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  1. #1
    Scentronic's Avatar
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    Thumbs down Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    And wasn't impressed at all! I'm not the type of person that will go trash-talk a scent because it doesn't suit my personal tastes, but I guess I just had high hopes for both of these, seeing that they are hardcore favorites of many Basenotes members. I suppose this post is quite pointless, but I just don't understand the allure of these two fragrance powerhouses. They seemed well-put-together, but couldn't have appealed to me less. I'm 25; maybe they're just not my "era".

    And for the record.....I agree, Kouros has a urine-like sourness to it that I'd never want to smell of! No offense to the fans!

  2. #2
    Renato's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Rive Gauche is a powerhouse?

    I didn't think much of Kouros when I first tried it. I only warmed to it when I wore it one summer.

    Let's see. So far we have "smells like urine", "smells not like urine, but the disinfectant cakes they have in urinals", that the latter noses are olfactorily challenged as neither of the two opposite smells are present, and now your contribution of "urine-like sourness", which you will note does not actually accord with either the first two views.

    I think Kouros could probably be described as being more niche-like than most niche scents.
    Renato
    Last edited by Renato; 3rd August 2006 at 04:56 AM.

  3. #3
    ChrisW's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    It took me one or two wearings to 'understand' Rive Gauche. It's a perfect casual scent.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato

    I didn't think much of Kouros when I first tried it.
    It was a different case with me : when I first smelled it, I thought instantly some wild animals and their ****. I remember second time still made me recoil (I thought the top note were totally horrendeus), but now that I have worn this many times, I absolutely love it. It`s amazing.

    Every single scent deserves at least a second chance.

  5. #5
    ChrisW's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    I don't mind the sillage that comes off of Kouros, but when I sniff the sprayed spot directly, it's very harsh and unwelcoming. Maybe if it were diffused over a larger area.....hmmm

  6. #6

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisW
    I don't mind the sillage that comes off of Kouros, but when I sniff the sprayed spot directly, it's very harsh and unwelcoming. Maybe if it were diffused over a larger area.....hmmm
    Yes, much like Kouros, this really, really, really works well with a large diffusion zone.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by perfectfeet
    And wasn't impressed at all! I'm not the type of person that will go trash-talk a scent because it doesn't suit my personal tastes, but I guess I just had high hopes for both of these, seeing that they are hardcore favorites of many Basenotes members. I suppose this post is quite pointless, but I just don't understand the allure of these two fragrance powerhouses. They seemed well-put-together, but couldn't have appealed to me less. I'm 25; maybe they're just not my "era".

    And for the record.....I agree, Kouros has a urine-like sourness to it that I'd never want to smell of! No offense to the fans!
    Duck for cover, mate! They'll tear you apart!
    The pursuit of philosophy is the hope that there is more to life than we realize. By philosophy, however, we come to realize that in fact there is less to life than previously imagined.

  8. #8
    ChrisW's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by Rashkae
    Yes, much like Kouros, this really, really, really works well with a large diffusion zone.
    haha, the only problem is that the spray will go everywhere, and particles of juice will probably get sucked into my carpeted floor. My room has traces of many past SotDs

  9. #9

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato
    I think Kouros could probably be described as being more niche-like than most niche scents.
    Renato
    LOL! What do you mean?

  10. #10

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by perfectfeet
    And wasn't impressed at all! I'm not the type of person that will go trash-talk a scent because it doesn't suit my personal tastes, but I guess I just had high hopes for both of these, seeing that they are hardcore favorites of many Basenotes members. I suppose this post is quite pointless, but I just don't understand the allure of these two fragrance powerhouses. They seemed well-put-together, but couldn't have appealed to me less. I'm 25; maybe they're just not my "era".

    And for the record.....I agree, Kouros has a urine-like sourness to it that I'd never want to smell of! No offense to the fans!
    I have a decant of Rive Gauche, and have tested Kouros at the counter once. I like them both!

    I think RG is, as mentioned, an excellent casual scent with a slight "older, respectable gent/barbershop" hint to it, and I have yet to get any form of "urine" smell from Kouros. All I get is "Yikes! That's some powerful man smell! And I LIKE IT!"

    I think simply because so many BNers are so ardent about them both, they both should be given not just a second chance, but several.

    QE

  11. #11

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    I don't (yet?) think much of Rive Gauche, it's really barbershoppy with a hint of basil or some other herb. Doesn't move me in any way.

    Kouros is a completely different story, and yes, it should be given several runs. Worked for me, and in my (rather small) wardrobe it's my favourite one.

    And then there are the different lighter reincarnations of Kouros to try, for those that get overpowered by the original.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    When I finally got to test Kouros the other week I got the strong impression that I was going camping and had a mixture of bug spray and urine on me. Disgusting!

  13. #13

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    I wonder what kind of urine you guys have.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by fakepurseninja
    I wonder what kind of urine you guys have.
    Obviously the aromatic woody kind, with a hint of incense and patchouli. LOL!

  15. #15
    Renato's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by milamber
    LOL! What do you mean?
    We discuss plenty of weird and controversial scents here - Voleur de Roses, Dilmun, Dzing, Black Cashmere etc. Controversial they may be, but none are as controversial and weird to so many as Kouros obviously is.

    I can't think of any other designer scent that such would apply to.
    Renato

  16. #16

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato
    We discuss plenty of weird and controversial scents here - Voleur de Roses, Dilmun, Dzing, Black Cashmere etc. Controversial they may be, but none are as controversial and weird to so many as Kouros obviously is.
    Quote Originally Posted by Renato

    I can't think of any other designer scent that such would apply to.
    Renato


    I agree!

  17. #17

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    I think most people are reminded of the toilete when they first smell Kouros because it smells like toilete cleaning chemicals.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    I think European when I smell Kouros.
    I've tried to give it 3 tries and can't get past that top note.
    It smells like your a peeing on the counter.

  19. #19
    Renato's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by incedal
    I think most people are reminded of the toilete when they first smell Kouros because it smells like toilete cleaning chemicals.
    Except that so many are adamant that they are clearly not referring to the chemicals at all - which is why the rest of us shake our heads and wonder what is wrong with their noses (while they presumably shake their heads and wonder what is wrong with our noses).
    Renato

  20. #20

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    In response to the perennial fascination with the fabled Kouros "piss note" and the perplexity and fascination it continually seems to engender, I am reposting an earlier post (lost with the recent move) in which I tried to put the whole thing into some kind of perspective:

    Almost everytime there's a post on *Kouros*, the fabled "piss note" or "urinal cake note" is mentioned. I thought I'd weigh in on the conversation with how I understand the nature of this note.

    Suprisingly, what is not mentioned often at all is the strong and persistent animalic note that is woven into the entire drydown. It is present from the first spray and persists to the end of *Kouros's* dying breath.

    The "piss note" or "urinal cake note" comes from this animalic component. Any one of three notes, jasmine, amber, or musk might be responsible for such a note. More than likely, it is the musk. Jasmine and amber tend to have a high indole component and project the fecal notes in many fragrances. Certain musks--and civet also--have a fecal component but also have what can be termed a urea component to them, or, less delicately, a "piss note".

    My experience from observing various reactions from Basenoters to various civet and musk containing fragrances is that some people have a hightened sensitivity to "piss notes" and some a complete "blind spot". Sorry I'm mixing my metaphors.

    Animalic components in fragrances are high-powered ways of extending the diffusivity and longevity of fragrances and, it's undeniable, their attraction. When blended well, as they're are in *Kouros*--unless you happen to be one of those people who is hypersensitive to fecal or urea notes--they intensify and clarify certain notes and also carry many of them, giving them an extension into the drydown they would not otherwise have had. They also add extra body and palpability to the fragrance, a certain undeniable textured aromatic substantivity. Finally, it should be noted, they appeal, at a very deep level, to the primal recognition of bodily odors which--in our not so distant past--we used as the main means of identifying our fellow creatures, much like dogs do, and which were very closely tied to sexual attraction.

    Much of this explains, on one level, why there are such strong, diametrically opposed responses to *Kouros* and perhaps, also, why so many women tend to find it a very attractive fragrance on a man. Furthermore, since women's fragrances have, traditionally, tended to be about seduction, it should not surprise us that fecal and urea notes have featured prominently in such fragrances, predominantly through the urea component of civet and the indole component of jasmine and other white florals. On a very deep level, I suspect women get *Kouros* more than men do because of this experience with such ingredients. It's interesting to consider that of all the comments on the dreaded "piss notes" in *Kouros*, almost all of them have come from men. I recall that when the women on this board have weighed in on *Kouros* the "piss note" has not been an issue with them. (Please correct me if I'm wrong on this point.) I used to wear *Kouros* a lot in the 1980s. As far as I can recall, *Kouros* always received nothing but praise from women. Men's reactions were ususally divided.

    One final note, just to show how idiosyncratic responses to fragrances can be: I have a hypersensitivity to civet and indole and they are almost always instant deal breakers when it comes to a fragrance. I love Gendarme V, but yet always in the background I can sense the articificial civet note lurking and this makes the fragrance essentially unwearable for me. I definitely perceive the animalic/fecal note in Kouros. I don't particularly like it until it softens and integrates the accord and with the other elements of the basenotes accord, but I do not pick up the "piss note" despite my sensitivity to such a note. Go figure. There's no doubt for a variety of reasons that Kouros will always produce a wide spectrum of responses. However, it's important to remember and be tolerant of the fact that not every one experiences a particular fragrance in the same way. We should always allow a bit of mystery for the olfactory experience and that's the way it is, somewhat mysterious, and that's the way I am sure it will always remain.

    Perfectfeet, I think you should give Rive Gauche Pour Homme a couple more tries. I have to admit that I didn't get it at first, but it grew on me to the point where now it's one of my staples.

    scentemental


    Last edited by scentemental; 3rd August 2006 at 05:24 PM.

  21. #21
    Renato's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by scentemental
    I definitely perceive the animalic/fecal note in Kouros. I don't particularly like it until it softens and integrates the accord and with the other elements of the basenotes accord, but I do not pick up the "piss note" despite my sensitivity to such a note. Go figure.

    scentemental

    Maybe because it's not actually there?

    While I found your analysis fascinating, I have a problem with it - the typical chemical urinal cake does not have an animalic, fecal or urea odor about it, rather a harsh, sharp, disinfectant smell (which come to think about it, is how some people perceive Kouros).
    Renato

  22. #22

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Well, once such a urinal cake actually get's to do what it's good for, there would be such a urea note.


    But to me it still doesn't make sense that people get that from Kouros. Ah well whatever.

  23. #23

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato
    Rive Gauche is a powerhouse?

    I didn't think much of Kouros when I first tried it. I only warmed to it when I wore it one summer.

    Let's see. So far we have "smells like urine", "smells not like urine, but the disinfectant cakes they have in urinals", that the latter noses are olfactorily challenged as neither of the two opposite smells are present, and now your contribution of "urine-like sourness", which you will note does not actually accord with either the first two views.

    I think Kouros could probably be described as being more niche-like than most niche scents.
    Renato
    You forgot, "Smells like a soiled locker-room towel that's been sitting out for 7 days".

  24. #24

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato
    Maybe because it's not actually there?

    While I found your analysis fascinating, I have a problem with it - the typical chemical urinal cake does not have an animalic, fecal or urea odor about it, rather a harsh, sharp, disinfectant smell (which come to think about it, is how some people perceive Kouros).
    Renato
    Not necessarily Renato.

    It's interesting that people describe it as a "chemical urinal cake note". But ask yourself, how is that note experience/perceived in the first place? It comes about when one pees on those urinal cakes. What you have is a mixture of highly aromatic ingredients in the urinal cake activated by pee--my apologies to the squeamish.

    I think the urea element is there if only because some people perceive it and because I actually think it really is there in the musk note in Kouros. I think the urinal cake note is resolved as such when, by some people, at one level, the urea note is perceived in tandem with the highly aromatic non-animalic elements of Kouros. Let's recall that Kouros is classified as a "aromatic fougère" and is a highly complex aromatic concoction, even leaving aside the animalic notes.

    For some people, the urine element is what is most salient, for others it's the aromatic elements of the fragrance that remind them of urinal cakes. In either case, it's hard to see how either could be perceived if there weren't a pee note in there somewhere in some kind of manner. At least, that's the way I explain it to myself.

    scentemental
    Last edited by scentemental; 3rd August 2006 at 06:29 PM.

  25. #25

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by perfectfeet
    And wasn't impressed at all! I'm not the type of person that will go trash-talk a scent because it doesn't suit my personal tastes, but I guess I just had high hopes for both of these, seeing that they are hardcore favorites of many Basenotes members. I suppose this post is quite pointless, but I just don't understand the allure of these two fragrance powerhouses. They seemed well-put-together, but couldn't have appealed to me less. I'm 25; maybe they're just not my "era".

    And for the record.....I agree, Kouros has a urine-like sourness to it that I'd never want to smell of! No offense to the fans!
    I just sample RG for the first time too last weekend. Not a bad scent. Didn't blow out of the water but am still intrigued by it.

  26. #26

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by manicboy
    You forgot, "Smells like a soiled locker-room towel that's been sitting out for 7 days".
    manicboy,

    That's just part of the bodily component of Kouros's scent profile. It's a complex one and, as I noted before, some people's noses with particular fragrances resolve things in different ways. My good friend MisterK, as he will tell you himself, can't smell civet at all. He's never going to get a fecal/urine animalic note in fragrances or, rather I what I should say, is he's going to definitely resolves that note in a different way than I am. Again, its shouldn't surprise us that we have such differing responses to fragrances and especially to such a complex multifaceted formulations as Kouros. If people only resolved the notes in Kouros as disgusting ones, then Kouros would never have made it as , and remained, YSL's best selling men's fragrance.

    I hope that towel you speak of isn't yours.

    scentemental
    Last edited by scentemental; 3rd August 2006 at 06:18 PM.

  27. #27
    Renato's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by scentemental
    Not necessarily Renato.

    It's interesting that people describe it as a "chemical urinal cake note". But ask yourself, how is that note experience/perceived in the first place? It comes about when one pees on those urinal cakes. What you have is a mixture of highly aromatic ingredients in the urinal cake activated by pee--my apologies to the squeamish.

    scentemental
    I don't agree. Those cakes are at their most acrid when the cleaner throws them in and flushes. That smell continues to come about after the continual flushing of fresh water over them. And it's only bored children that make a habit of aiming for them.

    Upon further reflection, I recollect going to WCs without the urinal cakes, on hot days by the beach. Now those were real pee smells - aahhg.
    Renato
    Last edited by Renato; 3rd August 2006 at 06:56 PM.

  28. #28
    Renato's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    Quote Originally Posted by manicboy
    You forgot, "Smells like a soiled locker-room towel that's been sitting out for 7 days".
    I stand corrected. Nonetheless, it's good to see someone else who's not in the pee camp.
    Renato

  29. #29

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    That's a good theory Scentemental, but I subscribe to a simpler one. The problem with your theory is that urinal cakes don't smell like piss, by design they are intended to cover the smell of piss. I've only smelled the Kouros Sport version, but from what I understand, it has similarities to the original and I can pick up a urinal cake note in Kouros sport, not a piss note. Urinal cakes would probably smell good to most noses if people didn't have such a strong mental connotation to it. Obviously the smell is going to remind people of piss. So Kouros sparks a memory of piss. The smell of hotdogs might spark a memory of baseball, but a hotdog doesn't smell like an actual baseball, rather hotdog is one of the smells that fill the air at a ball park. If you go into one of those crowded arm-to-arm piss-in-a-trough bathrooms at the ball park, urinal cakes are one of the smells that fill the air.

    **Update**
    I posted the above without realizing that there was a third page. The whole piss mixed with urinal cakes thing, reminds me of puke mixed with Jack Daniels. Jack Daniels does not smell the same after you watched a friend puke it up.
    Last edited by xirdneh69; 3rd August 2006 at 06:53 PM.

  30. #30

    Default Re: Tried Rive Gauche and Kouros today...

    OH NOOOOOOOOOOOOO, NOT AGAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Mic.

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