I don't know about ambergris but I know what could be more disgusting. Have you ever seen how they extract civet?
After reading Killer Vavoom's remarks about his fragrance-rich childhood , Rutherford_R's fascinating experiences * and the interesting story posted here about the Australian couple who stumbled upon approximately a quarter million dollars worth of ambergris while walking on the beach one day**, I have been wondering.
What fragrances do contain the costly ambergris?
Are there diferences between types of ambergris? Killer V almost sounds as if Blue Whale ambergris is not the real thing (or am I misreading?). Is Sperm Wale Ambergris or any other type distinct from any other in any significant way?
This fascinates me. I mean, what could be more disgusting and more alchemically mysterious than vomit that turns to aromatic gold?
* Killer Vavoom & Ritherford_R
** *Australian story link:
I don't know about ambergris but I know what could be more disgusting. Have you ever seen how they extract civet?
I'm quite sure the Creeds use real ambergris, as do the Madini oils. Olfactorily speaking there shouldn't be much difference between the real thing and synthetics, though.
I know for a fact Madini's Ambargris is the real deal. I e-mailed them awhile back asking the same question and they replied with a yes. But i doubt its 100% pure ambergris simply because its too cheap. Its probably a combination of other notes with a rather high concentration of ambergris. I could be wrong though.
As for other fragrances using the real stuff,i have know idea.
"I hold it that a little rebellion now and then is a good thing, and as necessary in the political world as storms in the physical...It is a medicine necessary for the sound health of government." - Thomas Jefferson
I read that some MPGs have Ambergris as a note and Ultraviolet Man also has it, though i doubt they used the real thing, but then i dont even know wat real ambergris smells like.
Current top 6:
1. Frederic Malle The Night
2. Roja Dove Enigma Parfum Pour Homme
3. MDCI Chypre Palatin
4. MFK Oud Cashmere Mood
5. Amouage Sunshine Man
WHich scent out there will give someone an idea of what Ambergris smells like? *A Creed?
OOOPS! I need to read the entire thread I guess....sorry.
How do they extract the civet?Originally Posted by AZsmells
There has been some talk about Eau des Merveilles using ambergis or an ambergis note, but I have nothing to go on for a reference.
I've had my Ambergris tincture for a few days now. I ordered a 40% tincture from www.Profumo.it. 16ml was about 60 USDollars. I started a thread on the womens side, but after reading one in the DIY section that got so heated it was locked, I felt perhaps twas not a good subject.
I got it out of curiosity, you know the lemming factor. On its own, it doesn't smell like so much. A little petro-oil at first, then a long, close to the skin soft, slightly sweet, slightly earthy phase. The thing is, this drydown lasts, oh, forever. Certainly 12 lours.
What is miraculous is the effect it has on other scents. It thickens and rounds them, not always a good thing if the original beauty was in transparent freshness. But even in that case, it extends them. Just overspraying a spritz of ambergris with a sritz of several of my four hour favorites turns them into all day affairs. It seems to meld them into a slow-release composition. I imagine if it were properly matured in a decant, some of the inital sharp distortion of scent would dissappear.
This is confusing to me, as Creed has several frags I hear generating complaints of short-lived scents. One would think, using the most expensive, effective fixative in existance, their frags would be very long lasting. Of course, they might use just a tiny tad, these days, since it is so expensive.
Please, spritz responsibly.
Thank you Shycat for the reply. What is DIY? I am not quite sure why the thread became so heated. *Animal cruelty?
Either I am confused and ignorant --very likely in any case -- or perhaps the heated ones may have been?
According to the press article linked above, ambergris is whale vomit that has bobbed and floated on the sea for 7-10 years, hopefully in sunny climes, until it has aged to round, sweet, fixative perfection and then presumably washed ashore or somehow harvested at sea. Where would the cruelty or harm come in for harvesting 10 year-old body waste?
Would/could people get close enough to induce whale wretching in some horrid manner, relaibly net the results and float the netted sea-mammal barf in a pre-selected sunny local for a deacde? Seems unlikely, but I suppose if enough money is involved one can be *risky, ingenious and cruel enough.
For those who missed the link to Killer V and Rutherford_R's illuminating dialogue:
Quote from Killer Vavoom on Jan 26th, 2006, Green Irish Tweed Thread:
Quote in response from Rutherford_rI just want to ask the people who speak of ambergris in Creed perfumes: are you familiar with ambergris REALLY? I'm not referring to any laughably synthetic ambergris sold by a Madini. I'm talking AMBERGRIS.
As an Arab who was brought up in a house that has never run out of agarwood chips, agarwood oil, sandalwood, *besides BLUE WHALE AMBERGRIS, I only get a SLIGHT hint of ambergis in Acier Aluminium among the Creed fragrances I have tried so far.
In GIT, ambergris is in nano measures to this nose--a microscopic smithereen that only helps enhance an overall accord. You gotta be GODS of noses to be able to tell it apart. I'm sorry, but to me you are just unknowingly repeating what others have been parroting. No offense intended, though.
I’ll second Killer Vavoom's observations.
I have been very fortunate to have sampled and to have had pointed out to me true ambergris in the vintage fragrances and parfum of the past when it was actually used in perfumery on a significant scale, but never on the scale some people imagine. Synthetic versions of ambergris have been around for decades and labdanum is often used to great effect to approximate the myriad qualities of ambergris, which it certainly does. Contrary to popular, misinformed, belief, ambergris has a broad spectrum scent profile depending upon the state in which it was found, how it is processed and diluted, and with what it is mixed.
Perfumers find it almost impossible to tie their production schedules to natural ambergris because of problems with its availability and its quality. It is extremely hard to come by and also quite variable both in quality and amount. Add on top of this the various legal injunctions and complexities about obtaining it an using it these days
and you have yourself a production nightmare.
Thank You, Godzilla, for the link to an ambergris source! I linked to it and you are right about thier prices for solid ambergris. Have you dealt with them before and can vouch for their product?
DIY = Do It Yourself Forum
How do they extract the civet?Originally Posted by rjrober22
I read an article that had some pictures but I can't find it now. I did find this.
All civets have scent-producing glands, located in a double pouch near the genitals. The fatty yellow secretion of these glands has a distinctive musky odor used for territorial marking. Commercially, this substance is known as civet and is used as a perfume fixative.
Animal rights groups say the civet is often kept in a narrow cage where, every two or three weeks, a person will grab the animal while another applies pressure to the musk gland between the genitals and the tail to extract a fatty, yellow substance that's used as the basis of perfume. (Most perfume companies now use synthetic civet musk).
I think that Azzaro Pour Homme still contains real ambergris.
Originally Posted by godzilla
I read awhile back while surfing for info. that the real ambergris' price has come down noticeably due to synthetics. That it used to be alot more than it is today.
My take on this topic:
a) You won't find real ambergris in cheap fragrances, not even quality synthetic ambergris on them.
b) Some top Houses use small amounts of real ambergris which has been processed and blended with natural and synthetic components (by expert noses) to give it a degree of consistency needed in their composition formulas.
I assume Creed would fit in case b). IMO.
« L'odeur de rose, faible, grâce au vent léger d'été qui passe, se mêle aux parfums qu'elle a mis.»
[ Paul Verlaine ]
You're welcome Lizzie. Unfortunately, I have not dealt with them, so I cannot vouch for their products. They are however, on my 'to do' list -- especially their Amber.Originally Posted by Lizzie
As I recall, Ambergris (in its solid state) was rather sweet, "organic", and frankly not that exceptional.
While I'm certainly glad that I experienced its unique scent, I think its true expression comes into play when its used in conjuction with other precious oils.
I generally consider the essential oils as a mean to train one's nose in identifying scents, but they are by definition very linear, and Ambergris is no exception.
Your search for a true Ambergris-based fragrance may very well lead you to some "interesting" places.
PS: Shycat's description was spot on.
Live a wonderfully perfumed life!
Last edited by StylinLA; 20th January 2010 at 06:57 PM.
I rep profumo it as having a great ambergis concentrate. I am planning to buy all Animalic concentrates! and will probably start a few amalgamated concoctions!
- I Want To Appreciate You With My Eyes Closed-
Chanel Antaeus Equipped With A Double Whipping Of A Black Leather Jacket
1. Eau Noire Cologne by Christian Dior
2. Lumière Noire pour Homme by Maison Francis Kurkdjian
3. New Haarlem by Bond No. 9
4. Chergui by Serge Lutens Les Salons du Palais Royal Shiseido
5. Francois Charles by Rance 1795
6. Puro Intense by Nejma
7. Usiku by Jo Wood Organics
8. New York by Parfums de Nicolai
9. Dia For Men by Amouage
10. Silver Mountain Water by Creed
Check out my huge niche swap list at http://community.basenotes.net/showthread.php?t=239240
An obvious example of synthetic ambergris would be drakkar noir
An example of real ambergris would be creed's bois de santal or royal scottish lavender.
even many of the newer millesime creeds contain genuine ambergris
Another real ambergris is Maitre's Santal Noble.
According to Pere de Pierre, Bergamotto Marino by Gianfrance Ferre uses what they percieve to be real ambergris. It is a really fine fragrance BTW.
Godzilla would obviously use a large font. He's a goddamn nuclear monster
Last edited by Sokkou; 21st January 2010 at 06:26 PM.
If Polge had replaced Chanel Allure Homme "Sport" with "Fraiche", Basenotes would be all over it.
Haha beat me to it on the large font thing.
Sale/sample thread. http://community.basenotes.net/showthread.php?t=218207
The owner of Les Nez had mentioned the use of real ambergris in their three original perfumes - The Unicorn Spell, Let me Play the Lion, and L'Antimatiere.
Iris Pallida 50ml
Ungaro I 75ml
and more! - http://www.basenotes.net/threads/301...n-Man-and-more
If anyone is interested in an ambergris absolute (Freon and/or CO2 extraction of the aromatic molecules, minus the fats etc.), or a tincture of the absolute, please PM me.
I know one of the scientist, Douglas, who used to work for 'THE' Ambergris company, that gets about 95% of the ambergris in the world (those who know ambergris know which company I'm talking about).
He's not with them any more, but now he's developed this ambergris absolute, which has never been done before. At least not released to the public.
I should add.... its not my own product, so I don't carry samples.
If you want to purchase 1 gram before getting a larger quantity, just let me know, and I can tell Douglas to send you 1 gram to start with.
Enfleurage in Greenwich Village sells Ambergris at $50/gram if anyone is desperately needing to know the scent of real ambergris. I'm curious but not fifty bucks curious.