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  1. #1

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    Question the different leathers

    What is the difference between Russian leather and leather? and how many different leathers are there? What's your favorite leather?
    Last edited by RuRu; 23rd September 2007 at 12:58 AM.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: the different leathers

    Quote Originally Posted by RuRu View Post
    What is the difference between Russian leather and leather? and how many different leathers are there? What's your favorite leather?

    Good thread..

    Even i would like to know about the different leathers...

    I know that i love Bogart by Jacques Bogart and it has 'Russian Leather' mentioned in the base notes...so i know i love this particular note of leather..

    The other leather that i quite like is in 'Cuiron'...

    Is there a 3rd type?

    gupts

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    Default Re: the different leathers

    favorite leathers

    mine are

    eau d'hermes — from a house that was into leather saddles and bags before they drifted into fashion
    Creed Royal English Leather — Early 1900's leather that still enlists new fans
    Knize Ten — German mens fashion house leather from 1924
    Helmut Lang Cuiron — nowhere nearly as kinky as his pictures, a very satisfying leather.
    Serge Lutens Cuir Mauresque — I don't know where to start with the SL's. Some despise this house, others camp outside.
    Heeley Fine Leather - I think this is still being produced.
    Montale - Aoud Cuir D'Arabie - wow!

    unless the Russians have a different way of making leather, I think the place names are just used to differentiate fragrances from other brands.
    I doubt that all Russian leathers smell alike.
    Last edited by fredricktoo; 23rd September 2007 at 01:29 AM.

  4. #4

    Wink Re: the different leathers

    Quote Originally Posted by fredricktoo View Post
    Knize Ten — German mens fashion house leather from 1924
    Helmut Lang Cuiron — nowhere nearly as kinky as his pictures, a very satisfying leather.
    FYI: Knize Ten is an Austrian House and Helmut Lang is not Helmut Newton.

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    Default Re: the different leathers

    Quote Originally Posted by Ruggles View Post
    FYI: Knize Ten is an Austrian House and Helmut Lang is not Helmut Newton.
    the accents are similar?

    How do you pronounce Knize phonetically?

  6. #6

    Default Re: the different leathers

    Quote Originally Posted by fredricktoo View Post
    favorite leathers

    Creed Royal English Leather — Early 1900's leather that still enlists new fans

    unless the Russians have a different way of making leather, I think the place names are just used to differentiate fragrances from other brands.
    I doubt that all Russian leathers smell alike.
    I thought Creed REL dated back to the 18th century, specifically 1780.

    My understanding is that Russian leathers share in their accord birch / birch tar,
    while English leathers don't. Anyone know specifics of say, Spanish leather or Arabian leather?

  7. #7
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    Default Re: the different leathers

    I did make a lot of oafish mistakes in my first post. It's as if I was under the spell of a White Witch from a very green land. I was trying to impress her and call attention to myself. Thanks for the corrections though. Wonder if she'll come back?

    Royal English Leather is from 1780. There's no excuse for my errors.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: the different leathers

    Quote Originally Posted by fredricktoo View Post
    the accents are similar?

    How do you pronounce Knize phonetically?
    There was a thread a while back, and the upshot was that the name "Knize" is Czech and is supposed to be pronounced k-NEE-zhuh. You're supposed to pronounce the "k" and the "n" together at the beginning. Also, the Czech has that little scoop over the "z" that makes it sound like the "s" in "pleasure."

    --------------------------------------
    Also, I gather from reading here and elsewhere that the three types of leather traditionally recognized as separate styles in perfumery are English, Russian, and Spanish leather. The Arabian, Mauresque, etc., I guess to be newcomers to the scheme of classification.
    Last edited by JaimeB; 23rd September 2007 at 07:19 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
    Yr good bud,

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  9. #9

    Default Re: the different leathers

    A few of my favourites are

    Daim Blond by Lutens (my favourite)
    Spanish Leather by Truefitt & Hill
    Dzing! by L'Artisan

    All very different. I'm no expert on different leathers, but I know what I like!
    Last edited by calexs; 23rd September 2007 at 08:11 AM.
    Current favourites: Silver Mountain Water - Terre d'Hermes - Erolfa - Fou d'Absinthe - Sequoia

  10. #10
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    Default Re: the different leathers

    Quote Originally Posted by Ruggles View Post
    FYI: Knize Ten is an Austrian House and Helmut Lang is not Helmut Newton.
    Have you ever seen Helmut Lang and Helmut Newton in the same room?

  11. #11

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    Default Re: the different leathers

    Quote Originally Posted by JaimeB View Post
    ...Also, I gather from reading here and elsewhere that the three types of leather traditionally recognized as separate styles in perfumery are English, Russian, and Spanish leather. The Arabian, Mauresque, etc., I guess to be newcomers to the scheme of classification.
    I know nothing about English Leather, but in perfumery the terms 'Russian Leather / Cuir de Russie / Juchten' and 'Spanish Leather / Peau d'Espagne' refer to smells of leathers imported from the regions mentioned. Those smells differed a lot in past centuries, depending on processing methods and tanning materials used. Moorish / Arabian leathers /Cuir Mauresque probably describe better what had been known as Spanish leather smells for centuries. It shouldn't be forgotten that the major part of Spain had been inhabited by 'los Morros', Muslims from North Africa, for a long period of time, i.e. until about AD1500. Spanish leather processing has therefore been based on Moorish traditions and their leather qualities have become famous all over 'Christian' Europe.

    The history of Messrs. Knize dates back to the year 1858 in Vienna. The Czech J.S. Knize was apointed purveyor to the Imperial Austrian-Hungarian court. In the early twentieth century the house maintained exclusive men’s tailor's shops also in Berlin, Paris, London, and New York, thus surviving WW1 and the German-Austrian revolutions relatively well. Marlene Dietrich has probably been their most prominent lady customer in Berlin.

    The fragrance Knize Ten originates from the international period between the wars (1924). I cannot believe that the perfumer should be unknown. From details I read, this was not a Viennese creation, and “Ten” refers to the top score in the polo game. “Knize”, being of Czech origin would be pronounced like knee-sche but due to the internationalization, that fragrance is often pronounced the English way in Europe. All rights to the Knize Brand are held by a company in the Munich area (Germany): Swiss-Knize Parfumeur GmbH.
    To me, the leather note in Knize is predominatly a ‘Russian Leather’ note due to some birch oil used. Russian leather originally characterized a certain boot leather (military, riding boots). Such leathers have to be waterproof, and in the early days nothing was better than applying a mix between (black) birch tar and oil to the tanned cow hide.

    Etienne Aigner Aktiengesellscaft (AIGNER)
    . The German group's principal activity is to offer leather goods, fashion clothing and accessories "for discerning men and women".(Wright Investor Service). They have several good leather fragrances. All are easy to wear and recommended as a starting point. But I would fail any blind test trying to separate their masculine leather perfumes from the feminine counterparts.

    A Last Word on Helmut Lang: He at least was born in Vienna (1956)! If he is the man behind Cuiron, I hope he will come up with an EDP version before long.
    Last edited by narcus; 23rd September 2007 at 10:58 AM.
    'Il mondo dei profumi č un universo senza limiti: una fraganza puo rievocare sensazioni, luoghi, persone o ancora condurre in uno spazio di nuove dimensioni emozionali' L. V.

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    Thumbs up Re: the different leathers

    Quote Originally Posted by fredricktoo View Post
    I did make a lot of oafish mistakes in my first post. It's as if I was under the spell of a White Witch from a very green land. I was trying to impress her and call attention to myself. Thanks for the corrections though. Wonder if she'll come back?

    Royal English Leather is from 1780. There's no excuse for my errors.
    I'm flattered, that you were trying to impress me : ) But you know I would n't have noticed the error unless someone pointed it out. I just love leathers. Please tell me more.
    BTW You have my attention now so you can relax.
    --------------------------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by narcus View Post
    [SIZE=3][SIZE=2]
    To me, the leather note in Knize is predominatly a ‘Russian Leather’ note due to some birch oil used. Russian leather originally characterized a certain boot leather (military, riding boots). Such leathers have to be waterproof, and in the early days nothing was better than applying a mix between (black) birch tar and oil to the tanned cow hide.
    [I][COLOR=Blue]
    thank you for most informative post, is there anything else I need to know about leathers?
    Last edited by RuRu; 23rd September 2007 at 12:06 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  13. #13

    Default Re: the different leathers

    Fabulous post Narcus! Thanks for all the information on my favourite fragrance family. Seems like I like all leathers, be they English, Russian, Spanish or Arabian
    I'm simplifying my life. For Sale Thread (some niche, some designer):
    http://community.basenotes.net/showthread.php?t=222407

  14. #14

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    Default Re: the different leathers

    Quote Originally Posted by RuRu View Post
    I'm flattered, that you were trying to impress me : ) But you know I would n't have noticed the error unless someone pointed it out. I just love leathers. Please tell me more.
    BTW You have my attention now so you can relax.
    --------------------------------------

    .... is there anything else I need to know about leathers?
    Finding the right ones for yourself is the biggest challenge. Not all 219 fragrances of the BN directory 'containing a leather note' can be called a leather fragrance, I think. But you may want to search the BN archive for more recommendations and detailed descriptions. BN menber Milamber is the expert. Check his reviews on leather frags, In Leather Man for example.
    'Il mondo dei profumi č un universo senza limiti: una fraganza puo rievocare sensazioni, luoghi, persone o ancora condurre in uno spazio di nuove dimensioni emozionali' L. V.

  15. #15
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    Default Re: the different leathers

    There is something really grounding about leather in a fragrance. The scent of processed tanned skins of animals applied to our own skins takes us all back into our ancestral tribal memory. The are savage and warm, comforting. It feels good to have a good leather around you.

    My three favorite leather scents are: Knize Ten, Miller Harris - Cuir Oranger, Ayala Moriel - Rebellious. All three are quite different but each has their own unique warm leather grounding quality. Knize Ten is a rich sweet well worn leather without going into stinky musks, but it's not too new either. Cuir Oranger is a pungent orange oak moss scent that becomes leathery in the combination of fruit and tannic moss. Very light for this style of leather but a great scent applied liverally. Rebellious is an outdoorsy "by the campfire" leather than is resinous and sweet. Potent and very nice.

    There is a long list of others that should be investigated, but these are my preference.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: the different leathers

    Thanks narcus,

    as always a well thought out and educational posting. This will be added to my scrapbook for further study.

  17. #17
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    Default Re: the different leathers

    Columbina of the blog Perfume Smellin' Things is a leather-scent enthusiast, and she has compiled a very long list of fragrances that feature leather accords.

    The main site is here. It is loading very slow these days, so the fastest way to see the list at the moment is via the text-only version of the Google cache:
    A-H
    I-Q
    R-Z
    Last edited by PaulSC; 23rd September 2007 at 03:54 PM.
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  18. #18
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    Default Re: the different leathers

    I posted a thread about leather back in May, where many Basenoters and I chimed in on our favorite leathers by loosely classified 'categories' (link here: http://community.basenotes.net/showthread.php?t=196879 )

    New leathers that I have found, since this May thread are:

    Eau d'Hermes by Hermes (stinky at the top, and soft and buttery at the drydown...nice)
    Dzing! by L'Artisan


    Let me also say this...perfumers recently have been 're-creating' a leather accord from florals. In the case of Kelly Caleche by Hermes, some (like me) don't 'get' the leather at all. Others do. I recently came upon another fragrance like this...I just can't remember the name now. I would call this a new category of leathers, Transparent Leathers.
    Last edited by mikeperez23; 23rd September 2007 at 04:13 PM.

  19. #19

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    Default Re: the different leathers

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeperez23 View Post
    Let me also say this...perfumers recently have been 're-creating' a leather accord from florals. In the case of Kelly Caleche by Hermes, some (like me) don't 'get' the leather at all. Others do. I recently came upon another fragrance like this...I just can't remember the name now. I would call this a new category of leathers, Transparent Leathers.
    It's funny that you say that but there is something about jasmin sambac that is leathery. I find it all very interesting and I'm off to check out the links you gave us.
    --------------------------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by narcus View Post
    Finding the right ones for yourself is the biggest challenge. Not all 219 fragrances of the BN directory 'containing a leather note' can be called a leather fragrance, I think. But you may want to search the BN archive for more recommendations and detailed descriptions. BN menber Milamber is the expert. Check his reviews on leather frags, In Leather Man for example.
    Thanks, Great suggestion, I will do that, and enjoy it!
    Last edited by RuRu; 23rd September 2007 at 04:29 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  20. #20
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    Default Re: the different leathers

    Quote Originally Posted by narcus View Post
    [SIZE=3][SIZE=2]
    The fragrance Knize Ten originates from the international period between the wars (1924). I cannot believe that the perfumer should be unknown. From details I read, this was not a Viennese creation, and “Ten” refers to the top score in the polo game. .

    (...)

    To me, the leather note in Knize is predominatly a ‘Russian Leather’ note due to some birch oil used. Russian leather originally characterized a certain boot leather (military, riding boots). Such leathers have to be waterproof, and in the early days nothing was better than applying a mix between (black) birch tar and oil to the tanned cow hide.
    Interesting to notice that this classical leather and it's most popular cousin between leathers - Ralph Lauren's green Polo - share their name's inspiration in some way.

    I know nothing about the polo game, but I suppose the players use leather boots.

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