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  1. #31

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Im in US.

    Quote Originally Posted by mumsy View Post
    Where are you? Ok if you're UK but not if not.

  2. #32

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Our post is too risky right now for anything precious. Best with someone over there.
    Currently wearing: Civet by Houbigant

  3. #33
    Paul Kiler
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    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Quote Originally Posted by mumsy View Post
    Our post is too risky right now for anything precious. Best with someone over there.

    So What is with the Post?

    I've got packages of EO's and other packages of fragrance samples to get to UK,... Is it impossible to use the mail?
    Must I use UPS or DHL?
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    Gold Medal for "Best Aroma"; Los Angeles Artisan Fragrance Salon

  4. #34

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Hey Paul, I recently received two orders of essential oil to the UK via USPS First-Class International Mail, without any issues. Both came with customs declaration forms on the outside, so it would probably be a good idea for you to do the same. You can pick up a form at any post office, or you can fill the form out below and print it.

    https://cns.usps.com/go/ShippingInformationAction_input

    - - - Updated - - -

    With regards to the original topic, I once ordered some cannabis essential oil from Switzerland but it was sweet smelling and not exactly like the dried herb or hash. The dried herb and hash have a deeper, musky sort of smell to them. I think that it may be down to the fact that they are legally obliged to fractionally distill the essential oil, to leave behind the cannabinoids (drug components). A little reading tells me that the cannabinoids have a boiling range between about 160°C and 220°C. Any terpenes with a similar boiling point would also get left behind. This could be why cannabis essential oils seem to lack the familiar smell of the dried herb or hash. Another reason why the essential oil may not smell exactly like the dried herb or hash could be because they steam distill the plants while they're still fresh, to get the maximum return. Many of the lighter terpenes would have evaporated off during drying but they make their way into the essential oil when fresh plants are used. Table 2 in the link below shows the chemical composition of essential oil from different cannabis strains.

    http://www.druglibrary.net/olsen/HEMP/IHA/jiha4208.html
    Last edited by Pears; 5th March 2013 at 11:45 PM.

  5. #35

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    This thread may help a few of you out as there is a breakdown of whats actually in cannabis and truck load of smellalikes (some not so).

    - - - Updated - - -

    This thread may help a few of you out as there is a breakdown of whats actually in cannabis and truck load of smellalikes (some not so).

  6. #36
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    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Paul, it honestly seems to vary to a nightmarish degree here.

    I just received a tracked USPS package from Malaysia via USPS/R.M.
    (USPS is delivered here by Royal Mail).
    It was properly declared on the Customs Form as 'Agarwood perfume' - I'm assuming that the initial Malaysian P.O. knew it was oil, passed it & our lot didn't argue with USPS' acceptance of the item. It was only 2x3ml, so not very bomb-like.
    But they are known for 'random sampling'.

    We really don't know what to expect here - I would describe it as 'hit & miss' at present, but oils may be a grey area anyway.

    Sorry if that doesn't help - Perfumer's Apprentice has a list of shipping codes that they use so maybe they know.

    Good luck
    Last edited by lpp; 6th March 2013 at 06:49 PM.

  7. #37

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Quote Originally Posted by Conni HD View Post
    Hi ! I bought it from Marienfelser Naturkosmetik here in germanyhttp://www.maienfelser-naturkosmetik...93a66642750c42 He has some quite rare essential oils and a few attars. I also bought a nice saffron attar. But be aware: he is not cheap !
    Hey, danke für den guten Tipp!

  8. #38

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    I made my own tincture which had a lovely fresh cannabis aroma but after about a month it turned brown and lost its fragrance.

  9. #39

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    I'd imagine that that would be down to oxidation. How long was the herb left in the alcohol for? You could try adding an antioxidant like rosemary oleoresin extract (ROE). An airtight cap would also help, aswel as storing it in a cool, dark place.

  10. #40

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Oh, that's a great tip. I didn't realize there were natural anti-oxidants I could use for stabilizing perfume. I'll look for rosemary oleoresin extract. Does it have an odor?
    Thanks,
    Jim

  11. #41

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Quote Originally Posted by James Peterson View Post
    Oh, that's a great tip. I didn't realize there were natural anti-oxidants I could use for stabilizing perfume. I'll look for rosemary oleoresin extract. Does it have an odor?
    Thanks,
    Jim
    The odor is faint, so it doesn't usually interfere with the fragrance of a blend, when used at the recommended concentration. However, check out the MSDS before buying, to make sure that it hasn't been blended with a carrier oil. If it has, then it probably won't dissolve in alcohol that's lower than 95% volume. If you have a choice, then choose one that was extracted with acetone rather than say hexane, as it will contain much less in the way of alcohol insoluble plant wax. Again, if you have a choice, then choose one that's high in carnosic acid, the primary antioxidant in Rosemary. If memory serves me correctly, the cannabinoids in cannabis are themselves antioxidants, although very few natural compounds are as effective as carnosic acid.
    Last edited by Pears; 7th January 2014 at 10:51 PM.

  12. #42
    Paul Kiler
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    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Vitamin E is also an excellent natural antioxidant as well. There a a number of them...

    PK
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    Gold Medal for "Best Aroma"; Los Angeles Artisan Fragrance Salon

  13. #43

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Indeed, Paul. The rosmarinic acid and carnosic acid found in Rosemary have stronger antioxidant activity than vitamin E but a combination of all three would work best.

    James, the ROE below is a good example, i.e. acetone extracted, undiluted and with a high carnosic acid content.

    http://www.lotioncrafter.com/rosemar...resin-roe.html

  14. #44
    Basenotes Junkie hoschhti's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Quote Originally Posted by Conni HD View Post
    Hi ! I bought it from Marienfelser Naturkosmetik here in germanyhttp://www.maienfelser-naturkosmetik...93a66642750c42 He has some quite rare essential oils and a few attars. I also bought a nice saffron attar. But be aware: he is not cheap !
    I just stumbled across Maienfelser Naturkosmetik and checked here on Basenotes if there are any opinions about them. I am interested in the Frankincense-Hydrosol and the Frankincense Frereana Oil. Basically I want to know if they are reliable? Thanks.
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  15. #45

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    I tested a few german suppliers, for me Maienfelser is very reliable. Meanwhile, I buy all my essential oils from them. I don´t have the Frankincense you are interested in, i have the Frankincense neglecta and it´s exellent.

    regards

  16. #46
    Basenotes Junkie hoschhti's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Quote Originally Posted by Conni HD View Post
    I tested a few german suppliers, for me Maienfelser is very reliable. Meanwhile, I buy all my essential oils from them. I don´t have the Frankincense you are interested in, i have the Frankincense neglecta and it´s exellent.

    regards
    Danke für die Antwort! Ja, das sieht schon alles sehr seriös aus, und dieses riesige Angebot - ich sehe schon wie mein Geldbeutel immer dünner wird!
    FAVOURITES:

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    4. Vitrum
    5. Norne
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  17. #47

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Ja das kannst du laut sagen, habe den letzten Monat zwei Bestellungen dort gemacht weil er so viele Raritäten hat. Er ist wirklich nicht billig, aber die Öle halten dann auch wirklich jahrelang.

    Gruß

  18. #48

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    I'm retesting the tincture, this time with the rosemary resinoid (ROE). It's only been a week or two and the last time it took about a month for it to turn brown. I'll let everyone know once I've determined that it stays green and keeps its aroma. Right now it has a distinct resiny smell that, I fear, would fool those dogs.

  19. #49

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Hey James, if memory serves me correctly, the cannabinoids darken from decarboxylation and/or oxidation. Decarboxylation doesn't require the presence of additional oxygen, so antioxidants won't stop the process. However, the cannabinoids are practically odorless, so whether or not they decarboxylate and change colour isn' particularly important. The tincture can also turn brown through the degradation of chlorophyll, which isn't anything to worry about by itself.

    It's the terpenes that you want to protect from oxidation, as they are primarily responsible for the odour. Although there are other hydrocarbons, alcohols, aldehydes and ketones that can contribute to the smell. The rate of oxidation is increased by heat and/or light, so storing your tincture in a cool, dark place is a good idea.

    As with many other herbs, such as Rosemary, Thyme, Sage, etc, the oleoresins are primarily found in surface glands, so lengthy extractions aren't required. With Rosemary and Thyme for example, the extraction is more or less complete within a couple of hours. Any longer than that and you're mostly just extracting the unwanted cellular contents. Unless you wish to extract the cell contents for their cosmetic or antioxidant properties, that is. I hope that this helps.
    Last edited by Pears; 17th February 2014 at 03:02 PM.

  20. #50

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Hi Pear, So it sounds like my tincture may very well turn color but won't loose its "fresh" smell.

  21. #51

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    I can't offer any guarantees, James but if you've added an antioxidant and you store it in a cold, dark place, with an airtight lid, it should be okay for several months.

  22. #52

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    I found Hops C02 Extract to smell a little bit like pot.

  23. #53

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    If cannabis oil from a quality strain (thinking west coast, US) was available, it would be great for perfuming indeed. I think cannabis might put clary sage to shame, as it's way richer and more complex.

    Fresh cannabis and smoked cannabis are two very different things. Both would be of value, but IMHO we shouldn't lump them together.

  24. #54

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    I agree, the smoked herb is much deeper smelling and nicer than say Cade or Birch. It would be easy enough to make a tar from it, assuming that you're in a state where it's legal.
    Last edited by Pears; 17th February 2014 at 11:52 PM.

  25. #55

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    To me the dry down of Zdravetz (‪Geranium macrorrhizum‬) smells like dope (not the smoke).

  26. #56

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Thank you Pears for your tip about the rosemary oleoresin. My tincture has remained green and fresh after a month in the fridge. The old one was brown and stale by now. The aroma smells, well, like grass--raw grass, not grass smoke.

  27. #57

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    How do you make tar out of it? Would be nice to try it with sage..

  28. #58

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Nizan, you can use the same bushcraft technique that's used for making Birch tar oil and Pine tar oil. Ideally you want to limit the temperature to around 800 °C though, as the lower temperature produces much fewer soot particles in the oil. The easiest way to achieve that is to wait until the embers have cooled to a cherry red and then shovel them over and around the can. It would be easier to do that if the top can was fairly small; you probably wouldn't have enough Cannabis material to fill a large can anyhow.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBfG2vPG_Y8
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zv0JMKbFsrQ

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_heat
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:In...ence_Color.jpg
    Last edited by Pears; 9th March 2014 at 11:09 PM.

  29. #59

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    I'm glad that it worked for you, James.

  30. #60

    Default Re: Cannabis in perfumery

    Thanks Pears
    I was going to try it with clary sage, not cannabis. It's illegal here. Though it seems a bit like too much logistics. How do I know this stuff is safe to use anyway?

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