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  1. #1
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    Default Heliotropin Replacer

    I have some Heliotropin only in a low concentration of 2.5% and I have not yet tried the IFF Heliotropin replacer (Heliotropex N). I cannot believe that it is some "new" chemical, it will
    rather be a mix of known chemicals. Does anyone here have a clue what IFF uses to imitate Heliotropin? Can anyone recommend the IFF Heliotropin replacer or any other one?
    Last edited by Domek; 1st August 2012 at 09:00 PM.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Heliotropin Replacer

    I've not tried the IFF replacer so can't comment on that, but I normally use veratraldehyde as a direct replacement for heliotropin (piperonal).

    Veratraldehyde is available from SAFC (if you have an account with them) and, in handy smaller quantities from Hekserij.
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  3. #3
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    Default Re: Heliotropin Replacer

    Thank you for the advise, Chris!

  4. #4
    Super Member otocione's Avatar
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    Default Re: Heliotropin Replacer

    They state it's a "Trade Secret" that means it must be a mixture of known chemicals as you said, because if it was a new one they would just patent it and declare the molecular structure, being protected on the market by the patent itself.
    Essentially they are selling a very simplified "vanilla perfume" as a note.
    Sebastiano - Organic Chemist

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Heliotropin Replacer

    Quote Originally Posted by otocione View Post
    They state it's a "Trade Secret" that means it must be a mixture of known chemicals as you said, because if it was a new one they would just patent it and declare the molecular structure, being protected on the market by the patent itself.
    Exactly this is what I was thinking.
    Quote Originally Posted by otocione View Post
    Essentially they are selling a very simplified "vanilla perfume" as a note.
    Ok, thanks, maybe I better try the veratraldehyde, where I know what I am using.

  6. #6
    Basenotes Member sibie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Heliotropin Replacer

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Bartlett View Post
    I've not tried the IFF replacer so can't comment on that, but I normally use veratraldehyde as a direct replacement for heliotropin (piperonal).

    Veratraldehyde is available from SAFC (if you have an account with them) and, in handy smaller quantities from Hekserij.
    Hi Chris! I know this is an old thread, but I keep coming back to this in my search for Heliotropex and I have been wondering about your use of Veratraldehyde instead of Heliotropin. Do you use as replacement in the same amounts as heliotropin? I have been using Heliotropex but it is very confusing as to whether it should be same amount of less, because I have read very contradicting information depending on who is describing Heliotropex so I have been following my nose. I figured if I used Veratraldehyde instead it may solve my headaches....

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Heliotropin Replacer

    Hi, Chris does not frequent here much anymore.

    I am sorry, but I cannot really help you, myself, because I use the real heliotropin, since it is not restricted for use, only restricted for sale.
    Paul Kiler
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  8. #8
    Basenotes Member sibie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Heliotropin Replacer

    Quote Originally Posted by pkiler View Post
    Hi, Chris does not frequent here much anymore.

    I am sorry, but I cannot really help you, myself, because I use the real heliotropin, since it is not restricted for use, only restricted for sale.
    Thanks Paul. I had a feeling Chris was not coming around much anymore, but I figured I'd ask just in case.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Heliotropin Replacer

    Quote Originally Posted by pkiler View Post
    Hi, Chris does not frequent here much anymore.

    I am sorry, but I cannot really help you, myself, because I use the real heliotropin, since it is not restricted for use, only restricted for sale.
    So, Paul, do you purchase your Heliotropin from a California supplier (or suppliers) so that you do not have to file a Report of Receipt with the California DOJ?

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Heliotropin Replacer

    Sorry, Never heard of this report of receipt. My purchase last came from NJ. I Did have to fill out some USA federal paperwork, but was not aware of any CA State paperwork...
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
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    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Heliotropin Replacer

    Quote Originally Posted by pkiler View Post
    Sorry, Never heard of this report of receipt. My purchase last came from NJ. I Did have to fill out some USA federal paperwork, but was not aware of any CA State paperwork...
    Ah, yes, California has its own requirement (imposed on the purchaser) for reporting out-of-state purchases of the Listed/Scheduled materials, but no reporting requirement if purchased from an in-state supplier. Anyway, here is the relevant link to the pertinent statute. It's the first section/paragraph.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Heliotropin Replacer

    Wow, so I'm a Professional Perfumer outlaw...
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Heliotropin Replacer

    The regulatory redundancy is frustrating to say the least. I could easily turn this into a rant about this sort of thing, but I won't. And here I was hoping that you had the inside track on a California supplier whose name you might share. Well, you have this info now, so I hope that it serves you well.

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Heliotropin Replacer

    Well, I am told now by the CA CBI, under the Attorney General, that the Bureau of Narcotic Enforcement does not exist any longer, and the CBI does it's work. So, talking with a person at my local CBI office to work out the kinks, but maybe this reporting is toothless? Hmmm.
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Heliotropin Replacer

    I'm searching for heliotropine too...anyone knows where to buy it in europe? and what kind of bureaucratic stuff is required to purchase it in Europe ?
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  16. #16
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    Default Re: Heliotropin Replacer

    I've learned that the only California Vendor that I can buy from requires a business license at a Commercial address. Which I don't have,
    So, that's problematic.
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Heliotropin Replacer

    In Europe, Omikron have heliotropine, but not pure, diluted at 6%.

    http://www.omikron-online.de/cgi-bin...&ls=d&nocache=

    Heliotropin are a very good scent, but I think it can be reproduced fairly faithfully (with veratraldeide, a bit of vanillin and benzhaldheyde and ionones etc. ),i tried...
    Last edited by Geco; 21st February 2018 at 08:38 PM.

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