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  1. #31
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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Quote Originally Posted by Motecuzoma
    [quote author=tmp link=1149882044/15#27 date=1150008740]there is a lot of debate as to whether this sort of "sensitivity" to chemicals even exists.
    .
    I keep asking myself if this thread is even real. This ''by-law'' issue is almost beyond comprehension. *[smiley=lolk.gif]
    [/quote]

    like I explained earlier, "by-laws" are municipal (city) laws that we have here in canada... i'm sure you have them in the united states as well (or wherever you are from I guess I shouldn't assume that you are from the US)... anyways... here are some basic examples of what a bylaw would be like in the united states...

    im assuming street parking times may differ from city to city even in the same state ?

    are there some states where smoking in bars is permissible in some towns and not others ? for example in NYC i know you can't smoke inside bars and nightclubs anymore but what about rural new york?

    those would be the equivilant of by laws...

  2. #32

    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Quote Originally Posted by czesc
    [quote author=Motecuzoma link=1149882044/15#29 date=1150025792][quote author=tmp link=1149882044/15#27 date=1150008740]there is a lot of debate as to whether this sort of "sensitivity" to chemicals even exists.
    .
    I keep asking myself if this thread is even real. This ''by-law'' issue is almost beyond comprehension. [smiley=lolk.gif]
    [/quote]

    like I explained earlier, "by-laws" are municipal (city) laws that we have here in canada... i'm sure you have them in the united states as well (or wherever you are from I guess I shouldn't assume that you are from the US)... anyways... here are some basic examples of what a bylaw would be like in the united states...

    im assuming street parking times may differ from city to city even in the same state ?

    are there some states where smoking in bars is permissible in some towns and not others ? for example in NYC i know you can't smoke inside bars and nightclubs anymore but what about rural new york?

    those would be the equivilant of by laws...[/quote]


    Oh, of course, of course. I'm well aware of what a by-law is, it's just the fact that there's some actual political push from something as, in my eyes, inocuous as a banning on fragrance that blows my mind. I just don't want to believe it ... this sort of issue speaks more on society and its so-called principles as opposed to the actual issue itself.

  3. #33
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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Quote Originally Posted by Motecuzoma
    [quote author=czesc link=1149882044/30#30 date=1150049459][quote author=Motecuzoma link=1149882044/15#29 date=1150025792][quote author=tmp link=1149882044/15#27 date=1150008740]there is a lot of debate as to whether this sort of "sensitivity" to chemicals even exists.
    .
    I keep asking myself if this thread is even real. This ''by-law'' issue is almost beyond comprehension. *[smiley=lolk.gif]
    [/quote]

    like I explained earlier, "by-laws" are municipal (city) laws that we have here in canada... i'm sure you have them in the united states as well (or wherever you are from I guess I shouldn't assume that you are from the US)... anyways... here are some basic examples of what a bylaw would be like in the united states...

    im assuming street parking times may differ from city to city even in the same state ?

    are there some states where smoking in bars is permissible in some towns and not others ? for example in NYC i know you can't smoke inside bars and nightclubs anymore but what about rural new york?

    those would be the equivilant of by laws...[/quote]


    Oh, of course, of course. I'm well aware of what a by-law is, it's just the fact that there's some actual political push from something as, in my eyes, inocuous as a banning on fragrance that blows my mind. I just don't want to believe it ... this sort of issue speaks more on society and its so-called principles as opposed to the actual issue itself.
    [/quote]

    oh its completely insane... but ottawa is kinda known for that kinda thing... just a couple years ago we passed bylaws to make it legal for women to walk around topless in public because men could... not that im complaining

  4. #34

    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    ^ Awesome! Come to think of it I think I heard a little something about that. Well, I may now have to re-evaluate the Canadian politicians! haha

  5. #35
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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Here's a link:

    http://www.cbc.ca/ottawa/story/ot-sc...1.html?ref=rss


    You can bet that actual polluters of the air must be laughing their way to the bank.
    Overcome by Fumes

  6. #36
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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Quote Originally Posted by docluv45
    Here's a link:

    http://www.cbc.ca/ottawa/story/ot-sc...1.html?ref=rss


    You can bet that actual polluters of the air must be laughing their way to the bank.
    Lot's of good links in that article, particularly the one about where the Royal Canadian Mounted Police are investigating whether a student committed assault by wearing too much hair gel and deodorant to school - which strikes me as kind of funny - my ladyfriend likes watching Discovery Channel's Crime Stories - and most of them are about the all too numerous serial killers in Canada. I suppose it's good to get some scores on the board.

    I wonder if the RCMP would launch an investigation with equal vigour if someone complained about what the Queen or Prince Charles were wearing when they come to town?

    The really, really dumb thing in those links is the claim that all those allergies and asthma sensitivities are the result of exposure to artificial chemicals. I live in what is reputed to be the hay fever capital of the world - we spend a small fortune on anti hayfever and asthma medication - most of which arises from the natural pollens of the very natural native plants.
    Renato


  7. #37
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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato
    [quote author=docluv45 link=1149882044/30#34 date=1150091214]Here's a link:

    http://www.cbc.ca/ottawa/story/ot-sc...1.html?ref=rss


    You can bet that actual polluters of the air must be laughing their way to the bank.
    Lot's of good links in that article, particularly the one about the Royal Canadian Mounted Police are investigating whether a student committed assault by wearing too much hair gel and deodorant to school - which strikes me as kind of funny - my ladyfriend likes watching Discovery Channel's Crime Stories - and most of them are about serial killers in Canada.

    The really, really dumb thing in those links is the claim that all those allergies and asthma sensitivities are the result of exposure to artificial chemicals. I live in what is reputed to be the hay fever capital of the world - we spend a small fortune on anti hayfever and asthma medication - most of which arises from the natural pollens of the very natural native plants.
    Renato

    [/quote]

    well you're just proving their point then really... overexposure to anything (in your case plant pollens) in their case artificial chems floating around from too much fragrance use creates allergies/sensitivities...

  8. #38

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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    OMG - and look at this link about the student who put on too much Aqua Velva http://cbc.ca/cgi-bin/templates/view...s_smells000419


  9. #39
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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Quote Originally Posted by czesc
    well you're just proving their point then really... overexposure to anything (in your case plant pollens) in their case artificial chems floating around from too much fragrance use creates allergies/sensitivities...
    Hardly. Any exposure causes the reaction. 99% of hay fever is caused by the natural environment where I live.
    The notion that artificial is bad, natural is good, just doesn't hold water.
    Renato

  10. #40
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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato
    [quote author=czesc link=1149882044/30#36 date=1150136189]
    well you're just proving their point then really... overexposure to anything (in your case plant pollens) in their case artificial chems floating around from too much fragrance use creates allergies/sensitivities...
    Hardly. Any exposure causes the reaction. 99% of hay fever is caused by the natural environment where I live.
    The notion that artificial is bad, natural is good, just doesn't hold water.
    Renato[/quote]

    your drawing assumptions from nowhere because nowhere are they saying that "natural is good", theyre simply saying that artificial is bad. the issue is not whether fragrances cause sensitivities or not, thats been proven already. The issue is do we stop the entire population from wearing them because they affect such and such percentage of people.

  11. #41

    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    My mom is very allergic to cats. If a cat owner walks into the room, my mom will get stuffed up and teary almost immediately (and without prior knowledge that the person owned a cat).

    Such and such a percentage of people are like my mom. Can we ban cats?

    I'm serious. A cat, while it is a living creature, is in the end mostly a luxury we choose to own. A cat is no more necessary to a good life than perfume or wine or red cars.

    I pose this as a rhetorical question, not to belittle cat owners.

    -ben
    Nihil Obstat Ben


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  12. #42
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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Quote Originally Posted by czesc
    [quote author=Renato link=1149882044/30#38 date=1150137165][quote author=czesc link=1149882044/30#36 date=1150136189]
    well you're just proving their point then really... overexposure to anything (in your case plant pollens) in their case artificial chems floating around from too much fragrance use creates allergies/sensitivities...
    Hardly. Any exposure causes the reaction. 99% of hay fever is caused by the natural environment where I live.
    The notion that artificial is bad, natural is good, just doesn't hold water.
    Renato[/quote]

    your drawing assumptions from nowhere because nowhere are they saying that "natural is good", theyre simply saying that artificial is bad. the issue is not whether fragrances cause sensitivities or not, thats been proven already. The issue is do we stop the entire population from wearing them because they affect such and such percentage of people.[/quote]
    The article's sub link at
    http://www.cbc.ca/story/news/nationa...ent000620.html

    states "But that's not the way Betty Bridges sees it. She's a nurse from Virginia who suffers from Multiple Chemical Sensitivity (MCS) and worries about the chemicals used to make scented products. She says the ingredients are no longer natural, but are made with carcinogens and irritants. "

    Where exactly do you see my "drawing assumptions from nowhere"?
    Renato

  13. #43
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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato
    [quote author=czesc link=1149882044/30#39 date=1150139756][quote author=Renato link=1149882044/30#38 date=1150137165][quote author=czesc link=1149882044/30#36 date=1150136189]
    well you're just proving their point then really... overexposure to anything (in your case plant pollens) in their case artificial chems floating around from too much fragrance use creates allergies/sensitivities...
    Hardly. Any exposure causes the reaction. 99% of hay fever is caused by the natural environment where I live.
    The notion that artificial is bad, natural is good, just doesn't hold water.
    Renato[/quote]

    your drawing assumptions from nowhere because nowhere are they saying that "natural is good", theyre simply saying that artificial is bad. the issue is not whether fragrances cause sensitivities or not, thats been proven already. The issue is do we stop the entire population from wearing them because they affect such and such percentage of people.[/quote]
    The article's sub link at
    http://www.cbc.ca/story/news/nationa...ent000620.html

    states "But that's not the way Betty Bridges sees it. She's a nurse from Virginia who suffers from Multiple Chemical Sensitivity (MCS) and worries about the chemicals used to make scented products. She says the ingredients are no longer natural, but are made with carcinogens and irritants. "

    Where exactly do you see my "drawing assumptions from nowhere"?
    Renato[/quote]

    what the heck does one nurse from virginia opinion in a Halifax newspaper story have to do with a municipal debate in ottawa.... you're not even linking the right story anyways. BUT what that nurse did happen to be talking about was that some of the new synthetic chems get absorbed by the skin and are stored in fat tissue and breastmilk... so I hope everyone pardons the bad joke here: but that does in fact seem to "hold water!" ha ha i love myself. anyways, you've been attacking my thread since the beginning by making no sense whatsoever.

  14. #44
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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Quote Originally Posted by czesc
    ha ha i love myself. anyways, you've been attacking my thread since the beginning by making no sense whatsoever.
    this constant pointless antagonism is getting really tiresome. *if you insist on conducting yourself in this manner, i suggest you take it to pm. *

  15. #45
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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents


  16. #46
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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul G.
    yea I actually just noticed and read that after posting my long rant, sorry about that. I sent you a pm of it instead

  17. #47

    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Things like this could only happen west of the Outaouais river.. I thought the language laws were bad. Does anyone know if this has something to do with all the Conservatives who recently moved into Ottawa trying to pull a Bush and distract us from some large-scale invasion by forcing us to debate perfume bans instead?

    What ever happened to the the mentality of the government having "no place in the bedrooms of the Nation"? I guess there is an upside... If we're legislating perfume we must not have any real problems, and we should be thankful for that.

  18. #48
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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Quote Originally Posted by Giordano
    Things like this could only happen west of the Outaouais river.. I thought the language laws were bad. Does anyone know if this has something to do with all the Conservatives who recently moved into Ottawa trying to pull a Bush and distract us from some large-scale invasion by forcing us to debate perfume bans instead?
    Although legislation of perfumes, a political issue of sorts, is this thread's subject, further expansion of the discussion to broader political themes conflicts with Basenotes rules.

    #9: Avoid hot topics
    Posts/signatures that involve politics are expressly forbidden on this board.

    http://www.basenotes.net/cgi-bin/art...ame=forumrules
    That girl, that bottle, that mattress and me.

  19. #49
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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Quote Originally Posted by Giordano
    Things like this could only happen west of the Outaouais river.. I thought the language laws were bad. Does anyone know if this has something to do with all the Conservatives who recently moved into Ottawa trying to pull a Bush and distract us from some large-scale invasion by forcing us to debate perfume bans instead?

    What ever happened to the the mentality of the government having "no place in the bedrooms of the Nation"? I guess there is an upside... If we're legislating perfume we must not have any real problems, and we should be thankful for that.
    once again, you have to understand that fragrances would not be outlawed for "personal" "bedroom" use. Only in public places such as office buildings or pub. transit or restaurants etc...



  20. #50
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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Quote Originally Posted by czesc

    what the heck does one nurse from virginia opinion in a Halifax newspaper story have to do with a municipal debate in ottawa.... you're not even linking the right story anyways. BUT what that nurse did happen to be talking about was that some of the new synthetic chems get absorbed by the skin and are stored in fat tissue and breastmilk... so I hope everyone pardons the bad joke here: but that does in fact seem to "hold water!" ha ha i love myself. anyways, you've been attacking my thread since the beginning by making no sense whatsoever.
    Hmmm - this is interesting.
    Exactly where have I been attacking your thread?
    If you have some prejudice or antagonism towards me - and you don't want me on your threads, even when I'm at pains to agree with your basic propostion - feel free to express it.
    But kindly don't state that I'm attacking your thread, when plainly I've been supporting it all the way through.

    You claim I draw assumptions about natural vs synthetic from nowhere. I point out and paste where I got it from - in a report citing a "victim" and the fragrance industry group. You then claim that it has nothing to do with the debate in Ottawa. So if the content of that debate has no relevance to Ottawa - WHY are they trying to ban it in Ottawa - what is their stated premise other than chemical sensitivities?

    Have they REALLY and actually stated a premise somewhere that the city of Ottawa doesn't like lower class fat ladies and welfare assisted stay at home moms who wear floral patterns and have weird haircuts and walk around malls smelling like 10 pounds of fabric softener as 16 litres of "body mist" at a time, and that this is the reason they want to ban ALL fragrances?

    Please enlighten me, preferrably with a link to the latter premise.
    Renato

  21. #51
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    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato
    [quote author=czesc link=1149882044/30#42 date=1150155463]

    what the heck does one nurse from virginia opinion in a Halifax newspaper story have to do with a municipal debate in ottawa.... you're not even linking the right story anyways. BUT what that nurse did happen to be talking about was that some of the new synthetic chems get absorbed by the skin and are stored in fat tissue and breastmilk... so I hope everyone pardons the bad joke here: but that does in fact seem to "hold water!" ha ha i love myself. anyways, you've been attacking my thread since the beginning by making no sense whatsoever.
    Hmmm - this is interesting.
    Exactly where have I been attacking your thread?
    If you have some prejudice or antagonism towards me - and you don't want me on your threads, even when I'm at pains to agree with your basic propostion - feel free to express it.
    But kindly don't state that I'm attacking your thread, when plainly I've been supporting it all the way through.

    You claim I draw assumptions about natural vs synthetic from nowhere. I point out and paste where I got it from - in a report citing a "victim" and the fragrance industry group. You then claim that it has nothing to do with the debate in Ottawa. So if the content of that debate has no relevance to Ottawa - WHY are they trying to ban it in Ottawa - what is their stated premise other than chemical sensitivities?

    Have they *REALLY and actually stated a premise somewhere that the city of Ottawa doesn't like lower class fat ladies and welfare assisted stay at home moms who wear floral patterns and have weird haircuts and walk around malls smelling like 10 pounds of fabric softener as 16 litres of "body mist" at a time, and that this is the reason they want to ban ALL fragrances?

    Please enlighten me, preferrably with a link to the latter premise.
    Renato
    [/quote]

    1. I had no prejudice of you, I don't know you. Your disagreeing with everything I say. I don't mind you being on my threads, in fact, I want you to be on them, just please read what I write first and argue with me on exact points I raise or talk about instead of arguments that can be loosely assosciated with the discussion at hand but dont focus on the core issue or ideas that I have put forward.

    2. No stated premise other than chemical sensitivities, there doesn't have to be another one.

    3. No they haven't and no its not.

    I'm not going to argue with you about any of this anymore, clearly we're not going to get anywhere with it other than getting eachother mad and making another czesc loves to argue thread for no reason that the whole board will hate. lets both drop it. no hard feelings. im extending an olive branch, hope you aren't chemically sensitive to it :P

  22. #52

    Default Re: radical groups in my city trying to ban scents

    i can't believe that the canadians do this . taliban and bin ladin did this in afgastan. should they repeat the try again...

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