Thread: Astronomical prices
I think I understand, if your point is that the new wave of high end 'niche' like lines, for example from designer houses (Boss, Cartier, Zegna) are overpriced and just cashing in on the trend.... that point I understand. Meaning the designer houses even if they're watered down versions of their old selves, at least there's a real history and brand there, but these new pretend ones are fake, then that point I get. But there are also many niche lines that are actually producing interesting (I don't say good) stuff and more of the asking price in theory is being directed to numerous 'real' activities like R&D, smaller production runs, packaging, etc instead of marketing.
but if your point is just that there's a lot of expensive perfume out there and it's crazy to expect people to pay for anything over $X, then see my earlier post
Tom Ford Splits:Noir de Noir, Neroli Portofino, Lavender Palm, Plum Japonais, Champacca Absolute, Tobacco Vanille ONE LEFT: Italian Cypress, Patchouli Absolu, Amber Absolute, Tuscan Leather, Oud Wood
Most of the time I am very proud of the Basenotes community. Time after time I have witnessed the thoughtfulness, empathy & genuine friendship that members of this community extend to others - oldtimers & newcomers alike. There are other times, however, when egos get the upper hand and civility goes out the window. My philosophy is that I won't say anything here that I would not say if you were standing in front of me. Welcome to Basenotes, each and every one of us. ~ TwoRoads
“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'”
― Isaac Asimov
CURRENTLY ACTIVE SPLITS:
TOM FORD Private Blend: Bois Marocain Reserve 2016 / Ombré Leather 16 / Vert d'Encens / Vert De Fleur
Comme des Garcons: Wonderoud ..... Amouage: Myths Man / Beloved Man / Interlude Man
Frapin: Passion Boisée ..... Valentino: Uomo Intense ..... Gerlain: Habit Rouge Dress Code
Le Labo: Thé Noir 29 / Poivre 23 ..... Christian Dior La Collection Privée: Vetiver / Oud Ispahan / Gris Montaigne
Maison Francis Kurkdjian: APOM pour homme / Cologne Pour Le Soir / Lumière Noire Pour Homme / Amyris Homme / OUD Satin Mood
Roja Dove: Amber Aoud Crystal Parfum / Aoud Crystal Parfum / Scandal Pour Homme EdP / Danger Pour Homme Parfum
Creed Les Royales Exclusives: Jardin d'Amalfi / Royal Mayfair / Spice and Wood / Pure White Cologne
With respect, I completely disagree with the comparisons to high performance vehicles.
I refuse to accept that MPG, L'Artisan, Diptyque, Aramis, YSL, Guerlain, Chanel, Hermes, PdN etc are Toyotas and that uber-priced fragrances like Tom Ford are Ferraris.
This is absolute nonsense.
Ferrari have built prestige by building cars that accelerate harder, travel faster, turn sharper and look better than average cars.
Much of this can be objectively measured and in so doing justifying a much higher price point.
I can select a number of sub $100 fragrances that last longer, have greater silage and smell better than many of the uber priced fragrances.
After many years on these boards, I have never seen any evidence that can justify the current wave of uber-pricing based on quality of ingredients.
What I can see is that some people are prepared to pay uber prices for exclusivity and marketing that gives them a warm, fuzzy feeling (and there is nothing wrong with this if you can afford it and this feeling is something you value).
Obviously the cost to produce certain fragrance is higher due to rarer ingredients, but I have never seen anyone present a costs case to justify the current wave of uber prices.
If you insist on using a car comparison, then it would be more correct to say that MPG, Diptyque, Aramis, Guerlain, Chanel, Hermes, PdN etc are Toyotas... and that fragrances from houses like Tom Ford are also Toyotas, but that your model will be a limited edition that no one you know will be driving, so you will feel special about your Toyota.... you will have to pay much more to be the only person you know with this limited edition, but if that makes you happy, Tom Ford is happy to please you.
I may be proven wrong, but after several years on these boards, this is how I see it.
One persons cheap is another persons expensive. I will buy a good fragrance that I love in the $300 range, but some prices are simply ridiculous! There is no way I will spend $1000 on a Roja Dove perfume. For heavens sake, that is simply not reasonable even for a split or a sample. But there are people that make a million a month or more that will. It's economics and, well, something I don't dare say. A fool and his money are soon parted. For that much money I would rather take a vacation. Annd I agree with the above post. Quality ingredients do not account for prices like that. It is a matter of greed and a way to seperate cash from the super rich in an attempt to become super rich.
1. Epic Man by Amouage (29 wears)
2. Leather Oud by Christian Dior (27 wears)
3. M7 by Yves Saint Laurent (22 wears)
4. Oud Imperial (black) by Perris Monte Carlo (21 wears)
5. Russian Tea Ritual by Masque (17 wears)
6. Fate Man by Amouage (17 wears)
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My fragrance blog: http://bigslyfragrance.wordpress.com/
Leaving aside collectors pieces in diamond encrusted bottles, there aren't really any astronomically priced scents, relative to say clothes.
The dearest I've come across was Clive Christian at 580 Euros (A$880) a bottle. That's around nine times the full price of a typical department store scent. Most other expensive scents aren't that dear.
But on the top floor of a department store here, I've seen jumpers for sale for A$6000 - which is 50 to 100 times the prices of their more typical good jumpers.
And there is one store here that sells neckties for A$400 each. I've only ever paid $20 for my ties (possibly because I hate neckties).
I'm sure that someone will come up with some scent that costs 50 to 100 times more than the typical department store scent, but it would be such a rarity that I think it immaterial to the general thrust of the discussion.
I don't understand this type of discussions about "astronomical prices" and even less the "value for money"-type of discussions when it comes to perfumes. Perfumes are luxury products. Noone needs perfumes in his or her life! If you like a frag and are willing to pay the price for it, then buy it! If you don't want to pay the price, then don't buy it! It won't kill you if you don't buy this perfume! I personally would be really angry if I couldn't afford bread and water anymore! That is something that you really need in your life!
Last edited by hoschhti; 6th May 2014 at 09:38 AM.
"Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"
1. Dia Man
3. Skin Graft
6. Hindu Kush
Colin, are you are the type of man that campaigns because the man down the end of your road has a mercedes on his drive and you have Renault on yours, because your male ego potentially feels a little battered and bruised?.. Id like to think not.
You can have any opinion about this mans Mercedes that you like, just as much as your entitled to love your renault, it doesnt make the blindest bit of difference.
Sometimes you should really listen to yourself and the things you say. There i ssomething called freedom of choice in the world, where as long as we are not hurting anyone else, we are entitled to buy what we like depending on various factors, mainly what we like (personal taste), and of course the reality sometimes of what our budget may be.
You should really stop this online bullying because that is what you basically do.
Last edited by DMA; 6th May 2014 at 09:59 AM.
It's just gouging imo. As long as people pay these prices, they will continue to be sold at such prices. You've got these "exclusive niche" houses coming out of no where and slapping a $200+ price tag on a fragrance, and once word of the house gets around, they are in business. I don't think they use much better fragrance oils than any other designer houses.. they do take more risks though, but is that worth paying so much for? I can assure you that after bottling and advertising and everything, these guys are making more than 10 times what they spent.
Ya figure a small bottle of say bergamot essential oil can be found for a buck, bergamot is a top note in most fragrances. They are using much larger quantities though, so I'm sure they get a bulk discount for buying in bulk, and it actually comes out to less than a buck (and now we've already verified from another thread that most perfumers don't make their own fragrance oils, they buy them). So let's say from their bulk discounts and everything, the amount of bergamot required for the top notes would be 20 drops, well from a 1 dollar bottle, 20 drops would probably be worth about 30-40 cents.. so if they're getting it at 75% off that price, they are paying about 10 cents for 20 drops of bergamot. So let's say there's 20 notes in a fragrance, the average price of each being about 10-20 cents.. well you do the math.. think how much they are profiting.
My Ultimate Top 5:
Le Vetiver Itasca (2010)
Burberry London (2006)
Eau des Baux (2006)
Arpege pour Homme (2005)
You are talking to someone from england, we dont go to gigantic warehouses to do our food shopping and buy 10 jars of some unheard of name brand of something for the store cupboard just to save 2 dollars, we do everything differently here, and it would stand you in good stead to always remember that..."
I think I have an idea what you were saying.
I expect your comments to be ignorant, childish and regularly incomprehensible due to your shocking spelling and grammatical skills but I find this actually offensive , not to mention racist.
"consumerism in UK isnt about discount retailers and customers demanding bargains even if that means buying things that the rest of the world lost interst in ten years ago," Tell that to the more than 900.000 people given emergency help from food banks in the last twelve months ( http://www.trusselltrust.org/stats) , or take a look at the "Poundland" and "Poundworld" shops springing up every week.
"the UK is very different," What ?????
"Nobody desires to walk around in the UK smelling of kouros or chanels anteus," So why are they still stocked in any decent boutique ??
"You are talking to someone from england, we dont go to gigantic warehouses to do our food shopping and buy 10 jars of some unheard of name brand of something for the store cupboard just to save 2 dollars" More astonishing generalization ignorance and racism.....
"It would stand you in good stead to always remember that" Why FFS ????????????
£8 - £30 buy!
£30 - £55 buy and review carefully
£55 - £80 probably buy but test over and over again till sure
£80 - £150 test constantly. Hesitate. Buy maybe once in four years special purchase.
£150 - £300 c'mon...no way
Plenty of good stuff in the lower price range
Martinijo, that guy is clearly trolling, don't waste your words on him
Why is perfume so expensive? It's not really. I remember Luca Turin talking about the price of Clive Christian in the Guide, and about how it was reputedly the most expensive perfume in the world per ml. He said that if you really wanted the most expensive perfume in the world, you would buy X kilos of pure orris butter from Florence, dilute it in perfumer's alcohol, and sell it off at around 500 euros per 50 ml. At that price, it would still be around ten times cheaper than Clive Christian X. His point was, the Orris butter tincture is the most expensive a perfume could get if you were basing the cost of the perfume on the cost of materials alone. In other words, materials make up a small fraction of the cost of a perfume, and marketing/product placement makes up for the rest. I would say, maybe 20% materials and 80% marketing. The comparison is inverted in the case of the luxury cars, where materials/performance, by necessity, makes up the bulk of the cost and marketing the rest, maybe 80/20 the other way. That makes sense - if the materials in the car are less than excellent, it can kill you, whereas a perfume will not. (Unless you are a member of IFRA and are eyeing up that oakmoss in that pre-reform bottle of Mitsouko you have on your vanity stand of course)
When choosing a perfume, a high price flatters us by assuming we have the money to pay and the taste required to discern that it is worth such a high price. Perfume companies know the psychology of buyers very well. A high price is simply another marketing tool, designed to make you feel like the King of Swing when you plonk down 600euros + for a bottle of Creed Jardins D'Amalfi. Price separates the people with good taste from the barbarians outside the gate, and again, the people who price these products are keenly aware of it. Price is not a barrier for the aspirational buyer, rather it is the hook. Now, for the rest of us, serious fans of perfume, the high price is a barrier.
If some here do not like this site then maybe they should find alternatives.
Your post was deleted as it was considered racist and that is obviously against the rules.
Please read the rules before any further posting.
There's a 'post' button and I suggest that you thoroughly read your posts in future prior to clicking it.