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  1. #1

    Default Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Thanks to abubakr al-misky I am smelling some of the finest natural essences, real ouds, the "liquid gold" of perfumery, plus some rare, natural animalics. I can say without a doubt, that this is like nothing I have ever smelled before, and I would like to share these impressions with you and to pass around these vials to other Basenotes members who are interested--as long as we all use just a dab and promise to post our opinions and pass them along promptly to the next person.

    First, the ouds.
    Probably the closest I have come to smelling real oud before was a small, unrefined sample from Tigerflag. These are more refined and perfume-ready. They range in color from golden to golden-red, and the aroma is so strong that it permeates the entire envelope, through sealed vials, and out from plastic wrap!

    In general, they smell bitter, medicinal, and deeply woody, a bit smoky, and similar to a pile of aged oak mulch, as if wood resins are leaching out slowly in the sun. They are hot and bittersweet, and very strong.

    Each one, from different countries of origin, smells slightly distinct from the others. Here are what I have smelled: (Please excuse and correct any misspellings).

    Cambodian Classic - Warm, a bit fecal, woody, hints of sawdust, with some sweetness in the drydown. Complex, deep, and medicinal.

    Junnid Cambodian - Warm, less fecal, with some rubbery nuances, sweeter in the drydown. Hours later, the most dramatic development. Cinnamon undertones.

    Indian Aged 10 Years - Also called "Hindi Assam Qasoosi Kadeem," which means the tree was 40-50 years old and the oud has been aged for a decade. Cooler, least fecal of all, most deeply woody, straightforward. The strongest and longest-lasting.

    Vietnam - Warm, sweeter but less complex or strong as Cambodian.

    Vietnam Wild - Herbal, not fecal, less bitter or woody, mildest with pleasant, sweet, green, haylike note. Hours later, fairly sweet and even a bit fruity or floral.

    I can't stop sniffing them all. They are totally amazing. There really isn't any synthetic substance that can replace this ingredient. It is too complicated to replicate in its entirety. Only fractions of this scent could be copied, and then, even the longevity or development would not match the actual substance.

    One more special one here, my favorite, because it is a perfume composition, and very, very beautiful:

    Dehn Misk Maliki Supreme - The meaning is "Oil of Kings Musk Supreme." Oud with some subtle floral and spice underpinnings. I can't describe this properly. Starts out smelling like woody oud, and then a dark, rosy floral creeps out, followed by spiciness similar to clove and other sweets. The whole fragrance is highly diffusive, bittersweet, and extremely pleasing, sensual, sexy, and mysterious. It is fabulous. Hours later, powdery, sweet, lovely. Is there white musk in the base? And maybe a touch of vanilla?

    Now for the animalics:

    Ambergris - Salty, dry, bitter, very diffusive, gradually sweetens. I didn't get much on myself, and it didn't last as long as I thought it would.

    Musk, Red - Dry, unsweet, musty, pungent, powdery, bitter, dusty, leathery. This is not at all like synthetic musk. It is nowhere near as sweet, and it is much, much stronger. Hours later, sweeter and very complex. Sharper and more masculine than the white musk. As time passes, it just gets better and better.

    Musk, White - Smooth, musty, powdery, starts out bitter and ends up sweet and leathery. Smells more like what we have grown accustomed to as "musk," and yet, it is so much more animalic than the synthetics we use. This is drier, and dirtier. Hours later, still sweetening and becoming powdery. This is very nice. Smells like perfume all by itself. Still later, smells very sweet and close to some synthetic musks. Now I see what chemists have tried to capture--it is the drydown phase, alone, of real musk. This is gorgeous.

    Just for fun, I presented my arms to my cat. She never reacts to any of my perfume samples--the one exception has been Dzing, which she sniffed for a few seconds. In contrast, her reaction to all of these scents was this:

    She sniffed, kept sniffing, and then began licking my arms. I had to stop her. She loved them--the animalics especially. I have never seen anything like that happen before.

    Again, thank you so very much, abubakr al-misky, for this extremely pleasant day of experiencing these incredible substances. I urge you others to take me up on this offer to share them.
    Last edited by purplebird7; 25th February 2009 at 02:17 AM.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Thanks for sharing your impressions. You've got me very intrigued. PM'd with regard to sampling.
    "Ointment and perfume rejoice the heart: so doth the sweetness of a man's friend by hearty counsel."

  3. #3

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Okay, I have responded to your PM.
    Oh, people, this is amazing stuff. The development is so slow and rich.
    The musk is divine.
    I can see why those poor creatures were hunted to near extinction. It would be make a profitable "ranching" business to turn a population of musk deer loose on a large piece of property, let them proliferate, and cull the males for their musk when they are old.
    I wonder if it is possible for the governments of China and India to spearhead such an effort. It seems that they should be able to make an attempt. Like sandalwood, it deserves to command a high price that would make sustainability feasible.

    (Must sign off. My other cat is on my lap, licking my arm.)
    Last edited by purplebird7; 24th February 2009 at 10:39 PM.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    This sounds very neat. I've been holding off on buying anything with oud or musk in it, because I knew intuitively that there was rare and unique stuff out there which could not be matched by commonly available fare.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Oh, purplebird..
    I'm with you !
    The musks are divine- absolutely [ oooh- a PUN !].
    Ambergris loves me, and I it; and I also am extremely fond of natural civet and castoreum.
    The ouds both fascinate and repel at the same time; love 'em in miniscule doses...

  6. #6

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Yeah, Chaya, isn't it all just freaking amazing?
    My cats thought so, too!
    Last edited by purplebird7; 25th February 2009 at 02:19 AM.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Even though the animalics sounds fantastic, I wouldnīt use them even if the animals are kept for this purpose solely. Ever seen the bearfarms where bears are kept and have a tap inside them(stomach I think it was) to get gal or some other internal juice out, not pretty

    Canīt be worth it in my eyes
    But once you get locked into a serious perfume collection, the tendency is to push it as far as you can.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Lian, my darling.
    I heartily feel what you're saying.

    Givaudan, Firmenich...have some amazing alternatives; they really can fool the nose.
    MANY cost nearly what the naturals do.

    Believe me- as a former [ and future ] vegetarian and humanitarian- it does pain me.
    We're taliking olfactory education ONLY.
    NOT advocating cruelty, sweetheart. MWAH !
    [You tender thang, you !]

  9. #9

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Thank you for sharing this marvelous post. In particular, the various ouds sound so interesting!
    I had the opportunity to smell beach-harvested ambergris. That was a unique experience. It was very "brown", with a toasty, nutty, salty/briny smell. I could imagine seaweed and also meaty notes from the protein compounds in it. It was not unpleasant at all. Quite an arresting smell.
    odysseusm

    "The force that through the green fuse drives the flower // drives my green age..." Dylan Thomas

  10. #10

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Lian, what if the animals were kept in the wild, roaming free, and hunted only at the time of harvest?
    It would encourage governments to set aside large tracts of natural habitat, which would help the environment. It would allow the animals to live a normal life. I do not suport keeping them in captivity.
    I suppose it is only wishful thinking that such a plan would work. After all, ivory that comes from protected elephants must be destroyed in order to avoid creating a black market for the product, instead of allowing elephants to provide a sustainable supply of ivory for countries that choose to raise them and use the tusks of deceased or culled animals.
    In that respect, only man's dishonesty and greed prevent such plans from working.

    Please realize that I am not going to begin to purchase products that support unsustainable and cruel practices.
    I have always wanted to see what real musk smells like, and my curiosity is satisfied, and here is what I realize:
    Natural musk smells very different at the outset, and not as pleasant or blendable as synthetic musk. Only upon drydown does it becomes sweet--and it does smell wonderful, far surpassing the synthetic in terms of strength, and tenacity. I don't think there would be a problem with anosomia with natural musk.
    Synthetic musk smells most similar to natural musk at the time of drydown, which means that the chemists have tried to bypass the harsh phase of the musk. They have succeeded in doing so. And, now that safe substitutes for the early synthetic musks have been created, there is no way that the industry would return to expensive naturals.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Yeah I donīt have enough faith in humanity to believe or even hope that we could orchestrate something like that (when it would be cruelty free on production scale)

    As a smelling experiment, itīs interesting to hear the difference and it sounds wonderful, Iīm just too much of a skeptic to see this happening cruelty free

    Iīd be interested to see what Nukapei (or nukapai) knows on this subject though She probably has a lot more knowledge on this that is recent and maybe on the alternatives too.
    But once you get locked into a serious perfume collection, the tendency is to push it as far as you can.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    I myself have no problem in general in wearing natural musk. As far as cruilty then of course it is never an option. As for me, I eat meat and wear leather and I am sure most of it comes from places that we can deam cruel to animals. But the practice of being cruel must be proved to me in order for me to obstain from a product for the simple fact that eating meat, wearing leather, wearing musk are all general things that are ok to do unless cruilty has been proven. The only people who could be free of blame in this case are vegans and then the debate opens, if humans should use animals products or not in general. The practise of wearing musk, yes there should be some consern but one must realize that there are farms dedicated to manufacturing musk that does not contain killing the musk deer for it. If someone says it is not right to harvest the musk deer just for their musk then this should also be said for all animals raised for their by products. Also one has to remember in many of these countries it would seem impossible that they would kill the deer just for its glands and not use the rest of it like the meat or the skin. Not that it dosnt happen but there is more bennifit for the people then just the musk. If that is the case then I myslef dont have a problem with the musk and if there is an ethical problem then there are only 2 optons left, hunt my food myself so I can assure there has been no cruilty in its raising or become a vegan. IMHO
    Last edited by abubakr_al-misky; 25th February 2009 at 03:23 PM.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    As far as cruelty goes, I would become a vegetarian if I had to kill animals by myself in order to eat them. I admit that I am a hypocrite, because I buy meat and fish at the grocery store, and I wear leather. I should stop doing all of these things if I am sincere.

    On the other hand, every living creature on this planet must kill in order to live. Sometimes I wonder what kind of God would make a system where every life must take a life in order to live. Even the seeds of wheat die when we grind them for flour. The carrots die when they are yanked from the ground. And every apple core that we throw away could have been planted to make a tree.

    To me, the biggest problems I have with humans are these:

    Loss of habitat. We, as a species, keep filling the earth, driving the other species (plant and animal) out and taking up the resources for ourselves, polluting the Earth as we go.

    Poaching. What little space we have left for the wild animals, we cannot leave them alone to live in peace. People illegally hunt protected species for economic gain. Yet, if people live in comfort, they do not understand the desparation of those who are so poor that they use any means to survive.

    That is why a solution that encourages both protection of habitat and species, plus economic gain for indiginous people would be the best solution. But, like Lian says, it would be difficult, if not impossible, to implement.
    Last edited by purplebird7; 26th February 2009 at 02:50 AM.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    As the dominate species on earth I believe we have a resposibility to be balanced in our actions. Take a little and give a little not over stepping the boundries. Unfortunatlly it is the greediness that has unbalanced things thus species become endangerd. It is unfortunate.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    As the discussion has taken a turn to discuss the moral and ethical ramifications of animal products and food in general, below are some links that people may find enlightening.

    http://www.animalliberationfront.com...m/feelings.pdf

    http://www.meat.org/

    They are presented from one point of view but what happens behind the scenes can be an eyeopener for many.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    I coould get through half of that video before I started feeling disgusted. Thanks Mr. Baldwin If I knew the meat I bought came from that I would not eat it. I would assume those are more extream cases and not the normal practise. To me though, the fact that people can treat animals in this way does not make it unethical to eat meat just unethical to eat meat from those sources. And as far musk goes then there is no documentation that I know of that these types of practices are done on the musk deer.

  17. #17

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    I pulled this from an artical about the musk deer.

    MUSK DEER FARMING AND MANAGEMENT OF MUSK DEER IN ZOOS

    Musk deer farming

    Musk deer are difficult to manage and breed on farms because of their solitary habits, territorial behaviour
    and excitable nature (Green, 1989). Experience in managing and breeding the animals and in extracting
    musk from live animals has been gained in China, India and Russia.
    Since 1958, efforts have been made to expand musk deer farming in China (Zhang, 1983). Such farms are
    located in the areas of Ma Er Kang, Miyalo and Manchuan in the province of Sichuan, in the Zhenping
    area in Shaanxi province and near Foziling in Anhui province (IUCN, 1984 and Zhang, 1983). According
    to Green (1989), there are also musk deer farms in the provinces of Qinghai and Shanxi and in Quangxi
    Autonomous Region, but Sichuan produces about half of the country’s musk from farmed deer. In 1984,
    there were 21 communal farms and four State farms in the province of Sichuan which, together, held about
    1000 musk deer, while some 2000 animals in total were kept in farms in the entire country (Green, 1989).
    The economic viability of these farms has been insufficiently studied (Green, 1989). Musk deer require a
    high quality diet and the rations have to be rich in proteins and carbohydrates and low in fibre (Green,
    1987b). The difficulty and cost of maintaining the farms were probably high, and the quality of the musk
    from farmed animals did not match that from wild musk deer, perhaps because the male deer on the farms
    were kept in very small cages (Green and Taylor, 1986). When musk deer farms were first established in
    China, in the 1960s, the animal losses were high, reaching 60-70% of all wild-caught animals. The
    animals died from gastro-enteritis and poor husbandry. Young musk deer, which are easier to tame than
    the adult animals, are particularly prone to such infections if no preventative measures are taken.
    Pneumonia is another frequent cause of illness. Green (1989) reported that only 17 (53%) of 32 musk deer
    born in zoos worldwide from 1959 to 1980 survived but, during that period (specifically, 1959-73), the
    survival rate of young deer on farms in China was reported to have improved. Trials in China proved that
    Forest Musk Deer were easier to domesticate than Himalayan Musk Deer (Green, 1989). Some farms were
    exclusively for breeding, while in others the musk was removed from the deer. Green (1989) reported that
    the number of musk deer farms in China was still growing, as demand for musk continued to rise, but this
    may no longer be the case. A new report on musk deer farming in China is expected to be completed soon
    by TRAFFIC-East Asia, which will shed more light on the current activities of China’s musk deer farms.
    Since 1965, there have been attempts in India to domesticate musk deer for the purposes of musk
    extraction from live animals at Kufri in Himachal Pradesh, and at Kanchula Kharak and Meroli, in
    northern Uttar Pradesh (Bhadauria, 1990 and Green, 1989). These musk deer farms were under
    government control and reportedly do not operate very effectively (Sathyakumar et al., 1993).
    Russia has also planned a programme for captive musk deer management (Prikhod‘ko, 1997 and
    Prikhod‘ko and Ovsyanikov, 1998). The management and breeding of animals in the Altai and Sayan
    Mountains appears promising, because the cost of managing and feeding could be kept low: in the opinion
    of Prikhod‘ko (1997), 10 000-15 000 musk deer could be managed in captivity in Russia at comparatively
    low cost and small farms with 20-25 musk deer could be profitable.

    Capturing musk deer and extracting musk from live animals

    Experience with musk deer has shown that populations bred in captivity, as with captive collections of
    many animal species, regularly require replenishment with wild animals (Green and Taylor, 1986). At
    present, there are no efficient methods of capturing live musk deer. Kattel and Alldredge (1991) proposed
    large nets, six metres long by two metres wide, used by a team of 10-15 people. Using this method, 50%
    of catching attempts were successful. Once captured, the musk deer were sedated.
    Flerov (1952) and Zhang (1983) describe the extraction of musk from the live animal, using a spatula that
    is inserted into the musk sac via the external orifice while the animal is manually restrained (Flerov, 1952
    and Green, 1989). The procedure takes a few minutes, and the opening to the musk sac is afterwards
    treated with an antibiotic cream. The extracted musk is dried, weighed and sealed in an airtight container.
    Because of their susceptibility to stress, the extraction should initially be carried out under anaesthesia,
    until the animals are sufficiently tamed (Green, 1989).
    The collection of musk from wild musk deer could form a substantial contribution for the income of people
    in rural areas, and could at the same time encourage the protection of musk deer populations and their
    habitat (Green and Taylor, 1986). It is precisely in rural areas that earning cash is difficult and that the
    temptation for poaching and smuggling is significant (P. Fomenko, in litt., March 1998 and Jackson, 1979).
    Last edited by abubakr_al-misky; 26th February 2009 at 03:49 PM.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Quote Originally Posted by abubakr_al-misky View Post
    ...Experience with musk deer has shown that populations bred in captivity, as with captive collections of
    many animal species, regularly require replenishment with wild animals... The collection of musk from wild musk deer could form a substantial contribution for the income of people
    in rural areas, and could at the same time encourage the protection of musk deer populations and their
    habitat...
    There is a lot of truth in that.

    And Diverdown, mass production is to blame for many of the ethical problems of meat production. I buy free-range products whenever my budget will allow it, but they are two to four times more expensive. In the state where I live, Nebraska, farmers often are subject to pressure to conform to unethical practices.

    For instance, farmers must meet the demands of the meatpackers who are the sole buyers of their livestock. For example, the meatpacker can contract with the farmers to:
    1. Raise only one breed of pig, so that the meat is uniformly sized and colored, thus limiting the gene pool and increasing susceptibility to sickness.
    2. Feed the animal only a certain type of food in specified amounts, ensuring profits for a particular feed manufacturer.
    3. Confine the animals in an allotted amount of space to standardize caloric output and ensure a quick growth rate.
    4. Cull any animals that do not meet specifications so as not to "waste" resources on diminished returns.

    This certainly does not represent a free marketplace or American values. The cost of a farmer declaring his or her independence is limited access to the market. The best option for meat eaters is to purchase a chest freezer and buy a half or quarter side of beef or pork at a time, or a certain number of chickens, from an ethical farmer.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Agree purple.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    I have always tried to purchase free range and meat, chicken and fish and typically purchase a organic fed, free range pork, beef and chickens from a local farmer.

    I find the taste and quality to be vastly superior to the mass produced meat.

  21. #21

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    I believe I cannot be sure about the origins of real musk or castoreum or civet - as far as I know, they could even come from an animal that was killed for that. And even if it wasn't, nobody can assure me that the extraction process didn't hurt.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Sniffing around
    I'll stop wearing black when they make something darker

  22. #22

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Tis true. How would a person definitively trace the origin of musk? Or oud, sandalwood, rosewood, or other endangered species? I can only trust the seller, and he can only trust the supplier, who must be honest.
    For that matter, we can only know what we are eating if we put the money right into the farmer's hand.
    (And now, here's a promotion for slow foods: this summer, shop local farmer's markets for produce.)

    Here are two links to identify which fish to buy at the grocery:
    http://www.fishonline.org/advice/eat/
    http://www.edf.org/page.cfm?tagID=1521

    Sorry for seeming to go OT here, but I think this discussion about natural products and sustainability is still relelvant to our perfume-buying habits, and that it deserves to remain here, because it shows the concern and intelligence of the consumers on this forum.

    Many times I have wondered, "If I buy this natural perfume, will I help people in other countries who are growing fields of flowers?" It is one of the major factors in my decision. This is why I would like to see a label on my fragrance that states "X% natural ingredients" although I doubt it will ever happen. With the exception of some of the independent, all-natural perfumers, few of the big houses reveal this information. For example, L'Artisan Parfumeur now has the 100% natural Eau de Jatamansi, and Aveda has a line of natural fragrances. Jean Patou has claimed to use as many naturals as possible. And I tend to buy expensive parfum concentrates because I think the French companies put the best ingredients in them, rather than the EDP or EDT. Beachroses is pretty adept at sniffing out naturals in perfumes, and she has pointed out some companies that make use of them. Even I am beginning to identify them. Some Italian companies seem to use real ingredients, which I suspect when the particular notes come on smelling particularly fresh, foody or plantlike. For example: the orange smells strong and beautiful but goes away very quickly, or there is a delicious vanilla that stays awhile, but when it leaves, there is no trace of it. But without clear labeling, anyone can make misleading claims as to the content of their products or the ethicality of their sources.
    Last edited by purplebird7; 27th February 2009 at 01:40 PM.

  23. #23

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    I am resurrecting this thread because I have the privilege of sampling these natural oils which purplebird has already sampled and written her impressions. Though I have been 'concocting' essential oil blends for 12 years, I am yet inexperienced (or should I say unrefined) with 'sniffing out' various notes and analyzing a fragrance from application to drydown. Nevertheless, I have begun to sample these naturals and will begin posting this evening. I will sample them in the same order as purplebird. I will be writing my impressions for (only) 2-3 per day as my inexperienced olfactories will become overwhelmed and confused with too many at once. Also, I would like to get impressions from my family and reactions from my cats, dog, horses, and even chickens (especially our mean ole rooster). Thanks for LQQKING. Talk to you soon ;-D
    "Ointment and perfume rejoice the heart: so doth the sweetness of a man's friend by hearty counsel."

  24. #24

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Looking forward to hearing your impressions, analavande, and thanks to purplebird for sharing hers.

    I find whether to eat or use animals and if so, how, is a very difficult area, and I'm still grappling with where to draw the line (I constantly find myself in a state of cognitive dissonance).

    On a lighter note, Purplebird, your cat has much better taste than mine. My guy will often lick my arm when I'm wearing fragrances that presumably contain a lot of synthetic ingredients. I thought that spoke to the quality of the fragrances and my excellent taste, until I caught him licking a photograph. Clearly he's a bit twisted!
    For sale: JL Scherrer parfum (reduced price) and more!

    "One half of the world cannot understand the pleasures of the other." ~ Jane Austen

    “Pleasure is the flower that passes; remembrance, the lasting perfume” ~ Jean de Boufflers

  25. #25

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Hello Everyone! I apologize that I am one day later than I intended with sharing my impressions of the first 2 of 9 natural essences. They are, indeed, very complex and change as the day wears on.

    First Two OUDS

    1-Cambodian, Classic: Opens sharp, green, camphoraceous, animalic and somewhat like fresh sawn pine.
    Starts to settle into a little bit sweeter dry hay and straw mingled with pine sawdust.
    Finally settles into mildly resinous dry hay and sawdust.
    I thought I detected sweetness but after showering and re-sampling I was unable to detect it again. I think this oud would be wonderful with citrus, green notes, and spice.

    2-Cambodian, Junnid: This oud opens pungent with hints of wet coffee grinds and wet tobacco. I thought I smelled cocoa!
    Early in the drydown, without losing the wet tobacco and coffee , it additionally takes on the wonderful smell of moist rich perfectly composted soil. Soil that has been mixed with compost made primarily of dead leaves and grass shavings.
    Later in the drydown I detect what I perceive as charred or burnt wood. Wood that has been overheated by the friction of a blade as well as wood that has been slightly charred in a fire. There is also a sweetness that reminds me of both patchouli (though no nearly as sweet) and myrrh (same smokiness but sweeter). This oud I would love to have in my collection of natural oils. Mmmmmmmmmmm!

    Thanks for looking. I can't wait to try the next ones. I think I will try to do 4 after church tomorrow. :-)
    Last edited by analavande; 13th March 2009 at 02:57 AM. Reason: corrections
    "Ointment and perfume rejoice the heart: so doth the sweetness of a man's friend by hearty counsel."

  26. #26

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    I find the fecal/barnyardy ouds like Cambodian/Lao/Indian hard to like and almost too savage to wear in public (no offence meant to those who appreciate them), but the sweet/flora/woody Indonesian ouds on the other hand smell like Nirvana to me... I hardly ever wear traditional Western colognes now that I've discovered the ouds from Borneo/Malaysia/Kalimantan. Good quality oils from these areas are increadibly uplifting and evocative. There are also amazing ouds from other places too, the Oriscent's Royal Kinam from Hong Kong for example is beatuful and unlike any other Indo-Chinese oils I've tried.

    Ouds are precious fragrances in every sense of the word and once you start appreciating them, traditional perfumes often smell synthetic, harsh or artificial in comparison.

  27. #27

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Quote Originally Posted by Igor01 View Post
    I find the fecal/barnyardy ouds like Cambodian/Lao/Indian hard to like and almost too savage to wear in public (no offence meant to those who appreciate them), but the sweet/flora/woody Indonesian ouds on the other hand smell like Nirvana to me... I hardly ever wear traditional Western colognes now that I've discovered the ouds from Borneo/Malaysia/Kalimantan. Good quality oils from these areas are increadibly uplifting and evocative. There are also amazing ouds from other places too, the Oriscent's Royal Kinam from Hong Kong for example is beatuful and unlike any other Indo-Chinese oils I've tried.

    Ouds are precious fragrances in every sense of the word and once you start appreciating them, traditional perfumes often smell synthetic, harsh or artificial in comparison.
    Igor01, Thanks for your input. I would love to, someday, sample some of the Borneo/Malaysia/Kalimantan oils that you mention. They sound wonderful.

    Hello again Everyone,

    I know that my kids would concur with Igor01 about the Indian. They didn't sample the Cambodians but, when I asked their impressions of the Vietnamese and Indian, Their responses were as follows:
    Vietnamese - horse dung,
    Vietnamese, wild - cow dung,
    Indian (aged 10 yrs) - some weed near a pile of dung--they obviously find them very fecal. Please forgive them as they are the primary caretakers of our horses and thus horses are their frame of reference right now.

    And now bear with me as I share my immature impressions as my points of reference are not yet as broad as most of yours nevertheless, through this project I am learning:

    3-Vietnamese (regular) - Initially sharp, cedar, musky, fecal and slightly camphoraceous.
    After a few minutes much more muted and slightly sweet though still fecal.
    I want to say that I detect a little peach but it is 'too little' to really define.
    Upon waking (I wore them to bed) there was a sweet warm hay-like ghost of a fragrance that lingered.

    4-Vietnamese (wild) Very nice evergreen opening. Fragrant like fresh cut juniper or spruce.
    It reminded me of a Christmas tree and a smoldering fire...somewhat alluring. There is also some sweetness. I am reminded a little of patchouli or a slightly sweet woody incense. This one always burns my nasal cavities like inhaling loose tobacco too deeply but, I like it!
    Upon waking, this one was still smoldering...very smoky on my skin.

    5-Indian (aged 10 years) - Anise? Minty? Does anyone else get that? Wow, a nice unexpected sweet fruitiness. Still a little indolic but, also fruity like a wonderful pipe tobacco. I am surprised every time I take another sniff. It is almost gourmand (caramel and peppery). It is also somewhat animalic. I like it a lot!
    Upon waking, I could still detect a sweet woodsy fragrance.

    Speaking of animalics, I will be wearing the musks tomorrow so, I will try to post by Wednesday with regard to these. I love animalics so I am very excited about these.

    Thanks again for LQQKING
    Last edited by analavande; 13th March 2009 at 02:58 AM. Reason: corrections and addtions from written notes
    "Ointment and perfume rejoice the heart: so doth the sweetness of a man's friend by hearty counsel."

  28. #28

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    analavande, I am impressed. Your descriptions put mine to shame.
    Please, next time, don't be so modest. A little well-deserved recognition is in order.
    And I especially respect the way you are already mentally blending them with other ingredients.

    I laughed about the kid's descriptions - dung, dung, and more dung.
    And I agreed strongly with the following statement that you made:

    Quote Originally Posted by analavande View Post
    ...Wood that has been overheated by the friction of a blade as well as wood that has been slightly charred in a fire.
    As far as my favorite goes, I don'tt know why, but my novice nose liked the Wild Vietnamese the best.

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackCat View Post
    ...your cat has much better taste than mine. ... I caught him licking a photograph.
    That beats all. Have you seen the videos that Quarry linked us to? The dogs that apply perfume to themselves by rolling on the paper samples in magazines? Very cool.

    Igor you must speak to abubakr_al-miksy. He knows his ouds like you do.

  29. #29

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Quote Originally Posted by purplebird7 View Post
    Igor you must speak to abubakr_al-miksy. He knows his ouds like you do.
    Thanks purplebird, I already had a chance to meet Simon and I won't even pretend to have anything remotely close to his expertise

  30. #30

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Quote Originally Posted by purplebird7 View Post
    analavande, I am impressed. Your descriptions put mine to shame.
    Please, next time, don't be so modest. A little well-deserved recognition is in order.
    And I especially respect the way you are already mentally blending them with other ingredients.

    I laughed about the kid's descriptions - dung, dung, and more dung.
    And I agreed strongly with the following statement that you made:

    As far as my favorite goes, I don'tt know why, but my novice nose liked the Wild Vietnamese the best.
    Thanks for your vote of confidence purplebird. I always appreciate your input and your impressions here at BN. I am thoroughly enjoying the oils and I am probably taking a bit more time with them. I ,too, like the Vietnamese Wild...very nice!

    I can't wait until tomorrow when I sample the animalics!
    Last edited by analavande; 10th March 2009 at 04:14 AM. Reason: add comment
    "Ointment and perfume rejoice the heart: so doth the sweetness of a man's friend by hearty counsel."

  31. #31

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    I look forward to reading about your responses, too.
    Kumquat didn't like the real musk, but, then, she doesn't like some of the synthetic musks, either, and I usually do.
    Last edited by purplebird7; 10th March 2009 at 03:24 PM.

  32. #32

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    OH!..............................MY!.............. ................GRACIOUS!!!

    Hello Everyone,

    I hope you have had a pleasant day. I was going to wait until tomorrow to post the remaining four natural essences but, for this one I cannot wait...

    For in this present moment in my study, with the windows open, and with a moderate but persistent rain falling; my yard is not the only thing flooding. In addition to the negative ions that are flooding and enhancing the air in this room, an amazing essence is flooding my olfactories that makes me almost swoon.
    In fact, someone help me up because I have fallen---in love with this one.
    Initially, it took my breath because of the immediate linear beauty. Then I began to detect what 'I perceive' as the components of this sweet exquisitely blended natural essence.

    6-This is 'My' impression of the perfume composition called Dehn Misk Maliki Supreme (Oil of Kings Musk Supreme): ---So accurately named.

    The queen of the botanical kingdom---rose, don't ask me which one or what form. I don't know...the intoxicating one.
    Then perhaps sweet elegant--- jasmine, just enough to be 'ever so slightly'... mmmmm...indoling?
    Or soft romantic---honeysuckle, a sweetness that is addicting and of which I never tire.
    Perfectly blended incense---sandalwood, white frankincense, and I know not what...but there is a perfect balance of floral and incense. I use to like incense, now I love it.
    Lightly applied spices...
    Sweet smooth vanilla or perhaps white amber.
    And last but, surely, not least (in my preference) there is the animalic. I found it to be very alluring for me, not unlike fragrances that contain civet, though it has to be a musk.
    I deem there are other components which my nose cannot extract.
    The drydown is sweet lightly flowery, incense-y, vanilla-y, musky, very light, and very beautiful. I deem that the use of a white floral, a lighter musk and maybe white frankincense makes the drydown soooooo nice. I think that this one has opened up yet another way for me to get into trouble with my budget. I'd love to know it's compostion. I want it!

    BTW, The kids concurred that it smelled like creamy dirt with slightly pleasant herbs. This is an improvement...yes?
    Kids! I'm TRYING to teach them...LOL!
    Thanks again for looking.
    Last edited by analavande; 12th March 2009 at 08:28 PM. Reason: correction
    "Ointment and perfume rejoice the heart: so doth the sweetness of a man's friend by hearty counsel."

  33. #33

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Because abubakr_al-misky is such a modest guy he's not going to say that he sells ouds, mukhallats and attars. He's an extremely honest guy and his prices are exceptionally reasonable. His evilbay shop is riversofmusk. I believe he has a website in the works which is going to feature new stock he's getting in.
    I'm not affiliated in any way. I've purchased from him in the past and have always been satisfied with the products and excellent communication.
    Enjoy!
    Last edited by bluemoon; 11th March 2009 at 07:56 PM.

  34. #34

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Quote Originally Posted by bluemoon View Post
    Because abubakr_al-misky is such a modest guy he's not going to say that he sells ouds, mukhallats and attars. He's an extremely honest guy and his prices are exceptionally reasonable. His evilbay shop is riversofmusk. I believe he has a website in the works which is going to feature new stock he's getting in.
    I'm not affiliated in any way. I've purchased from him in the past and have always been satisfied with the products and excellent communication.
    Enjoy!
    Thank you for the 'heads up' bluemoon. I have found the ebay shop and bookmarked it.
    "Ointment and perfume rejoice the heart: so doth the sweetness of a man's friend by hearty counsel."

  35. #35

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Hello everyone,

    I hope your day has been pleasant. As I promised, here are my impressions for the last 3 of the 9 natural essences from abubakr al-misky. It has been an immense pleasure to participate in this project.

    And now my impressions of the oils:


    7- Ambergris (white) I love Orientals so this one was an automatic yes. I think I may have diluted my sample a little too much but what I did get was at first was light, warm, sweet, slightly animalic vanilla. Then came a tiny bit of sourness like white distilled vinegar which has been further diluted. And finally there was a note with which I was not yet very familiar... as I began to ponder the source of this essence I was reminded of the authentic smell of a breeze blowing off of the ocean…it was salt, of course, and I loved it.

    8- Musk (red) Initially, in your face animalic, green, and dry. The animalic quality was strong but not unpleasant and I likened it to the smell of the skin of our horses which is animalic but also has a little sweetness due to alfalfa, hay, grasses, and commercial 10% sweet feed. Once the dry-down began there was an aromatic herbal edge. I am unable to pinpoint it but it was a pleasant smell not too dissimilar from herbs we would use everyday in the kitchen so it was probably indicative of the vegetation consumed by this species. This herbal note was slightly sharp but fleeting. When ever I sniffed long enough to try and identify it…it would elude me. This elusive aromatic note made this musk very appealing to me, probably because I work with essential oils and I am accustomed to intense natural aromas. This one was my favorite of the two musks.

    9- Musk (white) This musk was softer and sweeter than the Red Musk but more indolic than sweet. This, however, did not lessen its appeal for me. It was very enticing like a stinky sweet white flower and I kept sniffing it. Now understand me, I would not want to smell like this alone, but the smell was not offensive at all. It was very nice. I now have a much better understanding and knowledge of what to expect when a fragrance lists white musk in its notes. I did like and and I much prefer the animalic note in this than that indolic note that is found in fresh daisies...daisies STINK.

    Thank you all for looking, and a BIG THANKS to purplebird for passing the oils to me.
    Last edited by analavande; 12th March 2009 at 08:24 PM. Reason: general editing for additional comments and clarification
    "Ointment and perfume rejoice the heart: so doth the sweetness of a man's friend by hearty counsel."

  36. #36

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Very nice reviews and thoughts. I love to hear others opinions. The hard part ofr me is putting the emotions attached with the scent into words. Very difficult indeed. One thought here, I used to use the term "fecal" for any barnyardy note but since i have some Oud here that literally smell like what comes out the wrong of a dog I have prefered to use the term 'animalic' or something of that nature. Like the Red and White Musk, to me they smell like if one would rub the fresh fur of the musk deer rather then smelling like its dung. Any thoughts?

  37. #37

    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Quote Originally Posted by abubakr_al-misky View Post
    Very nice reviews and thoughts. I love to hear others opinions. The hard part ofr me is putting the emotions attached with the scent into words. Very difficult indeed. One thought here, I used to use the term "fecal" for any barnyardy note but since i have some Oud here that literally smell like what comes out the wrong of a dog I have prefered to use the term 'animalic' or something of that nature. Like the Red and White Musk, to me they smell like if one would rub the fresh fur of the musk deer rather then smelling like its dung. Any thoughts?
    Yes, you are right. I guess we (I) initially come from our level of experience-- mine being elementary. I have grown a great deal from this experience and henceforth I will use something other than...well, let me begin now by saying, I will use animalic, indolic, or some other term. Your insight and knowledge is appreciated.
    Last edited by analavande; 11th March 2009 at 10:12 PM.
    "Ointment and perfume rejoice the heart: so doth the sweetness of a man's friend by hearty counsel."

  38. #38
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    Default Re: Real Oud, Real Musk, Real Ambergris -- What Amazing Aromas

    Quote Originally Posted by Lian View Post
    Even though the animalics sounds fantastic, I wouldnīt use them even if the animals are kept for this purpose solely. Ever seen the bearfarms where bears are kept and have a tap inside them(stomach I think it was) to get gal or some other internal juice out, not pretty

    Canīt be worth it in my eyes
    This.

    Dans La Nuit Vers Le Jour Sans Adieu Je Reviens Vers Toi.


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