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  1. #1

    Default Most overrated and underrated

    In your opinion, is there any fragrance out there that gets way too many, undeserved accolades? Are there any gems out there that don't receive their time in the limelight?

    In other words, what do you think are some of the most overrated and underrated fragrances? Some feelings might get hurt, and there might be some smug laughter, but its all in good fun.

    I'll fire some off...

    overrated: Green Irish Tweed
    underrated: Zino Davidoff

  2. #2

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    i'd agree with Green Irish Tweed and throw in another Creed scent, Bois du Portugal. i find both over-powering, and have received negative comments whenever i wore samples. they both remind me of unwashed shirts, where deodorant has been heavily applied by the wearer to (unsuccessfully) cover up the whiff!

    all the scents i enjoy, are all quite popular on here, so i can't think of any which are unerrated.
    I Thang You!

    Favourites: Knize Ten, Creed Royal English Leather, Creed Cuir de Russie, Acqua di Parma Colonia, Helmut Lang Cuiron, Creed Zeste Mandarine Pampelmousse

  3. #3

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    These are all just my opinion, and I know that everyone has their own taste.

    M7 - I think that M7 is an overrated scent, though it works really well for some people, it does not sit well with me.

    Guerlain Vetiver - Underrated. A lot of people like it, but you hardly ever hear someone say "Oh, that Guerlain Vetiver is such a well composed scent!" It really is, and it really takes the bitterness out of the Vetiver, without losing it's fresh and clean factor.

    A*Men - Tried it I don't know how many times, and I'm going to try it again soon, but the chocolate note is just so... cloying. Even light applications don't sit well with me, but I think it's because I don't like chocolate fragrances.

    Terre de Hermes - Way overrated. Kind of boring to me. Not bad, but not good in my very humble opinion.

    Cool Water - Underrated. For obious reasons, but I do enjoy my Green Frich Tweed very much!

    Lucky You - Underrated. It's a scent from my (not so distant) highschool years, so I have a definite soft spot for it.

    Versace Blue Jeans - Way overrated. I mean, it's not a bad scent, but it's really not good at all. I do recieve a lot of compliments with this one though.

    Lacoste pour Homme - Underrated. Also a scent from my highschool years, so it's also got a soft spot in my heart.
    - Rich
    As always, disregard most of what I say. It's not worth your heart health to actually worry about what a 23 year old guy from Kansas thinks. Even if he is really ridiculously good looking.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    As a senior BN I think both BDP and GIT have had a a considerable following. Before fragrances like Musk Ravageur became popular here, they got top rankings all the time. I still think they belong there but I welcome the wider choice in top lquids we have in 2006/07.
    Guerlain's Vetiver is a wonderful fresh cologne, mainly for the summer, outstanding among the Guerlains! On the other hand - calling it a Vetiver is barely justified, particularly when we talk about the current version. Lovers of true and 'bitter' vetiver root are likely to be more satisfied with other brands. I personally consider this Guerlain as nice and easy to wear as Terre D'Hermes. But I am wondering if YSL, Rive Gauche Pour Homme, isn't the better Terre?
    'Il mondo dei profumi è un universo senza limiti: una fraganza puo rievocare sensazioni, luoghi, persone o ancora condurre in uno spazio di nuove dimensioni emozionali' L. V.

  5. #5

    Post Re: Most overrated and underrated

    While Serge Lutens is a great fragrance house, it is overrated at the moment. Things go in cycles here in Basenotes, and at this very moment SL seems to be the thing. Whenever a new member asks for recommendations, he gets an image that Serge Lutens is the beginning and the end in his quest to find the best fragrances in the world. Great houses, such as Lorenzo Villoresi and Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier are not as big at the moment here, and not too many here are familiar with the kinds of Trumper's or Santa Maria Novella! I believe, that one of the things that makes SL the most popular niche house is, that the scents are generally sweet and soft, while not at all mainstream or boring, still alot more easily approachable than MPG or Villoresi's very natural and raw Classic-series.

    While L'Artisan has great concepts and several quite alright scents, they in general lack depth, clarity, strength and quality of Frederic Malle and all the houses mentioned above, me thinks.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    As a general rule I have found the Creed fragrances to be over rated. No question they put out a quality product but I don't see it as any better then other well established lines like Givenchy, Hermès, Chanel....

    I remember in a marketing class I took many years ago reading a study where identical products were given to people to evaluate. The people were told that one was a premium product with a high price and the other was a value product with a bargain price. When people were asked which of these identical products was better, the one marketed as the premium product was overwhelmingly ranked higher.

    As under rated I would say Alan Cumming's Cumming. It really is an exceptional and unique fragrance but due to its "joke" name and celebrity association just does not get the respect it deserves.
    In all matters of opinion, our adversaries are insane - Oscar Wilde

  7. #7

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Guerlain's Vetiver strikes me as terribly overrated. It's loud, soapy and I have received nothing but wrinkled noses whenever I wore it.

    Creed's BdP is the definition of the word 'cloying' to me. I tried a sample based on the favorable reviews here, and it just hit me as very overpowering.

    Burberry London and John Varvatos both strike me as very underrated scents. For the price tag, both are extremely great pickups, wonderful scents and have received positive feedback whenever detected.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Except for Fumerie Turque, I find the entire Serge Lutens line a bit overrated. I do like the smell of Arabie, Vetiver Oriental, Chergui and the others, but I think they would be much more appropriate as a room spray for some oriental brothel.
    The same goes for Green Irish Tweed: an inoffensive and nice fragrance, but certainly not worth all the praise.

    As for underrated: Trumpers' Sandalwood cologne deserves more attention!

  9. #9

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny_Ludlow
    While Serge Lutens is a great fragrance house, it is overrated at the moment. Things go in cycles here in Basenotes, and at this very moment SL seems to be the thing. Whenever a new member asks for recommendations, he gets an image that Serge Lutens is the beginning and the end in his quest to find the best fragrances in the world. Great houses, such as Lorenzo Villoresi and Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier are not as big at the moment here, and not too many here are familiar with the kinds of Trumper's or Santa Maria Novella! I believe, that one of the things that makes SL the most popular niche house is, that the scents are generally sweet and soft, while not at all mainstream or boring, still alot more easily approachable than MPG or Villoresi's very natural and raw Classic-series.
    Although I consider it safer to express an opinion on fragrances rather than brands (no house perfumer is constantly inspired) I can second this paragraph. I have also learned that each year of scent exposure changes my preferences and increases my capability to differentiate. There are wonderful fragrances also made by L'Artisans, but I do not expect to find one 'with balls' among them.
    Last edited by narcus; 19th February 2007 at 02:34 PM.
    'Il mondo dei profumi è un universo senza limiti: una fraganza puo rievocare sensazioni, luoghi, persone o ancora condurre in uno spazio di nuove dimensioni emozionali' L. V.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Although it's dropped off the radar in the past two months in favor of Lutens and GIT, my most overrated is PdN New York. Why? .. eh... take your pick. Same complaint with BdP, but add lots and lots of powder.

    Most underrated, PdN Sacrebleu! As much coverage as Chergui and other sweet, heavy, oriental Lutens get around here, I'm amazed almost nobody talks about it. It strikes me as having that sort of Lutens chicness without the "too much" factor. It's sweet, it's dark, it's woody... it's by no means my favorite scent, but nobody ever really gives it a shot.
    Last edited by rach2jlc; 19th February 2007 at 01:10 PM.
    Is there any point in saying everything? -Basho

  11. #11

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Most overrated to me would have to be Musc Ravageur. Maybe "ovrerrated" isn't quite accurate - it's just one of the few frags that I can't wrap my head (or nose) around, as I don't understand what it's trying to accomplish. Lord knows, I've tried. . and tried, but what starts out on me as a baleful cinnamon cloud dries down to an olfactory black hole, a scent only Willy Wonka could love.
    "Oh, my Lolita, I have only words to play with!"
    - Vladimir Nabokov,
    Lolita

  12. #12

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    There was a very controversial thread on the problem to fix the expression "overrated" like 2 months ago . I am very aware of the fact that there are completely different opinions about what "overrated" exactly means and to me it looks like it´s a matter of attention. SL gets a lot of attention right now and PdN New York got a lot of attention before christmas and so on and so on. As Narcus pointed out it goes in circles.

    I don´t have any problem if a line or a frag that I dislike is highly praised but I often feel that it´s a shame that certain lines or frags that I love don´t get the attention they deserve at least IMO. So instead of classifiying currently popular frags as "overrated" it´s much more fun to try to make people aware of the fact that there´s a lot of equaliy interesting frags out there and thet it´s definitely worth the effort to swich the focus from the board´s always changing current favorites to other interesting offers.

    The lines which get sadly not that much intention (this is not a complete list):

    - D´Orsay (They are all excellent, not only Le Dandy)
    - Patricia de Nicolai (The are all excellent, not only New York)
    - Mazzolari (Unfortunately all of them can´t be found in the directory except for Alessandro and guess what: they are all excellent! Vetyver, Patchouli, Lui, Signature)

    I don´t know if these line are underrated, but they deserve more attention.

    Christian
    Last edited by costello; 19th February 2007 at 01:31 PM.
    Guerlain: Après L´ondée - Chanel: Cuir de Russie - Dior: Dior Homme - Divine: L´homme de coeur - Caron: Le 3me homme
    ---------------------------

    "Tra il fiore colto e l’ altro donato / l’ inesprimibile nulla" Giuseppe Ungaretti

  13. #13

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    overrated: the creeds
    underrated: the fragonards

  14. #14

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Overrated: Anything from the YSL line, except for M7 Fresh which is actually one of my most underrated frags.

    Underrated: Diptyque Oyedo-doesnt get nearly the amount of play on here that it should, especially as a Summer/Spring scent.
    Last edited by Words; 19th February 2007 at 04:05 PM.
    I'm a fresh scent junkie and proud of it!

  15. #15

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Over rated - Not going there , because although I may not like a frag, the next gent/gal will. I think there are certain houses that get the 'benefit of the doubt' on the forum, while other houses are 'beat down like a red-headed stepchild'.

    Under rated - IMHO Pomegranate Noir - Jo Malone and Le Labo - Patchouli 24 are not talked about much, but are very interesting scents.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Overated - creed line (except for silver mountain water)
    Underrated - Comme de Garcons White

  17. #17

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Over: A*Men. I tried and tried to like this one, but couldn't. It might work for some people, but not for me. I was recently at the mall in the White Linen Candle Co or whatever it's called (next to Bath and Bodyworks), and they had candles that smelled like A*Men. The caramel, coffee, chocolate concoction was just overpowering and I found myself steering clear of the display.

    Under: This is a tough one because I think there are any number of hidden gems out there that people don't discuss as much. I think Zino certainly qualifies, but also think that Carolina's first men's fragrance, though it does get some recognition, deserves more.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    overrated: Serge Lutens and L'Artisan lines (except Iris Silver Mist and Dzing!)

    underrated: the house of MPG (which is so superior to L'Artisan, its not even funny)
    -

  19. #19

    CologneJunkie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    I too am not going to name any frag as "overrated." Who am I to call a frag that may be someone's holy grail "overrated?"

    I know the majority of basenoters stick their nose up at Calvin Klein...but CK be is totally spectacular, and is underrated here.
    "Wait...is David Bowie really God?" - Penelope Garcia

  20. #20

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    I think that CK Be is underrated nowadays and still remains a unique scent.

  21. #21

    CologneJunkie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by ck__
    I think that CK Be is underrated nowadays and still remains a unique scent.
    Excellent first post, I like you already . Welcome to basenotes!
    "Wait...is David Bowie really God?" - Penelope Garcia

  22. #22

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    I think there's no overrated scent here: for each scent you can find within five minutes 10 people vomiting when smelling it.
    Underrated - pehaps Dali Laguna PH. Not a fresh bottle, but after some months it has an extremely good dry-down, mosy compliments received when wearing it.

  23. #23

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by Words
    Underrated: Diptyque Oyedo-doesnt get nearly the amount of play on here that it should, especially as a Summer/Spring scent.
    Damn right! Words, I can assure you that I've recommended Oyedo on a couple of summer/spring threads, in the past. This stuff is truly amazing. Lifesavers?!! What's that?

  24. #24

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Most overrated I feel are GIT and some of the SL scents,
    Underrated I feel are the IL Profvmo range and MPG's Ambre Precieux and Santal Noble........
    These opinions are based on my PERSONAL taste ofcourse......
    Current Favourites: Touaregh -Il Profumo/ Le Vainqueur- Rue Rance/ Versus Uomo -Versace/ Sculpture -Nikos/ Acier Aluminium - Creed/ Santal Noble - MPG

  25. #25

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Wow...

    GIT is my personal fave. It's fresh without being annoyingly so. But to each their own.

    I would have to agree that many BNers (myself included) tend to underrate popular designer frags like the CK's or at times Armanis, etc.

  26. #26

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Yeah, I smelled RSVP by Kenneth Cole, and thought "Actually, it's not bad!"
    - Rich
    As always, disregard most of what I say. It's not worth your heart health to actually worry about what a 23 year old guy from Kansas thinks. Even if he is really ridiculously good looking.

  27. #27
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    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Overrated

    Creed
    , by a longshot.

    A couple of underrated houses

    Diptyque
    - Eau Lente, Opôné, Philosykos, L'Eau Trois, others

    Parfums de Nicolai - New York, Carre d'As, Sacrebleu, others
    Last edited by pluran; 22nd February 2007 at 02:59 AM.

  28. #28

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by pluran
    Overrated

    Creed, by a longshot. For the most part they're vapid and anorexic.
    No one studies a Serge Lutens perfumer either. And get ready for a few more smashing Lutens reviews by me coming soon
    -

  29. #29

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Qualifications of "overrated" and "underrated" are subject to the audience we are considering. For example, a Basenotes member may think that Creed is overrated (and many may agree) but to people who aren't junkies, Creed don't mean a thing. I might think that GIT and Himalaya are overrated, but the overwhelming majority of Americans (that I know) have never heard of them.

    It reminds me of five years ago when my friend and I thought (singer) Bright Eyes was overrated. The average music fan had probably never heard of him.

    That said, I think Calvin Klein is vastly overrated. Sure, Obssesion is nice, and most of his stuff is "safe", but it's hardly worth the price. This is in the realm of "non-Basenoters" mind you; few here think of CK as the creme de la creme of colognes.

    Also overrated: nearly anything from Hugo Boss, Davidoff, newer Ralph Lauren releases in general (Blue, Black, whatever...), anything that smells cheap but doesn't come cheap. A few of the Bond No. 9 scents as well. Most D & G for men. The new Dior Homme.

    Underrated: Rive Gauche Light, Safari by RL, most of the Caswell-Massey line for men, Lorenzo Villoresi, Gucci Rush maybe even Pour Homme, Eau Sauvage Xtreme, Halstons, many of the Comme des Garcon entries, Creed Vetiver '48, Polo Sport Extreme, SMW, Escada PH, yada yada yada...

  30. #30

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by pluran
    Overrated

    Creed
    , by a longshot. For the most part they're vapid and anorexic.

    Scentemental's words work well here. He was responding to a thread regarding Oliver Creed being one of the great perfumers.

    Creed as a house by its very nature is an anachronism. Simple formulas using mostly natural ingredients to produce simple effects. A house base that pretty much runs through all their fragrances. What many people fail to understand is that in terms of the huge achievements of modern perfumery, Olivier Creed is little more than an amateur with lots of money mixing essential oils, while the great perfumers such as François Coty, Ernest Beaux, Earnest Daltroff, Jean Carles, Edmond Roundnitska, Jean Paul Guerlain, Jean Kerleo, to name a few, have produced monuments of originality through the intersection of chemistry and art and have defined the direction of modern perfumery and its perfumes. If one honestly doesn't know who these perfumers are and if one honestly doesn't know their creations, on what possible basis can one claim that "Olivier Creed is the world's greatest living nose". Sophia Grojsman with the creation of Trésor in 1990 basically out of 4 aromachemicals has had more influence on the direction of modern perfumery than Olivier Creed could ever hope to have and as yet hasn't had in the slightest. Olivier Creed might be a legend in his own mind and in the minds of Creed acolytes, certainly, but in the big bad and real world of perfumery and its history and its momentous achievements in the field of aromachemistry, he is irrelevant. A truer measure of Olivier Creed's influence and centrality to modern perfumery would be to say a footnote to a footnote. When students at all the great perfume schools study to be a perfumer, they don't study Creeds as part of their training. They start by trying to match the perfumes and fragrances of the truly great modern noses as a way of being intiated into the complex, modern art of perfumery. Creeds don't even rate a look in these schools. Modern perfumery has moved away from 18th century modes of production and conceptions. Like I said, Creed is an anachronism and is irrelevant to present and the future development of the art of perfumery. Olivier Creed "the world's greatest living nose"? Not even close. This whole thread is a joke, right?

    A couple of underrated houses

    Diptyque
    - (Eau Lente, Opôné, Philosykos, others)

    Parfums de Nicolai - (not a weak fragrance among them, and several greats including New York (one of the best I own), Carre d'As, Sacrebleu, and Odalisque)
    This thread is meant to be light hearted.
    Funnily enough I read this the other day, along with another anti-creed rant by the same writer. I respect his knowledge greatly, but not that particular aspect of his opinion. I believe the agressiveness with which it is written betrays the lack of cool objectivity expressed.

    I prefer old school perfumery where a few fine natural smelling notes have a chance to shine. I also prefer bebop jazz, a fifty-sixty year old style, to other music. Has music moved on to electronics making Bach, Charlie Parker and others redundant?

    Other people prefer complex blends with different qualities of smell and long development. I have no problem with that. I can see the art in that too, I just don't like it as much. Creed does what it does very well, in my opinion. Quite possibly, it does it better than anyone else.

    I believe that the creed lineup is stronger in its mens scents than its womens and that is the reason it gets so much attention here and less on other fora where womens scents are the focus. In some ways, I think scents such as neroli sauvage and selection verte are way underrated.
    "Don’t try to be original. Be simple. Be good technically, and if there is something in you, it will come out. ” - Henri Matisse.

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  31. #31

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by hirch_duckfinder
    This thread is meant to be light hearted.
    Funnily enough I read this the other day, along with another anti-creed rant by the same writer. I respect his knowledge greatly, but not that particular aspect of his opinion. I believe the agressiveness with which it is written betrays the lack of cool objectivity expressed.

    I prefer old school perfumery where a few fine natural smelling notes have a chance to shine. I also prefer bebop jazz, a fifty-sixty year old style, to other music. Has music moved on to electronics making Bach, Charlie Parker and others redundant?

    Other people prefer complex blends with different qualities of smell and long development. I have no problem with that. I can see the art in that too, I just don't like it as much. Creed does what it does very well, in my opinion. Quite possibly, it does it better than anyone else.

    I believe that the creed lineup is stronger in its mens scents than its womens and that is the reason it gets so much attention here and less on other fora where womens scents are the focus. In some ways, I think scents such as neroli sauvage and selection verte are way underrated.
    The basic fault in that rant is that it assumes that perfume history started from 1900. By dismissing everything that Creed has done, the rant has not only dismissed the fantastic contributions by Creed, but also of other old and distinguished houses like SMN, Penhaligons and others. It also highlights another fact - that many "niche" houses weren't on the radar screen of the average consumer in the "olden times". This is a topic which I have discussed at another perfume board, and yes, the old niche houses have made a significant contribution to perfumery in their own way. Even if their contributions arent formally taught at perfume schools, their influence can be seen in many other fragrances.
    -

  32. #32

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Overrated:
    • Gucci Envy for Men (rich man's Old Spice)
    • Many Creed scents (need I say more?)
    Underrated:
    • Many of the lesser-known Bond No. 9 scents (Gramercy Park, Great Jones, Riverside Drive)
    • Luciano Soprani Uomo (a smoother, more refined YSL Live Jazz)
    Celebrating 10 years on Basenotes - and smelling better than ever

    My mission statement: "I am not afraid to keep on living - I am not afraid to walk this world alone."

  33. #33

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    I've said this before and I'll say it again!

    The terms "overrated" and "underrated" should be stricken from our vocabulary. Both terms imply some sort of absolute and not just opinion.

    When a poster says "fragrence X or house X is overrated" what they are in affect saying is "I can't believe so many people find this good! Can't they see that I have better taste than they do? What's wrong with their noses?"

    It's all subjective. My Holy Grail might be someone elses vomit inducing horror. And no one is right!

    Might it not be better to say "in my opinion, I'm not a fan of fragrence X or house X"?

    The scent grows richer, he knows he must be near
    He finds a long passageway lit by chandelier
    Each step he takes, the perfumes change
    From familiar fragrance to flavours strange
    A magnificent chamber meets his eye

  34. #34

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    in my opinion, I'm not a fan of Aqua di gio

    in my opinion, I'm a fan of Guess Man

  35. #35

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by G Man
    in my opinion, I'm not a fan of Aqua di gio

    in my opinion, I'm a fan of Guess Man
    Nice

    Maybe I'm a little sensitive.

    The scent grows richer, he knows he must be near
    He finds a long passageway lit by chandelier
    Each step he takes, the perfumes change
    From familiar fragrance to flavours strange
    A magnificent chamber meets his eye

  36. #36

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by hirch_duckfinder
    This thread is meant to be light hearted.
    Funnily enough I read this the other day, along with another anti-creed rant by the same writer. I respect his knowledge greatly, but not that particular aspect of his opinion. I believe the agressiveness with which it is written betrays the lack of cool objectivity expressed.

    I prefer old school perfumery where a few fine natural smelling notes have a chance to shine. I also prefer bebop jazz, a fifty-sixty year old style, to other music. Has music moved on to electronics making Bach, Charlie Parker and others redundant?

    Other people prefer complex blends with different qualities of smell and long development. I have no problem with that. I can see the art in that too, I just don't like it as much. Creed does what it does very well, in my opinion. Quite possibly, it does it better than anyone else.

    I believe that the creed lineup is stronger in its mens scents than its womens and that is the reason it gets so much attention here and less on other fora where womens scents are the focus. In some ways, I think scents such as neroli sauvage and selection verte are way underrated.
    Much, much more than anyone's respect, I prefer not to be taken out of context.

    If anyone would care to have a look at the original context of my so called "rant", he or she can do so here:

    http://community.basenotes.net/showt...ht=anachronism

    Let me return this thread to the lightheartedness that was highjacked even as such lightheartedness was being asserted.

    I think that Creed's Santal Imperial is underrated.
    I think Sean John's Unforgivable is underrated (seriously).

    I think, generally, most designer fragrances are underrated as a matter of course and niche fragrances are, generally, as a matter of course, overrated. A check of most of my posts will confirm the specifics of the designer fragrances I think are underrated.

    Of course, there's always the danger that anything I say might just be a "rant", so I am warning you; read my post carefully. I am known as someone who says the first thing that pops into my empty head.

    scentemental

    Last edited by scentemental; 20th February 2007 at 03:44 AM.

  37. #37

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by scentemental


    Of course, there's always the danger that anything I say might just be a "rant", so I am warning you; read my post carefully. I am known as someone who says the first thing that pops into my empty head.

    scentemental

    I will back up scentementals original post (although hes more than capable of doing that himself) - his original post, as he says, was taken out of context and in the original context makes more sense (it was a particularly silly thread that it was mentioned in and his post put an end to it)

    And what a way to reach 2000 posts
    -

  38. #38

    CologneJunkie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by scentemental
    I think, generally, most designer fragrances are underrated as a matter of course and niche fragrances are, generally, as a matter of course, overrated. A check of most of my posts will confirm the specifics of the designer fragrances I think are underrated.
    I second that notion, that lots of designer scents are underrated. The only problem I see with wearing them is that many others wear them as well because of their accessibility. But I guess there's a reason that many basenoters refer to many designer frags as "safe scents"....they smell great, and many would agree!

    I'm not opposed to wearing niche frags by any means. I have tons of niche frags I'd own and wear...if I had the money .
    "Wait...is David Bowie really God?" - Penelope Garcia

  39. #39

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Just a note: My initial intentions in starting this thread were good. I thought that it would be fun. Of course it is hard to talk about "overrated", especially when the term implies something that is enjoyed by many.

    It was in good fun. I have to say this, because it looks as if some people are taking this to heart. If any were offended, I didn't mean any harm.

  40. #40

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by Simon Moon
    I've said this before and I'll say it again!

    The terms "overrated" and "underrated" should be stricken from our vocabulary. Both terms imply some sort of absolute and not just opinion.

    When a poster says "fragrence X or house X is overrated" what they are in affect saying is "I can't believe so many people find this good! Can't they see that I have better taste than they do? What's wrong with their noses?"

    It's all subjective. My Holy Grail might be someone elses vomit inducing horror. And no one is right!

    Might it not be better to say "in my opinion, I'm not a fan of fragrence X or house X"?

    I tend to disagree here... when I consider a house or a certain frag overrated (in this case, most of the YSL line) it doesnt mean that I dislike the scent(s) or that I cant believe someone else finds it "good", it just means that the amount of "hype" it receives is unwarranted (in my opinion, of course).
    Overrated doesnt mean bad. Underrated doesnt mean great.
    I'm a fresh scent junkie and proud of it!

  41. #41
    smeller
    Guest

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by hirch_duckfinder
    I prefer old school perfumery where a few fine natural smelling notes have a chance to shine. I also prefer bebop jazz, a fifty-sixty year old style, to other music. Has music moved on to electronics making Bach, Charlie Parker and others redundant?

    Other people prefer complex blends with different qualities of smell and long development. I have no problem with that. I can see the art in that too, I just don't like it as much. Creed does what it does very well, in my opinion. Quite possibly, it does it better than anyone else.

    I believe that the creed lineup is stronger in its mens scents than its womens and that is the reason it gets so much attention here and less on other fora where womens scents are the focus. In some ways, I think scents such as neroli sauvage and selection verte are way underrated.
    Maybe a litte off topic, but...

    I need to say, this musical analogy is very, very innapropriate as an argument.

    As a lover of both Bach and Charlie Parker (as well as other classical composers and jazz players/composers at the same height), I must say they are anything but simple. Their music is infinitely more complex than (like you said) electronic music, or any other type of pop music.

    If you mean that their musical language was simple, that's just plain wrong. It's very, very complex, and I believe you know that.

    If you mean that the instruments Bach and Charlie Parker used were simple when compared to electronic music, remember that Bach composed not only for small groups or solo instruments, but also for very large ones (see St. Matthew's Passion). And about Charlie Parker, besides the fact that he played with very different instruments, one should consider that, as a sax player, he had an almost infinite range of expression. The point is: their music is never monochromatic, and is always full of complexity, much more than any pop/electronic music.

    If you just mean simplicity is better (as an argument pro-niche), you probably should favor minimalist names like Philip Glass, Steve Reich, or Arvo Part - never Bach.

    Sorry for the off-topic digression, but my point is: to compare niche fragances with Bach (and Charlie Parker) and designer/mainstream fragrances with pop/electronic is not a valid argument. I actually believe we are talking of two very distinct arts (music and perfums). The closest thing to compare with perfumes are - I believe - wines.

    I completely agree with you when you say there are masterpieces among the niche fragrances and among the designer ones.

    Abut myself, I stick to the traditional houses (including Guerlain), and keep away from Creed, Lutens and so on, just because I don't have access to them, and because my actual wardrobe has (more than) everything I need.

    Would I try Green Irish Tweed or Bois du Portugal if I had access to it? You bet I would. Would I try Lutens? Probably not. Would I cause a better impression on people just by wearing niche instead of classic designer frags? I doubt it.

    So, niche is certainly overrated to my needs, perhaps not for your needs.

    By the way, I also appreciate bebop.

    Peace

  42. #42

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    I'll skip the overrated category because I try to appreciate a fragrance even if it's one I would never wear.

    Underrated: Any from CB I Hate Perfume, Diptyque, and Le Labo (Jasmin 17 is a devastatingly beautiful interpretation of jasmine).

  43. #43

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by smeller
    Maybe a litte off topic, but...

    I need to say, this musical analogy is very, very innapropriate as an argument.

    As a lover of both Bach and Charlie Parker (as well as other classical composers and jazz players/composers at the same height), I must say they are anything but simple. Their music is infinitely more complex than (like you said) electronic music, or any other type of pop music.

    If you mean that their musical language was simple, that's just plain wrong. It's very, very complex, and I believe you know that.

    If you mean that the instruments Bach and Charlie Parker used were simple when compared to electronic music, remember that Bach composed not only for small groups or solo instruments, but also for very large ones (see St. Matthew's Passion). And about Charlie Parker, besides the fact that he played with very different instruments, one should consider that, as a sax player, he had an almost infinite range of expression. The point is: their music is never monochromatic, and is always full of complexity, much more than any pop/electronic music.

    If you just mean simplicity is better (as an argument pro-niche), you probably should favor minimalist names like Philip Glass, Steve Reich, or Arvo Part - never Bach.

    Sorry for the off-topic digression, but my point is: to compare niche fragances with Bach (and Charlie Parker) and designer/mainstream fragrances with pop/electronic is not a valid argument. I actually believe we are talking of two very distinct arts (music and perfums). The closest thing to compare with perfumes are - I believe - wines.

    I completely agree with you when you say there are masterpieces among the niche fragrances and among the designer ones.

    Abut myself, I stick to the traditional houses (including Guerlain), and keep away from Creed, Lutens and so on, just because I don't have access to them, and because my actual wardrobe has (more than) everything I need.

    Would I try Green Irish Tweed or Bois du Portugal if I had access to it? You bet I would. Would I try Lutens? Probably not. Would I cause a better impression on people just by wearing niche instead of classic designer frags? I doubt it.

    So, niche is certainly overrated to my needs, perhaps not for your needs.

    By the way, I also appreciate bebop.

    Peace
    Of course Bach, bird and others' music is not simple. I was just making the point that I don't think things shoud be dismissed because they are old whether they be perfumes, music or people. In a way I am opposing the "progress" ethos.
    --------------------------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by scentemental
    Much, much more than anyone's respect, I prefer not to be taken out of context.

    If anyone would care to have a look at the original context of my so called "rant", he or she can do so here:

    http://community.basenotes.net/showt...ht=anachronism

    Let me return this thread to the lightheartedness that was highjacked even as such lightheartedness was being asserted.

    I think that Creed's Santal Imperial is underrated.
    I think Sean John's Unforgivable is underrated (seriously).

    I think, generally, most designer fragrances are underrated as a matter of course and niche fragrances are, generally, as a matter of course, overrated. A check of most of my posts will confirm the specifics of the designer fragrances I think are underrated.

    Of course, there's always the danger that anything I say might just be a "rant", so I am warning you; read my post carefully. I am known as someone who says the first thing that pops into my empty head.

    scentemental

    Appologies. Your quote is taken out of context and more appologies because I knew that and still went ahead with my post. I had just recently read another post by you criticising creed (sorry, I can't remember where it is) and was thinking about replying to it when this triggered me off. .

    Having said that, while I understand that the blind worship of Creed or any other house or fragrance is silly and can be annoying, I think it is possible to overreact and "throw the baby out with the bathwater". I like the "anachronism".

    Appologies again. I agree about santal Imperial. I have no opinion on niche vs designer as I don't really see the value in the distinction. There are ones I like and ones I don't. Several of the ones I like are made by Creed.
    Last edited by hirch_duckfinder; 20th February 2007 at 10:21 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
    "Don’t try to be original. Be simple. Be good technically, and if there is something in you, it will come out. ” - Henri Matisse.

    "Wear R de Capucci" - Hirch Duckfinder

    reviews

  44. #44

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by hirch_duckfinder
    . . . Appologies. Your quote is taken out of context and more appologies because I knew that and still went ahead with my post. I had just recently read another post by you criticising creed (sorry, I can't remember where it is) and was thinking about replying to it when this triggered me off. .

    Having said that, while I understand that the blind worship of Creed or any other house or fragrance is silly and can be annoying, I think it is possible to overreact and "throw the baby out with the bathwater". I like the "anachronism".

    Appologies again. I agree about santal Imperial. I have no opinion on niche vs designer as I don't really see the value in the distinction. There are ones I like and ones I don't. Several of the ones I like are made by Creed.
    No problem at all hirch_duckfinder. Your presence and thoughtful posting on Basenotes has engendered a lot of good will with me, and so it's easy for me to say "apology accepted", and accepted, indeed, is the argument that you made in the post under discussion about what Creed does and your preference for that kind of perfumery. I understand wholeheartedly your sentiments despite what my post on Creed says. It was, as you know, a strong rhetorical response to some absolute nonsense so it can easily be mistaken for what I ultimate think about Creed, which is more complex, positive, and nuanced.

    I unfortunately have found myself in the past as the guy who had to come in and "correct" some misapprehensions and in some cases blatant myths about Creed. I reluctantly accepted the role, but I can't say that negative reviewing--even the kind that sets the record straight--is something I particulary enjoy. If one looks at my posts on Creed, they are overwhelming negative because of the strong rhetorical purprose they required. My only justification is that if I didn't demythologize much of the Creed advertizing spin and the mindless gushing of Creed accolytes, every second post would still be about Creed as it was once was.

    I have always said I would like to see some real objective subjective positive and nuanced reviews of Creed fragrances and of the house in general than has hitherto been the case, and trust me when I say that substantive commentary on Creed--like your posts on Creed on what they do and why you like them--will be welcomed wholeheartedly by me without any cynicism.

    I did write one positive response about Creed where I tried to practice what I preached. I can't find it now, but it's more indicative of my "more complex, positive, and nuanced" view of the house.

    Best regards,

    scentemental

    P.S. In keeping with the subject of this thread, I tried David Beckham's Instinct the other day and found it be very pleasant and well constructed. I think it's underrated. It has a really beautiful citrus opening, very Mediterranean in it's naturalness, and it's drydown reminds me of certain elements of Caron's Le Anarchiste with its strong metallic orangey clovey, sanguinity.
    Last edited by scentemental; 20th February 2007 at 08:05 PM.

  45. #45

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by scentemental

    P.S. In keeping with the subject of this thread, I tried David Beckham's Instinct the other day and found it be very pleasant and well constructed. I think it's underrated. It has a really beautiful citrus opening, very Mediterranean in it's naturalness, and it's drydown reminds me of certain elements of Caron's Le Anarchiste with its strong metallic orangey clovey, sanguinity.
    I didnt see that one coming! An overrated soccer player's fragrance is underrated !

    scentemental, it would be interesting to have your opinions on the new Chanel exclusifs, perhaps in a new thread.
    -

  46. #46

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by zztopp
    I didnt see that one coming! An overrated soccer player's fragrance is underrated !
    Overated how? Have you ever watched him play zz? Now if you are THE zz you may be in a position to judge . Maybe you are. HEY EVERYBODY ZINADINE ZIDANE IS IN THE HOUSE........
    --------------------------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by scentemental
    No problem at all hirch_duckfinder. Your presence and thoughtful posting on Basenotes has engendered a lot of good will with me, and so it's easy for me to say "apology accepted", and accepted, indeed, is the argument that you made in the post under discussion about what Creed does and your preference for that kind of perfumery. I understand wholeheartedly your sentiments despite what my post on Creed says. It was, as you know, a strong rhetorical response to some absolute nonsense so it can easily be mistaken for what I ultimate think about Creed, which is more complex, positive, and nuanced.

    I unfortunately have found myself in the past as the guy who had to come in and "correct" some misapprehensions and in some cases blatant myths about Creed. I reluctantly accepted the role, but I can't say that negative reviewing--even the kind that sets the record straight--is something I particulary enjoy. If one looks at my posts on Creed, they are overwhelming negative because of the strong rhetorical purprose they required. My only justification is that if I didn't demythologize much of the Creed adverstizing spin and the mindless gushing of Creed accolytes, every second post would still be about Creed as it was once was.

    I have always said I would like to see some real objective subjective positive and nuanced reviews of Creed fragrances and of the house in general than has hitherto been the case, and trust me when I say that substantive commentary on Creed--like your posts on Creed on what they do and why you like them--will be welcomed wholeheartedly by me without any cynicism.

    I did write one positive response about Creed where I tried to practice what I preached. I can't find it now, but it's more indicative of my "more complex, positive, and nuanced" view of the house.

    Best regards,

    scentemental

    P.S. In keeping with the subject of this thread, I tried David Beckham's Instinct the other day and found it be very pleasant and well constructed. I think it's underrated. It has a really beautiful citrus opening, very Mediterranean in it's naturalness, and it's drydown reminds me of certain elements of Caron's Le Anarchiste with its strong metallic orangey clovey, sanguinity.
    Thankyou sir.
    Last edited by hirch_duckfinder; 20th February 2007 at 06:37 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
    "Don’t try to be original. Be simple. Be good technically, and if there is something in you, it will come out. ” - Henri Matisse.

    "Wear R de Capucci" - Hirch Duckfinder

    reviews

  47. #47
    smeller
    Guest

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Quote Originally Posted by hirch_duckfinder
    Of course Bach, bird and others' music is not simple. I was just making the point that I don't think things shoud be dismissed because they are old whether they be perfumes, music or people. In a way I am opposing the "progress" ethos.
    --------------------------------------
    I see your point. And that's the reason I tend to stick to old-time favourites like Chanel Pour Monsieur, Guerlain Vetiver, Monsieur Givenchy, and alikes.

    Among the theme underrated/overrated: I see Calvin Kleins as overrated, and Azzaros as underrated.

  48. #48

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Terre d'Hermes and Mugler cologne are both far overrated, imho. The former is a bit too synthetic and after the first hour loses most of its depth and is far too remeniscent of dish soap. It's not a bad smell, per se, but I don't see it as particularly classy, or fresh, or.. well, much of anything. It doesn't fit nicely into any category of wearability for this nose.

    Mugler cologne is ok, but the synthetic top notes are a bit brash and it just doesn't deserve the nearly universal accolades it receives here.

    It's not that I think either of them are bad scents. They are constructed well, and smell nice enough (even to me), I just don't think they are that much better than other colognes in their respective categories that they should be suggested so often. It perpetuates the cycle of suggesting them as newbies constantly hear them mentioned, seek them out, and then turn around and recommending them themselves. I know when I was new here I got the impression that both were the pinnacles of perfumery. Perhaps it's just a long hard road for each of us to realize that we need to follow our own noses.
    Last edited by SculptureOfSoul; 19th March 2008 at 07:04 AM.
    ***For sale:

    Iris Pallida 50ml

    Ungaro I 75ml

    and more!
    - http://www.basenotes.net/threads/301...n-Man-and-more

  49. #49

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    ones that get a bit of buzz that I don't really care for:

    Creed GIT
    C&S No.88
    Domenico Caraceni PH
    Rose Poivree
    Terre d'Hermes
    Avignon
    Passage d'Enfer
    Musc Ravageur
    Tauer LDDM
    Ambre Sultan, Arabie, and most SL's
    Tobacco Vanille
    Egoiste

    off the top of my head....or what I can remember....

    biehl parfumkunstwerke al02 and the line should be getting more talk.

  50. #50

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Underrated:
    Guerlain Xerius Rouge
    Salvatore Ferragamo PH
    Lagerfeld Jako and Man (2003)
    Issey Miyake L'eau Bleue
    D&G Masculine

    Overrated:
    Polo
    anything Creed
    anything Lacoste
    anything Hugo Boss
    Usher
    Unforgivable

  51. #51

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Long Island, NY
    Posts
    1,034

    Default Re: Most overrated and underrated

    Kouros is the most overrated by a country mile...and it has been reformulated drastically since the 80's.
    Calling Creed overrated is just plain sour grapes.
    Last edited by samplermike; 19th March 2008 at 02:47 PM.

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