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  1. #91

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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    It's sad to see all this crap happening especially with the rather unsurprising lack of clarity from Royal Mail. I feel for those of you that had stuff destroyed by RM, customs or whoever. I guess there was always that risk with sending Internationally as perfumes were not allowed anyway and we got around it by declaring it as cosmetics or toiletries. I was lucky in that I had no outgoing decants/bottles recently and I was able to edit my listing after I saw what's been going on. Just last week I received a parcel from Duty Free Perfume in UK and that had a completed ID8000 label on it. I also had one from ALZD in Germany and that was delivered by Parcel Force. It will be interesting to see what happens with incoming parcels because that could mean no more ALZD, Surrender To Chance etc. God that's going to be heart breaking for me. But I'm going to be really peeved if we can not send within the UK and yet business customers can. It doesn't matter if a business customer has packed it on a box and put the ID8000 sticker on. We can all do that if they made it clear. Being a business customer doesn't make the perfume any safer. Now if anyone from Royal Mail is reading can someone please untie Mr Eadie so he can get to his PC/phone and give us some answers. I really hope you've been feeding him whilst you had him tied up because he's going to have a lot of emails to read.

  2. #92
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    I sincerely hope that he's been suffocated by them! But they probs didn't tell him what was going on either!

    At present, the plan is that personal customers *should* be able to ship within the U.K. from July, but I don't think that all the agreements have been signed yet, so the date could alter.

    I also don't think that we know anything approaching the full story.

    Interesting that the Press are not biting, but there's a bit of home news at present, what with dobbin, reynard & all!

  3. #93
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Quote Originally Posted by lpp View Post
    Interesting that the Press are not biting
    LOL! If the press in the UK is anything like the press here in the States, it probably isn't even on their radar.

  4. #94
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    No, more interested housebreaking foxes & bute riddled horse-burgers, (& our leader's new haircut - check out the back-combing!)
    But cc'ing to them usually encourages a reply!

  5. #95
    Super Member galwaygirl001's Avatar
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    'Sending internationally via Air services is 100% prohibited and the contents will be confiscated and destroyed and you may be liable for prosecution'.

    I think it is the same story here in Ireland! Crap! What next - will they stop us bringing home perfume when we are on holiday?! I just bought a bunch of small atomisers, funnels, etc, to start swapping samples!
    My current favourites Chanel Bois des Iles & Frederic Malle Iris Poudre

  6. #96

    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    I got a parcel yesterday from outside the EU, but it wasn't marked as perfume (not at my request!). I think that was my last perfume by post :-(

  7. #97
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    @ Scentsucker

    Was listening to Dr. D. Spiegelhalter, Prof.of Public Understanding of Risk @ Cambridge on B.B.C. R4's 'Today' earlier.
    He quoted some interesting figures about the safety of international commercial airline flights as last year was apparently the safest since 1945 (475 fatalities in 23 accidents worldwide, way more flights, etc.).

    Presumably it will even be safer now that the dreaded exploding scent bottles no longer fly!

  8. #98
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Quote Originally Posted by lpp View Post
    I sincerely hope that he's been suffocated by them! But they probs didn't tell him what was going on either!

    At present, the plan is that personal customers *should* be able to ship within the U.K. from July, but I don't think that all the agreements have been signed yet, so the date could alter.

    I also don't think that we know anything approaching the full story.

    Interesting that the Press are not biting, but there's a bit of home news at present, what with dobbin, reynard & all!
    That would be the day, lpp. The ban was imposed without any consultation whatsoever. Disgraceful.

    Quote Originally Posted by galwaygirl001 View Post
    I think it is the same story here in Ireland! Crap! What next - will they stop us bringing home perfume when we are on holiday?! I just bought a bunch of small atomisers, funnels, etc, to start swapping samples!
    And there I was thinking you guys in Ireland had a bit more sense than the muppets we have over here!! Don't let the British teach you about Health and Safety, as your economy will truly go down the toilet then....

    Quote Originally Posted by lpp View Post
    Presumably it will even be safer now that the dreaded exploding scent bottles no longer fly!
    ROTF LMAO....!!

  9. #99
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Tanj!

  10. #100

    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    But isn't this an EU thing???????

    So will effect say Ireland and other EU countries?
    DONNA

  11. #101

    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Quote Originally Posted by lpp View Post

    Presumably it will even be safer now that the dreaded exploding scent bottles no longer fly!
    Has anybody in the world of officialdom made any announcement regarding on board/in flight duty free perfume sales??
    Currently wearing: Aventus by Creed

  12. #102
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Quote Originally Posted by donna255 View Post
    But isn't this an EU thing???????

    So will effect say Ireland and other EU countries?
    I was under the impression that it was from the Chicago Convention! Annex 18, from memory, link is somewhere earlier on!
    Or check out Wikipedia:-
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convent...Civil_Aviation

    - - - Updated - - -

    @ HDDS - Sorry, don't know - could ask an airline!

  13. #103

    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Quote Originally Posted by HDD8 View Post
    Has anybody in the world of officialdom made any announcement regarding on board/in flight duty free perfume sales??
    These are known to be completely safe because airlines make money out of them . . .
    A person who is nice to you, but rude to the waiter, is not a nice person.”
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  14. #104
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Bartlett View Post
    These are known to be completely safe because airlines make money out of them . . .
    Well said!

  15. #105
    Super Member galwaygirl001's Avatar
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Quote Originally Posted by rum View Post
    And there I was thinking you guys in Ireland had a bit more sense than the muppets we have over here!! Don't let the British teach you about Health and Safety, as your economy will truly go down the toilet then....
    It already has! the uk had nothing to do with our economy going down the toilet though, that was excessive lending by banks to fuel a property boom that went bang, our government deciding to bail out the bust banks & turn banking debt into irish debt and the our government accepting EU money to 'help us' in exchange for austerity budgets for the next couple of hundred years and our economic sovereignty...aaaggghhh! Ahem, rant over, sorry, back to perfume!

    The change to international postage laws seems to be an EU thing as well as a US thing - since January my local post office query if parcels destined for international addresses contain perfume, I don't think it was being enforced until this year. I don't want to risk packages being destroyed so until a reasonably priced alternative option comes up for shipping fragrances internationally I will be sticking to postage within Ireland only.
    Last edited by galwaygirl001; 13th February 2013 at 07:00 PM.
    My current favourites Chanel Bois des Iles & Frederic Malle Iris Poudre

  16. #106
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Looks Like it isn't Royal Mail's fault, they are just enforcing the ICAO new guidlines:
    International

    International outbound parcels will continue to face the restrictions imposed by the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO), while revised restrictions on international parcels will come into force on 14th January, 2013.
    For Sale: VINTAGE Montales

  17. #107
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Quote Originally Posted by Possum-Pie View Post
    Looks Like it isn't Royal Mail's fault, they are just enforcing the ICAO new guidlines:
    International

    International outbound parcels will continue to face the restrictions imposed by the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO), while revised restrictions on international parcels will come into force on 14th January, 2013.
    Totally agree that the rules/reason for the rules are not their fault - my problem is with the way that they told the public one thing & the poor old staff another!

    And sprung it on the public without notice - don't forget, even Ebay didn't realise until a while after it was affecting sold listings.

    In most businesses, a customer repeatedly asking a question wouldn't need to go to the Chairman's Office for an (eventual) answer as the idea that something was amiss would occur earlier!
    Last edited by lpp; 14th February 2013 at 02:59 PM.

  18. #108

    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    after reading through this thread I'm starting to appreciate where I live!!! I thought canada post was bad... HAH!

  19. #109
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Quote Originally Posted by hawk View Post
    after reading through this thread I'm starting to appreciate where I live!!! I thought canada post was bad... HAH!

    Welcome to our world of rampant incompetence!

  20. #110

    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Quote Originally Posted by lpp View Post
    Welcome to our world of rampant incompetence!
    LOL

    But how do online stores like luckyscent and First in Fragrance send and receive perfumes? They have all kinds of different perfumes from different parts of the world in their stocks and paying higher fees or using a different shipping service would mean spending extra money which is not what businesses want these days.

  21. #111

    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Hawk, Canadian customs are famous for destroying perfume sent from the rest of the world. They send the empty box back and a warning letter. Stuff from the US seemed to be okay.
    DONNA

  22. #112
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    ...
    Last edited by lpp; 14th February 2013 at 01:11 PM.

  23. #113
    Basenotes Member La Flâneuse's Avatar
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    I've emailed Essenza Nobile today asking if they've had any problems delivering to the UK, and they said they haven't heard of anything untoward (they use UPS) so I may do a financially risky experiment tomorrow and buy the frag I've been coveting and see what happens....

  24. #114

    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    La Falneuse, its products leaving the UK at the moment. Items are coming in okay, so far.

    On MUA a number of people saying they have been swapping and the other side from the UK has not turned up. Cosmetics marked as such are being x-rayed now.
    DONNA

  25. #115
    Basenotes Member La Flâneuse's Avatar
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Quote Originally Posted by donna255 View Post
    La Falneuse, its products leaving the UK at the moment. Items are coming in okay, so far.

    On MUA a number of people saying they have been swapping and the other side from the UK has not turned up. Cosmetics marked as such are being x-rayed now.
    Phew!

    To be honest, this is really confusing what with the often contradictary info from the Royal Mail...I thought the biggest threat to perfume this year would be any new IFRA regs, I shall try and stock up while I can, but the situation is shite frankly

    - - - Updated - - -

    @donna255

    Thanks for the info btw

  26. #116

    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    I think I'm going to bite the bullet, and order from the Netherlands in the next few weeks. I'll warn them that they need to find a suitable carrier so the perfume actually gets here.

    In light of all these developments, I went a bit mad and bought quite a few bottles from heathrow duty free yesterday. It seems this may soon become the cheapest way to purchase some fragrances in the UK. Will probably get a few more on the way back....

  27. #117
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Quote Originally Posted by La Flâneuse View Post
    I've emailed Essenza Nobile today asking if they've had any problems delivering to the UK, and they said they haven't heard of anything untoward (they use UPS) so I may do a financially risky experiment tomorrow and buy the frag I've been coveting and see what happens....
    UPS does not generally use commercial carriers, they have their own fleet of planes, so they may not be subject to ICAO.

    Here in the States, you cannot send perfumes any other way except First Class Mail which moves by Ground. UPS will move perfumes by air as long as it is marked with the correct stickers.

  28. #118

    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    A response to my letter from a Mr David Gee, Chairman and Chief Executive Office.

    Dear Mrs (I deleted my name for privacy),

    Thank you for emailing James Eadie on 8 February 2013 about the changes to what can and cannot be sent in the mail to overseas destinations. As part of our Chairman and Chief Executive’s Office, I have been asked to look into your enquiry and provide a response.

    Last year, the Civil Aviation Authority (CAA), Department for Transport (DfT) and the Maritime and Coastguard Agency (MCA) agreed updated rules with Royal Mail for sending small quantities of specific consumer items through the post, which affect what can and cannot be sent to both UK and international destinations. These updated rules mean specific changes to the types of items that can be carried by Royal Mail.

    We cannot speak for airlines or the CAA, however when luggage is checked in at airports there are permitted thresholds of Dangerous Goods that may be carried which can be in check-in baggage, carry-on baggage or on person, and whether you need the airlines’ permission to carry them or whether they are completely forbidden. Airlines and security screening agencies have the right to refuse the carriage of certain items and restrictions implemented by countries in the interests of aviation security.

    There are no reviews due in July 2013. On January 14 2013, the new rules came into effect for all contract business customers sending larger volumes on account to UK addresses and for all consumers and businesses sending items abroad. On July 15 2013, the new rules will be introduced for consumers and smaller business customers who send smaller volumes to UK addresses.

    Royal Mail is not a carrier of dangerous goods and we have been working with the transport regulators to ensure what we do carry is sent in compliance with the rules. Royal Mail is not a licensed ADR Dangerous Goods carrier and as such we are not permitted to carry perfumes to international destinations. We realise the changes will have an effect on the perfumery industry and we are sorry that this is the case.

    I would like to thank you for raising your concerns about the changes and giving us the opportunity to respond. If I can be of any further help or assistance, please contact me again.

    Yours sincerely

    David Gee
    Chairman and Chief Executive Office
    100 Victoria Embankment LONDON EC4Y 0HQ


    - - - Updated - - -

    This quite clearly states that there are NO REVIEWS due in July 2013. This is sealed and delivered and seemingly unchangeable however hard we stamp our perfumers little feet. We need to find a solution that complies and yet achieves what we need.

    The question is simple...
    How are we going to be allowed to send small fragrance samples globally and without risk of destruction?

    I have tried one method which was to soak cotton in fragrance. The recipient has received it and was able to apply the frag. I'm not sure this actually achieved full compliance as in flammability but it did prevent it being a liquid and therefore was not under that section rule any longer.

    Other options that presumably still comply may be
    a) solid perfumes.
    b) perfumes in oil as a base
    c) perfume ingredients as long as they are not in an alcohol base as a tincture

    I have to say this has blown my own business plans up entirely. Many years of careful planning and investment about to whistle up the swanee unless we can find a reasonable and compliant solution.
    Currently wearing: Beautiful by Estée Lauder

  29. #119
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Quote Originally Posted by mumsy View Post
    The question is simple...
    How are we going to be allowed to send small fragrance samples globally and without risk of destruction?
    There simply has to be a way - can't we start to use DHL, Citi Post, UPS or something along those lines?

  30. #120
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    Default Re: No national nor international shipping of fragrances from July 15th 2013!

    Check out Royal Mail twitter feed - quote:-

    "I'm hiring! Senior Communications Manager at Royal Mail - United Kingdom'

    Thanks R.M.!

    I re-iterate:
    "Totally agree that the rules/reason for the rules are not their fault - my problem is with the way that they told the public one thing & the poor old staff another!

    And sprung it on the public without notice - don't forget, even Ebay didn't realise until a while after it was affecting sold listings.''


    I'm sure that something will be worked out & maybe we will be told about it when it is!
    The online retailers are trying to find carriers, so hopefully there will be a way.

    How much money & goods are lost by people in the meantime remains to be seen - one Ebay seller has apparently lost about £800 in destroyed goods so far.

    Thank you for your help @mumsy - sorry, affecting a lot of small businesses/start-ups I imagine.

    Link for Tucker so he can apply for a new job:-
    http://www.linkedin.com/jobs?viewJob...=jobs_share_fb
    Last edited by lpp; 15th February 2013 at 02:24 PM.

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