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  1. #1

    Red face Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Some people here on Basenotes get easily pissed when I mention sexuality, or when I ask people if a scent is more feminine or masculine. Now here's the reason why I'm cautious about it..... and why I keep the perfume hobby for myself, not for everyone to know.....

    Around 4 PM, I applied 4 little sprays of Black Aoud, from a sample.

    At 8 PM, my uncle and his girlfriend visited us unexpectedly.
    He kept asking my mom if she cooked anything special, with thyme or something like that. I was a little worried.......

    He asked it 3 times, and the third time my mom said that maybe he was smelling my cologne...... I didn't like it at all that she said this.
    Knowing that it's perfume that he is smelling, he said he smelled patchouli.
    Which is right. One of the fragrance notes is patchouli leaves. http://www.basenotes.net/ID26125633.html

    After that, he said / asked the following:
    "Why do you use this?"
    "You're not turning gay, are you???"

    He also said the scent is "storming" (big projection).
    Of course I responded that I'm not gay at all.

    This left a very bad taste in my mouth...
    It must be a culture thing to associate perfume and stuff like that with being gay.
    He is not the first guy mentioning how gay perfume is...

    So please, to all the people here on the board, (especially gays and metrosexuals), please respect my questions about certain scents..... don't forget that we all live in different environments, cultures and cities and that certain views on things can vary. Thanks a lot.
    Last edited by Suppressor; 28th July 2008 at 12:23 AM.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by JBL View Post
    [I]
    It must be a culture thing to associate perfume and stuff like that with being gay.
    Perhaps this is true in the Culture of Homophobia, Intolerance, and Narrow-Mindedness but not in the Culture of Evolved Individuals.

  3. #3

    Post Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    I'm curious, in what Country do you live? If you don't mind me asking....Thanks
    Don't panic. Just stay calm, and reload....

  4. #4

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Belgium.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    My dad said the same thing but it was (mostly) in jest. I get passing strange looks when I talk about it but it doesn't really bother me.
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  6. #6

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    I think it's fine to ask if a fragrance is more traditionally masculine or feminine, of course realizing that that does vary quite a bit from culture to culture. (I have men's violet and rose shaving creams from England that would NEVER be made here in the US, for example.) However, from reading all of your post, I think you have some "coming out" to do in terms of your olfactory interests at the very least. Who cares what your uncle thinks of you or your fragrance? If he was so interested in it, maybe it could turn out to be a shared interest! Who knows?

  7. #7

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by JBL View Post
    Belgium.
    thats interesting....

    i didnt know Belgium was a culture infested with homophobia....oh well.


    another question...How old are you?
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  8. #8

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by acceptfacts View Post
    thats interesting....

    i didnt know Belgium was a culture infested with homophobia....oh well.


    another question...How old are you?
    I'm 20.
    And no, Belgium is not a culture infested with homophobia....
    Americans seem to overuse that word.

    All I see is, that in some people's head, they associate perfume with being gay.
    That's interesting.

    Now comes the question. Can you blame them?
    This is a picture from one of my favorite Basenotes users, Dimitri.

    Promoting Gaultier².......
    Last edited by Suppressor; 28th July 2008 at 12:59 AM.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    I would have responded to your Uncle that "I don't think i'm turning gay, but you do look very handsome today, thanks for asking!" .

    Don't let your Uncle's insecurity and homophobia rub off on you. I am a straight male and dont give a flying **** about what anyone thinks about my fragrance hobby. I am a confident, secure man who loves cologne .

  10. #10

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    i would and do tell to anyone who listens about my large and growing collection of fragrances and how well "female" fragrances sit on my skin.....and I'm straight..=)

    if you're comfortable with who you are you will never have to worry about anyone else's opinion on your sexuality ....or what you like....or what fragrances you enjoy.

    if someone else's opinion could "turn you gay", i would have been waving a huge rainbow banner years ago but the coolest part about the human nature is that regardless of anything or anyone the true nature of what you are is innate and can not be truly altered by anyone else's words or actions....it can only be repressed for a period of time but it could never be destroyed....Ever.

    you are still the same good person you were before, the only thing that would change is someone else's opinion of you....which means that the only person who has changed for the worse.....is the one who'se opinion of you altered....you are still the same.
    Last edited by acceptfacts; 28th July 2008 at 01:09 AM.
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  11. #11

    Smile Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by JBL View Post
    Belgium.
    Thanks. I guess in different cultures, and in different societies I guess we think that we should conform to the " norm " of others. I really don't who sets these standards, nor did I ever really care. I'm not a real smart guy, but one thing I do know for sure is that we are each responsible for our own happiness, so perhaps simply say it's something I enjoy, and let it go at that. Don't ever let anyone make you believe that you doing something for the wrong reason, to hell with them man, spray on!!
    Don't panic. Just stay calm, and reload....

  12. #12

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    I think all this depends on a number of factors.

    Age: The reaches a point in life when you don't give a toss what anyone else thinks. I'm 45 and more than capable of making somebody look pathetic for suggesting that smelling good has anything to do with their sexuality. Anyone who wants to take me on will end up on the losing side. As many have found.

    Culture: I live in London which is very tolerant on the whole. We are a multi-cultural, multi-sexually preferent city which accepts all-comers really. Nobody cares if you're gay in London. It's actually more unusual for a straight guy to be into fragrance I suppose, but women find it fascinating and yes, sexy, in a straight male. A woman I know explained why she found it sexy a week or so ago. She said "A man who appreciates the difference between scents, is probably also a good cook. Men who are good cooks are more likely to notice fine detail in a woman. Combine all of those elements and you are likely to end up with a man who is very sensual in bed." Needless to say, I didn't argue...

    Attitudes to Homosexuality.

    It is a sad fact of life that some countries are so intolerant, backward and downright uncultured that they think it actually matters if someone is gay. It doesn't. The normal macho man who is obsessed about gayness is probably wishing he could have told his sports coach his true feelings for him.

    If anyone mentions "gay" in the context of perfume tell them to f-off. I act. I smell great, I get loads of women. I'm straight and I don't give a sh!t what neanderthals think.

    Get tough, enjoy fragrance and tell the rest of the world to jump off a cliff.
    In a world where people smell bad, it is the personal responsibility of every Basenoter to improve the world one SotD at a time...

  13. #13

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by JBL View Post
    I'm 20.
    And no, Belgium is not a culture infested with homophobia....
    Americans seem to overuse that word.

    All I see is, that in some people's head, they associate perfume with being gay.
    That's interesting.

    Now comes the question. Can you blame them?

    can I blame them? absolutely! who else do you want me to blame? Myself? for having good taste and using the olfactory senses that we have all been blessed with to its fullest capacity?

    do you see wine connoisseurs being accused of anything other than having love for a great product? same goes for cigar lovers (you dont see anyone accusing them of homoerotic behavior though they enjoy sucking constantly on an obvious fallic symbol).

    Because many non-updated segments of the western society still use stereotypical, narrow minded, idiotic view of what makes a "manly man" and what makes a "homo man". And if you are not smart enough to look past that incredible idiocy and absolute hypocrisy then you might fully deserve all the heartache and pain those words might have caused you.
    Last edited by acceptfacts; 28th July 2008 at 01:12 AM.
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  14. #14

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    All the women at work know i always smell good, and i get hugs from them on a daily basis. If someone thinks i'm gay because i wear cologne, then so be it.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Of course, there's the possibilty your uncle was gesting and had no intention of hurting your feelings. A close buddy of mine is gay and frequently says, "Look at that woman, she's built!" Or, "that woman is really hot." I gest and say, "I think you're a closet straight." And he doesn't mind a bit.

    Did your uncle intend to injure, or was it a remark that was meant innocently? Sometimes remarks meant innocently can still injure. One must "know their audience" before stating such things. But there is a chance that this was his attempt at warming up to you. As your uncle, it's possible he didn't mean to make you feel bad.
    Last edited by Bossa Nova; 28th July 2008 at 01:12 AM.
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  16. #16

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by acceptfacts View Post
    can I blame them? absolutely! who else do you want me to blame? Myself? for having good taste and using the olfactory senses that we have all been blessed with to its fullest capacity?

    do you see wine connoisseurs being accused of anything other than having love for a great product? same goes for cigar lovers (you dont see anyone accusing them of homoerotic behavior though they enjoy sucking constantly on an onbvious fallic symbol).

    Because many unupdated segments of the western society still use stereotypical, narrow minded, idiotic view of what makes a "manly, man" and what makes a "homo man". And if you are not smart enough to look past that incredible idiocy and absolute hypocrisy then you might fully deserve all the heartache and pain those words might have caused you.
    You are right.

    But you need to understand why I posted this topic.

    1) Some people do associate perfume with being gay.
    2) This is why I sometimes ask for opinions about scents, in terms of being more feminine or masculine

    Nothing more. Nothing less.

    Quote: And if you are not smart enough to look past that incredible idiocy and absolute hypocrisy then you might fully deserve all the heartache and pain those words might have caused you.

    Dude. I am still on Basenotes, remember?
    It pisses me off that people think this.

  17. #17

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by bossanova_boy View Post
    Of course, there's the possibilty your uncle was gesting and had no intention of hurting your feelings. A close buddy of mine is gay and frequently says, "Look at that woman, she's built!" Or, "that woman is really hot." I gest and say, "I think you're a closet straight." And he doesn't mind a bit.

    Did your uncle intend to injure, or was it a remark that was meant innocently? Sometimes remarks meant innocently can still injure. One must "know their audience" before stating such things. But there is a chance that this was his attempt at warming up to you. As your uncle, it's possible he didn't mean to make you feel bad.
    My uncle says whatever comes up in him.... He never holds back.
    I don't really care if he said it to hurt me, to joke or whatever.
    I just find the link between homosexuality and perfume interesting.
    I will always use perfume, no matter what happens folks. Don't worry.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by JBL View Post
    1) Some people do associate perfume with being gay.
    2) This is why I sometimes ask for opinions about scents, in terms of being more feminine or masculine
    Just a couple more thoughts, then I promise to shut up:

    Ref. your #1: I don't think you need to be anxious about this. There are lots of bad things people could think about you, this is not one of them.

    Ref. your #2: I knew of a handsome, virile gentleman who wore rose oil in his hair and sprayed himself with his wife's perfume before stepping out with the ladies every weekend evening. (It was the 1930's and this bottle of perfume was the only one in the house!) Women dropped at his feet (literally, I'm told) and he fathered 16 children. He was my Grandfather. A feminine scent will not create a feminine personality.
    Snarky is as snarky does.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by JBL View Post
    I'm 20.
    And no, Belgium is not a culture infested with homophobia....
    Americans seem to overuse that word.

    All I see is, that in some people's head, they associate perfume with being gay.
    That's interesting.

    Now comes the question. Can you blame them?
    This is a picture from one of my favorite Basenotes users, Dimitri.

    Promoting Gaultier².......
    Dimitri gay? No. The guy next to him? maybe.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by knightowl View Post
    Dimitri gay? No. The guy next to him? maybe.
    I know Dimitri isn't.
    That's not the reason I posted this picture.

    I posted this picture to show why people might associate perfume with gay stuff.
    Gaultier made his workers wear a kilt.
    Why did he do that? To reach a certain "group" maybe....
    I know that it's about the unisex character of the scent, but reality shows something else.
    Last edited by Suppressor; 28th July 2008 at 01:38 AM.

  21. #21
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    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    According to Sigmund Freud the psychological defense mechanism of projection, one in which and individual "projects" his or her personally undesirable desires or thoughts or feelings to characterize another individual, is a relatively common process used by every one of us to a degree.

    That well may have been the case with your uncle.
    'Those who grow too big for their pants will be exposed in the end'--anon

  22. #22

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by kbe View Post
    According to Sigmund Freud the psychological defense mechanism of projection, one in which and individual "projects" his or her personally undesirable desires or thoughts or feelings to characterize another individual, is a relatively common process used by every one of us to a degree.

    That well may have been the case with your uncle.
    Indeed. I was thinking that too.

    But more importantly, I was surprised he picked out the patchouli. He's right. Gah, perhaps that's what bothers me about Black Aoud, and not the oud at all.

  23. #23

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by JBL View Post
    You are right.

    But you need to understand why I posted this topic.

    1) Some people do associate perfume with being gay.
    2) This is why I sometimes ask for opinions about scents, in terms of being more feminine or masculine

    Nothing more. Nothing less.

    Quote: And if you are not smart enough to look past that incredible idiocy and absolute hypocrisy then you might fully deserve all the heartache and pain those words might have caused you.

    Dude. I am still on Basenotes, remember?
    It pisses me off that people think this.
    this shouldnt piss you off.....you have plainly stated that ignorant words have a strong effect on you......and in my mind that should be the only thing that pisses you off....=)

    P.S so when you ask next time "does this one smell too feminine or too masculine" what you really asking is "is this fragrance not going to be interpreted as gay by a homophobic person who knows nothing about fragrances?"...

    P.S 2.....if your uncle interprets black aoud as "gay" or "feminine" then he might have bigger issues than narrow mindedness.
    Last edited by acceptfacts; 28th July 2008 at 01:59 AM.
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  24. #24

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by acceptfacts View Post
    this shouldnt piss you off.....you have plainly stated that ignorant words have a strong effect on you......and in my mind that should be the only thing that pisses you off....=)

    P.S so when you ask next time "does this oen smell too feminine or too masculine" what you really asking is "is this fragrance not going to be interpreted as gay by a homophobic person who knows nothing about fragrances?"...

    P.S 2.....if your uncle interprets black aoud as "gay" or "feminine" then he might have bigger issues than narrow mindedness.
    He didn't really say if Black Aoud is good or not.
    He gave me the impression he was amazed by the smell.....
    Maybe he was jaleous I don't know and I don't care.

    P.S so when you ask next time "does this oen smell too feminine or too masculine" what you really asking is "is this fragrance not going to be interpreted as gay by a homophobic person who knows nothing about fragrances?"... and because I want manly perfumes in general.

  25. #25

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Some dudes are always going to think that colognes are gay, that's just it, but they're in the minority and are heavily frowned upon by pretty much everyone else.

    I was on one of the shaving forums a while back and some asshole said that he didn't use colognes because they were for gays. Pretty much everyone on the board, myself included, went off on the guy to the point where he doesn't even show up too often anymore. Mind you, I'm pretty sure the guys on the shaving forums are pretty much straight and conservative, and they took offense to the comment, so I wouldn't worry about it. Anyone who says crap like that is probably an asshole, anyway.

  26. #26

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    I would never even think about whether a scent made me gay or not.

    A fragrance doesn't have that power. Sexuality comes from without not within.

    A smell is just a smell.

    I wear a fragrance based on whether I think it works on my skin or not. Chanel No 5 doesn't, but 19 does - and I get compliments for wearing it because it has an air of familiarity about it to a lot of women, but it smells different on a man.

    Loosen up dude. I think you need to answer some of your own issues about fragrance and sexuality. Why does it bother you so much if someone else thinks a fragrance is feminine? Most people know f*ck all about fragrances.

    Wear whatever you like. If people think you are gay, let them - does it really matter? No woman I know thinks I am gay, they are more turned on by the fact that I recognise what perfume they are wearing.
    In a world where people smell bad, it is the personal responsibility of every Basenoter to improve the world one SotD at a time...

  27. #27

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by JBL View Post
    He didn't really say if Black Aoud is good or not.
    He gave me the impression he was amazed by the smell.....
    Maybe he was jaleous I don't know and I don't care.

    P.S so when you ask next time "does this oen smell too feminine or too masculine" what you really asking is "is this fragrance not going to be interpreted as gay by a homophobic person who knows nothing about fragrances?"... and because I want manly perfumes in general.
    whats "manly" is such an ambiguous term that I'm sorry but I dont believe that is what you are saying...it is what majority of your society interprets to be "feminine" that you dont want.....color pink was considered gay but now it is not only acceptable for men but is considered super fashionable,"cool and masculine"...

    your skin does a natural job of masculating any scent you wear.....if you dislike flowers then dont wear floral scent.....but i dare you tell me that Le Labo Rose 31 is a feminine scent yet its main ingredient is a flower.....

    if you want others to be more openminded maybe its always the best idea to start with yourself first.....once that happens, i think your attitude towards what anyone thinks is "masculine or feminine" will change drastically.
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  28. #28

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by mmaximus View Post
    Some dudes are always going to think that colognes are gay, that's just it, but they're in the minority and are heavily frowned upon by pretty much everyone else.

    I was on one of the shaving forums a while back and some asshole said that he didn't use colognes because they were for gays. Pretty much everyone on the board, myself included, went off on the guy to the point where he doesn't even show up too often anymore. Mind you, I'm pretty sure the guys on the shaving forums are pretty much straight and conservative, and they took offense to the comment, so I wouldn't worry about it. Anyone who says crap like that is probably an asshole, anyway.
    Well said. I actually have a good gay friend...my wifes best friend..and he is into colognes too. My wife jokes that he and I are alike...wearing polo shirts, dressing nice for work, cologne, but she teases because she knows there are idiots out there. I'm not metrosexual either. I think it is funny that people think smelling good is "gay." Most people that smell bad drive the women away and my reason for being into colegnes were early life reactions from women. Their missing out AND are homophobes.
    Last edited by ToughCool; 28th July 2008 at 02:16 AM.
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  29. #29

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by acceptfacts View Post
    .....color pink was considered gay but now it is not only acceptable for men but is considered super fashionable,"cool and masculine"...
    That will be for America.
    Don't forget about the differences between cultures....
    Belgium and other countries are not so open minded...
    I'm also not so open minded for the colour pink. This doesn't mean that I will give a guy with a pink shirt strange looks or something. I will just not wear it. That's all.

    You also react pretty angry to the link some people make between perfume and being gay.
    In fact we have a lot of things in common.
    I just don't feel like being a rebel and wearing feminine stuff....
    (please don't focus now on the word rebel if you want to react to this message)

    Btw I would love to try Rose 31.

  30. #30

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    I would prefer that gays and straight men and women don't think maybe I'm gay just because of the fragrance that I'm wearing. For one thing, since I'm not familiar with gay culture, I wouldn't know if I'm accidentally wearing the wrong thing. So I'm with JBL in asking fellow basenoters to help us out with correctly identifying masculine and neutral non-gay fragrances. And this has nothing to do with any lack of confidence or insecurity with my own sexuality. It's all about wanting others to perceive me correctly, so as to avoid problems.

  31. #31

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by ToughCool View Post
    Well said. I actually have a good gay friend...my wifes best friend..and he is into colognes too. My wife jokes that he and I are alike...wearing polo shirts, dressing nice for work, cologne, but she teases because she knows there are idiots out there. I'm not metrosexual either. I think it is funny that people think smelling good is "gay." Most people that smell bad drive the women away and my reason for being into colegnes were early life reactions from women. Their missing out AND are homophobes.
    Right on, man. I couldn't agree with you more. It's funny, but my fiancee teases me too. Once I used this one called Black Cashmere that she has, and she was poking fun at me. All good fun, though!

  32. #32

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by JBL View Post
    That will be for America.
    Don't forget about the differences between cultures....
    Belgium and other countries are not so open minded...
    I'm also not so open minded for the colour pink. This doesn't mean that I will give a guy with a pink shirt strange looks or something. I will just not wear it. That's all.

    You also react pretty angry to the link some people make between perfume and being gay.
    In fact we have a lot of things in common.
    I just don't feel like being a rebel and wearing feminine stuff....
    (please don't focus now on the word rebel if you want to react to this message)

    Btw I would love to try Rose 31.

    that is the point.....we live in cultures where attitude of many is narrow minded and deragatory to anything that isnt a "norm"......but that doesnt make it right or accepting it as just that doesnt make it better....

    50 years ago in America looking at black people as second class citizens and even as far lesser humans than white people, was considered a "norm" for the majority of the U.S society...now, if I lived there and accepted it as "oh well, thats just what it is" would not make it any better......it is up to you to educate yourself and make the best judgements based on what you believe is right not what someone else believes is right.

    and you are correct....ignorance and/or stupidity angers me.
    Last edited by acceptfacts; 28th July 2008 at 03:04 AM.
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  33. #33

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by aeromatic View Post
    I would prefer that gays and straight men and women don't think maybe I'm gay just because of the fragrance that I'm wearing. For one thing, since I'm not familiar with gay culture, I wouldn't know if I'm accidentally wearing the wrong thing. So I'm with JBL in asking fellow basenoters to help us out with correctly identifying masculine and neutral non-gay fragrances. And this has nothing to do with any lack of confidence or insecurity with my own sexuality. It's all about wanting others to perceive me correctly, so as to avoid problems.
    Spot on.

  34. #34

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by aeromatic View Post
    I would prefer that gays and straight men and women don't think maybe I'm gay just because of the fragrance that I'm wearing. For one thing, since I'm not familiar with gay culture, I wouldn't know if I'm accidentally wearing the wrong thing. So I'm with JBL in asking fellow basenoters to help us out with correctly identifying masculine and neutral non-gay fragrances. And this has nothing to do with any lack of confidence or insecurity with my own sexuality. It's all about wanting others to perceive me correctly, so as to avoid problems.
    then you need to buy yourself a bottle of ADG and Curve and be content....and I dont see much purpose for you to remain on this site, if your goal is to not be "percieved incorrectly" by random homophobes.

    but to each their own.....good luck
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  35. #35

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by acceptfacts View Post
    then you need to buy yourself a bottle of ADG and Curve and be content....and I dont see much purpose for you to remain on this site, if your goal is to not be "percieved incorrectly" by random homophobes.

    but to each their own.....good luck
    Not everyone has the guts to be confident like you are.
    We Basenoters can not change the thoughts of "homophobes".
    I also don't want people to talk behind my back, calling me "the guy who wears feminine perfume". That is not why I use perfume.

  36. #36

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    wait till uncle sees your bottles
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  37. #37

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by JBL View Post
    Not everyone has the guts to be confident like you are.
    We Basenoters can not change the thoughts of "homophobes".
    I also don't want people to talk behind my back, calling me "the guy who wears feminine perfume". That is not why I use perfume.
    I'm curious to know what your reasoning behind wearing a fragrance is.

  38. #38
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    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by aeromatic View Post
    I would prefer that gays and straight men and women don't think maybe I'm gay just because of the fragrance that I'm wearing. For one thing, since I'm not familiar with gay culture, I wouldn't know if I'm accidentally wearing the wrong thing. So I'm with JBL in asking fellow basenoters to help us out with correctly identifying masculine and neutral non-gay fragrances. And this has nothing to do with any lack of confidence or insecurity with my own sexuality. It's all about wanting others to perceive me correctly, so as to avoid problems.
    Quote Originally Posted by JBL View Post
    Spot on.
    Guys,

    I think this topic has been covered numerous times on this board with topics like "What fragrances are gay". People are gay, fragrances aren't.

    I am gay. I do not know of any special fragrance(s) that signifies being gay - I looked in the handbook and didn't see any listed .

    I don't wear any particular scent because I am gay. My wardrobe runs the gambit from very masculine scents (Kouros, Zino) to ones feminine (Fracas). I wear them because I like them - that's the only reason.

    If you are not comfortable wearing a fragrance, then I suggest you don't. But I personally would not let others influence/dictate what I like and want to wear.
    Last edited by petruccijc; 28th July 2008 at 10:11 AM.
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  39. #39
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    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    How could "neutral non-gay fragrances" ever be reasonably defined or identified? There are many thousands of gay men and many thousands of straight men world-wide. Each of these groups uses many thousands of fragrances. I am sure there is a very large overlap in usage between these two groups. Would a gay fragrance be one that is used only by gay men and never by straight men? If so, how would anyone know what they are? Only God knows the real answer to that question and I have a feeling that He isn't going to talk about it. It is unrealistic to expect to get the answer from us mortal Basenoters. I think that men who are secure about their own sexuality shouldn't care about this issue. Our enjoyment of life, and fragrances, should not depend on the opinions of others.

  40. #40

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    I don't mean to be mean or snobby - but to be honest with JBL and all of you in fact who have replied to this theard....

    I really don't understand this posting, its meaning and why it is here in the fragrance discussion board?

    Homophobia is Homophobia no matter how much you may try to justify it by painting it a diffrent color with culture, enviorment or race. If you fear daily others thoughts or judgements upon - you are truly wasting away a life my friend.

  41. #41

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    I understand that at 20 a person is still figuring out who they are and comments especially from a close relative can cut to the quick. However, I think that you should wear perfume for yourself. If you feel comfortable in a fragrance then you should wear it, and wear it proudly. If someone associates it with a certain sexual preference it tells you more about them than it does you.

  42. #42

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by JBL View Post
    Not everyone has the guts to be confident like you are.
    We Basenoters can not change the thoughts of "homophobes".
    I also don't want people to talk behind my back, calling me "the guy who wears feminine perfume". That is not why I use perfume.
    It doesn't take guts to be self confident. Personally, I think I'd prefer to be "the guy who wears feminine perfume" than the guy who lets others dictate what I can and cannot wear.
    Last edited by surreality; 28th July 2008 at 04:04 AM.

  43. #43

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Can the rest of the posts now be about why a person calls me gay for using perfume?
    And why he would think that? Maybe the perfume world is dominated by gay people?
    Can some one give another explanation, next to the politically correct answers like "homophobia"?

  44. #44

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    It's not gay, it makes you look sophisticated and interesting.

  45. #45

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by JBL View Post
    Can the rest of the posts now be about why a person calls me gay for using perfume?
    And why he would think that? Maybe the perfume world is dominated by gay people?
    Can some one give another explanation, next to the politically correct answers like "homophobia"?

    I'll try. They grew up in an era or area where women wore perfume and men sweated. Colognes weren't accepted or accessible. To them "scents" are something women do so they aren't into it. Who knows. The key is that you love it and it makes you feel good no matter your preference. Some people aren't into it. Just like some people aren't into football but love basketball or love opera but hate musicals or love horor but hate action. It is pure preference in life, gay or straight. I'm straight and my Dad wore the old stuff like Old Spice and then in my teens Obsession and by mom liked the smells and I learned. A love for something should be a joy and not matter.
    Last edited by ToughCool; 28th July 2008 at 02:26 PM.
    "As you walk down the fairway of life you must smell the roses, for you only get to play one round."
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  46. #46

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by JBL View Post
    Can the rest of the posts now be about why a person calls me gay for using perfume?
    And why he would think that? Maybe the perfume world is dominated by gay people?
    Can some one give another explanation, next to the politically correct answers like "homophobia"?
    If you want an answer to why a person would call you gay for wearing perfume, I suggest you ask the person himself.

  47. #47

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by surreality View Post
    If you want an answer to why a person would call you gay for wearing perfume, I suggest you ask the person himself.
    I couldn't agree more. JBL, how in the world will we know what will make your uncle or anyone think anything in particular? Think of the impossible task you're setting for members of the board. Sure, it's easy to ask a question like "will people think I'm gay" because of a scent (or some question very like that--whichever one you want, I'm trying to communicate with the idea of the question you want to ask) but that's where the easy ends. Easy to ask, but to answer? Impossible! How will we know what your uncle will think? How do we know what anyone will think?

    Say the next member here posts a thread asking "I'm 20, I like X, Y, and Z for fun activities in life. What scent will I like if I like those and am the age I am?" Easy to ask, but heck, think about how impossible it is for us to know what that member will like for smells. We can't know! Easy to ask, yes, but it asks the impossible.

    You are asking us to know not what you'll think from the scents we suggest, but what other people will think from the smells upon your body. We can't know that. If your uncle has a reaction, ask him about it--how can you think this forum can give you an answer about what your uncle says or does?

    The members here can say what they want (within the rules of course) but really, they won't have the answers you're seeking. The site is devoted to, and the de facto way members post, is urging people like you to smell fragrances for yourself. Maybe some fragrances won't appeal to you in the future because you'll associate them with women's scents. Maybe this Montale is now lodged in your brain as one that makes your uncle ask if you're gay, and as a result you won't wear it. Suit yourself and don't wear things you don't like, but people here think you should wear the things you like--because you like them. And because things you like, like fragrances, have nothing to do with your sexual orientation. If you get that, JBL, then you've figured out a lot more than your uncle has.

    But don't ask more of the posters here than they can answer. We can't say what scent any one person's nose will like, much less what any second nose smelling the first person will think. No idea. Easy to form the question, but that doesn't mean there's an answer.
    --Chris
    That girl, that bottle, that mattress and me.

  48. #48

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Same problem here. I would say 8 out of 10 men using perfume are gay. It's really old-fashioned thinking like that, and I understand how you felt. I've been there before!
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  49. #49

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by knightowl View Post
    I would have responded to your Uncle that "I don't think i'm turning gay, but you do look very handsome today, thanks for asking!" .
    LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by knightowl View Post
    Don't let your Uncle's insecurity and homophobia rub off on you. I am a straight male and dont give a flying **** about what anyone thinks about my fragrance hobby. I am a confident, secure man who loves cologne .
    Amen to that bud


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  50. #50

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Well, I am Belgian ! It's no a question of country culture your are facing but of perfume culture, JLB. I do have the same problem with my colleagues. Oud (the real one) is a fascinating thing to me but people here are not used to it. It is the same with attars, I can't wear anything like that if I go to the office because I get remarks of all sorts. Even Musk from Kiehl's is subject to discussion.

    I am on all sorts of perfume forums just because scent is a subject that I cannot discuss easily with my familly or my friends, nobody understands me ...

    Just go for it, gay or not. You are living for yourself, not the others.
    L'amour fait songer, vivre et croire. Il a, pour réchauffer le coeur, un rayon de plus que la gloire; et ce rayon, c'est le bonheur. (Victor HUGO)

  51. #51
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    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Perhaps your uncle's remark is bothering you more than you let on. If you disagree with him or feel offended in the least at what he said, perhaps you should tell him how his words make you feel. Then he would have to confront the consequences of making such a personal and potentially wounding remark.

    If you are now twenty years old, you are a man, and you deserve the respect that is due to a man. Unfortunately, the sad fact is that sometimes you will not get it unless you are willing to point it out to people when they are not giving it to you.

    There are some men who call people gay as a test, to see if you will defend yourself, not by denying it, but by demanding the respect you deserve, whether you are gay or not. These men make the serious mistake of thinking that a gay man will not demand respect, and the only way to make them respect you is to stand up to them — again,
    whether you are gay or not. Saying "But uncle, I'm not gay" won't do that. What will do it is saying something like "Uncle, I love you, but you make a serious mistake if you think you don't owe me the same respect you owe any other man just because I am young and I am your nephew. Please don't make this mistake again." If my uncle tried to laugh it off and say he was kidding, I would continue by saying that I didn't think this kind of thing was funny. If you let him walk all over you, he won't stop. And you might also tell him that you know plenty of men all over the world who are interested in fragrance and that most of them aren't gay. After all, you are a member of Basenotes, and you have a wonderful example in us to share with people who believe that kind of nonsense.

    In response to your question about why some people might see perfume as being gay: Do perfume companies advertise in gay markets? Yes, they do, because they know that gay men like to smell good, as straight and bisexual men do, and they know there is a lot of money to be made among the gay community. They also advertise to straight men. How many perfume ads show overtly sexual images of a man with a woman? Most of them do, because most men are straight and most straight men want to attract women.

    Now I personally am a gay man, and telling me that gay men have wonderful taste and love beautiful things won't upset me; but I also know that like all stereotypes, this one is false. There are a lot of gay men who are slobs and have no taste at all; I know a lot of them personally. I also know a lot of straight men who are well-put-together and have excellent taste. All of which just shows that people who assume that everyone fits their stereotypes don't know very much, and probably don't deserve to be taken seriously. Even though I'm sure you love your dear uncle, maybe you need to recognize that he might be such a man, and take at least some of his words with a very large grain of salt.
    Yr good bud,

    JaimeB

    "Why spend life seeking that which does not satisfy? Why remain a slave, when freedom waits? Let your life shine; illumine the world with your truth!"

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  52. #52

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by HDS1963 View Post
    She said "A man who appreciates the difference between scents, is probably also a good cook. Men who are good cooks are more likely to notice fine detail in a woman. Combine all of those elements and you are likely to end up with a man who is very sensual in bed." Needless to say, I didn't argue...
    I like that. I like it a lot.
    Looking for a sample of Gucci Envy Me.

  53. #53

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Jaime, I really like what you said.
    What time is it now in SF ???
    L'amour fait songer, vivre et croire. Il a, pour réchauffer le coeur, un rayon de plus que la gloire; et ce rayon, c'est le bonheur. (Victor HUGO)

  54. #54
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    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by Night View Post
    Jaime, I really like what you said.
    What time is it now in SF ???
    Il est 23h44m à ce moment.
    Yr good bud,

    JaimeB

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  55. #55

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by JBL View Post
    I'm 20.
    And no, Belgium is not a culture infested with homophobia....
    Americans seem to overuse that word.

    All I see is, that in some people's head, they associate perfume with being gay.
    That's interesting.

    Now comes the question. Can you blame them?
    This is a picture from one of my favorite Basenotes users, Dimitri.

    Promoting Gaultier².......
    Im astounded at how this picture can make its way into a completely unrelated topic.

    The chap to the left is gay, and I (to the right) am not. Is my uniform for the launch somehow supporting the ideal that perfume is gay? I don't get it?
    I think that when a person is comfortable in their own skin, it doesn't matter at all about their outward appearance or the opinions of others. If anything, the kilt did wonders for my sex life at home... the Mrs wouldnt let me take the damn thing off.

    Gaultier made his male promoters wear a kilt, because in the fashion world, he is known for re-introducing 2 things to the world stage:
    1. Corsets for women, and
    2. Kilts for men.
    Last edited by Sorcery of Scent; 28th July 2008 at 09:11 AM.

  56. #56

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    I'm an American currently living in Belgium. I've been living in Belgium 8 months now.

    At first I found Belgium much more open to our mutual hobby. Male cologne and edt advertisements are common on mainstream television and on billboards, and there are many popular perfume stores in all the major cities. This gave me the initial impression that in general Belgium was very cool about men and perfume.

    However, at my wife's work in Belgium there is a straight married man who wears a variety of gorgeous perfumes. The female co-workers of this man compliment him and love visiting his office because it smells amazing. However, this man is ostracized by his male coworkers and they make many jokes behind his back about him being "gay" and a "ladyboy". Maybe they are jealous of the attention the scented man gets, maybe they are insecure about themselves, I dont know. Maybe they are just *********.

    Anyway, dont let your uncle get you down. I can sympathise because I come from a very homophobic and racist family which in general was suspicious of art/fashion and aesthetics in all forms (sad to say). Because of this many of my interests were repressed growing up. All I can say is that it gets better once you have your own place and more control over your home environment.

    There are philistines everywhere. Ignore them the best you can and be true to your desires and what you enjoy. People need to be cool to each other, but the world often doesnt agree it seems.

    PS That kilt rocks.
    Last edited by Xephon23; 28th July 2008 at 10:31 AM.

  57. #57

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Quote Originally Posted by aeromatic View Post
    I would prefer that gays and straight men and women don't think maybe I'm gay just because of the fragrance that I'm wearing. For one thing, since I'm not familiar with gay culture, I wouldn't know if I'm accidentally wearing the wrong thing. So I'm with JBL in asking fellow basenoters to help us out with correctly identifying masculine and neutral non-gay fragrances. And this has nothing to do with any lack of confidence or insecurity with my own sexuality. It's all about wanting others to perceive me correctly, so as to avoid problems.
    I'm really sorry, but I have a problem with this.

    A fragrance does not make someone gay, straight or bisexual. It is nothing but a scent.

    If you carry this on, are you not going to wear a patterned shirt in case some neanderthal thinks patterned shirts are effeminiate? What about people who take a dislike to the way you walk? Or the way you hold your coffee cup?

    You cannot live your life terrified by the idea that some dickhead is going to think badly of you.

    And this business of "correctly identifying" fragrancies which are masculine and "neutral non-gay" in itself is both almost impossible and secondly highly offensive to the gay members on this board. It's like saying
    "I don't want to wear any fragrance which makes me smell like THEM." Well, the "them" in question are perfectly rounded, whole people who don't need further castigation and rejection on a forum which is open to all and actually sexuality does not and need not come up.

    I will not take part in any witch hunt of fragrancies because they might be seen as "gay" or "straight" or "neutral". This olfactory apartheid is repugnant to me and has no place on these boards.

    The issue at heart here is not your uncles, but yours. Stand up for yourself and stop worrying about other people's opinions.
    In a world where people smell bad, it is the personal responsibility of every Basenoter to improve the world one SotD at a time...

  58. #58
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    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    I just gotta say this:

    A lot of people are constantly assuming that I'm straight, and frankly, it doesn't usually bother me too much, even though they're mistaken. Why would it bother a straight man if people sometimes assume he's gay? What they may assume about him is no more true than what they sometimes assume about me. They have no more real evidence that he's gay than they have that I'm straight, and they are wrong about both.

    The real problem is that people should assume anything at all about another guy's sexuality. In the first place, it's usually none of their business; and in the second place, if for some legitimate reason it is, they can always ask in a polite and discreet way.

    If you are going to assume anything, maybe the best thing to assume is that any guy could be either gay or straight (or, if he's really lucky, bisexual). In fact, in the ancient Greek and Roman Mediterranean, this is exactly what people did assume, and they were usually only surprised if a guy had absolutely no interest at all in one sex or the other. And, of course, they were often wrong then, too!
    Yr good bud,

    JaimeB

    "Why spend life seeking that which does not satisfy? Why remain a slave, when freedom waits? Let your life shine; illumine the world with your truth!"

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    Fiat justitia ruat cælum.

    Let justice be done, even if the sky should fall.

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    Let him who can hope for nothing despair of nothing.

    Male irato ferrum committitur.
    It is an evil thing to arm an angry man.
    —Seneca

  59. #59

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Very well said JaimeB.

    JBL, if I were in your predicament and it were bothering me, I'd definately confront my uncle - a phone call or pulling him aside at the next family function should do it. I'm 20 and I don't let anyone get on my nerves or bully me, family or not.

    I've had co-workers and very close friends who I knew from the very first minute were gay, and it wasn't because of the way they smelt. I've never had a problem with homosexuals, and didn't bat an eyelid when one of my best friends came out and said he was as camp as a row of tents.

    Also Dimitri, is that photo from David Jones perth? I think I recognise the white boxes & TV in the background haha.
    Last edited by Anthony87; 28th July 2008 at 11:26 AM.
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  60. #60

    Default Re: Family member discovers my perfume hobby...

    Give the poor guy a break and a bit of support!

    I remember being 20. Each stage of my life so far has had its own confusions (currently at the age of 40 how not to f*** up my children, maintain a long standing relationship under pressure, endure the fact that I have not yet been as successful as I wanted to be etc). Its all bloody hard. People who share their issues and ask for help should be supported, not shot down. Those responding with a sneer or an easy glib answer are really putting themslves in the same catagory as uncle - that of not thinking too hard.

    JBL - why he thinks you are gay for wearing perfume?
    Actually, I think the chances are that he doesn't really think that (although I could be wrong). As to why he SAID that....well, there may be many reasons for this and you, knowing him and the culture, will have to figure it out. Some cultures (and cultures are exist on many scales - national culture is only one small factor, social background, wealth, education will likely be more important) view any kind of asthetic appreciation as "gay". What if you went to the ballet? Opera? Baroque music? Bebop jazz? Sometimes people make defensive comments beacuse they are worried about what people will think of them....maybe he just didn't know how to react?

    But the basic issue here, I believe, is that four sprays of Black Oud is too many. It is a huge scent with massive projection. If you are not in a place where you are expected to be wearing perfume at a particular time, this would seem a very bold statement, a may be seen to be a signal of something. Maybe just go with one or two under your shirt, or stick with something lighter in those sorts of situations.

    Personally, I wouldn't recommend challanging your uncle. Given his reactions so far, I think he may take that as very confrontational and it may cause problems in your family you would rather avoid. It will become very clear to him time that you are or are not gay by him seeing who your partners are. Probably the best course of action is just to leave it and let time and evidence sort it out.



    All the best.
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