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  1. #31

    Default Re: Reformulations that IMPROVED on the original...

    Quote Originally Posted by Furriner View Post
    Yosh Sombre Negra is much better in the newer version.
    True, but that wasn't a reformulation. If I'm not mistaken, she discontinued Sombre Negra, then created an entirely new scent and re-used the name for it. Sombre Negra is excellent (!!!) but I think it was foolish of Yosh to re-use the name of a different scent since it can be hard to know which reviews are for which scent. They're entirely different. I don't get it.

    ...I must say, her use of the paper mustaches to market the new Sombre Negra was brilliant. And the scent really is a big bold wow.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Redneck Perfumisto View Post
    I was not wowed by vintage Fahrenheit, when I finally got to sniff it. The newer stuff just continues to seem more interesting to me.
    Interesting!!! I would love to smell vintage Fahrenheit, as I really enjoy the current version, though it's the only version I know. Where did you find vintage?

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    Quote Originally Posted by David Ruskin View Post
    None. When a fragrance is reformulated it is not the same as the original; therefore it cannot be an improvement. It is not the same. You may prefer the reformulation, that is your prerogative but it cannot be an improvement.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaelee View Post
    So....originals can NEVER be improved upon, because, therefore, they would no longer be original? So once it's on the market, that's it. It's as good as it's going to get.

    I don't agree, in theory. It's a sad world when there's a whole class of things that can not ever be improved upon by default.
    I agree with Kaelee, 100%. Anything can be improved, especially when done by the original perfumer. I doubt most perfumers consider their releases perfect. Musicians often work on their music up until the very point they're forced to release it due to demands from their labels. I wouldn't be surprised at all if there are many cases where a perfumer completed a scent for a deadline but later realized it could use just a bit of this or a little less of that, leading to a future reformulation.

    ON THE OTHER HAND... reformulations due to ingredient price increases or restrictions... those are what we typically think of since they happen so often, and those are a bad sign.
    "Follow your nose. It always knows." -- Toucan Sam

  2. #32

    Default Re: Reformulations that IMPROVED on the original...

    Quote Originally Posted by David Ruskin View Post
    None. When a fragrance is reformulated it is not the same as the original; therefore it cannot be an improvement. It is not the same. You may prefer the reformulation, that is your prerogative but it cannot be an improvement.
    Yes and no. I believe the problem here is the lack of truth: the branding & label stays the same. That is one of the biggest problems with the industry imho: why sell a different juice in the same bottle, brand and under the same name??? For minor changes one can use the software name giving: Fahrenheit 1.1
    For a totally different formula: change the name.

    In the end it's the consumer that gets fooled.
    @SomethingSmelly

  3. #33

    Default Re: Reformulations that IMPROVED on the original...

    Quote Originally Posted by L'Homme Blanc Individuel View Post
    I agree with Kaelee, 100%. Anything can be improved, especially when done by the original perfumer. I doubt most perfumers consider their releases perfect. Musicians often work on their music up until the very point they're forced to release it due to demands from their labels. I wouldn't be surprised at all if there are many cases where a perfumer completed a scent for a deadline but later realized it could use just a bit of this or a little less of that, leading to a future reformulation.

    ON THE OTHER HAND... reformulations due to ingredient price increases or restrictions... those are what we typically think of since they happen so often, and those are a bad sign.
    Quote Originally Posted by Irina View Post
    Yes and no. I believe the problem here is the lack of truth: the branding & label stays the same. That is one of the biggest problems with the industry imho: why sell a different juice in the same bottle, brand and under the same name??? For minor changes one can use the software name giving: Fahrenheit 1.1
    For a totally different formula: change the name.

    In the end it's the consumer that gets fooled.
    I think perfumers can and should reformulate their fragrances if truly necessary. The analogy with music is somewhat apt. For example, in classical music, composers have been known to revise their scores, sometimes with strikingly different results. So, when musicians perform such works, they have to indicate which version they are performing.

    So, indeed it would be best if brands/houses also indicate which formulation the perfume they are selling is in. Unfortunately, that seems unlikely since these brands would always prefer to pretend no reformulations had been enacted, perhaps in fear of losing customers. Well, discerning perfumistas will know anyway.

    I find it interesting that the distinct formulations of Dior's Dior Homme series are listed as separate entries in Fragrantica. So, the original formulation (2005) by Olivier Polge is one entry, while the repatriated version (2011) by Francois Demachy is another entry, and so on for the flankers. This is one instance where Dior acknowledges the reformulations, even if this is not clear on the actual bottles and boxes, excepting the changes in bottle design.

    For perfumistas, even if the houses do not publicly acknowledge the reformulations, we know anyway, and the Internet is a powerful tool for research. Of course, not everyone interested in buying perfumes do their research...

  4. #34

    Default Re: Reformulations that IMPROVED on the original...

    Quote Originally Posted by Irina View Post
    Yes and no. I believe the problem here is the lack of truth: the branding & label stays the same. That is one of the biggest problems with the industry imho: why sell a different juice in the same bottle, brand and under the same name???
    Quote Originally Posted by Maque View Post
    I think perfumers can and should reformulate their fragrances if truly necessary. The analogy with music is somewhat apt. For example, in classical music, composers have been known to revise their scores, sometimes with strikingly different results. So, when musicians perform such works, they have to indicate which version they are performing.
    Yes! Yes! And more yes! I've often said it would be helpful if perfume were treated more like wine, with a year mark printed on the bottle and the box. It isn't going to happen, but it would be helpful.
    "Follow your nose. It always knows." -- Toucan Sam

  5. #35

    Default Re: Reformulations that IMPROVED on the original...

    Quote Originally Posted by L'Homme Blanc Individuel View Post
    Yes! Yes! And more yes! I've often said it would be helpful if perfume were treated more like wine, with a year mark printed on the bottle and the box. It isn't going to happen, but it would be helpful.
    This... may be a dangerous way to go. Batch madness lies that way!

    Seriously, the Creed Millésime is a concept supposedly like wine vintages, where products may differ from year to year because of the quality of the ingredients used (and possibly also because of QC issues, and reformulations).

  6. #36
    Super Member andregooren's Avatar
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    Default Re: Reformulations that IMPROVED on the original...

    I was commenting on another thread and realized that Ubar falls into this category. I'm not sure how many of you have tried the original but the current formulation just stomps it.

  7. #37
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    Default Re: Reformulations that IMPROVED on the original...

    Many of the older Guerlain's and Chanel's have to have been reformulated. I have never smelled Sous Le Vent in it's original formulation, but what they re-released was still magic.

    Also, for a look on a constantly changing line (some could say somewhat annoyingly) look no further than Slumberhouse. I don't think there is a fragrance he has made that hasn't gone through some changes. Again, not having smelled any of the originals, but one of the recent reformulations of Jeke is one of the greatest things I have smelled. This isn't cost cutting though, it's just the way he views his creations as something that can constantly evolve as he pleases.

  8. #38

    Default Re: Reformulations that IMPROVED on the original...

    I had been working my way thru my last bottle of vintage ANTAEUS when it dawned on me that once it was gone I'd be bereft. So I took the bottle out of wearing rotation and blind bought a new bottle. I saw that the frag still got pretty great reviews so I wasn't really thinking it had really changed much due to reformulation.
    At the first spritz I was heartbroken. It opened "fresh". WTF? ANTAEUS doesn't open fresh, it is a warm cashmere sweater from the get go! But you know what? As it dried down I could smell my old favorite coming thru. And after a few wearings, I wasn't struck by the dramatic difference anymore and I've really grown to love this reformulation. In fact, I never got a complement on my vintage version, but this one gathers many.
    Maybe I can say it improved the original in that it seems to have somehow updated the classic to make it more "acceptable" to today's sensitive noses yet has retained enough of the original to satisfy longtime fans.
    And the updated formula of the shower gel ain't bad either!
    "Ca sent les pieds!"

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