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  1. #1

    Default first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Hi all,

    Can someone please advise me on what base oils to use. I cannot use alcohol so it would have to be oils.

    I am under the understanding that one can use jojobo oil, Sandalwood oil and fractionation coconut oil.

    My question is; What are the pros and cons of using the above mentioned oils and are there better alternatives.

    Also where can I get pipettes and small empty bottles/vials from
    I am from the UK so I would appreciate it if someone could point me to a uk supplier. I have looked but obviously my googling skills are not that great.

    thanks

  2. #2

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    check out the stickies in this forum. Tons of useful info there.
    You can check out my fragrances at www.garnerjames.com
    While I work on the website, you can email me for any inquiries at james@garnerjames.com

  3. #3
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    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Hi ahmir,
    You don't say why you can't use alcohol - if it's for difficulty of supply reasons then there is help to be had in the earlier mentioned threads. If it is for religious or other personal reasons then I'd suggest a couple of alternatives:
    DPG (di-proylene glycol) is good for producing a roll-on scent
    Cyclomethicone is good for a sprayable (though not as good as ethanol)

    The problem with organic fixed oils like jojoba is that they can go off and tend to have a distinct scent of their own. Fractionated coconut oil isn't really what it sounds like - it works well though and is a good alternative to DPG. Sandalwood is an essential oil of considerable scent in its own right and prohibitively expensive to boot (but it can still make a lovely carrier if you can afford it and it does not tend to go off).

    Bottles are difficult - there are suggestions on other threads - if you just want small practical bottles though, many of the essential oil suppliers stock them and so do some of the cosmetics supplies people.

    Hope that helps.
    Chris Bartlett
    Perfumes from the edge . . .

    www.perfumedesigner.co.uk
    Twitter: @PellWallPerfume

    If you are looking for a perfumery consultation Iím happy to quote: if you want free advice, thatís what these forums are for
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  4. #4

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Hi there
    We can help with pipettes!

    http://www.essentially-me.co.uk/lab_pipettes.php

    Best regards
    Sian
    Sian at Essentially Me

    http://www.essentially-me.co.uk
    http://aleclawless.blogspot.om

  5. #5

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    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Hi,
    I get my bottles from here: http://www.naturallythinking.com
    Got my pipettes and small vials from eBay.

  6. #6

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Jojoba is probably the best. This was the answer I got from a friend who is a Dermatologist. I've read a lot of folks who do natural perfumes that Jojoba is their choice.

    Roll-on bottles can be found in singles and bulk at sks-bottle.com and specialtybottles.com. One does only bulk and one allows singles and small quantities.

  7. #7

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    I hear that jojobo does not have a long shelf life. I want to bottle my creations and expect them to last at least 2 3 years.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Quote Originally Posted by ahmir View Post
    I hear that jojobo does not have a long shelf life. I want to bottle my creations and expect them to last at least 2 3 years.
    In that case you will either need to add antioxidants as a preservative or use something like DPG rather than an organic oil. Having said that, keep in mind that many of the essential oils that you will be adding are themselves antioxidants so they will help preserve the carrier oil. Even so I think 2-3 years is asking too much of jojoba.
    Chris Bartlett
    Perfumes from the edge . . .

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    Twitter: @PellWallPerfume

    If you are looking for a perfumery consultation Iím happy to quote: if you want free advice, thatís what these forums are for
    You can also join my blog if you wish to ask questions of me.

  9. #9

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    hmm, in that case then I think I may have to get cheap sandalwood oil and use that.

    What about almond oil? any good?

  10. #10
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    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Quote Originally Posted by ahmir View Post
    hmm, in that case then I think I may have to get cheap sandalwood oil and use that.

    What about almond oil? any good?
    Almond oil is fine, but has the same issue regarding keeping quality as jojoba. I'm not sure there is such a thing as cheap sandalwood oil . . . what's wrong with DPG? It's cheap, widely available, stable and safe (and completely alcohol free) . . .
    Chris Bartlett
    Perfumes from the edge . . .

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    If you are looking for a perfumery consultation Iím happy to quote: if you want free advice, thatís what these forums are for
    You can also join my blog if you wish to ask questions of me.

  11. #11

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Almond oil would be doing good to keep six months: I keep mine in the fridge, and use it for testing small amounts of blends. As far a cheap sandalwood, some decent sandalwood that's as cheap as you're going to find without being adulterated can be had from QT. I have some of his lowest-end sandalwood (12mL for $22 shipped), and it's nothing special, but it's good (no off-notes), and better than getting some crap that's probably largely synthetic. The only thing is you'd have to want all your frags to have a sandalwood base. If you're going for the itar theme, then that's fine, but if you want to branch out from it, you'll eventually need to move to other diluents.

  12. #12

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    yes I wanted to keep things 100% natural to start with. I wanted to go the attar route.

    Chris, please can you refer me to where I could get DPG.
    How would I use it?

  13. #13
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    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    There are quite a few places you can buy DPG - I get mine from Mistral but some of the essential oil suppliers stock it too.

    In use it's just like any other carrier - it's a clear, odourless, oily liquid. Almost all essential oils are miscible in DPG so you simply make your blend and then add DPG to dilute it to the level you want and put it into roll-on bottles.
    Chris Bartlett
    Perfumes from the edge . . .

    www.perfumedesigner.co.uk
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    If you are looking for a perfumery consultation Iím happy to quote: if you want free advice, thatís what these forums are for
    You can also join my blog if you wish to ask questions of me.

  14. #14

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Bartlett View Post
    There are quite a few places you can buy DPG - I get mine from Mistral but some of the essential oil suppliers stock it too.

    In use it's just like any other carrier - it's a clear, odourless, oily liquid. Almost all essential oils are miscible in DPG so you simply make your blend and then add DPG to dilute it to the level you want and put it into roll-on bottles.
    Chris, thanks for the info about DPG. I have DPG and I use it to make dilutions of some of my stronger aromachemicals, so they're easier to work with. I'd never given any thought to making oil based versions of my perfumes using DPG. Oil based perfumes can often perform differently than those using alcohol. I'll have to try making some DPG based perfumes-- your suggestions are very helpful. I don't know why I never thought of it myself, but there ya' go!
    "He is a very shallow critic who cannot see an eternal rebel in the heart of a conservative."-- G.K. Chesterton

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    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    you're very welcome Indie - my pleasure.

    Recently I had a request for a solid perfume - something I have never made - if you have idea's about an appropriate carrier for that I'd be very interested to hear them! My 1st thought was beeswax, but I think that would be too hard, and of course it has its own very distinct aroma . . . You hardly see solid perfumes commercially any more and I think that was part of the reason for the request. Seemed like quite a good idea to me and would no doubt also behave differently from the same accord in ethanol or DPG.
    Chris Bartlett
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  16. #16

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Beeswax is fully-miscible (double-boiler) with mineral oil and petrolatum. The lip balm I've used for the last few years I make with about 60-40 beeswax and olive oil, with a bit of camphor thrown in as it cools. I've not had a problem with rancidity (batch made about two years ago), but of course olive oil is rather distinctively-scented. Still, other oils should serve equally-well, shelf-life depending, of course (which is why I suggested non-vegetable oils first).

  17. #17
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    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Thanks, I'll have a go at that.
    Chris Bartlett
    Perfumes from the edge . . .

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  18. #18

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Hi Ahmir, I sell all natural perfumes and can give you some advice.
    I use fractionated coconut oil. It has the longest shelf life of all the oils, light feel and odorless base. Jojoba is actually a wax, solidifies in cold temperatures and doesn't have as long of shelf life. Almond oil is better for massage and is quite heavy. Fractionated coconut oil may also used for macerations/infusions. This way you can make your own fragrant natural oils out of organic materials such as herbs, resins, ie vanilla bean. I infuse in little canning glass jars myrrh, vanilla beans, angelica and costus root, lapsang tea, orris, figs, spices and so much more.
    As for fixatives (aka "base notes" such as sandalwood, amyris, frankincense, myrrh, galbanum, labdanum, benzoin, peru balsam, patchouli, costus, angelica, orris, vetiver) It will be up to you, the creative perfumist to decide what to use.
    If a essential oil or absolute is being sold cheap it is probably not the real thing or is being diluted. This is especially true of sandalwood. Buying cheap oils when you are starting perfumery is robbing yourself of smelling how beautiful the oils actually are. I beg you not to buy off ebay. Start with the basics: a couple base, heart and top notes. Natural perfumery is not cheap.
    Joining the Natural Perfumery Group on Yahoo http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalPerfumery/ might be super helpful as there are beginning an expert natural perfumists from all over the world there who ask and answer questions. There you would find a resource for where to get good quality oils, bottles and answer any question you might have.
    I hope this helps,
    K

  19. #19

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Chris, I also sell solid perfumes and can give you a recipe that is a gold standard for natural perfumers. Mandy Aftel (natural perfumest extraordinaire) uses the one below:

    Basic Solid Perfume:
    5ml of Jojoba or fractionated coconut oil
    15-20 drops (your first may be a tester for fragrance ratios)
    1/2 heaping tsp of GOLDEN grated beeswax (white leaves an unpleasent candle smell)
    Small non metal dish for melting wax. I use for big amounts glass measuring cups, smaller amounts ceramic souffle dish
    Lip balm or other container for solid perfume


    Pour oil into mixing beaker,small bowl or cup, shot glass
    Add your drops of perfume to the oil
    Melt the beeswax in non metal dish over heat
    Remove from heat and stir in the perfume blend.DO not over heat the wax or oil!
    (I like to use wooden craft/chop sticks for stirring)
    immediately pour mixture into container. Do not move the container. Let it sit for at least 15 minutes or you will have an uneven top.


    You can experiment with essence ratios or trying floral waxes or concretes (Floral concretes are lovely for solids) mixed with golden beeswax. Caranuba and candelilia waxs have higher melting points. Scentless 100 pure soy wax can add a little shine but has a much lower melting point than beeswax. I like mixing soywax in my solids or sometimes shea, mango or other butters for different consistencies. I will add cocoa butter if it will enhance the scent.

    I forgot to mention that vitamin e is a natural preservative that can be added to oil perfumes or solids in small amounts more will have yucky effect. k
    Last edited by songsfor3; 20th August 2011 at 04:45 AM. Reason: spelling errors and confusing repeat of word

  20. #20
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    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Thank you very much for this useful information songsfor3, it's very much appreciated.

    I shall get on and buy some waxes so that I can start experimenting. I'm particularly attracted to the idea of using floral concretes in this way - now if only violet concrete was still available . . .

    Thanks again, Chris
    Chris Bartlett
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  21. #21

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Hi Chris,
    You are so welcome!
    I buy my violet leaf and other gorgeously fragrant floral concretes at http://www.libertynatural.com/ Liberty Natural. I make use of the concretes in my oil,solid and alcohol based perfumes. I infuse concretes in alcohol for weeks(the longer the better) then filter for use later. The concretes display a complex olfactory range nearer to the living plant material.
    There are many fun historcal violet solflorie recipies to play with and put your own creative take on. I love orris root. The liberty natural concrete/butter sample I bought has lasted me forever. I diluted just half of the tiny sample by lightly warming it in a glass ounce bottle with a fractionated coconut oil. The odor is very strong.
    I hope this helps. If you do not find violet leaf concrete, perhaps the absolute?
    Happy composing!
    K

  22. #22

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    thanks songfor3

    I shall take your advise on board

  23. #23
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    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Hi Ahmir.......Here is a simple scent I make from essential oils diluted in an apricot base oil.

    The following recipe makes a seductive Oriental type fragrance and is very long lasting.


    20ml (7/10 fl oz) Apricot base oil
    2 drops ylang-ylang
    2 drops rose
    2 drops balsam of Peru
    2 drops vanilla
    2 drops jasmine
    1 drop patchouli

    This will produce a rich scent like Shalimar.

    Enjoy!

  24. #24

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    thanks for that winky. I will try this mix when I order my oils inshallah

  25. #25

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Thanks everyone for their excellent advise..

    I think the best way to go when starting out creating your own blends using Essential Oils would be to use DPG or Coconut Fractured Oil.

    I have heard that DPG tends to "flatten" out the scents, while CFO oil doesnt flatten the scents, but it can go rancid.

    Is this true?

  26. #26
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    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    The first thing to recognise is that a fragrance will seem quite different when it's in oil than when it's in alcohol. That flattening as some people describe it is the top notes being less bright and volatile, but lasting better and it will happen equally in both the oils you are considering.

    Fractionated Coconut Oil (or caprylic/capric triglyceride) is certainly liable to go rancid eventually but it keeps much better than most other organic oils. DPG does not go rancid.
    Chris Bartlett
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    If you are looking for a perfumery consultation Iím happy to quote: if you want free advice, thatís what these forums are for
    You can also join my blog if you wish to ask questions of me.

  27. #27

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Thanks for the advise Chris.

    Is their a difference in thickness between DFP or CFO?

    Also does one have a more sticky feel then the other?

  28. #28
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    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    I would not describe either as sticky, but DPG has a thicker consistency than fractionated coconut oil - technically it would depend on what fraction of the crude coconut oil we are talking about but in practice the stuff that is sold as fractionated coconut oil is the short and medium chain tryglycerides - the thicker textured long chain parts are separated out as they are more valuable - so it is usually a pale yellow, thin, odourless liquid. DPG is thicker, equally odourless and clear. Both feel oily to the touch rather than sticky.

    Neither is expensive - why not buy some of each and see which you prefer?
    Chris Bartlett
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    If you are looking for a perfumery consultation Iím happy to quote: if you want free advice, thatís what these forums are for
    You can also join my blog if you wish to ask questions of me.

  29. #29

    Default Re: first time scent creation using essentail oils - need some advise

    Thank you will do.

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