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  1. #1

    Default The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Here is a collection of quotes accumulated from other threads regarding any and all experiences with regards to MPG formualtions. I have listed the quotes by scent. There may be some overlap and repetition of quotes when they apply to more than one scent - I tried not to take things out of context and so have included all or most of the original quote.

    Regarding the long thread title, I apologize, I am just trying to make it easier to find when searching by title.

    Santal Noble
    Mudassir: I can confirm Santal Noble, Route de Vetiver and Ambre Precieux to have been reformulated. Not sure about others. They are almost similar- but one could easily tell a difference smelling them side by side. Ambre Precieux is probably the one that has lost the most "oomph" in the newer version.

    Azsmells: Sadly my favorite Santal Noble has been reformulated. I have a small amount left of the old and compared it to my new bottle and they are really different in the top notes especially. Much weaker and that coffee note is missing and I smell more of a chocolate note. Some websites still have the old 90 ml bottles listed but I ordered from one of them and they sent me the new 100 ml bottles. I wish I could find old bottles of Santal Noble and Amber Precieux. Anyone know where I can find them?

    NSamadi: I have Santal Noble in the newer style bottle and can say, it's the same as the old stuff. I'm guessing they didn't reformulate it right after the bottle style change.
    I'll take that back. After spending some more time with my new bottle. Yup, there's a difference. It's not as intense smelling either.

    Buzzlepuff: Santal Noble is the biggest disappointment to me. The new version is definitely changed and does not have the coffee note at the outset. If its there, I can not smell it. It is a very nice gentle sandalwood fragrance with a noticeable cedar note, but it has lost all the darkness and character of the older version. It is still a very good sandalwood fragrance but it is very different from the old one.

    So the new formulas have changed for all of these MPG's. The Eau d' Iles and Parfum d' Habit have not changed much - just subtle differences. The Ambre Preciuex and Santal Noble are much lighter and therefore have lost some character. Santal Noble seems to have lost the coffee note altogether and is a nice sandalwood, but a completely different fragrance with much less darkness. The old sample decants will show a very different fragrance than what comes in the bottles now of Santal Noble.

    AromiErotici: I know Santal Noble's reformulation isn't quite as good as the original since I have it and bought it solely on my sampling the original. The coffee replaced with fig and the sandalwood not as deep.

    SculptureOfSoul: The coffee note and some of the dryness (which I suppose could be interpreted as stuffiness) has been removed from the new formulation of Santal Noble. It's sweeter, too.. it shares that same sweet note that Bois de Turquie has but it is toned way down in SN.

    While I respect the older formulation and think it's more interesting and smells of higher quality, I like the newer version better in this case but it seems just a bit too similar to BdT now (they still smell different but whereas in the past every MPG seemed to have its own identity, now it seems many share a lot of DNA).

    Schachman: Sorry to report, that I have now confirmed (at least to my nose) that MPG is doing something to their formulas. I compared Route du Vetiver, Santal Noble and Iris Bleu Gris - each both new and old, and there are differences. I can't say that they are worse (yet), but they do seem different. Or is my nose (and brain) just fooling me? I tried it blind, and I could always pick out the new batches - even after several repeats.

    Buzzlepuff: The biggest changes seem to be in Santal Noble and Route du Vetiver. Santal Noble has lost most of the coffee note at the opening and is lighter and cut with a bit of cedar - but still probably one of the best sandalwood fragrances there is. Ambre Precieux seems to be lighter with less strong myrtle or green notes up front and more subtle, but still the mostly the same scent and very nicely done.

    Azsmells: The top bottle is the old 90 ml bottle, the bottom one is the new 100 ml bottle. I owned the 90 ml and now the 100 ml and I really smell a difference in the two. The deep coffee note is much less in the newer formulation and the sandalwood isn't as nice. Some people swear they don't smell a difference. The new stuff is still a great fragrance.

    Mudassir: Azsmells is right. Although I must admit, I smelled the difference (especially in the top notes) because I was trying really hard to find differences. Another thing to note is that they might display the older picture while having the newer ones in stock (happened to me with 3 websites and I had to return them).

    Ruggles: The newer version, to my nose, has a different quality of sandalwood and is more or less, a lighter sent.

    AromiErotici: Went back to look at the website showing the newer bottles and the listed accords are different also. The newer bottle is listing fig tree leaves,ivy greens and cedarwood. The older accord lists sandalwood,precious woods, vetiver and coffee. I'm not quite sure I want the reformulation.

    Delmar: From what I've read about SN, including what Luca Turin has written about it, it is my impression that the sandalwood used is not of the Mysore variety. I don't think we're looking at a dramatic difference between the two formulations (such as Mysore sandalwood in the earlier version vs another variety in the later one).

    Delmar: I just did a blind test. I have a couple samples of SN from about two years back - one from Les Senteurs (UK) and the other from Lucky Scent (California). The Lucky Scent sample and the Les Senteurs one are virtually identical. But I can easily notice a difference in the Beauty Encounter version - enough for me to consider it a different (albiet related) scent to the "older" SN version. The funny thing is that I can't quite make up my mind if I like the newer or the older version better. The sandalwood in the newer BE version, although there, is less pronounced (noticeably more in the background by comparison) and there is light floral dimension (not particularly in a feminine sense) with something slightly animalic about it - a dimension that actually appeals to me. (Could that be the "fig" you're referring to?) The "older" samples are dustier and dryer and the woody "sandalwood" dimension seems more pronounced in the forfront with a kind of "nuttyness" about it - to my nose. So I guess this sort of contradicts what I said above

    AromiErotici: I've recently received the reformulation and it's good. A bit different than the original and IMHO, the original is better, but not by much. I feel like I'm splitting hairs and can understand some thinking the newer version is better.

    All in all, a great scent regardless of the bottle.

    Teflondog: The new reformulation is a nice woody scent, but there's more than just sandalwood in it. Like others have said, there's a cedar note that gives it a rougher edge. It's also not as heavy as the original.

    The old formulation smells more edible IMO. The sandalwood and the coffee notes have a "doughy" quality that makes the scent more of a gourmand.

    SculptureOfSoul: Finally wearing them both side by side. Definitely a difference in the top notes. The differences are less noticeable after about 5-10 mins but the new one seems everso slightly 'fresher' and more vibrant and alive. I've only had them on about 15 mins but I'm liking the new one better tbh. It's not quite as deep/dark, but actually seems richer, in a sense.

    Dullah: Sent back a newer bottle. It's not a gigantic difference for me, maybe it is for other scents. That said, I've smelled the argyle Santal Noble, and the newer Santal Noble, and the new one had more of a certain note I associate with "old woman" that is both powdery and has a velvety olfactory texture that reminds of dark purple velvet. The old one had more beige/brown/vanilla in it's powdery notes. IDK how to explain it. All the other notes are intact to my nose.



    Ambre Precieux
    Mudassir: I can confirm Santal Noble, Route de Vetiver and Ambre Precieux to have been reformulated. Not sure about others. They are almost similar- but one could easily tell a difference smelling them side by side. Ambre Precieux is probably the one that has lost the most "oomph" in the newer version.

    Buzzlepuff: Ambre Precieux is different from the older version in that it is lighter and not nearly as potent. Other than strength of formula it appears very similar to me. A problem with the lighter version is that the effect of the myrtle and its interaction with the amber elements changes in the lighter formula. The net result is ambre precieux becomes more a generic nice gentle amber formula. The cold/warm contrast of the myrtle and amber is gone from the new one because at the lighter concentration, the myrtle is much less noticeable.

    So the new formulas have changed for all of these MPG's. The Eau d' Iles and Parfum d' Habit have not changed much - just subtle differences. The Ambre Preciuex and Santal Noble are much lighter and therefore have lost some character. Santal Noble seems to have lost the coffee note altogether and is a nice sandalwood, but a completely different fragrance with much less darkness. The old sample decants will show a very different fragrance than what comes in the bottles now of Santal Noble.

    BuzzlePuff: The biggest changes seem to be in Santal Noble and Route du Vetiver. Santal Noble has lost most of the coffee note at the opening and is lighter and cut with a bit of cedar - but still probably one of the best sandalwood fragrances there is. Ambre Precieux seems to be lighter with less strong myrtle or green notes up front and more subtle, but still the mostly the same scent and very nicely done.



    Route Du Vetiver
    Mudassir: I can confirm Santal Noble, Route de Vetiver and Ambre Precieux to have been reformulated. Not sure about others. They are almost similar- but one could easily tell a difference smelling them side by side. Ambre Precieux is probably the one that has lost the most "oomph" in the newer version.

    Strollyourlobster: I'd say that RdV is less big and dirty, a significant loss. Still a beautiful frag but no longer the sharp, earthy experience it was.

    cpk: The only MPG I have experience with the old and new version is Route du Vetiver but the reformulation is so radical that I think MPG should be sewed for using the same name in so opposite developing scents. The old formulation is a top and mid of roots being pulled off wet earth and a drydown of cool vetiver. The new has lost the earth component and replaced it with jasmin!


    jlros: As a person dedicated to RdV I am very sad to say they have changed the formula. It is so different that it hardly should don the same name. I am not sure if this was a cost cutting issue of otherwise but if you are dedicated to this scent quickly go to your local retailer and buy the old formulation if you will be sad without it. If you have never purchased it but want to I would hurry.


    jlros: I went to Aedes to buy a bottle and they said it seemed more watery. I smelled it on a card and didn't want to spray it on as it smelled wrong. They sprayed it on and WHOA it was a totally different juice. Less earthy, less dark, more transparent and bright. It was just totally different.

    Having not sprayed it on my skin I did not have enough of a real impression to distill the notes in my mind.


    kdo: [when you read the rest of his quotes you'll see he is talking about the new formula here]Just tried a sample of RdV (from lessenteurs), and I actually did like it, although it was not exactly what I expected after reading all the reviews.
    I expected something raw earthy, powerful, in-your-face. Instead it was "tame", very rounded, and pleasant. Not warm though, rather cold. Thankfully, vetiver was without its medicinal edge.
    Also it was not very strong, and didn't last very long on me.

    Do you think it is the new formula that I tried?

    kdo: [regarding the new formula] Alright, received a sample of RdV from theperfumedcourt today.

    Well, maybe it is all my imagination, but I think it was different this time.
    I still wouldn't call it "in your face". Perhaps I expected too much from it. Here it is:

    Now it started with a raw pungent burst, very brief just for a few seconds.
    Then for a while it was distinctly vetiverish. For a moment I even thought: "Hey, where is it going? acrid medicinal?" But soon it was diffused and subdued in the enveloping earthiness. I'd even say some kind of "oily earthiness". It doesn't smell of the "earth" to me, but I can see how it could be called "earthy" in a broader sense.
    At the same time, it still remained quite Strong and Rough. Cold and green.

    Placebo effect? Power of expectation? I don't know.

    Just sent the emails both to theperfumedcourt and lessenteurs and asked where did the samples come from. We'll see how it plays out.


    P.S. By the way, I think MH Vetiver Bourbon still wins over RdV in the "raw earth" department.

    kdo: Well, well, well....

    Have received lightning fast replies both from theperfumedcourt and from lessenteurs, and... what do you know!...The theperfumedcourt sample was the original - from the old 90ml bottle, and lessenteurs sample was new formula - from the new 100ml bottle.

    Precisely what I suspected.

    Curiously enough, the guy from lessenteurs (in reply to my suggestion that the new RdV might be somewhat different) said he also noticed that the juice from the new bottles was, I quote, " RATHER DIFFERENT..! "

    Oh, and it is comforting to know it was not just my imagination.
    The new RdV is not the same as the original.

    Schachman: Sorry to report, that I have now confirmed (at least to my nose) that MPG is doing something to their formulas. I compared Route du Vetiver, Santal Noble and Iris Bleu Gris - each both new and old, and there are differences. I can't say that they are worse (yet), but they do seem different. Or is my nose (and brain) just fooling me? I tried it blind, and I could always pick out the new batches - even after several repeats.



    Parfum d'Habit
    Strollyourlobster: Parfum d'Habit, on the other hand, has escaped with minimal change, and arguably is even improved.See Mudassir's descriptions of the differences here (http://community.basenotes.net/showt...rfum+d%27habit). I had a bottle of the old stuff and I'd say I'm enjoying the new stuff at least as much. I think Mudassir is right to say that they've added a touch more dry amber and sandalwood. This version is more opaque, meant here as a term of approbation, as in the opposite of transparent. The old one had a touch of Ellena's sheer sensibility, and I loved the frag but thought the lightness in the basenotes was a little misplaced. Anyway, very subtle differences.

    Mudassir: I just applied both of them. I can tell right away the opening of older one is more herbal than the 100ml bottle. How the rest plays out, I don't know yet. Watered down it might not be though, as the 100ml bottle one is still pretty strong.

    Mudassir: I am one of those who found Santal Noble to be a bit different. Parfum d'Habit would smell different to more people, in my opinion. Both stay pretty linear throughtout, although the herbal character of older bottle tones down after a while. The verdict? Locate an older bottle if you like Parfum d'Habit for its herbalness and dirtiness.Go with the newer bottle if you like it because of its "dark" character (new bottle has more pronounced amber/sandal). I fall in the later camp, and am happier to have the 100ml bottle.

    Buzzlepuff: I am smelling the new 100 ml. Parfum d'Habit on my arm - I spritzed a single spray 30 hours ago. It is still going strong. I have only smelled the old bottle from samples I had last year and the new is definitely not less strong! This stuff is way powerful, long lasting and slightly offensive at first. I believe that any regular wearer of PdH would soon start to naturally exude this scent from the skin as a native scent - it is that penetrating an odor. But it is strangely appealing. A warning here for anyone thinking of blind buying this one - don't do it! Its a real mountain man scent.

    Parfum d' Habit has not lost any of its dark leathery character and it is unique with the same "old wool blanket" odor that it used to have which is an acquired taste for sure. The combination of black currant, petitgrain, patchouli, and leather gives it a dirtiness and darkness that reminds me of other arabian leathers such as Aoud Cuir Arabie and also Oriscent Oud Royale. But this is much stronger a scent and has a pine wood feel to it (from the petitgrain?). Dark woods mixed with raw leather and old wool. I would not be surprised if the new formula has agarwood oil in it. Parfum d' Habit is a very strong fragrance that is full of character. A rough and natural character for sure. It may or might not be better than the old one but it definitely is not weaker.

    Strollyourlobster: So, to continue the fascinating saga. The company I ordered the old formula from was out of stock, so I ordered the new formula and love it. Mudassir's description of the differences seems quite accurate to me, as well, but the differences are subtle. The new formula does have a bit less herbal dirtiness in the opening but by drydown I really can't tell the difference. Maybe a touch more sandalwood? Any rate, I'm enjoying my new bottle very much. Many thanks to Mudassir for answering my questions so patiently.



    Eau d'Iles
    Buzzlepuff: I love Eau d' Iles and the new version of Eau d' Iles is the same as the old one as far as I can tell. I highly recomend it. I also had bottles of the new formulation of Santal Noble, Ambre Precieux, and Parfum d' Habit. My older formula experience comes from samples and decants of the older forumulas. Parfum d' Habit didn't seem to be much different to me, although I am sure the subtle changes mentioned by Mudassair are there - I was not able to discern these subtleties having limited experience with the older one.

    So the new formulas have changed for all of these MPG's. The Eau d' Iles and Parfum d' Habit have not changed much - just subtle differences. The Ambre Preciuex and Santal Noble are much lighter and therefore have lost some character. Santal Noble seems to have lost the coffee note altogether and is a nice sandalwood, but a completely different fragrance with much less darkness. The old sample decants will show a very different fragrance than what comes in the bottles now of Santal Noble.



    Jardin du Nil
    Ruggles: Most people would be happy that the bizzaro foot fungus/parmesan cheese top note was no longer part of Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier's Jardin du Nil experience. But for me, it's part of the trip down the Nile. No 30 seconds of rank odor, no River Nile cruise!



    Fraicheur Muskissime
    Ruggles: My new Fraicheur Muskissime has been f*cked with too - much lighter and it was light to start with!
    Any other MPG reformulation stories out there? Interesting that you mention the musk base. What I'm finding with MPG is that many of them share the same fruity musk base. JdN and FM basically dry-down to the same fruity base.
    The original FM had a much more complex opening, that lasted longer. The mix of grapefruit with the berry note was very subtle and rich. Now it seems like lemon fresh over a berry musk - end of story. It lost some of its depth - and that is tough when you're starting with a fresh citrus.
    Don't get me wrong, I still like the fragrances. They're just less complex than they used to be.
    I smell a budget cut and an attempt at making them easier to accept right out of the bottle.
    Please leave the top notes alone, they last 30 seconds and provide that fantastic rush I've become so addicted to!



    Iris Bleu Gris
    Schachman: Hi Mike,
    Yep - there seems to be a difference between old and new... with several of the MPG frags:
    http://community.basenotes.net/showt...is#post1194477

    The newer version of IBG seems to go sour on my skin compared to the original..., though the top notes and middle seem about the same.

    Schachman: For me, the dry-down on the new version went a little off on me, so while I still like it, I preferred the original. I can't say there is a huge difference, but perhaps they changed one product and that made a difference. I have to admit, I wore it rarely... though I kept the bottle, and will revisit it a little later.

    Schachman: Sorry to report, that I have now confirmed (at least to my nose) that MPG is doing something to their formulas. I compared Route du Vetiver, Santal Noble and Iris Bleu Gris - each both new and old, and there are differences. I can't say that they are worse (yet), but they do seem different. Or is my nose (and brain) just fooling me? I tried it blind, and I could always pick out the new batches - even after several repeats.
    Last edited by SculptureOfSoul; 11th June 2009 at 05:58 AM.
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  2. #2

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Thanks for pulling it all together, SculptureofSoul!

    I think I got lucky with Santal - came in the old bottle - and also Eau d'Iles (altho I had to completely remove the cap and decant as it just DID NOT SPRAY). I also ordered Garrigue and haven't spent time with it yet but initial impressions are good in a GIT sort of way - this one, on the other hand, was very keen to come out of the bottle - just look at it sideways and it's all over the place - they need to fix the mechanisms.

  3. #3

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    I own new and old bottles of Santal Noble and Ambre Précieux.

    The new Santal Noble, without making a side by side comparison, smells like Santal Noble, but the shock and horror occurs when smelling them side by side! What a difference! All the great topnotes are removed in the new version! 80% of the depth and strenght are simply gone. The longer in the drydown, the more they come together, but the new one stays a diluted version of the old one. If I had the chance to test them side by side before buying a new bottle, I think I would have resisted and kept looking for an old bottle, but here the next problem: Often the picture and the ml size varies when looking online for the old version. For example they show the old pic and list 100ml or the other way round. And there's no guarantee you get the old version, if the old pic and 90ml is stated. One would have to directly get in contact and ask about the bottle precisely.

    With Ambre Précieux I'm quite happy. The new one smells stronger, more ambery and balanced and overall fantastic. The green aspects are more or less gone in the new version.
    Last edited by dr.creed; 11th June 2009 at 09:36 AM.
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  4. #4

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    How does a Basenoters vs MPG law suit sound lile to you? lol

  5. #5

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Excellent compilation!

    It would be interesting to get this to MPG and have them comment. (No, I won't be doing that.)

  6. #6

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Thanks SoS for your concise anthology. Now, let's hope we get some validation from MpG. They should be required to put a warning on their new boxes: Buyer be Aware: Top Notes Have Been Seriously Compromised.
    Last edited by Kevin Guyer; 11th June 2009 at 02:57 PM.

  7. #7

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Another observation about Santal Noble. The older juice is amber in color, compared to the new version, which is close to clear.

  8. #8

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    I doff my cap to you, sir! Fantastic effort.

    I recently bought Ambre Precieux and received, as I expected, the new bottle. I'd never smelt it before, but bought it blind because of its rave reviews and because of my current amber fetish!

    I was expecting something deeper and richer, so I was just a little disappointed. Maybe it's the reformulation. Despite that, I still thinks it's magnificent.

  9. #9

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    I have a new bottle of Parfum d'Habit and I also have sampled the old juice. The new one appears to be slightly less herbal in the opening, however to my nose after that they're very similar. I love the old juice and I love the new juice just the same...

  10. #10

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Quote Originally Posted by cpk View Post
    How does a Basenoters vs MPG law suit sound lile to you? lol


    Not a bad idea. I understand that for financial reasons he may have needed to adjust the old formulas - if they were too challenging for many BNers I can only imagine it was quite rare that the regular public would fall for them - but he should have released the new ones as a fraiche version or with new names or something. Or at least make the old ones available by request.

    Heck, even if it was a price issue I'm sure the fans of the old scents would be willing to pay a bit more as there was just nothing else like many of them. I mean vintage Route du Vetiver, for instance, is worth every penny of $150 or even $200 for a 100ml bottle when you compare it to a lot of the niche garbage out there selling for just as much or more.
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  11. #11

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Looking for more comments on the new RdV.

    Is the berry aspect more promiment now since the jasmine is more present now? Is it still "dark" compared to brighter vetivers such as Guerlains or (especially) Annick Goutals? What's kind of longevity do you get with the new version and what did you get with the old? How would you rate both the old and new on a scale of 1-10. Any other info you can share is appreciated.
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  12. #12

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    The black currant was forcefully ripped out of the new version. I'm just testing them on paper but the old one was dark, smooth, earthy.. almost had a wet earth quality. The new one is bright, starting with an iodine like note not completely unlike Annick Goutal Vetiver, although not as iodine-ish and not as airy. I'd say that's probably the vetiver it's closest too, although it's a *bit* heavier and with a bit more body. Smells a lot like plain vetiver oil, tbh.

    While I haven't skin tested it yet, and I'm can't yet say if it's a good or bad vetiver on its own merits, it is not at all like the old Route Du Vetiver and I can understand why anyone who wanted the old and got the new would be upset. Yup - this reformulation is perhaps the most drastic (although tbh, the removal of the coffee note in Santal Noble was a pretty big change, I just happen to think for the better!).
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  13. #13

    Post Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    The orig. RdV, had a royally harsh opening. Bourbon Vetiver was to be found aplenty in this version, apparent from the first spray throughout the whole progression of the fragrance. I think that part of the problem with reformulations is that the perfume house seldoms admits it's reformulations, and thus we are guessing as to the pyramids of the fragrances. All we can do most of the time is guess.Albeit an educated guess none the less a guess. The Vetiver in the newer version is tamed down a bit, and now I can clearly pick up a hint of sweetness. I don't know what is forming this accord, but it is there.If you want a more Bourbon pronounced Vetiver look into SMN, Etro, or AG, to name a few, and you will find it.I don't that much damage was done to this fragrance in the reformulation of it.

    Both versions are very well done, and will hold there own against other offerings in the Vetiver world. IMHO
    Don't panic. Just stay calm, and reload....

  14. #14

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Are you guys 100% it's reformulation and not just batch variation? I have an old RdV and there's barely any berry or blackcurrant, just a little in the drydown.

    Does anyone have two old bottles to compare?

    With creeds for examples almost each bottle and each sample is different enough that I would suspect them or reformulation if I hadn't had as many bottles/samples to compare.
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  15. #15

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    I've posted that on another MPG reformulation thread. I have two old RdV bottles and one new. There seems to be some sort of logical progrssion from old bottle No1 to old bottle No2 then to the new bottle. There is some sort of graduation of the differences from one bottle to the next.
    Last edited by cpk; 10th July 2009 at 10:18 PM.

  16. #16

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Can anyone comment on Centure or Garrigue?

  17. #17

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Well, the black currant/berry accord in RDV never smelled ostensibly like berries so much as it smoothed out the vetiver and made it "darker." The new RDV is much brighter smelling.. much more conventional. It's like the vetiver without the soggy mud aspect of the original.
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  18. #18

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Quote Originally Posted by SculptureOfSoul View Post
    Well, the black currant/berry accord in RDV never smelled ostensibly like berries so much as it smoothed out the vetiver and made it "darker." The new RDV is much brighter smelling.. much more conventional. It's like the vetiver without the soggy mud aspect of the original.
    Oooh - the soggy mud was the whole point!
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  19. #19
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    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Failing to find Jardin du Nil in the old 90 ml. bottle, I recently purchased a new 100 ml bottle, and am both relieved and happy to report that the controversial "stinky feet"/"overripe cheese" note that makes this scent so compelling for me is intact and undiluted in the current formulation! Moot point, of course, if (as I fear,) MPG is going under. At least I have a bottle now. Mwahahahah!

  20. #20

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    I almost feel guilty for this thread, now.

    I should add after wearing the new Route Du Vetiver that it's not as bright/different as my initial impressions indicated. Still, it is a bit drier and it feels like the berry note has been toned way down and replaced with a berry'ish jasmine - it achieves a somewhat similar smell but the texture is different and the scent doesn't have as much depth. The longevity is down to a reasonable 8 or so hours instead of the 16+ I got with the original.

    I think the new RdV is a good scent and while it is different than the original, I still think it is a unique vetiver offering. I actually like the reduced longevity - I just wish the berry/muddy feel was fully instead of only partially intact.
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  21. #21

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    I wrote this somewhere else, but it is quite relevant here as well. The new RdV smells very much like Diesel Fuel for Life pour femme and i think the common thread is jasmin and berries, present in both pyramids.

  22. #22

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    I'm super curious about the new RdV now, and hope to get a bottle of that to compare with my 90ml one which I adore. I bet I won't even know the difference though!

    I think that if I only had RdV and Jardin du Nil in my collection, and nothing else, I'd be fine.
    Last edited by GAIVS IVLIVS CAESAR; 24th July 2009 at 04:05 PM.
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  23. #23
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    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Quote Originally Posted by GAIVS IVLIVS CAESAR View Post
    I think that if I only had RdV and Jardin du Nil in my collection, and nothing else, I'd be fine.
    Ditto
    "The beginning of freedom is the realization that you are not the "thinker." The moment you start watching the thinker, a higher level of consciousness becomes activated. You then begin to realize that there is a vast realm of intelligence beyond thought, that thought is only a tiny aspect of that intelligence. You also realize that all the things that truly matter - beauty, love, creativity, joy, inner peace - arise from beyond the mind.

    You begin to awaken"

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  24. #24
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    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Quote Originally Posted by Vibert View Post
    Failing to find Jardin du Nil in the old 90 ml. bottle, I recently purchased a new 100 ml bottle, and am both relieved and happy to report that the controversial "stinky feet"/"overripe cheese" note that makes this scent so compelling for me is intact and undiluted in the current formulation! Moot point, of course, if (as I fear,) MPG is going under. At least I have a bottle now. Mwahahahah!
    Good news. Wonder why Ruggles' bottle smelled different to him?
    "The beginning of freedom is the realization that you are not the "thinker." The moment you start watching the thinker, a higher level of consciousness becomes activated. You then begin to realize that there is a vast realm of intelligence beyond thought, that thought is only a tiny aspect of that intelligence. You also realize that all the things that truly matter - beauty, love, creativity, joy, inner peace - arise from beyond the mind.

    You begin to awaken"

    -- Eckhart Tolle

  25. #25

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Quote Originally Posted by Ruggles View Post
    Thanks SoS for your concise anthology. Now, let's hope we get some validation from MpG. They should be required to put a warning on their new boxes: Buyer be Aware: Top Notes Have Been Seriously Compromised.
    Aren't MPG going out of business? Flogging a nearly dead horse won't do much good, will it?
    "I exist for myself, and for those to whom my unquenchable thirst for freedom gives everything, but also for everyone, since insofar as I am able to love - I love everyone. Of noble hearts, I am the noblest - and the most generous of those that yearn to give love in return. - I am a human being, I love death and I love life."

    Egon Schiele - Self-Potrait


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  26. #26
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    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Quote Originally Posted by manicboy View Post
    Aren't MPG going out of business? Flogging a nearly dead horse won't do much good, will it?
    I thought they were just eliminating shipping to the US, not necessarily going out of business.
    "The beginning of freedom is the realization that you are not the "thinker." The moment you start watching the thinker, a higher level of consciousness becomes activated. You then begin to realize that there is a vast realm of intelligence beyond thought, that thought is only a tiny aspect of that intelligence. You also realize that all the things that truly matter - beauty, love, creativity, joy, inner peace - arise from beyond the mind.

    You begin to awaken"

    -- Eckhart Tolle

  27. #27

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeperez23 View Post
    I thought they were just eliminating shipping to the US, not necessarily going out of business.
    My understanding is that they're going under. Here are some of the items that have been discussed on various threads:
    1. Their US distributor is out of business.
    2. They are also out, or running out, of MPG at major places that carried the line in London and Frankfort.
    3. They are not returning calls and e-mails from Lucky Scent/Scent Bar
    4. A basenotes member (scentemental) said he knew the people at MPG said he would get the scoop and share it with us, but he seems to have since gone silent on the matter.
    5. Earlier in the year, they closed one of their two boutiques in Paris.

    I'm glad I was lucky enough to acquire back-up bottles of my five favorites. It sounds to me like they are going down - and maybe even already have. I've heard that our basenotes guys in Paris stopped posting because people kept asking them to make purchases for them, but it would be nice if somebody who has been in Paris in the last few weeks and may know something more definite could speak about this matter.
    Last edited by Tonyprince; 24th July 2009 at 05:46 PM.

  28. #28

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    I can second Ruggles frustration on Fraicheur Muskissime. Does anyone know when the reformulations and new bottle styles began production? I am looking for an older bottle of FM but I'm not sure if there is a way of telling it is old or new unless I actually smell it myself.

  29. #29

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    How much lighter is the reformulation to you, Nizzle? Also, please share any other changes you noticed. Thanks!
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  30. #30

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Quote Originally Posted by SculptureOfSoul View Post
    How much lighter is the reformulation to you, Nizzle? Also, please share any other changes you noticed. Thanks!
    The top notes of the older formulation are far richer and more complex, slightly herbal and a little more unisex IMO. The new is a more linear lemon/berry/musk which fades and lingers as a berry/musk skin scent and is slightly more feminine.

  31. #31

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    I just tried the 100ml of Jardin du Nil, and it's a little different than the original. Still funky, but a little less spice. It gives the same overall effect as before but it seems like the ingredients are cheaper. Maybe that's the big difference between the new and old. Maybe they were just cutting costs.
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  32. #32

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Any word on when these reformulations began or when Jean-Paul Millet Lage took over?

  33. #33

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Millet Lage took over in 1997 according to the website. The reformulations seem to be about the same time as the new bottles, so like 2007-2008.

    After comparing several reformulations vs the originals, I have to conclude that the changes were probably made for the sake of cost rather than trying to popularize them. It doesn't make much business sense to change things for these types of brands, with connaisseur customers - especially when Route du Vetiver seems the most different and that was their best seller.

    The reason I think the issue is cost is because for example Parfum d'Habit - the new version seems funkier and more brash than the old one which was actually easier to take in my opinion. It does smell a little cheaper though. Same goes for Eau des Iles. If anything the new one is louder and messier than the old, which is closer to Eau du Navigateur, though the new and old smell almost exactly the same after 5 minutes. With Jardin du Nil, the funky aspect of it that turns alot of people off is still there. It just smells a little brighter and .. a little cheaper.

    That's my impression anyhow.
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  34. #34

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    The gorgeous Santal Noble!
    When I started reading here on basenotes (no postings), there was Santal Noble time. Everybody was smitten and it was touted to be the very best niche man's fragrance ever.
    I was arranging notes in my head. Dizzy and lightheaded I read more and more, but without a sample it all didn't make sense. A decant was ordered soon (my very first decant order and from overseas as well - what will customs say?) and wow, then it arrived! What an amazing fragrance! I'm still taken by Santal Noble these days, it's that good!

    What a shame the new formulation can't live up with that amazing 90ml bottle.
    Last edited by dr.creed; 27th August 2009 at 06:00 PM.
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  35. #35

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Quote Originally Posted by GAIVS IVLIVS CAESAR View Post
    Millet Lage took over in 1997 according to the website. The reformulations seem to be about the same time as the new bottles, so like 2007-2008.

    After comparing several reformulations vs the originals, I have to conclude that the changes were probably made for the sake of cost rather than trying to popularize them. It doesn't make much business sense to change things for these types of brands, with connaisseur customers - especially when Route du Vetiver seems the most different and that was their best seller.

    The reason I think the issue is cost is because for example Parfum d'Habit - the new version seems funkier and more brash than the old one which was actually easier to take in my opinion. It does smell a little cheaper though. Same goes for Eau des Iles. If anything the new one is louder and messier than the old, which is closer to Eau du Navigateur, though the new and old smell almost exactly the same after 5 minutes. With Jardin du Nil, the funky aspect of it that turns alot of people off is still there. It just smells a little brighter and .. a little cheaper.

    That's my impression anyhow.
    I can see the reasoning behind your posting and I probably agree but the case of RdV confuses me. Isn't vetiver one of the cheapest raw materials? The new version lacks the oomph that I can only imagine came for a very specific type of vetiver. How expensive could that be? Or is it that they couldn't get hold of that special type of vetiver oil?

    And by the way, has anyone found this strong clay/ earth vibe from a specific type or origin of vetiver oil?

  36. #36

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Quote Originally Posted by dr.creed View Post
    The gorgeous Santal Noble!
    When I started reading here on basenotes (no postings), there was Santal Noble time...

    What a shame the new formulation can't live up with that amazing 90ml bottle.
    I managed to pick up just about every male MPG fragrance at good prices (at least the ones I'm interested in) including several 90ml's but Santal Noble I couldn't find even in 100ml format, except at full retail, so I've still yet to experience it's glory. Must say that almost all the others in the male line have blown me away. I just hope they're as good in winter as in summer.

    Quote Originally Posted by cpk View Post
    I can see the reasoning behind your posting and I probably agree but the case of RdV confuses me. Isn't vetiver one of the cheapest raw materials? The new version lacks the oomph that I can only imagine came for a very specific type of vetiver. How expensive could that be? Or is it that they couldn't get hold of that special type of vetiver oil?
    Maybe what gave the old RdV that special earthy clay aspect were some other ingredients which were more expensive, in a addition to the vetiver oil. Maybe the type of vetiver they used was fancy. Maybe they were using the best available types of all the ingredients, and they just reverted to cheaper ones, and in the case of RdV it made a big change overall, whereas for the others it's less so for chemistry reasons.

    Or maybe it was a really ill-concieved attempt to make the fragrances "hits" but that strikes me as quasi-suicidal unless it's matched with some kind of advertizing campaign which these small companies can hardly afford in good times, never mind in bad times.

    I guess we'll never know.
    Last edited by GAIVS IVLIVS CAESAR; 28th August 2009 at 12:27 PM.
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  37. #37

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    I really can't think of any other ingredient that has this muddy quality. Please brainstorm! I need more of it!

  38. #38

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Carrot seed oil has a bit of a claylike/muddy quality. So does cepes (a mushroom, the boletus edulis) absolute. I definitely feel the blackcurrant note has been reduced/cheapened in the new RDV - whatever replaces it (jasmine? Perhaps a decent sized dose of hedione?) just doesn't have the depth and body of the original. It adds the sweetness but it's saccharin thin.

    Patchouli/Spikenard/Valerian Root all can have dirty/earthy musky qualities, as well.

    None are particularly expensive though, outside of the blackcurrant absolute - and even that is not so pricey - especially considering it is used in small quantities only lest it overpower a blend.

    I really think he was trying to make the line more palatable to first time shoppers. Given how divisive the house was even on BN, I don't think that the majority of their income was coming from us - the few and fickle fragrance aficionados.
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  39. #39

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Interesting about the mudlike ingredients SoS, but do you really think that Millet Lage, the guy who made Bois de Turquie which is one of your favourites of all time, would really try to "improve" the line by making most of the perfumes smell a bit like cheap imitations of themselves?

    If I didn't know about the reformulations and you gave me a 100ml parfum d'habit and jardin du nil and told me they were designer imitations of the MPG I'd believe it.

    I'm super curious about the 100ml RdV, upset that I couldn't find a bottle.

    Quote Originally Posted by SculptureOfSoul View Post
    None are particularly expensive though, outside of the blackcurrant absolute - and even that is not so pricey - especially considering it is used in small quantities only lest it overpower a blend.

    I really think he was trying to make the line more palatable to first time shoppers. Given how divisive the house was even on BN, I don't think that the majority of their income was coming from us - the few and fickle fragrance aficionados.
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  40. #40

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Quote Originally Posted by GAIVS IVLIVS CAESAR View Post
    Interesting about the mudlike ingredients SoS, but do you really think that Millet Lage, the guy who made Bois de Turquie which is one of your favourites of all time, would really try to "improve" the line by making most of the perfumes smell a bit like cheap imitations of themselves?

    If I didn't know about the reformulations and you gave me a 100ml parfum d'habit and jardin du nil and told me they were designer imitations of the MPG I'd believe it.

    I'm super curious about the 100ml RdV, upset that I couldn't find a bottle.
    Just look at how divisive the old formulations were here on Basenotes.. and we are about as openminded as fragrance customers come. So, yes, I do think that he might have tried to make the line more palatable for the public. I think Bois de Turquie is actually quite palatable and I feel he definitely spent a lot of time getting the top notes just right, the one area Laporte seemed to have little regard for (I mean, how many of the older MPGs had rough openings? Even those who loved the frags often admitted the openings were rough!).
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  41. #41

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Quote Originally Posted by SculptureOfSoul View Post
    [...] I feel he definitely spent a lot of time getting the top notes just right, the one area Laporte seemed to have little regard for (I mean, how many of the older MPGs had rough openings? Even those who loved the frags often admitted the openings were rough!).
    But the rough openings are/were what gave them a distinctive character

    I fear that once my little sample vial runs out, I'll never smell Parfum d'Habit's farmyard top notes again.

    [That's a bad thing, in case anyone's wondering ]
    Last edited by simisker; 29th August 2009 at 12:40 AM.

  42. #42

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Have you tried the new vs old Parfum d'Habit? The reason I don't think the reformulations were a popularizing measure is because the new version is *more* barnyardy version than the 90ml one I have. Can anyone corroborate or dispute this?

    Quote Originally Posted by simisker View Post
    But the rough openings are/were what gave them a distinctive character

    I fear that once my little sample vial runs out, I'll never smell Parfum d'Habit's farmyard top notes again.

    [That's a bad thing, in case anyone's wondering ]
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  43. #43

    Default Re: The Master MPG Reformulation Thread [Maitre Parfumeur et Gantier, Reformulated]

    Hey, has anyone tried the reformulated Centaure vs the original?
    Fraiche Badiane?
    Racine?

    Any Centaure fans here? I have the original, and just adore it. I wear it whenever I wear burgundy. It's an unusually macho scent for me, and frankly I've never gotten a compliment on it, most people don't like it for some reason, but it's a secret favourite of mine.

    I have the new Fraiche Badiane, and it was my ultimate scent on almost every hot humid day. Lots of compliments and pleasure out of it.

    Racine I have the new one, and it makes me think of an herbal and dirtier Guerlain Vetiver. I like it alot, but have yet to wear it in public because it's a bit out of character for me.

    FYI here are some short comments about the one's I've tried, old vs new.

    Jardin du Nil is the one that's changed the most from what I've tried (have not yet compared Santal Noble, RdV or Ambre Precieux though) The new one is gentler, softer, and I think more feminine than the original. It's definitely less tangy, which some may like. Less prominent geranium leaf. The problem is that this difference removes much of it's "manly" character. This is the only MPG reformulation that I've tried that makes enough of a difference that I won't wear the new one. The old one is my SOTD several times a week. The new version is too gentle for me. It's sort of turned into a lovely woman's scent to me, though I'm sure some guys would like this version better from the changes.

    Secret Melange is almost unchanged, though maybe very slightly diluted (I'm guessing with all the new bottles they put the same amount of perfume, but with more alcohol, to fill up 100 vs 90ml. Both are great, and I wear them often, but as a fragrance, I've noticed that to me, it's all about oranges and cloves, but to most people who notice it, they think it just smells like soap, which is a disappointment to me. Someone said it smells like Thrills gum. Ick!

    Parfum d'Habit isn't changed much - might be a bit more husky and barnyard than previously, but nothing serious. Again the old one seems a little more concentrated, though they both last a long time.

    Eau des Iles is kind of brasher and more volatile. The old one was a little more like Eau du Navigateur and tamer. The change isn't radical, and I don't really have a preference. I like the opening of the new one better and the drydown of the old one.

    Iris Bleu Gris
    - I love both versions - an amazing rainy weather fragrance in my opinion. The old one seems a little more concentrated, and the floral aspects of it are more prominent.

    I have the new Route du Vetiver on the way, so I'll finally be able to see what everyone's been talking about.
    Last edited by GAIVS IVLIVS CAESAR; 25th September 2009 at 01:05 AM.
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