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  1. #1

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    Default Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    As you know, citruses are my favorite kind of fragrance. They are uplifiting, versatile, refreshing, sharp, sunny and manly. I have many citrus fragrances and I love them all.

    But there is something that bothers me. Many people, including basenoters, seem to think that citruses, specially those that have lemon or lime notes, are cheap smelling and inferior fragrances. Invariably, there is always a number of basenoters who say that a perfume with lime/lemon notes smells like floor cleaner or another cleaning product. They say that it is cheap smelling. They say it is not first class.

    On the other hand, I have never heard a complaint about orange notes, or notes of other citrus fruits. It seems that only lime and lemon have this bad reputation. Do you agree that lime and lemon take all the blame, and orange is worshipped with much more fervor? Can we say that orange is safer than lemon?
    Last edited by LuciusVorenus; 24th August 2008 at 06:14 PM.

  2. #2
    DustB's Avatar
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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    I don't agree with your analysis or conclusions.
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  3. #3

    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    I see what you mean though Lucius. To me its more of a ...Lemon is perceived as "just another citrus scent" where orange gets away with it a bit more. Just an opinion obviously.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    Quote Originally Posted by LuciusVorenus View Post
    As you know, citruses are my favorite kind of fragrance.
    I didn't know this. Why wasn't I told sooner!!!!????
    Last edited by Kevin Guyer; 24th August 2008 at 06:44 PM.

  5. #5

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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    The association of lemon and industrial cleaners (even car cleaners use lemon) is most unfortunate for perfume lovers. It's very likely that your baby ass and mine were cleaned with an oil that had a lemon scent. And that's where it all started. The smell of lemon oils is omnipresent and popular even though it may stink in combination with soap or terpentine. But what can we do? The use of orange oil is spreading, too. Environment people found out that it's good for treating wood. I worked with that in my hobby carpenter school. That took part of the magic out of orangey colognes, but I managed to not let that kill my joy completely. Lavender oil is a deluxe thinner for oil painting. That usually smells so good it even added to my delight over pleasant lavender colognes. Narcisso Rodriguez for him has a rather new note that irritated me from the beginning. Just the other day I discovered that same note in a textile softener - grrrr! If I hadn't disliked NR from the start, I might now.

    Try and immunize yourself at least against the nasty talk. Let your nose decide! The longer you hang around BN more cliché associations will come under your eyes. I can only advise you not to trust them, and rely on what you smell only. As the music lover you are, has it never disturbed you when Italian pizza commercials use the beginning of a Verdi Aria? It's about as brutal!
    Last edited by narcus; 24th August 2008 at 07:20 PM.
    'Il mondo dei profumi è un universo senza limiti: una fraganza puo rievocare sensazioni, luoghi, persone o ancora condurre in uno spazio di nuove dimensioni emozionali' L. V.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    Quote Originally Posted by LuciusVorenus View Post
    But there is something that bothers me. Many people, including basenoters, seem to think that citruses, specially those that have lemon or lime notes, are cheap smelling and inferior fragrances. Invariably, there is always a number of basenoters who say that a perfume with lime/lemon notes smells like floor cleaner or another cleaning product. They say that it is cheap smelling. They say it is not first class.
    Lemon/lime done the wrong way ends up smelling like floor cleaner. But witness the lemon in Monsieur Balmain, GFT Trumpers, Bois de Cedrat, or even Armani eau pour homme. Or the lime in GFT West Indian Limes, Virgin Island Water. Or the tangy spicy understones of Crowns Spiced Limes. These all will keep you away from the household cleaner aura..
    -

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    Quote Originally Posted by LuciusVorenus View Post
    But there is something that bothers me. Many people, including basenoters, seem to think that citruses, specially those that have lemon or lime notes, are cheap smelling and inferior fragrances. Invariably, there is always a number of basenoters who say that a perfume with lime/lemon notes smells like floor cleaner or another cleaning product. They say that it is cheap smelling. They say it is not first class.
    I don't perceive this, but citrus isn't one of my favorite frag types so maybe I just haven't been paying attention.

    Quote Originally Posted by LuciusVorenus View Post
    On the other hand, I have never heard a complaint about orange notes, or notes of other citrus fruits. It seems that only lime and lemon have this bad reputation. Do you agree that lime and lemon take all the blame, and orange is worshipped with much more fervor? Can we say that orange is safer than lemon?
    Lime and lemon do seem to be very popular in cleaners, air fresheners, etc. Maybe because they are sharp, strong scents that can cover other odors easily? Lemon and lime are commonly used scents in everything; orange, not so much, therefore, I would say yes, maybe orange is a tad safer for a frag note.

    I don't know. I suspect I have no idea what i'm talking about.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    I can sort of see how you'd come to form that opinion. We're somewhat fickle as a group around here.

    There is a near perpetual praise of a scent I own which I consider woefully short lasting - Eau d'Orange Verte by Hermes.

    By way of contrast, many of the older lemony woody scents like Homme de Gres and Boucheron Homme are often labelled "old man smell" here, rather than "classic". Although YSL PH usually fairs somewhat better.

    And more modern ones like D&G Masculine are just dismissed out of hand, for nebulous reasons I can't fathom.

    However, if it's a niche lemon scent like ADP Colonia Assoluta or Etro's Lemon Sorbet, the praise from here is often difficult to contain.

    But again, if it's something that smells almost akin to Colonia Assoluta, but doesn't have the ADP name - like Art of Shaving Lemon Essential Oil - the silence is somewhat deafening.
    Renato

  9. #9

    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    I disagree with your analysis....Its hard to generalyze.....I think both are very good and safe, it depends on each fragance in particular.
    "Burn their homes and churches.Then see if they will not laugh, sing and pray again.
    For when two of them meet anywhere in the world, see if they will not create a new Armenia."

    William Saroyan.
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    Using: Antaeus, The Dreamer, Eau Sauvage and Voyage d Hermes

    Wishing: Tuscan Soul by Ferragamo and Concentré d Orange Verte




    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  10. #10

    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    Disagree. Unless the orange is really well done, I automatically think household cleaners.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    I actually don't care for the smell of orange at all. I would take lemon or lime almost any day over orange, even if the orange is done well.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    It is true that traditionally lemon is used a lot in laundry detergents and cleaning solvents, but by the same tolken, orange was used a lot in flavouring medications (vitamin tabs, cough syrups and lozenges), so one could argue that both have a long history being used in household products that we have all grown up with.

    To the statement that many people believe that lemon used in perfumery denotes a scent that is of an inferior quality, I tend to agree with DustB on this one - absolute rubbish.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    I don't agree. It all depends on how the fragrance is made. There definitely are some very good lemon fragrances, and some not as good. Just like there are some very good orange fragrances, and some that are not as good.

    I happen to think one of the most "first class" scents on the market is Nina Ricci Signoricci (lemon).
    Last edited by petruccijc; 25th August 2008 at 03:48 PM.
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  14. #14

    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    Quote Originally Posted by LuciusVorenus View Post
    Many people, including basenoters, seem to think that citruses, specially those that have lemon or lime notes, are cheap smelling and inferior fragrances. Invariably, there is always a number of basenoters who say that a perfume with lime/lemon notes smells like floor cleaner or another cleaning product. They say that it is cheap smelling. They say it is not first class.
    I must be oblivious, I have never formed that impression of basenoters. I don't recall reading any statements reflecting those views.
    Two roads diverged in a yellow wood, and sorry I could not travel both and be one traveler, long I stood and looked down one as far as I could to where it bent in the undergrowth; Then took the other, as just as fair, ...... I shall be telling this with a sigh somewhere ages and ages hence: Two roads diverged in a wood, and I -- I took the one less traveled by, and that has made all the difference. - Robert Frost

  15. #15

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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    It is not all the basenoters, TwoRoads. Just a good number of them. Read the reviews of the citruses and you will find the comparisons with cleaning products.

    .

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    I think any note (lemon, orange, cedar, praline, pink pepper, etc) is open to be interpreted by Basenoters (who write reviews) and others as a 'bad association' with some other strong smelling product.

    There is no 'safe' note.

    Here on Basenotes, I am reminded every day, that many people strongly disagree with my assessment and enjoyment of the fragrances in my wardrobe. This does not impact my enjoyment of them at all.

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeperez23 View Post
    I think any note (lemon, orange, cedar, praline, pink pepper, etc) is open to be interpreted by Basenoters (who write reviews) and others as a 'bad association' with some other strong smelling product.

    There is no 'safe' note.

    Here on Basenotes, I am reminded every day, that many people strongly disagree with my assessment and enjoyment of the fragrances in my wardrobe. This does not impact my enjoyment of them at all.
    Man alive, I sure agree with everything here.
    That girl, that bottle, that mattress and me.

  18. #18

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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    Yes, I know what you mean. But I am not saying that there are absolutes. There are no completely safe and no completely unsafe notes. But I believe that there are notes that are safer than others, on average.

    .


    Quote Originally Posted by mikeperez23 View Post
    I think any note (lemon, orange, cedar, praline, pink pepper, etc) is open to be interpreted by Basenoters (who write reviews) and others as a 'bad association' with some other strong smelling product.

    There is no 'safe' note.

    Here on Basenotes, I am reminded every day, that many people strongly disagree with my assessment and enjoyment of the fragrances in my wardrobe. This does not impact my enjoyment of them at all.
    Last edited by LuciusVorenus; 25th August 2008 at 02:26 PM.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    Quote Originally Posted by LuciusVorenus View Post
    Yes, I know what you mean. But I am not saying that there are absolutes. There are no completely safe and no completely unsafe notes. But I believe that there are notes that are safer than others, on average.

    .
    Safer? As in etiquette wise? As in avoiding a social faux pas?

    Naaaa, don't think you're right about lemon lime orange or any other citrus this way. Don't think you're right.
    That girl, that bottle, that mattress and me.

  20. #20

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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    I mean safer in the sense that the note is better appreciated by other people. It is just a way of saying that people like it more and/or complain less about it.

    .
    Last edited by LuciusVorenus; 25th August 2008 at 02:35 PM.

  21. #21
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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    Quote Originally Posted by LuciusVorenus View Post
    I mean safer in the sense that the note is better appreciated by other people. It is just a way of saying that people like it more and/or complain less about it.

    .
    Same thing. Readers understand what's going on here.
    That girl, that bottle, that mattress and me.

  22. #22

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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    Guys, try to understand my perspective. A scientific mind is always trying to find patterns. Patterns are relations between variables that, "on average", are significant and exist in a population. By reading the reviews, I have the impression that there is a pattern regarding the appreciation of Lemon/Lime versus Orange notes. One note seems to be more accepted than the other. I might be wrong, it is an impression based on a small sample. To be more certain, I would have to do an empirical study and collect data from many basenoters.

    But to say that every pattern is just "a silly stereotype" is not always the best approach. There ARE patterns.... they do exist! Finding patters is what science (including social science) is all about. That is why companies do so much research before launching a product. They spend fortunes doing it. it is worth it.
    Last edited by LuciusVorenus; 25th August 2008 at 02:51 PM.

  23. #23
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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    Quote Originally Posted by LuciusVorenus View Post
    Guys, try to understand my perspective. A scientific mind is always trying to find patterns. Patterns are relations between variables that, "on average", are significant and exist in a population. By reading the reviews, I have the impression that there is a pattern regarding the appreciation of Lemon/Lime versus Orange notes. One note seems to be more accepted than the other. I might be wrong, it is an impression based on a small sample. To be more certain, I would have to do an empirical study and collect data from many basenoters.

    But to say that every pattern is just "a silly stereotype" is not always the best approach. There ARE patterns.... they do exist! Finding patters is what science (including social science) is all about. That is why companies do so much research before launching a product. They spend fortunes doing it. it is worth it.
    Well members have answered your question and there's a plain obvious response to it present here before you on this thread. Need I say "mumbo jumbo" with regard to your throwing comparisons to scientific mind and corporate research?

    If there's a faux pas in your mind associated with certain citrus scents (oooo, guys, which will be safer for me to wear? I'm so concerned with what's safer!) then it's a faux pas that originates in your head.
    Last edited by DustB; 25th August 2008 at 03:13 PM. Reason: Idiot that I am I forgot to include the quotation.
    That girl, that bottle, that mattress and me.

  24. #24

    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    I think Lucius, that when making statements such as this:

    "Many people, including basenoters, seem to think that citruses, specially those that have lemon or lime notes, are cheap smelling and inferior fragrances."

    ... they are totally unfounded. It appears to me as if you are attempting to promote your own opinions by presenting them as those shared by "many people". The answers in this thread may also only represent a small sample of members, but the "pattern" we see emerging here is that you're a bit off the mark. Agree?

  25. #25

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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    I am sorry, I didn't mean to be a nuissance. It was just my impression from reading the reviews.

    .

    Quote Originally Posted by DustB View Post
    Well members have answered your question and there's a plain obvious response to it present here before you on this thread. Need I say "mumbo jumbo" with regard to your throwing comparisons to scientific mind and corporate research?

    If there's a faux pas in your mind associated with certain citrus scents (oooo, guys, which will be safer for me to wear? I'm so concerned with what's safer!) then it's a faux pas that originates in your head.

  26. #26

    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    Quote Originally Posted by LuciusVorenus View Post
    I am sorry, ...
    Accepted!

    Now get out of yourself and get involved in threads started by other people.
    Two roads diverged in a yellow wood, and sorry I could not travel both and be one traveler, long I stood and looked down one as far as I could to where it bent in the undergrowth; Then took the other, as just as fair, ...... I shall be telling this with a sigh somewhere ages and ages hence: Two roads diverged in a wood, and I -- I took the one less traveled by, and that has made all the difference. - Robert Frost

  27. #27

    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    Cleaning product smelling fragrance would be perfect in places like Europe where they don't clean anything.

  28. #28
    timaru's Avatar
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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    what about allure blanche ie?sure many maybe dislike it but noone can say its actually cheap smelling.
    take i as a challenge-u only gotta find the real good lemon ones, if they work with ur chemistry heads will turn and thats cos of all the other positive attributes of lemony scents that u have listed in the beginning.

  29. #29
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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    haha, or my subjective oppinion about that is cos of sirslartys point^^

  30. #30

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    Default Re: Orange is Safer than Lemon?

    I think Lemon can get a bad rap due to the amount of "lemon fresh" cleaners out there. But I think Rose gets it even worse, since there are so many really cheap rose scents out there that aren't even cleaners..

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