Oh look, this thread again! It's called marketing, every company does it.
Thread: What a load of BS
Top note: Windsor is a tour of the British Empire Edward once ruled. Its top note is British gin, Jamaican lime
and a touch of Scottish highland pine.
Middle note: "Duke of Windsor" roses, those he preferred in his own garden, the Nuits de Young variety.
Base note: Bahamian orange, Canadian cedar and a dab of Australian eucalyptus.
Don't you find it amusing when a house goes to such an extent to market its products & Mr Creed goes on to talk
about why batches vary citing the reason as harvests are different every year hence the fragrance is different,
I mean I don't believe why people don't find it insulting to their intelligence when such people lie to them.
No matter how expensive a fragrance is, I'm pretty sure its 96-98% synthetic and maybe 2% natural,
I may be wrong about that, but i'm pretty sure the British gin and the Australian eucalyptus are not sourced from where
they are claimed, and are just synthetic molecules created in a laboratory somewhere.
Do share your thoughts.
Oh look, this thread again! It's called marketing, every company does it.
I don't mind it. Great scents, the best IMHO. Is it all fact in the marketing? I could care less. How they smell is all I care about.
Agree with you. Marketing is marketing, but there are ridiculous levels. In any case, kudos for managing to convince people to part with their money this way, and managing to enter US mainstream distribution of high end department stores. Clive Christian is following in the footsteps, but I think somewhat less successfully.
Bond no 9, if I am not mistaken, was created by a former Creed marketer who correctly thought the business model could be replicated also stateside. (With better bottles, at least).
They have to spice it up to get us excited..
Look at all the LuckyScent dramatic interpretations..
I don't disagree with any opinions here but in relation to Eucalyptus Oil, it is not exactly expensive here in Aust. I would think, and I could be wrong, that it would be much cheaper to source real oil here than to engage in synthetic uses.
I am going to say about 99% of Creed customers don't care about what the heck is in their juice. If it sounds good, it should smell good. I myself do find it somewhat insulting, yes, but it is what they actually produce that counts. Some of their fragrances are pretty darn good, not like their descriptions make them out to be, but that's marketing.
The premise of harvest would depend on percent yield, which in my mind has nothing to do with the quality of the juice. Why? Because chemistry has taught us to extract and remove the pure from the impure, meaning that there isn't any reason why the harvest would have anything to do with the quality of the smell when oils can be extracted and purified. Perhaps harvest would directly affect supply and demand.
Is the juice worth the squeeze?
They can create any ridiculous stories they want on their website - and long as they make stuff that I love, I don't care.
All food brands and restaurants claim to use the finest ingredients in the world. I doubt they all do. I don't think a multi-million dollar cultural icon drives a Fiat like I see in the commercial. I really doubt many celebs wear the fragrances that bear their name.
Also, I am assuming your 2 percent figure was just a guess? When a wine has better years no one questions that, but you do with this. Perhaps they are tweaking the formula based on market research? Have you personally experienced significant differences between batches?
Anyway, it's pretty rare to see advertising that doesn't sell the feeling and illusion and the dream along with the product.
And where did you read that? In a magazine - or did you have to seek it out on their website? I think Windsor is an amazing fragrance. Makes no difference to me what they write up about it on their website. I would rather have that than a boring sub-par fragrance whose creator has nothing really flattering to say about it. What made you go to the Creed website to read about Windsor?
Yes, Creed's marketing is often full of themselves. Having said that, after wearing several of their fragrances for a while now, I would buy them all over again, no regrets.
Papa John's uses only the finest ingredients in their pizzas. Better ingredients, better pizza. Papa Johns.
Notes are a very subjective experience. While predetermined notes descriptions may be a help up to a certain point, the ultimate factor is what is perceived and works on one's skin.
Logic should prevail here, IMO. That is, if your batches vary a great deal then you should label the bottles in an obvious way, not with a tiny number. And you should include an insert that explains the situation. So, my major complaint is that they seem to want to "have it both ways." The fans go crazy obsessing over batch codes while most buyers don't even know there has been any "controversy" over such matters. If they like the "Millesime" idea, then why don't they put a month and year on the label, and in large font on the front of the bottle? Otherwise, I do not accept any claim (made by them or another company) that batches can vary significantly. If that is the case then you must make sure that your customers know this !
Last edited by Bigsly; 20th January 2014 at 09:04 AM.
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Yes, Creed's fragrances are largely synthetic. Though they use high quality synthetic ingredients amongst natural ones.
Fun fact: Did you know John F. Kennedy wore Creed Vetiver? Well, actually JFK didn't wear it. Just an unnamed political family of profound style and influence.
Remember that while it is perfectly acceptable to criticize the content of a post - criticizing the poster is not.
Mean spirited, nasty, snide, sarcastic, hateful, and rude individuals on Basenotes don't warrant or deserve other individuals' acknowledgement or respect.
I see the Creed vitriol is in full effect on here again... Quelle suprise!!
There play on words and marketing sphill is comedy at best, irritating at worst, but as has already been underlined, the only thing that matters is how it smells...
I found myself in Libertys London mooching around the fragrance dept the other week rocking GIT, when i realised i became very self conscious due to all this bad attitude i read on here.
Its absolute nonscence, nobody commented negativley on how i smelt, in fact i gained a quite a few smiles and one compliment from an independant SA for another well known high end brand, even when its in there interest to make you swap from one brand to theres.
You keep thinking the way you do, you are entitled to your opnion, and im sure others are mature and independant enough to open there wallet and spend there money on whatever they feel like, not what others try to tell them to...
Maybe it appeals to the American market. It's all a bit
Not much different to putting a celebrity or NY on the packaging. One man's king Edward is another man's Beckham.
Last edited by Rüssel; 20th January 2014 at 10:38 AM.
'In 2009, Comme des Garçons felt it was necessary to do something in response to the general negativity engendered by the recession and to counter the feeling of things being blocked or stopped because of the crisis. BLACK Comme des Garçons was born.
2013 marks the regeneration of that concept through the launch of BLACK Comme des Garçons Eau de Toilette, an emergency, guerrillalike, spiced-up new scent.'
At least Creed aren't pretending to rescue us from financial misery.
Thanks. I won't buy anything that tries to romanticize the Duke of Windsor.
While I dislike Windsor specifically and am not a fan of Creed's marketing tactics generally, it is hard to argue against their sales results. As others have said, what the fragrance smells like is most important to me regardless of the actual ingredients or marketing gimmicks used. I just wish I were more impressed by the end results...
Current Top Favorites:
1) Portrait of a Lady original formula (EdP Frédéric Malle)
2) Giorgio for Men vintage/V.I.P. for Men (Giorgio Beverly Hills)
3) Dia Man vintage edt (Amouage)
4) Anat Fritz Original Formula and Classical (Anat Fritz) - tie
4) Lalfeorosa (O'driù) - tie
6) Les Nombres d'Or Vetyver (Mona di Orio)
7) Captain vintage (Molyneux)
8) Tzora (Anat Fritz)
9) Javanese Patchouli (Zegna) - tie
9) Monsieur de Givenchy vintage (Givenchy) - tie
9) Coeur de Vetiver Sacré (L'Artisan) - tie
9) X for Men (Clive Christian) - tie
9) Patou pour Homme Privé (Jean Patou) - tie
9) Oud Shamash (The Different Company) - tie
Today we thought we would start with the question, “What is a Millesime”? It’s a great question we hear frequently.
The word “millesime”, of course, appears on many CREED fragrance bottles, such as Royal Water, Tabarome or Imperial Millesime.
The “millesime” designation means that the best crops from a particular year’s harvest — be it bergamot from Sicily or lemon from Calabria — were used in the creation of that particular bottle of CREED fragrance. It is a mark of quality.
This raises a related question: Does CREED use 100% natural ingredients in its fragrances? This is a great query as the CREED family, based in France, takes enormous pride in each year selecting the best natural ingredients for their creations. Sixth-generation master perfumer Olivier CREED and his son, Erwin, travel to Bulgaria to meet rose growers, Parma to meet cultivators of violets, India to meet sandalwood foresters — indeed, they travel the globe — to personally inspect annual crops and choose the most fragrant for shipment to the CREED workshop in the French countryside.
In some locales, CREED’s relationships with growers date back generations. These strong ties help CREED obtain ingredients to which other perfume houses simply would not have access, such as responsibly harvested sandalwood from Mysore, India, the world’s best and most expensive, obtained only by following complex local rules and located in a place inaccessible by air.
Proudly, CREED is the strongest advocate for natural ingredients in fragrance.
Natural elements such as oils derived from floral blooms, leaves and stems, juices from fruit and their rinds, natural spices and woods are the main components of CREED. Still, even CREED must use a synthetic ingredient or two.
Creating a 100% natural CREED perfume is preferable, of course. But a natural composition would not survive the months-long journey that begins with hand bottling at the CREED workshop in France, sea shipping to the United States, clearance at the U.S. port and transportation by ground to CREED’s authorized retailers coast to coast — Neiman Marcus, Bergdorf Goodman, select Saks Fifth Avenue stores, select Nordstrom’s, select Bloomingdale’s and the new CREED boutique at 794 Madison Avenue in New York — if there were not a synthetic to prevent natural ingredients from spoiling along the way in the wide temperature variations that occur from, say, Boston to San Diego.
Nevertheless, CREED has been a friend of the environment for 250 years. And of course, all CREED products, including room sprays, are in recyclable glass bottles (with natural spray pumps).
The fact that it is nowhere mentioned what proportion is natural and what proportion is synthetic,
simply means it can be interpreted either way's. Neither is your opinion false nor is mine true.
I'm not naive enough to try and change anyone's opinion, all I'm trying to say is I don't like it when
a house that sell's such expensive cologne and makes claims regarding "Millesime" ,"Hand
assembling" ,"Natural ingrediet's" and "Pineapple from Timbuktu" keep's its users in the dark.
If a house is confident that it's claim's and facts are true, why not back it with reasonable & specific
proof, such as expected from a brand of such level, instead of being vague and saying " A synthetic
ingredient or two"
I have nothing against Creed, it's just that I won't be ignorant enough and let a Brand take me for granted
as a consumer, I don't like being fed unrealistic claims or being lied at, It may be the era of marketing, but
when you step over the line and start being unrealistic and make claims without sufficient & substantive
evidence, even though you might manage to capture a large number from your target market, you lose
a few consumers in that process.
I know many of you are not affected and enjoy the fragrance and judge it on the merit of how you perceive
it and not how it is sold, I respect your opinion , It's a much simpler life that way.
Just a note on batch variations. Every single house out there has batch variations. They just don't talk about it.
OP you say you have nothing against Creed, but then make two lengthy posts about how much they are deceiving people via their marketing?
I'm waiting for the men's fragrance with a picture of a woman giving a handjob on the front
The bullshit machine is full - let's cut to the chase
Sounds to me like you have an agenda. And it's not marketing/advertising related - it's Creed related.
"It may be the era of marketing, but when you step over the line and start being unrealistic and make claims without sufficient & substantive
evidence" -- I would be interested what products you actually allow yourself to buy then.
No offense to the OP, but pretty much every perfume you purchase is BS. Just look at the note pyramid of any fragrance. I would venture to guess the majority of the notes listed are synthetics. Sandalwood, Oakmoss, Oud and on and on and on.
So the question is, does marketing WORK on you?
Personally, I ignore marketing almost in its entirety, and what I do see of marketing tends to turn me off, rather than on. But it does work on the masses, that is why they do it.
Now for me, real marketing happens here on BN where you all are raving over a fragrance which urges me to give it a go.
Last edited by danieq; 20th January 2014 at 05:18 PM.
It's starting to feel troll-ish in here...
Last edited by kumquat; 20th January 2014 at 09:07 PM.
I find it incredible that colonialism is now used as a selling point. Celebrating the British Empire. Have they gone mad? That was an evil period full of horror for those who were ruled over. They should then include something about the wonders of the world's greatest international slave traders and how the Empire benefitted from it all. It's sickening what people will stoop to to make a buck.
Niche marketing has a lot of different takes, and the Creed version is just one of them. I find that most of niche marketing is basically "our fragrance is more obscure, more exclusive, more artistic, more hip, and/or more cerebral than all the others." And just like Creed, which actually does try to source better-than-average components for at least a part of their juice, there is some truth to the claim when it's not Creed. The "hot" anti-Creed niche tends to be fresher and closer to the cutting edge of perfumery fashion, unconstrained by mainstream tastes. Some people like that form of being relevant - I know I drift into it all the time, just like I'm tempted to renew my subscription to Wired periodically, between moments of being totally disgusted by trendy tech.
It's a lot like appealing to magazine readerships. Creed appeals to people who would not be ashamed to pick up a high-end home-and-gardening magazine. CdG - at their more staid end, appeals to somebody who would read Monocle, but is more generally appealing to Hi-Fructose readers. It's all good. Thank G_d we're not all reading the same stuff.
Build a better colonialism - because if history is any indication, it won't go away, and if the news is any indication, it isn't going away. We just have to try to make it better. More sensitive. Less militarist. More by letting others partake, rather than either forcing them to take, or giving with the expectation of something in return. Colonizing by attraction of people, if you will. That way, people can refuse. As opposed to bribed leaders, who tend not to.
Star Trek got it right - Prime Directive. Bit too late for that, but we can try to mitigate.
Yeah - it's the old-school version of appealing to those who admire the robber barons of Silicon Valley.
OMG - new fragrance line idea! Move over, Bond - your HTTP frag was weak, and it is about to be replaced by GEEK®. The fragrance of the technocracy.™
Same reason you could take a Bic pen, put a $1M price tag on it and someone will buy it.
I'll buy marketing hype all day long. But, yes, the Creed stuff is an insult to the intelligence, in my opinion. I agree with you.
Look at Hermes, in comparison. What's their message? Can you even detect one, other than, "This stuff is really expensive, it's really well-made, and we edit the collection for you so you can leave feeling as if you'll be attired in good taste." Ellena was a bit of a departure from that, I admit, at times, but that's the thread throughout the store.
Pretty much the same at Loro Piana? Yeah, I think so. What's the message at Le Labo? I can't even tell you, except maybe, "downtown, not your father's Oldsmobile."
Now, compare that to the Burger King paper crown packaging offered by Creed. It's almost like old casino interior decor. And that's just the packaging.
h8rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr rrrrrs g1a h8
You had to actively seek that out in order to be "insulted" by it.
I like when companies describe their products by shrugging their shoulders and mumble "I mean...I dont know....its ok I guess....whatever....."
Want to trade - Tauer LddM for Windsor, Amber Absolute, Gucci Envy....
CHEAP CREED SPLITS
Millesime Imperial, Green Irish Tweed
Eucalyptus oil is indeed, very cheap and plentiful. Not what call a rare thing.
"We don't know if you should buy our product. Between IFRA, the perfumer who quit half-way through development, and our company's sketchy back story, we sure wouldn't buy it."
"Don't buy this fragrance. Some of the chemicals have six-membered rings - just like that crap they dumped in West Virginia."
"We protest our fragrances. The ads exploit women, promote stereotypical gay images, and insult your intelligence. Boycott our large parent company that ruined this brand!"
As far as Creed goes, I've liked a few of their frags. I've never paid attention to their marketing stories, and I'm not sure why those who don't like their fragrances get more wrapped up in their marketing than their fans do.