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  1. #121
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by kumquat View Post
    I guess I may be the only one who is not convinced by the testing on paper strips.
    Most perfumes, even the greatest ones, are composed while testing on high quality smelling strips. In general, most of the great perfumers tend to prefer smelling strips for smelling a wide variety of finished perfumes
    Last edited by pluran; 16th April 2014 at 09:54 PM.

  2. #122
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Still, it seems that, for the purposes of reviewing it is more useful to ascertain how it performs when worn. I just can't get much information from this clinical/detached approach.

    I need wafting. If I don't get wafting, I lose interest. :-(

  3. #123
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by kumquat View Post
    Still, it seems that, for the purposes of reviewing..............
    I understand what you're saying but the perfumers do a lot more reviewing than anyone here.


    Wasser and Guerlain


    Octavian Coifan


    Mathilde Laurent


    Jean-Paul Guerlain


    Maurice Roucel

    Someone at Guerlain told me that Jean Paul always has a bunch of them in his pocket. Also have to realize that these guys - great perfumers, Turin, etc, have far better noses than the average person when it comes to understanding what they're actually smelling. And don't forget that it was the great perfumers themselves who wanted more of Luca's reviews back in the early 90's.


    Tania Sanchez smelling perfume on Luca Turin's skin :-)
    Last edited by pluran; 26th April 2014 at 01:07 PM.

  4. #124

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    I had never read any Luca Turin on any medium until a couple of months ago, and I have rapidly come to the conclusion (and this is an analogy that you probably have to be British to get this analogy) that he's the Charlie Brooker of the perfume world.

    If I want to listen to a highly subjective and generally depressing diatribe about a scent which I've never smelled and which includes literally nothing which will further inform me about what makes up the fragrance then Luca Turin fits the bill. I've yet to find any reviews which are informative or which could help to educate me as to whether I would want to try the fragrance; they just seem to assume that he's discussing the fragrances with people who have already experienced them. If I'd already smelled them then why would his opinion of the fragrance change my opinion of it?

    He's just a person, and his opinions don't seem to tally particularly with mine on most of the reviews that I've read, so I'm not minded to give his opinions more credence than those of anybody else. If I like a perfume then I don't particularly care if some 'authority' somewhere is sneering about it.
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  5. #125

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Have you read The Guide, kumquat? They explain that in the modus operandi that scents are sampled on strips and then if they seem interesting enough tried on skin as well. This is pretty much how I have done it for years - if I can smell a cheap aromachemical on paper or another wannabe clone of something done with less finesse why bother wearing the thing? In the face of hundreds of perfumes to review, and given the above - that strips are a neutral testing (and also composing) ground for perfumers and reviewers alike - this makes sense to me.
    Last edited by mr. reasonable; 16th April 2014 at 11:07 PM.
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  6. #126

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    100% right. i have the same feeling. Even the review of the ones I know always leave me thinking a Luca Turin should have done much better.

    Quote Originally Posted by sfmedusa View Post
    I had never read any Luca Turin on any medium until a couple of months ago, and I have rapidly come to the conclusion (and this is an analogy that you probably have to be British to get this analogy) that he's the Charlie Brooker of the perfume world.

    If I want to listen to a highly subjective and generally depressing diatribe about a scent which I've never smelled and which includes literally nothing which will further inform me about what makes up the fragrance then Luca Turin fits the bill. I've yet to find any reviews which are informative or which could help to educate me as to whether I would want to try the fragrance; they just seem to assume that he's discussing the fragrances with people who have already experienced them. If I'd already smelled them then why would his opinion of the fragrance change my opinion of it?

    He's just a person, and his opinions don't seem to tally particularly with mine on most of the reviews that I've read, so I'm not minded to give his opinions more credence than those of anybody else. If I like a perfume then I don't particularly care if some 'authority' somewhere is sneering about it.

  7. #127
    kumquat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by mr. reasonable View Post
    Have you read The Guide, kumquat? They explain that in the modus operandi that scents are sampled on strips and then if they seem interesting enough tried on skin as well. This is pretty much how I have done it for years - if I can smell a cheap aromachemical on paper or another wannabe clone of something done with less finesse why bother wearing the thing? In the face of hundreds of perfumes to review, and given the above - that strips are a neutral testing (and also composing) ground for perfumers and reviewers alike - this makes sense to me.

    I can understand shuffling through and eliminating the duds on paper, yes. I just don't get reviewing them without trying them on. I try on everything I'm interested in.

  8. #128
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Someone here on BN recently said she hated Iris Silver Mist on paper so she wasn't going to try it on. That's a good example of a scent being sold short, IMO. ISM needs to warm up and meld with body heat. It's a cold scent but it morphs when it's heated up. Plus, it's an acquired taste and it grows on one. I didn't like it myself the first 2 times I tried it. But the wafting really makes a difference with a scent like that and it's magical.

  9. #129

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Take the guide and look up reviews on fragrantica. You will get a much better idea of what the fragrance is about. Luca made a list of perfumes in which many are blatant crap that had no reason to be reviewed except for him to tell a witty snide story. After you've tried it, maybe you can relate to Luca's story. I rather read a review by alaform or dead idol.

  10. #130
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    The one drawback to my idea about warming up perfume with body heat is that it won't work on vampires. :-(

  11. #131
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by mr. reasonable View Post
    Have you read The Guide, kumquat? They explain that in the modus operandi that scents are sampled on strips and then if they seem interesting enough tried on skin as well.........
    She's never liked Luca and goes to extremes to let everyone know. :-)

  12. #132
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Too extreme? I hope LT can take a little ribbing. He certainly knows how to dish it out.

  13. #133
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by kumquat View Post
    The one drawback to my idea about warming up perfume with body heat is that it won't work on vampires. :-(
    LOL!

    Don't worry - Dior Homme Eau For Men smells exactly the same on paper as it does on RPatz's cold vampire skin!

    Seriously, skin does benefit fragrances which need the basenotes to be pushed off hard. Typically, this muddles a scent relative to what you get on paper (and that's not even counting the destruction of some aromachemicals by skin enzymes and those freeloading one-celled "guests"), but it can also help things that rely on heavier stuff volatilizing to make the heart work. Personally, I don't think that a scent which sucks on paper or skin can go 5-star on the other, but I do think that an opinion could vary slightly (half a star?) based on whether something performs optimally or not. The fact that Ann Gottlieb tests Axe candidates on skin for the evaluation of briefs shows that skin does matter. I just don't think it can save the irredeemable - even by just one star.
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  14. #134
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by kumquat View Post
    Too extreme? I hope LT can take a little ribbing. He certainly knows how to dish it out.
    Everybody deserves a good nuggie now and then!

    Personally, I think our "One Star Synchronized Scent Day" back in 2008 was not only hilarious, but showed just how good (and BAD) some of Luca's 1-star wonders are.

    http://www.basenotes.net/threads/211...cent-Synch-Day!!!
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  15. #135
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Just found out that Mechant Loup had one star rating. How funny! Oy!

  16. #136

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by pluran View Post
    I understand what you're saying but the perfumers do a lot more reviewing than anyone here. :-)



    Wasser and Guerlain



    Jean-Paul Guerlain

    Someone at Guerlain told me that Jean Paul always has a bunch of them in his pocket. Also have to realize that these guys - great perfumers, Turin, etc, have far better noses than the average person when it comes to understanding what they're actually smelling.
    This is a point I've argued against more than once in the past. That is, perfumers have a certain kind of experience, and of course a whole lot of knowledge on the general subject, but that doesn't mean they will be of much to me personally. How many of them have studied the vintage greats for hours on several occasions and then written about their experiences? That is what I'm interested in - I really don't care what the latest "bit hit" designer scent smells like on a piece of paper, and probably not at all.

  17. #137
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by CapriDog View Post
    Just found out that Mechant Loup had one star rating. How funny! Oy!
    Exactly! I think that the more experience one has, the more one can see and appreciate the subjectivity of the ratings, which makes them far less threatening, and even funny in a rather endearing way. I see that one of my favorite Chanels with a dubious but rather enjoyable synthetic citrus has a 1-star rating, and I want to wink and cry out, "OH, THE HUMANITY!"
    * * * *

  18. #138

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by elevation View Post
    I rather read a review by alaform or dead idol.
    Agree!!! (add darvant, foetidus, sirslarty, jackhunter, Jamie, dimaondflame etc to the mix)

  19. #139

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    I rather read a review by alaform or dead idol.
    Quote Originally Posted by badarun View Post
    Agree!!! (add darvant, foetidus, sirslarty, jackhunter, Jamie, dimaondflame etc to the mix)
    No offense to the people you mentioned, but you're high. Both of you are high. You know, as in licking coconut skins and burning down trees high.

  20. #140

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    I wonder if there are other restaurant, book, movie, or art critics who are slated as much as Luca Turin is for his perfume criticism. There are film critics I love and those I wouldn't bother reading, but I can't imagine having the energy to be as vitriolic about any of them as some of Luca's detractors here. I think the fact that people are so passionately against him means he must be doing something right.

    He's one guy with an opinion. It happens to be an extremely educated opinion (and not just about perfume - he knows a lot about culture and science and history, and if you can't see that from reading his reviews, then you're not really reading his reviews), but he's not forcing anyone to agree with him.

    For some who are new to perfume, the sheer huge-ness of the selection out there can be intimidating and tiring, and it's helpful to have a place to start. The Guide can provide that starting point, like a knowledgeable person saying "ok, here, these are the ones I like, so maybe try these first." But anyone with half a brain will make up his own mind and form his own opinions.

    When I started I didn't have that knowledgeable person and I didn't know about Basenotes, so I found Luca and Tania very helpful.

  21. #141

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    And before anyone gets their panties all up in a bunch I would also like to add that your (badarun and elevation) opinions are not right or wrong and neither are my opinions right or wrong. We all gravitate to who who gravitate. I still think you are both high, but opinions vary and that is OK.

  22. #142

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by kumquat View Post
    I guess I may be the only one who is not convinced by the testing on paper strips.
    There's definitely some validity to this! However, what Luca and Tania provide are not really extensive, in depth analyses; their reviews really are more like snapshots filled with wit and, at times, some brilliant observations. It really takes days, possibly even longer to get a fully fleshed out overview of what scents are doing. So perhaps it's better to approach their reviews from that angle?
    Quote Originally Posted by sfmedusa View Post
    I had never read any Luca Turin on any medium until a couple of months ago, and I have rapidly come to the conclusion (and this is an analogy that you probably have to be British to get this analogy) that he's the Charlie Brooker of the perfume world.

    If I want to listen to a highly subjective and generally depressing diatribe about a scent which I've never smelled and which includes literally nothing which will further inform me about what makes up the fragrance then Luca Turin fits the bill. I've yet to find any reviews which are informative or which could help to educate me as to whether I would want to try the fragrance; they just seem to assume that he's discussing the fragrances with people who have already experienced them. If I'd already smelled them then why would his opinion of the fragrance change my opinion of it?

    He's just a person, and his opinions don't seem to tally particularly with mine on most of the reviews that I've read, so I'm not minded to give his opinions more credence than those of anybody else. If I like a perfume then I don't particularly care if some 'authority' somewhere is sneering about it.
    Ha! I love Charlie Brooker. He can be brutal at times, but his observations are pretty smart and often on-point. I'd argue it's the same with L+T, but also keep in mind that there are many glowing, positive reviews in The Guide as well—it's not all snark and take-downs!
    Quote Originally Posted by kumquat View Post
    I can understand shuffling through and eliminating the duds on paper, yes. I just don't get reviewing them without trying them on. I try on everything I'm interested in.
    This is an interesting point though, as there are a number of duds that enter the guide. They do outline the process at the outset, but they do review garbage as well. I mean I can't imagine that anyone would approach this recent Givenchy scent and expect much from it. In fact, I can't imagine that Givenchy themselves think too highly of it
    Quote Originally Posted by elevation View Post
    I rather read a review by alaform or dead idol.
    I don't know; I've heard that Alaform chap can be a bit dodgy
    Quote Originally Posted by kumquat View Post
    Too extreme? I hope LT can take a little ribbing. He certainly knows how to dish it out.
    He does. I've met him, and he can certainly take it. Some of the responses that he gets on here though can take it a little too far and both he and Tania have been subject to some pretty vicious personal attacks from some of our less-than-civil members. It's a good reminder that we're talking about scented liquids and no-one's manhood (or womanhood) is being attacked! They're just opinions—many of which are pretty snarky.
    Quote Originally Posted by Indagnacious View Post
    I rather read a review by alaform or dead idol.
    No offense to the people you mentioned, but you're high. Both of you are high. You know, as in licking coconut skins and burning down trees high.
    How. Dare. You.


    Quote Originally Posted by Kagey View Post
    I wonder if there are other restaurant, book, movie, or art critics who are slated as much as Luca Turin is for his perfume criticism. There are film critics I love and those I wouldn't bother reading, but I can't imagine having the energy to be as vitriolic about any of them as some of Luca's detractors here. I think the fact that people are so passionately against him means he must be doing something right.

    I love me some good snark, and I get it spades from these two. While I certainly consider their opinions and expertise, I recognize that perfume appreciation is almost entirely subjective, and so it's the form of their writing that I'm most enamored with. To be honest, there are very few people that I listen to for direct suggestions—and that's not because I don't trust or respect the opinions of others, but it's in my nature to want to explore things on my own. Have fun with their reviews, but take them for what they are—informed, yet still subjective, opinions.

    He's one guy with an opinion. It happens to be an extremely educated opinion (and not just about perfume - he knows a lot about culture and science and history, and if you can't see that from reading his reviews, then you're not really reading his reviews), but he's not forcing anyone to agree with him.

    For some who are new to perfume, the sheer huge-ness of the selection out there can be intimidating and tiring, and it's helpful to have a place to start. The Guide can provide that starting point, like a knowledgeable person saying "ok, here, these are the ones I like, so maybe try these first." But anyone with half a brain will make up his own mind and form his own opinions.

    When I started I didn't have that knowledgeable person and I didn't know about Basenotes, so I found Luca and Tania very helpful.
    I get where the detractors are coming from—and I understand how people can get bent out of shape when their taste is knocked. But it's pretty obvious that a number of the more aggressive detractors haven't really read that much of their work or are simply taking it all a bit too seriously. There are some solid, thoughtful detractors in this thread, I'd argue. Valid points coming from both sides!

    L+T's writing is, by turn, smart, literate, pithy, hilarious, critical, analytical, and often dismissive—they cover a lot of ground in a very short space. In no way should it be read as gospel, and many of their more reasonable detractors understand that, laugh it off, and can at least appreciate the sauciness.
    Last edited by deadidol; 17th April 2014 at 07:20 AM.

  23. #143

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    If a fragrance smells hideous on a strip, why waste time spraying it on your skin? Your body ain't gonna make it divine.

  24. #144

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by deadidol View Post

    I don't know; I've heard that Alaform chap can be a a bit dodgy!
    How. Dare. *YOU*!!!


    Discover my Guest Reviewer Of The Day here

  25. #145
    Dependent pluran's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kagey View Post
    I wonder if there are other restaurant, book, movie, or art critics who are slated as much as Luca Turin is for his perfume criticism.............
    "Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds." Albert Einstein
    Last edited by pluran; 17th April 2014 at 11:06 AM.

  26. #146

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Alfarom & D.I. - you're equally dodgy imo - but thanks for the reviews both

  27. #147

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kagey View Post
    I wonder if there are other restaurant, book, movie, or art critics who are slated as much as Luca Turin is for his perfume criticism. There are film critics I love and those I wouldn't bother reading, but I can't imagine having the energy to be as vitriolic about any of them as some of Luca's detractors here. I think the fact that people are so passionately against him means he must be doing something right.

    He's one guy with an opinion. It happens to be an extremely educated opinion (and not just about perfume - he knows a lot about culture and science and history, and if you can't see that from reading his reviews, then you're not really reading his reviews), but he's not forcing anyone to agree with him.

    For some who are new to perfume, the sheer huge-ness of the selection out there can be intimidating and tiring, and it's helpful to have a place to start. The Guide can provide that starting point, like a knowledgeable person saying "ok, here, these are the ones I like, so maybe try these first." But anyone with half a brain will make up his own mind and form his own opinions.

    When I started I didn't have that knowledgeable person and I didn't know about Basenotes, so I found Luca and Tania very helpful.
    Right, but I do have one big criticism of the book, which is that it should have been called "The Tongue in Cheek Guide" or "A Whimsical Guide," or else it should have been more rigorous and consistent. That said, it has plenty of value, especially to the newbie (assuming he or she doesn't "take it as gospel"), and I don't see the need for emotional invective. Moreover, there are many imprecise elements involved, and we often see that online, such as reviews that claim a scent is a fougere even though there's no lavender or coumarin in it! If a person says the scent possesses a "fougere vibe," is that acceptable? We don't have a Pope of Perfumery, so it seems that for the near future it's not reasonable to expect any one book to solve all the issues that arise in online discussions.
    Last edited by Bigsly; 17th April 2014 at 08:56 PM.

  28. #148

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bigsly View Post
    Right, but I do have one big criticism of the book, which is that it should have been called "The Tongue in Cheek Guide" or "A Whimsical Guide," or else it should have been more rigorous and consistent. That said, it has plenty of value, especially to the newbie (assuming he or she doesn't "take it as gospel"), and I don't see the need for emotional invective. Moreover, there are many imprecise elements involved, and we often see that online, such as reviews that claim a scent is a fougere even though there's no lavender or coumarin in it! If a person says the scent possesses a "fougere vibe," is that acceptable? We don't have a Pope of Perfumery, so it seems that for the near future it's not reasonable to expect any one book to solve all the issues that arise in online discussions.
    I think it's entirely possible that "The Guide" was a somewhat tongue in cheek title. But I also think you miss the point of criticism. Perception of perfume is highly subjective and people will always disagree about smells. What- should we tell critics that they're only allowed to talk about the actual aroma chemicals that went into a perfume, stick to the "facts," and withhold any opinion or impression (which would be a neat trick given that perfume houses don't give us complete information about compositions)? That would be like saying an art critic is only allowed to talk about the chemical composition of the paint in a Mark Rothko.

    I'm very thankful that there is no Pope of perfumery. Discussion of fragrances might be quite boring if there were. And The Guide is not the bible, but Turin and Sanchez never claimed it was.

  29. #149

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kagey View Post
    I think it's entirely possible that "The Guide" was a somewhat tongue in cheek title. But I also think you miss the point of criticism. Perception of perfume is highly subjective and people will always disagree about smells. What- should we tell critics that they're only allowed to talk about the actual aroma chemicals that went into a perfume, stick to the "facts," and withhold any opinion or impression (which would be a neat trick given that perfume houses don't give us complete information about compositions)? That would be like saying an art critic is only allowed to talk about the chemical composition of the paint in a Mark Rothko.

    I'm very thankful that there is no Pope of perfumery. Discussion of fragrances might be quite boring if there were. And The Guide is not the bible, but Turin and Sanchez never claimed it was.
    We'll have to agree to disagree then, as "The Guide" is the height of pretension IMO. And I never suggested that a Pope of Perfumery is a good idea; the rest of your comment I find incomprehensible, so I can't comment on it.

  30. #150

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bigsly View Post
    the rest of your comment I find incomprehensible, so I can't comment on it.
    Sorry- didn't mean to be confusing. I was just responding to your point that the book should have been more rigorous and consistent. I was trying to figure out how you do that when perfume is so subjective. Every review is someone's personal reaction, colored by her experience, knowledge, prejudices, etc., as well as the subject (perfume in this case) itself.

    Pretentious might be a fair call. But that's something different altogether.

  31. #151
    Basenotes Junkie SirNosebleed's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    His latest two reviews are up, and they are extremely entertaining to read. Incredibly well written.

  32. #152

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bigsly View Post
    Right, but I do have one big criticism of the book, which is that it should have been called "The Tongue in Cheek Guide" or "A Whimsical Guide," or else it should have been more rigorous and consistent. That said, it has plenty of value, especially to the newbie (assuming he or she doesn't "take it as gospel"), and I don't see the need for emotional invective. Moreover, there are many imprecise elements involved, and we often see that online, such as reviews that claim a scent is a fougere even though there's no lavender or coumarin in it! If a person says the scent possesses a "fougere vibe," is that acceptable? We don't have a Pope of Perfumery, so it seems that for the near future it's not reasonable to expect any one book to solve all the issues that arise in online discussions.
    For the kind of guide you want about more precise elements, I think you are looking for Michael Edwards' Fragrances of the World.

  33. #153

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    I think people may be forgetting the sheer breadth of reviewing over a thousand perfumes. Anyone who has written a review with some deliberate thought knows that it takes a little time. To wear, test, and write three a day would take a year. Who here could imagine doing three a day EVERY day for a year? Reviews aren't LT's main gig. He's always been more into the hard-core science academic side of things. Combine your day job with writing a book and I'm sure you could see the limitations....thus perfume strips, thus some short reviews. And until the general public gets caught up with the level of passion that most of us Basenoters have toward perfumes, I don't think too many people are going to be making the sort of living they want to be making as perfume reviewers. It's better than it ever was, but there's still a long way to go.
    Last edited by Indagnacious; 18th April 2014 at 09:18 PM.

  34. #154
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Such an amusing thread. The perfume world is so lucky to have Luca Turin around. Many great reviewers on various sites, including this one, use his words and ideas (Basenotes' own serpent used them to great effect), but, not surprisingly, the ones who use his words and ideas the most are the people who attack him. In the past his reviews may have been primarily directed toward the perfumers, and while Perfumes: The A-Z Guide is an intriguing blast for everyone open to it, notice the dedication page, where it says: "For the perfumers".

    I love these editorial reviews from the first book. I just hope there's another one coming. And in case you didn't realize it, anyone here is free to write their own book.

    I completely agree that the book is as "gripping as any thriller" and that
    "Turin confirms his right to be classed alongside Proust". This book is a hundred times more compelling and contains far more relevant information than any perfume book ever published. It's like the distance between a hawk from the moon. Nothing is even close, and for many reasons nothing probably ever will be.

    Perfumes: The A-Z Guide
    (Luca Turin & Tania Sanchez)

    Editorial reviews: (I wrote them out, so if there's a mistake it's mine)

    “Their work is, quite simply, ravishingly entertaining, and it passes the high test that the high test that their praise is even more compelling than their criticism...Its blend of technical and evocative writing is exemplary in the strict sense; people who write about smell and taste in any context should use it as an example.” John Lanchester, The New Yorker

    “Along with being witty and knowledgeable about the chemistry and culture of perfume, Sanchez and Turin are whizzes at conveying, through words, all that the nose knows.” -Style.com

    “With Turin, Sanchez developed one of the most distinctive voices in fragrance writing” -Elle

    “Entertaining and indeed encyclopedic.” -Forbes.com

    “Unfailingly entertaining...This will be a must have...Their passion for a few scents and their outrage at the others’ failings make for entry after entry of hilarious, catty comments interspersed with occasional erudite, eloquent disquisitions.” -Publishers Weekly (starred review)

    “Perfumes: The Guide shines a bright, revolving searchlight over an extensive, potentially limitless smell-scape, and offers much to contemplate, even to regret, and most importantly alerts you to the need to set aside some fairly solid prejudices ...[The authors have] produced a provocative and hugely entertaining book.” -The Times Literary Supplement

    “Turin and Sanchez offer some of the most stylish, erudite and hilarious criticism in any subject field.” -The Dallas Morning News

    “Far more addictive that it has any right to be.” -The Guardian (U.K.)

    “[A] magnificent book that could do for the perfume industry what the best guides do for wine...It opens the mind to the vivid intricacies of scent and is a cracking good read.” -The Daily Telegraph (U.K.)

    “Perfumes: The A-Z Guide is one of the best books I have ever read. It is dazzlingly good.” -India Knight, The Sunday Times (U.K.)

    “Dazzling insight abounds in Perfumes...shocks with originality.” -Maclean’s

    “Forget everything you have read about [scent] and grab a copy of Perfumes...a work as gripping as any thriller.” -Jan Moir, The Daily Mail (U.K.)

    “On one level this is a serious, instructive tome. On the other it is an addictive, dip-in-and-outable romp through some of the greatest and worst scents ever produced.” -Daily Express (U.K.)

    “There is a great tradition of olfactory literature, and in Perfumes Turin confirms his right to be classed alongside Proust or Patrick Suskind as a poet of smell.” -The Observer (U.K.)

    “No one can doubt that they’ve written a work of the highest criticism , one which elevates writing about perfume to the best sort of writing about wine or rock music.” -Philip Hensher, The Independent (U.K.)

    “They make it so entertaining, you don’t even have to like perfume to enjoy perfume to enjoy reading about it.” -The Denver Post

    “Compelling because it’s arrestingly honest, passionately poetic.” Grazia (Australia)

    “(My) favorite book of open-sky criticism this year.” - Dwight Garner, “Paper Cuts” (the New York Times blog)

    “[T]his bigoted, snarling, monomaniacal, subjective, triumphalist and quite magnificent book.” -Prospect (U.K.)

    “[N]othing less than an essential possession. Most books that are calles life-changing don’t make the least little difference to anybody whatsoever. In its own field, this one deserves the name.” - Evening Standard (U.K.)

    “I breathed in, rather than read, in one delighted gulp; opinionated, knowledgeable, sharply written, and surprisingly comprehensive, it’s a purely enjoyably book.” -Hilary Mantel


    ______________________



    Luca Turin's "Duftnotes" Articles 2003 - 2010
    - http://doublebasenotes.blogspot.com/


    It would also be great to see Octavian Coifan replace all the great articles he wrote on his blog. As knowledgeable about perfume as anyone ever has been and writes just as well. He removed 99% of what was there. There was a massive amount of it. http://1000fragrances.blogspot.com/



    Last edited by pluran; 2nd May 2014 at 02:47 AM.

  35. #155

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Sure. Le Guide was brilliant. Besides, who ever expects to agree with critics all of the time? Movies? Check. I've seen some duds because I read good reviews. Restaurants? Check. Shoes? Them, too.

    The problem arises when readers' opinions don't match those of the reviewer. Some people feel ashamed, as if they might have misunderstood something that superior people understand. Other people are frustrated because critics got to tell the whole world something negative and affect sales, while supporters remain mute and ineffectual. Yet other people are angry when they trust reviews and spend their money, and their experiences don't live up to the hype.

    Like pluran said, though, everyone is free to write a book. Turin put in many years of research and work in order to reach the level of "expert." At least he knows more about his subject than most of the stars of reality TV. To me, the unfortunate aspect of today's public taste is that shock value sells entertainment media.

  36. #156

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    I fell down the perfume rabbit hole after purchasing a copy of 'The Guide'. Did I treat it as gospel initially? Probably - I didn't know much, and I sought out the things flagged out as good. As time went past, however, I found myself knowing what I liked and being better able to form my own views. I think Luca Turin has done a great service to the perfume community by getting newbies interested in the first place.
    Last edited by joshuaang; 25th April 2014 at 12:20 PM.
    Check out my perfume blog, The Smelly Vagabond: http://thesmellyvagabond.wordpress.com

  37. #157

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    I've just spent a few days in Vienna and couldn't avoid repeating to myself the sentence about the Ottoman Empire bringing administrative inefficiency and baggy trousers in areas that would otherwise have been irremediably German!
    (LT on Cuir Ottoman, a fragrance quite misreviewed by him, IMO. Love his writing- and Cuir Ottoman anyway!)
    "Your fragrance with a fume of iodine" L. Cohen

  38. #158
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by Indagnacious View Post
    I rather read a review by alaform or dead idol.


    No offense to the people you mentioned, but you're high. Both of you are high. You know, as in licking coconut skins and burning down trees high.
    pardon me, can anyone point me to where Darvant & Crew are? wanna help them with their....ummm....research
    improving olfactory environments one molecule at a time....

  39. #159
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by pluran View Post
    Such an amusing thread. The perfume world is so lucky to have Luca Turin around. Many great reviewers on various sites, including this one, use his words and ideas (Basenotes' own serpent used them to great effect), but, not surprisingly, the ones who use his words and ideas the most are the people who attack him. In the past his reviews may have been primarily directed toward the perfumers, and while Perfumes: The A-Z Guide is an intriguing blast for everyone open to it, notice the dedication page, where it says: "For the perfumers".

    I love these editorial reviews from the first book. I just hope there's another one coming. And in case you didn't realize it, anyone here is free to write their own book.

    I completely agree that the book is as "gripping as any thriller" and that
    "Turin confirms his right to be classed alongside Proust". This book is a hundred times more compelling and contains far more relevant information than any perfume book ever published. It's like the distance between a hawk from the moon. Nothing is even close, and for many reasons nothing probably ever will be.

    Perfumes: The A-Z Guide
    (Luca Turin & Tania Sanchez)

    Editorial reviews: (I wrote them out, so if there's a mistake it's mine)

    “Their work is, quite simply, ravishingly entertaining, and it passes the high test that the high test that their praise is even more compelling than their criticism...Its blend of technical and evocative writing is exemplary in the strict sense; people who write about smell and taste in any context should use it as an example.” John Lanchester, The New Yorker

    “Along with being witty and knowledgeable about the chemistry and culture of perfume, Sanchez and Turin are whizzes at conveying, through words, all that the nose knows.” -Style.com

    “With Turin, Sanchez developed one of the most distinctive voices in fragrance writing” -Elle

    “Entertaining and indeed encyclopedic.” -Forbes.com

    “Unfailingly entertaining...This will be a must have...Their passion for a few scents and their outrage at the others’ failings make for entry after entry of hilarious, catty comments interspersed with occasional erudite, eloquent disquisitions.” -Publishers Weekly (starred review)

    “Perfumes: The Guide shines a bright, revolving searchlight over an extensive, potentially limitless smell-scape, and offers much to contemplate, even to regret, and most importantly alerts you to the need to set aside some fairly solid prejudices ...[The authors have] produced a provocative and hugely entertaining book.” -The Times Literary Supplement

    “Turin and Sanchez offer some of the most stylish, erudite and hilarious criticism in any subject field.” -The Dallas Morning News

    “Far more addictive that it has any right to be.” -The Guardian (U.K.)

    “[A] magnificent book that could do for the perfume industry what the best guides do for wine...It opens the mind to the vivid intricacies of scent and is a cracking good read.” -The Daily Telegraph (U.K.)

    “Perfumes: The A-Z Guide is one of the best books I have ever read. It is dazzlingly good.” -India Knight, The Sunday Times (U.K.)

    “Dazzling insight abounds in Perfumes...shocks with originality.” -Maclean’s

    “Forget everything you have read about [scent] and grab a copy of Perfumes...a work as gripping as any thriller.” -Jan Moir, The Daily Mail (U.K.)

    “On one level this is a serious, instructive tome. On the other it is an addictive, dip-in-and-outable romp through some of the greatest and worst scents ever produced.” -Daily Express (U.K.)

    “There is a great tradition of olfactory literature, and in Perfumes Turin confirms his right to be classed alongside Proust or Patrick Suskind as a poet of smell.” -The Observer (U.K.)

    “No one can doubt that they’ve written a work of the highest criticism , one which elevates writing about perfume to the best sort of writing about wine or rock music.” -Philip Hensher, The Independent (U.K.)

    “They make it so entertaining, you don’t even have to like perfume to enjoy perfume to enjoy reading about it.” -The Denver Post

    “Compelling because it’s arrestingly honest, passionately poetic.” Grazia (Australia)

    “(My) favorite book of open-sky criticism this year.” - Dwight Garner, “Paper Cuts” (the New York Times blog)

    “[T]his bigoted, snarling, monomaniacal, subjective, triumphalist and quite magnificent book.” -Prospect (U.K.)

    “[N]othing less than an essential possession. Most books that are calles life-changing don’t make the least little difference to anybody whatsoever. In its own field, this one deserves the name.” - Evening Standard (U.K.)

    “I breathed in, rather than read, in one delighted gulp; opinionated, knowledgeable, sharply written, and surprisingly comprehensive, it’s a purely enjoyably book.” -Hilary Mantel


    -- It would also be great to see Octavian Coifan replace all the great articles he wrote on his blog. As knowledgeable about perfume as anyone ever has been and writes just as well. He removed 99% of what was there. There was a massive amount of it. http://1000fragrances.blogspot.com/



    Nice!
    * * * *

  40. #160

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Looks like they are trying to get two more reviews up today:

    BEAUTY GUIDE
    Message in a Bottle: Viktor & Rolf and Hermès
    luca turin reviews bonbon and jour d'hermès absolu

    (From the main page, but following the link... it "doesn't exist")
    Having Simultaneous Affairs with: Amouage Memoir Man, Fate Man, Interlude Man, Epic Extrait (yep... the femme version), Tribute, Homage, Opus IV, VI, & VII • Puredistance M, Black • Tauer L'Air & Carillon pour un Ange • Knize Ten Golden • L'Artisan Al Oudh, Traversee du Bosphore, Dzing! • TF Noir de Noir • Xerjoff Homme, Richwood, Regio, 1861, 1888, Zafar • Serge Lutens MKK, Gris Clair, Fille en Aiguilles, La Myrre • H de Parfums 1740, Noir Patchouli, Tub3 Animale • Abdes Salaam Tabac, Sharif, Mecca Balsam • Slumberhouse Vikt, Baque • MDCI Invasion Barbare, Chypre Palatin • Nicoläi NY, Vie de Chateau Intense, L'Eau Mixte • Dior Leather Oud & Patchouli Imperial • Chanel Sycomore • Guerlain Derby, Songe d'un Bois d'Ete • MFK Oud Cashmere Mood • Ormonde Jayne Man

  41. #161

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Didn't he already review Jour d'Hermes EdT? Come on, Luca, we are jonesing hard and you are giving us scrapings from the pipe!

  42. #162

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    :-) The fragrances reviewed reflect the launches in the Gulf....

  43. #163
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by luca turin View Post
    :-) The fragrances reviewed reflect the launches in the Gulf....
    Welcome back! We are glad to see you
    improving olfactory environments one molecule at a time....

  44. #164

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Link to article, pls? Thankee.

  45. #165

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Here you go - arabia.style.com

  46. #166

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by lpp View Post
    Here you go - arabia.style.com
    Thanks, all. I have to say I'm particularly enjoying this thread and the opinions/emotions that Luca's words generate. Keep 'em coming.

    Best,

    Shashi
    CEO & Publisher, Style.com/Arabia

  47. #167

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Thanks for publishing them, Shashi

  48. #168

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by shashimenon View Post
    Thanks, all. I have to say I'm particularly enjoying this thread and the opinions/emotions that Luca's words generate. Keep 'em coming.

    Best,

    Shashi
    CEO & Publisher, Style.com/Arabia
    Thanks for providing a platform for some informed reviews (as opposed to advertorial fluff pieces) . . . where there's credibility, smart readers will congregate (naturally I include myself amongst said smart ones)
    “Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'”
    ― Isaac Asimov

  49. #169
    Moderator

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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by HORNS View Post
    Didn't he already review Jour d'Hermes EdT? Come on, Luca, we are jonesing hard and you are giving us scrapings from the pipe!
    LOL

    Apparently different enough that the reviews sound rather dissimilar, other than the central tea stuff. Gotta give him a little bit of flanker leeway - and room for the occasional 4- or 5-star fragrance!

    Jour d'Hermès (EDP): http://arabia.style.com/beauty/beaut...saab-hermes/#9

    Jour d'Hermès Absolu (EDP): http://arabia.style.com/beauty/beaut...rances-2014/#7

    I do like the original - I'll be interested to see if the Absolu does anything for me.

    Have to say that I'm disappointed about BonBon, but Spicebomb has left me happy for quite a while.
    * * * *

  50. #170

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kagey View Post
    Sorry- didn't mean to be confusing. I was just responding to your point that the book should have been more rigorous and consistent. I was trying to figure out how you do that when perfume is so subjective. Every review is someone's personal reaction, colored by her experience, knowledge, prejudices, etc., as well as the subject (perfume in this case) itself.

    Pretentious might be a fair call. But that's something different altogether.
    For what it is, I think the title just doesn't fit. And if your claim is correct, then nobody should use this title for such a book! Perhaps if one simply used GC/MS charts, with "expert" commentary on them, that title would make some sense. However, even then, there are just too many scents that have been marketed. A better title might be, "A Guide to the World's Most Popular Scents," if one were to include detailed "reviews" of as many scents as were in "The Guide" (and if the scents were indeed the most popular, obviously). Otherwise, as I said long ago, a title like, "Perfumes: A Tongue in Cheek Guide" would have made much more sense, IMO. Still, since there was (and still is) so little literature on the subject in book form, I consider my criticism to be minor, because all aficionados should consider owning it, even if he or she thinks the title is absurd.

  51. #171

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Personally I seem do not be interested in any other "expertise" of any perfume than how it clicks/agrees with my nose/skin/brain
    when I read any reviews, (can not say I read Turin ones though) I just sort of see between the lines - if the person does it casually for number of reviews or tries to go deeper, I often then go back to perfume to see that catchy perspective from another humans..soul..and sometimes I do find it, what I personally missed in it
    So some people with their reviews are capable to open their world of smells to me< but mostly - not)

    and thinking that no matter which are your intentions each review will get PROFIT to producers..hmmm...weird in some way

  52. #172
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    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    I like intelligent snarky writing and love the book - that being sad, I have bought some $200+ juice that got one star reviews :-)


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    improving olfactory environments one molecule at a time....

  53. #173

    Default Re: Why did Luca Turin dissapear from style?

    Thanks for the link! I enjoyed the reviews -- funny and enlightening -- with skillful writing that still incorporates his great use of metaphor, allegory, irony, and hyperbole. As far as the ratings go, agree or disagree -- it matters not.

    Now, once again, how can I find some fragrance samples in this cattle-and-corn state where I live?

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