if it was offered in store. The other 2 gentlemen one was from Puerto Rico and the other from Colombia, both urban dwellers. The reason I mention their country of origin because it might be a factor for consideration.

Received my sample vial last week and have been testing it since. I first applied it to a perfume strip and also a tissue. Large amount of alcohol followed by barnyard/manure scent with some very sharp and strong almost urines notes. I could not sense much else. In about two hours this softened a bit but the same primary scent notes were still holding forth for another three hours, it seemed very linear in nature. This did indeed remind me of horses and livestock (not sure about camels, never been around any) having spent time taking care of horses and cattle.
The next day I put some on my wrist; it was a completely different experience. The barnyard aspects were still there and still strong; however there were also resins and a faint sense of patchouli. After an hour the barnyard faded somewhat while the resins /patchouli notes took a stronger role and lasted about four hours on my skin. It is always interesting to me how different the scent can be between skin and scent strips. The skin test was much nicer then the perfumers strip/tissue experience.
The name of the perfume Oud Caravan has some interesting characterizations associated with it. The primary ingredient Oud is made from agarwood/aloewood, which comes mainly from South East Asia, yet, it seems to me, that the concept and popularity of Oud is much more Middle Eastern in nature. The actual wood, unburned, has very little scent on its own. There is also a huge difference between the scent of burning agarwood and the scent of the distilled oil. The Caravan part of the name brings to mind a long line of camels in very dry desert areas under hot sun. So animals, leather, sweat, dry air and whatever else is being transported (spices, aromatic oils?) Between the two parts of the name there are many cross over scents as a lot of the spices of Asia are very much used in the Middle East, lots of trade going on in both direction. At the same time anything with the word caravan in it would seem to warrant some animal and or leather scents in the mix, plus the already mentioned spices and oils. So there is a huge potential pallet available for use here.
I am looking forward to seeing how this progresses and would like to thank you for allowing me to participate in this group. Hope these comments help.

Thank you. My samples arrived thismorning. I am freshly scrubbed and ready for action. I have had this on my arm just a little while. Bear in mind my skin normally eats through top notes very quickly and brings out the dark side in most things.

Opening the bottle took me to the spicy hot market place of an unknown eastern land, but as if I was standing in the doorway of a chemist whilst observing this from there. The spicy heat playing with a cool medicinal cleanliness. Upon application, there was instantly a honeyed, almost camphorous, castoreum with a dark woodsy note that I didn't recognise in the opening, which quickly started playing with my senses by swinging inbetween that, to a medicinal sticking plaster with an almost plasticine like tone. Over both these two interplays was a buzzing, singing, sweet but sharp note, like a propolis bee buzzing overhead in fresh, hot, clean air.

The plaster note is staying with me but I'm picking up an earthy, pine needly resinous smell mixed with a sweaty well worn saddle made of the finest leather. There is a hint of something spicy like saffron and maybe a mere touch of cardomon maybe, and maybe the merest trace of smoke, but not much on me, these things still buried deep within the honeyed and warm animal fur, leather and resinous woodsy undergrowth. The sticking plaster element hasn't left and the other warmer parts are leaving it slowly leaving me honeyed, resinous, woodsy and mediciney and it is staying linear like this but getting more gentle now and perhaps a little smokier.

I would find this quite difficult as a womans perfume without a floral or sweeter touch. There may be one, but my skin isn't picking anything feminine up in this. This is real masculine man perfume. There may be an avenue for two routes with this perfume, almost twins but different. A his and hers version that can be worn by either or layered too.

So far this is quite unlike anything I am familiar with. If this is good Oudh showing itself, then I am beginning to understand peoples fascination with it. It morphs from one stage to another without any jarring, like a journey for the senses. I can see why this is good for meditation and spritual matters.
Fascinating journey so far, but I must apply myself to some work whilst sniffing. I will need to smell my Indian Agarwood again to see what is similar if anything.

I agree with mumsy's statement about Oud Caravan being a bit of a challenge for a woman to love as it is currently, without a touch of something floral to soften it a bit. Just a trace of something to take the edge off its austerity would add more appeal to me (and I say this as someone who enjoys wearing masculine fragrances).

For someone who has never smelled a good Oudh before, only cheap Indian agarwood, I certainly find this a challenge to the senses. It is not a perfume that just settles gently on the skin. It marches forth and declares itself in all its glory. For me, the peppery, medicinal aspects that hit the nose first would need some taming before it was suitable for a more gentle feminine market. I normally wear crisp, dry and green perfumes such as Ivoire, Sherrer and Yendi. Having children really makes me sensitive to the sticking plaster aspect of this and I found that difficult to get past. It will be of course be that a middle aged housewife is really not the marketing target of this perfume, however she may be the one buying it for her man.

I wore this all last night and had the musk deer on the other hand just because I could. The chocolatey sweetness of the musk drydown was a real contrast to the sharper medicinal aspects of this wood. I ending up like a hampster, sniffing both hand backs together to wonder whether the linear end quality could be enhanced with the more rounded gourmand aspects of something like the musk. As if one were close and one were far away. There is a note I remember in Sikkim perfume that I always loved that this is reminding me of, but I will have to smell Sikkim again and look it up and see what it could be. The image that sprung to my mind unbidden, was a 12 hour clock for some reason and about 9 oclock felt thin till 11.00. It felt like the mattress could do with a fraction more padding in a previously comfy bed. Am I talking rubbish? Does this make any sense?. It's so hard to describe an imaginary smell idea.

Just an addition. I want to make it clear that I am not being critical here, just analytic I hope.

Just joined this group and although I haven't smelled the 1st version of "Oud Caravan" yet, I want to say that for me Oud and Castoreum go hand in hand! They share some aspects of the smell and the overall vibe is also very similar. With Castoreum you can make Oud even more deep and mysterious. Best example is "Pure Oud" from Kilian. Okay, it's maybe not a good Oud-perfume as the name suggests, but the (synthetic) Castoreum makes it really sexy, so I can only imagine that it would smell heavenly if Profumo mixed it with high quality Oud. I noticed that a few people complained that they smelled alcohol a lot in the beginning. Increasing the concentration would maybe help, otherwise it will be difficult to make an Oud-perfume that can be compared with pure oils or even surpass them! I hope that helped at least a little bit?

My sample arrived today. Thank-you Salaam and Mastika. This is not my full review, just the first impressions. My daughter (20) said, "It smells like a bathroom where they are trying to cover up the smells." My wife said, "I get patchouli, bell-bottoms and afghan coats. It reminds me of a shop in England with rough wooden floors where I used to buy bell-bottoms in the 1970s." So Oud Caravan does have the power to take people on a trip to other places, which is good.

I see what others mean when they describe an initial "spice" effect, but for me I call this an olfactory dissonance and I try to avoid it if possible. This dissonance is borderline OK, sort of like a jazz note, and I suspect that Salaam is doing this on purpose, but for me, it's not something that "sets off the ruby" as he says.

I was disappointed in the type of oud used in this perfume. I was worried about this when I heard it would be a Bengali oud. I find that the Indian ouds always have a good amount of barnyard in them. I know this is characteristic of many types of oud and is probably an acquired taste, but there are other ouds that do not have this quality, not at all. For instance, Cambodian oud is lovely and has no barnyard fecal quality to it. Instead it is shimmering and sweet and brilliant and it shifts and changes as the day progresses. This is what I was hoping for in Oud Caravan.

As with many of Salaam's fragrances I find that Oud Caravan behaves entirely differently, and much better, when it is put on cloth instead of skin. On cloth, I get a warmer undertone of almost floral quality at first, and this lasts longer than on skin. On skin, the softer elements evaporate within minutes to leave the animalic and arabian market smells that others have noted. What I do like is the way, after hours, everything is gone except the oud itself. This was what I expected would happen. It's too bad that there are few other natural fragrances that can accompany the tenacity of oud. I don't know what else Salaam could add that would travel with the oud for hours and hours all the way to the end of the olfactory voyage. Actually I think I might detect a bit of sandalwood there, and as my wife said patchouli. But I could be wrong.

I'll write more in a couple of days after further tests.

Further to my note yesterday, after more trials, and testing it on more friends Thursday night, I offer two more ideas:

1. Too much oud. The Bengali oud that Salaam is using in Oud Caravan is very strong. It dominates everything after a few minutes, and my hanky from yesterday is still powerfully strong with Oud Caravan 24 hours later. Will the smell ever leave or will it stay for days and days? Is this desirable?

2. The wrong kind of oud. I am not a connoisseur of oud, but others participating are, so please voice your opinions if I am wrong. I feel that Indian ouds are perhaps the least accessible of all oud types. They have a strong animal, manure-like component to their fragrance that is truly an acquired taste. Cambodian and Borneo ouds do not have this quality and are arguably even more beautiful. Maybe this is just my taste, but I wonder what others think.

I like the animalic facet, bshell. I just need other/more facets in addition to the animalic and leather that I'm getting.

I am waiting for a sample of Cambodian Oud so I will have a marginally less humble opinion after that. What has this project done to me... ordering Oudh? Judging by those who revere it, once you have smelled the best, it is a slippery slope and you can never go back. I'm afraid my wallet will not be getting me the best, but I will report my finding anyway. I don't feel I can comment on Oudh quality or determine what part of the perfume is just Oudh until I have smelled it without anything mixed with it. I only have Indian agarwood of low quality (presumably). Bshell, I think you have smelled my stinky agarwood. It is a bit barnyardy.

@mumsy: may I ask from where are you getting your Cambodi sample? And I f I may suggest that you should also try a Bengali Oud to make your reference relevant because I am afraid that a Cambodian Oud is very different from Bengali, so it will be Like comparing Apples to Oranges. it's a good education and an adventure non the less to know the whole range of Oud.
@bshel: Oud will stay on fabric until washed. I have shirts that I haven't worn in months and they smell of Oud. Is it desriable??? for me Of course it is. I love having my cloths smell this luxurious specially when i know it is natural. I associate Oud with potency and metamorphosis, I have yet to see an Oud"Light" that is to be taken lightly and yet remain true. The brilliancy of this Oud is that it smells exactly like those leather hides that hang on the Caravan's camels sides. This is their predominant smell. If it were to be changed to a different Oud it will be a kin to a whole new frangrance/perfume. If it were to be say a Borneo Oud it will probably be called Tropical and not Caravan because the smell does not conjure up images of Caravan but rather of plush tropical green forest with fruit overtones.