The whole niche culture is losing its content. Armani started the viral exclusivity take-over with his wood and pebble niche line.
Is it me or are prices of niche fragrances really getting out of hand?
I mean , Le Labo, 165 euro for 100ml , Amouage 170 euro for 50ml, Bois 1920 130 euro's for 100ml.
I'm sure Guerlains Sprit. Double Vanille is very good ( yeah, yeah...lim.edition, I know...)
but 200$ for a friggin 75ml?? Come on!! This is ridiculous!!
and what about those Luxe CdG's?
I like niche fragrances, but there was a time I used to think that 95 euro was , and still ,is a lot. Where does it end? Are they trying to spoil the fun for us? Greedy b..tards!!
Last edited by eric; 24th November 2007 at 03:24 PM.
The whole niche culture is losing its content. Armani started the viral exclusivity take-over with his wood and pebble niche line.
My responses to the high prices:
Floris Santal 1.7oz - $32
Carlos Santana 3.3oz - $20
Carven Homme 1.7oz - $10
John Varvatos 3.3oz - $25
Bogart Witness 1oz - $10
I love a bargain........
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth." - Mike Tyson
Some people want to pay more for niche scents. It makes them feel more special.
I think the prices are a bit excessive. I just recently bought a couple niche fragrances, most being run-offs of the big Montale sale. I don't see myself ever paying what they ask for them in the US, $210 for a 3.4oz bottle of Aoud compared to $140 from Paris directly? Yeah, I think I know which one I'll go with. It's pretty ridiculous in my opinion that there are such huge price discrepancies between the Paris store and the US. Oh well, Montale will be getting my money directly.
But now it looks like ,. I dunno,...it looks like this is based on nothing but greed. Sure, cost of natural compounds etc. will increase , bla,bla, but now I'm starting to think they're trying to fool the customers.
They market the idea of "being exclusive" and "use only natural ingredients" and then try to make us think that,that justifies to ask 165 euro for a lousy 100ml?
I'm sure this will go on for a long time. As long as we keep on paying those prices.
Killervavoom is right. "Niche" is the new marketing term.
Last edited by eric; 24th November 2007 at 04:27 PM.
Here's a refreshing change. I was just shopping around on-line and discovered that the newly designed MPG bottles are 100 ml instead of the previous 90 ml, but are still $110. Woo hoo! Hopefully that's not an oversight or a price increase waiting to happen. To put things into perspective, that makes the MPG fragrances exactly half the price of Serge Lutens.
Inflation is rampant. Various categories of products seem to escalate all at once to catch up to the inflation that already occurred in other areas. Home prices rose first, then imported products from Europe such as shoes, clothing, and also fragrance. The dollar has fallen in value against the Euro creating price escalation if paying in $$. Fragrance will continue to rise in value as commodites grow in value versus currency value - especially the $$.
Buzzlepuff is right. In regards to retail perfumes, prices are up all around. I remember a few years back being able to get a really nice scent for about $40 with tax. Now it is around $60. Hell, they were trying to sell me a bottle of Kouros at the Bay for about $70!!
Now, if that is where retail "designer" scents are, what about niche?
On a slightly different note, this is one of the greatest reasons why I make my purchases almost exclusively online. Even with elevated prices, places like scentiments and others really come through. Heck, why pay $300 for a 120mL of Creed at Holt Renfrew when I can get one through scentiments for $110?
Perhaps online stores are doing for the perfume market what downloading songs did for the record store.
You are not your perfume.
I feel like designer scents are more expensive than few years ago. And thn started producing 90ml or 80ml bottles.
It's great that we can still spot some great frags in Tj Maxx or Perfumania or online, but the bargain prices may also go up as the department store prices increase.
Last few months in European airports in duty free sections many scents had 45-60 Euro price tag, which is $80-90. Are those really discounted duty free prices?
As the old saying goes, the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Guess who's driving up prices?
Last edited by knightowl; 24th November 2007 at 07:08 PM.
keepin' it musky
As was mentioned earlier, it's the low dollar vs. the euro.
And, I have to politely disagree with KO... Thank God for the rich. Think about it.
"We are fast approaching the stage of the ultimate inversion: the stage where the government is free to do anything it pleases, while the citizens may act only by permission; which is the stage of the darkest periods of human history, the stage of rule by brute force." Ayn Rand...
"The essence of fascism is to make laws forbidding everything and then enforce them selectively against your enemies."
One of the reasons I haven't bought a Serge Lutens yet is that I set a limit of under $200 for 100 ml for myself and at $110 for 50 ml, he's over. And really, why should a fragrance ever be that expensive unless it has something incredibly rare in it (which I'm sure the SL ones don't)?
Not all niche went over the top
Crabtree and Evelyn - Floris - etc.... still price very well
But what make me laugh is the regular houses 50ml bottles at £35.00 that makes a 100ml worth £70.00 which is over priced
within the niche market - philosophy - image and price is another game
Yes why would a bottle of Creed or MPG cost more than a bottle of Artisan ?????
I think like cosmetics etc.... is the target of the HOUSE what customer - what purse etc...
Everything has been looked at - where to advertise etc... to reach the right purse.
Then the packaging - the bottle etc,,,,, makes the difference too
A good exemple is L'oreal cosmetic which are in the cheaper side is packed simply and can be found in regular supermarket/chemist
A few fancy ingredients and packaging and you are La Prairie etc.....
It's all about conspicuous consumption, snobbery, and exclusivity. No use of natural ingredients available to any perfumer with a hint of conscience could justify such high prices for a commercial scent, after all; what the extra money buys isn't rare ingredients or even skillful blending, but bragging rights because your perfume is more expensive than anyone else's.
Same deal as $200 jeans, really.
"low dollar v.s.euro" , hmm, maybe, but still it doesn't explain the absurd prices they ask now. I mean, where's the logic?
Le Labo for instance, present themself as a small company, made with friends , love for real perumers, anti mass product etc. Really romantic and all. In the mean time they ask 165 euro for a bottle of perfume.
Why does a 100ml L'Artisan cost 85 euro and a 100ml Le Labo 165 ?
Look at the recent Montale sale for example.
First of all, I respect their "philosophy", but think about it. Normal retail price of 100ml was 122 euro. And then, because of the Swiss Montale closing , suddenly they were selling them for half the price ,so, suddenly now they are half worth the price? and they did good buissiness , let's be honest.
And I'm sure it scared some other retailers, and made them think about giving discounts on their prices.
I know it's all buisiness and all, but I wonder , where does it end. Really. We'll see.
I'll stop wining now, and start enjoying fragrances now, LOL!
The last thing I wanna do is annoy some with my posts. Just a few thoughts from a regular customer, that's all.
Last edited by eric; 24th November 2007 at 11:01 PM.
Maybe a lot of it is part of a hype too, there are the hot and happening houses that get a lot of attention for a while and use this opportunity to cash in, but there are also classics like L'Artisan who don't really work like that. Either way, I'm afraid prices will keep going up quite a bit in the future.
Last edited by eric; 24th November 2007 at 11:29 PM.
Niches do have sick prices.
Still they sell probably enough as some rich guy doesn't want his not-so-rich neighbour to smell exactly like him.
i wouldn't say so. I don't really buy that many niche because it's just too much for a simple college student. And it would please me if the prices for niches went down. However, the prices aren't really that outrageous. If you look at the prices of a Gant sweater or an Etro tie, a bottle of MPG, Montale, or Tom Ford is fairly relatively inexpensive. It's the high life and whether or not the fragrances are actually worth the money I don't know but I know I can't afford it.
Another comment I would like to add to this thread: If a niche scent costs $150+ for a bottle, it had damned well better smell unlike anything else out there before it. That is one of the reasons I have been hesitant to try to Bond No. 9 house.
I disagree with pretty much everyone here! In my view fragrances are priced way too cheap. It is the fact that they are priced too cheap that keeps driving the trend to discontinue or reformulate really high quality fragrances that have costly ingredients.
Thirty years ago a guy could afford maybe one cologne, and it was a luxury item. If you were to alter the cost then for inflation it's price now would be more than the price of a niche. It's because consumers are not prepared to pay a lot for fragrances, compared to what they once paid, that means that we are now awash in ten thousand low quality, low cost fragrances. (Some of which are very good, I might add.)
There needs to be new price point for high quality products.
(Of course this does not mean that every niche must be worth the price that they are charging — I'm sure most are not.)
There are people to whom the truth of language does not matter — they are known as liars.
You remember Gresham's Law in economics? Bad money drives good money out of circulation. The same may be true of product quality. Bad products flood the market and drive the good products out of the low-price market.
I think bad perfumes are driving the prices of good ones up. That's not to say some mass-market or designer frags aren't good. Still, many of those lower- and medium-price scents are more expensive than they were, maybe because of the weak dollar, but the low quality doesn't justify those prices.
To get better quality, people are moving to the niche houses (though not all niche frags are that great either). So the mediocre mass-market offerings are driving more people to get into the niche market, and the relative scarcity and lower production levels of the niche houses are driving prices up.
Yr good bud,
"Why spend life seeking that which does not satisfy? Why remain a slave, when freedom waits? Let your life shine; illumine the world with your truth!"
Fiat justitia ruat cælum.
Let justice be done, even if the sky should fall.
— Lucius Calpurnius Piso Caesoninus
Qui nihil potest sperare, desperet nihil.
Let him who can hope for nothing despair of nothing.
Male irato ferrum committitur.
It is an evil thing to arm an angry man.
. . .And we don't often get to 'test drive' the products we hear such raves about, do we? That's another factor.
I would wear Amouage Gold--if someone paid me 170 euros daily to do so.
I told a mate I bought a fragrance for £45, and he freaked out - “You’re paying for water”. I was embarrassed and didn’t know what to say to justify my spend. It however got me thinking.
Effectively, we ARE paying for water. Whatever they put in it; when it comes down to the crunch it’s more than likely made mostly from water. Hell, we’re all practically water.
So why is it so expensive? I guess you could argue the special ingredients added. However the fragrance market isn’t exactly niche. It’s a big industry, where the big and medium businesses can benefit from economics of scale, mainly benefiting from bulk buying to reduce costs per ingredient. If you can buy it the store, I believe the company is big enough to benefit – and there’s a whole load of brands in the shops now. It’s not like they put gold in it... not even silver.
How about the manufacturying costs? Like I said, they could be manufacturing in one factory (for the small houses) or several worldwide. If they aren’t using machines, they can outsource to cheaper labour countries such as India. All businesses do this, it’s ‘normal’ for modern countries now. I will add, whether they distil fragrances, use special blending techniques, or keep it marinating for years. It’s not the most complex process, or money hungry.
You could be perhaps paying for the name. ‘Chanel’ for instance. Yes I agree with you who agree.
Finally and I feel this is the most likely cause for charging big bucks (or pounds for us), is the fact that if it cost less – you wouldn’t buy it. Psychiatrists for instance charge phenomenal amounts of money (not from experience I might add). But imagine if you went (yes I mean it) and the person charged 20$ or £10 for the session. You’d question the content and the person’s ability to help. You may think he/she’s not professional/experienced/good enough, and may change to his colleague who charges over a hundred, or more. You may feel that if you’re going to get the job done, you may as well get it done right. Right?
I may be ignorant, and have got all my thoughts wrong. There may be more to it. Or I might be stupid, or just incorrect in any way.
To be honest, I’m not too bothered even though it sounds like I have a big grudge against the industry. I don’t.
1) I like fragrances
2) I’ll buy fragrances
I just hope my degree will enable me to earn, and spend more on sexy water. Anyway, just some thoughts…
particularly with niche houses who use good quality ingrediants, costs can be quite large. also, fragrance has always been a 'luxury' item. the way i see the market now, if you want something good and cheap it's there for you, if not you can pay some pretty high prices. either way, it's all good.
current favourites: guerlain vetiver, trumper eucris, adp colonia
latest swag: cdg man2, lolita lempicka au masculin
next buys: keiko mecheri oliban, michael by michael kors
I was thinking about this the other day. What is the per pound (16oz) cost of the actual PERFUME. Well, let's assume the average EdT is 10% fragrance, and 90% inert ingredients.
So, my 3.4 ounce bottle of Prada that I just bought was approx $70. Of course, only 10% of that is actually fragrance. So, 0.34 ounces of fragrance cost me $70.
Now, to figure the per pound cost, we divide 16/0.34 and multiple that by 70.
16/.34 = 47.06
47.06 * 70 = $3294.2
Almost $3300 a pound. Wow.
Pricing of luxury products is not undertaken through Cost Plus pricing...Under Cost plus pricing mechanism the final price of a product is a function of the costs incurred in the manufacturing of a product.
The fragrance pricing is certainly not influenced a lot by the raw material costs incurred in manufacturing them. Instead its the placement of the brand that determines its price. The target audience is selected and the brand is then promoted to appeal to this niche clientale.
I dont think Chanel perfumes cost more to make is why they price their products higher than lets say YSL. There may be a slight variation in the cost, however its the target audience and the brand positioning that ultimately guides the pricing. I am sure if Chanel's were not priced as they are now, it wouldnt be an aspirational brand for most people who look forward to buy it and flaunt that they have bought it.
Its a race that most fragrance companies have gotten themselves into and with the increasing disposable incomes of the consumers, the companies are getting to price their products at their own discretion. However one must also not forget that due to insanely high marketing and advertisement costs a major part of their revenues may be going towards meeting these costs.
I think one can conclude that increase in fragrance prices has surely been at a much faster pace than the rate of increase in their costs.
You are paying not just for the ingredients of the fragrance. I feel that you are paying also for the skill and artistry of the fragrance creation. It is like buying designer clothes, the materials are not necessarily more expensive but you are paying for the whole artistic creation and the image of the name.
If you were to buy an expensive painting, you are not just paying for the paint and paper.
Last edited by BrothaG; 25th November 2007 at 01:46 PM. Reason: Thanks for merging