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  1. #1
    Renato's Avatar
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    Default Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    I just quickly counted about 10 threads on my first page display of 50 threads that relate to designer scents, and some of them are pretty old scents - not current fare really.

    i travelled around Europe last year, as well as going to Singapore and Dubai, and walked into lots of fragrance stores. For the most part, in the majority of fragrance stores, be they in Brussels, Amsterdam, Luxembourg, Bologna or my "home town" of Bassano Del Grappa, the scents are about 85% the same as what is sold down here in Australia, and in the duty frees at airports along the way, and in Singapore and Dubai.

    Those designer scents occupy a lot of shelf space in expensive locations - they have to be selling well, or the shops would go bust. Plainly lots of males (or their wives) are buying them.

    Yet in terms of discussion here, if I said that it was relatively minuscule in relation to the biggest selling scents in the world, I think I'd be overstating the situation.

    If I was someone who quite liked fragrances that are sold in stores worldwide, and who wanted some guidance, I suspect I'd be a bit perplexed if I came to this forum. As for me right now, I can't comment on around two thirds or more of the threads, mainly because I don't know the scents being discussed and am unlikely to ever come across most of them.

    Any thoughts?
    Cheers,
    Renato

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    As for European cities you cited above perhaps it's true, a lot of what is talked about here (niche) I imagine often is hard to find in stores there, but not true for Paris and other areas of France which I know well and which offer a lot of diversity and availability of the lesser known fragrances or ones talked about here. Also, in the States if you live in or in proximity to large cities like NYC, Los Angeles, Miami, San Francisco, Chicago etc. one would I guess feel less perplexed when reading on Basenotes about certain scents as there is better availability of niche as in other more remote areas. Just my thought.
    Last edited by hednic; 30th July 2014 at 06:04 AM.
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  3. #3

    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    You obviously live in a large city (Melbourne) so the high end stores there a bound to stock a fairly large range of niche fragrances. Niche fragrances are sold worldwide, just in higher end stores that's all. Not really that hard to find for the most part.
    Currently wearing: Poivre 23 by Le Labo

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato View Post
    Those designer scents occupy a lot of shelf space in expensive locations - they have to be selling well, or the shops would go bust. Plainly lots of males (or their wives) are buying them.

    Yet in terms of discussion here, if I said that it was relatively minuscule in relation to the biggest selling scents in the world, I think I'd be overstating the situation.

    If I was someone who quite liked fragrances that are sold in stores worldwide, and who wanted some guidance, I suspect I'd be a bit perplexed if I came to this forum. As for me right now, I can't comment on around two thirds or more of the threads, mainly because I don't know the scents being discussed and am unlikely to ever come across most of them.

    Any thoughts?
    Cheers,
    Renato
    What hednic said about the "larger cities" having availability to products that the smaller cities and more rural areas do not have is SPOT ON! That's VERY important to consider and keep in mind when people suggest various items.

    Also....I honestly think that another reason why this might be the case, is because there are many in the online fragrance forum community who like to "publicly display knowledge". It's kind of a power type thing. By naming ones that are little/ hardly ever/ never discussed as opposed to mentioning ones that are known by the "lesser informed (when it comes to fragrances)...it puts them in a more "informed" category and thus a position of being perceived as more knowledgeable. And with knowledge comes power. Also, people will therefore "respect" the Basenotes member that seems to "know more" than the others (and by mentioning rather obscure items as opposed to the more popular ones, they are achieving a bit of a "rep" as a more highly respected member of the forum)

    So, with an increase in forum approval by mentioning the lesser known scents, there is no benefit to mentioning the ones that already sell well, and that are already known, and that are already universally appealing to a wider audience.

    I'm sure there are several members who truly have the best intentions and who really want to help by mentioning "new and unknown" or "hidden gem" type fragrances....but a lot of times the ones mentioned come with a hefty price tag, which could suggest a bit of an affluent snobbishness on behalf of the one doing the suggesting as well. After all, not everyone wants to sink hundreds of dollars in to one bottle of a particular fragrance. Personally, I'm more impressed when relatively unknown fragrances with an inexpensive price tag are mentioned as opposed to the high dollar ones.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    I think a big problem is that the number of new designer frags launched each year has gone through the roof, all competing for store shelf space, but the number of well made ones has stayed pretty static. So as a proportion, the designer hidden gems have actually reduced and become even more hidden, and existing greats are getting pushed off the shelves by the new stuff (which are the only ones that also come with additional marketing material that the stores can use to make a promotional display). For example, it is next to impossible to buy Burberry London in a store in my town now, it used to be everywhere and where I live is not exactly small.


    It's no wonder a lot of people on BN have given up even talking about designer frags.
    Last edited by andym72; 30th July 2014 at 07:32 AM.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    I don't think that chasing down interesting new releases generally has anything at all to do with 'affluent snobbishness' , 'power' & stuff like that - it's more likely just passionate people wanting to share a new discovery imo.

    There's nothing much sold anywhere near me anyway, so my purchases are 99% made via the internet, whichever part of the market is under consideration.

    From reading the various sections here, people do share new low cost discoveries as well as the more expensive ones - Lomani being a recent example.

    I hope that I never stop exploring
    Last edited by lpp; 30th July 2014 at 09:30 AM.
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  7. #7
    Renato's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Quote Originally Posted by hednic View Post
    As for European cities you cited above perhaps it's true, a lot of what is talked about here (niche) I imagine often is hard to find in stores there, but not true for Paris and other areas of France which I know well and which offer a lot of diversity and availability of the lesser known fragrances or ones talked about here. Also, in the States if you live in or in proximity to large cities like NYC, Los Angeles, Miami, San Francisco, Chicago etc. one would I guess feel less perplexed when reading on Basenotes about certain scents as there is better availability of niche as in other more remote areas. Just my thought.
    True, but that's not really what i was mainly going on about. i can think of several score designer scent threads I've started here over the years, where I got zero responses - until you came along, and then I got one response.

    Despite the niche shops in Paris, I'm pretty sure judging by location and shop size, that most Parisian males would be wearing stuff they bought at Sephora. Same in Berlin where there seems to be a Douglas store every 500m walking along that main street which starts with a K but I can't pronounce.
    Regards,
    Renato

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Quote Originally Posted by rollzst View Post
    You obviously live in a large city (Melbourne) so the high end stores there a bound to stock a fairly large range of niche fragrances. Niche fragrances are sold worldwide, just in higher end stores that's all. Not really that hard to find for the most part.
    Niche stores go bust pretty quickly in Melbourne. There is a niche store in the Italian home town which has more niche scents in it than I've ever found in all of Melbourne when we did have lots of niche stores, and more niche scents than in any other European niche shop I've ever walked into.

    But that's a bit of a digression I started, where my main point was lack of discussion about what most guys actually wear.
    Regards,
    Renato

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Quote Originally Posted by SportsFan View Post

    Also....I honestly think that another reason why this might be the case, is because there are many in the online fragrance forum community who like to "publicly display knowledge". It's kind of a power type thing. By naming ones that are little/ hardly ever/ never discussed as opposed to mentioning ones that are known by the "lesser informed (when it comes to fragrances)...it puts them in a more "informed" category and thus a position of being perceived as more knowledgeable. And with knowledge comes power. Also, people will therefore "respect" the Basenotes member that seems to "know more" than the others (and by mentioning rather obscure items as opposed to the more popular ones, they are achieving a bit of a "rep" as a more highly respected member of the forum)
    Very true. But once we used to have experts in designer scents displaying their very useful advanced knowledge of those scents, in the same way that people with niche expertise do know.

    Most seem to have disappeared from here.
    Regards,
    Renato

  10. #10

    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    If certain scents are in a lot of shops one can simply try them out. Many people post here because they want an opinion about a scent that is not available locally. Isn't that fairly obvious?

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Quote Originally Posted by andym72 View Post
    I think a big problem is that the number of new designer frags launched each year has gone through the roof, all competing for store shelf space, but the number of well made ones has stayed pretty static. So as a proportion, the designer hidden gems have actually reduced and become even more hidden, and existing greats are getting pushed off the shelves by the new stuff (which are the only ones that also come with additional marketing material that the stores can use to make a promotional display). For example, it is next to impossible to buy Burberry London in a store in my town now, it used to be everywhere and where I live is not exactly small.


    It's no wonder a lot of people on BN have given up even talking about designer frags.
    Yes there is a large turnover - I know because when scents don't do well in Europe, they all wind up down here in Australia heavily discounted. In Europe last year, half the stores I walked into were offering me samples/sprays of Guess Seductive Homme which they were selling for 60 or 70 Euros. I got back to Australia six week later, and Seductive Homme was going for a measly $29.

    But does a scent have to be a "gem" to warrant discussion here, or to warrant not being studiously ignored should it be raised?

    To my mind, with thousands of shops selling a similar range of scents around the world in huge quantities to males - they ought merit some discussion. If one peruses the threads here, one would hardly know most exist.
    Regards,
    Renato

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Quote Originally Posted by Bigsly View Post
    If certain scents are in a lot of shops one can simply try them out. Many people post here because they want an opinion about a scent that is not available locally. Isn't that fairly obvious?
    So it's a forum for the discussion of men's fragrances, and fragrances worn by men - that rarely, if ever, mentions the vast majority of scents actually sold to men?
    Cheers,
    Renato

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Quote Originally Posted by lpp View Post
    I don't think that chasing down interesting new releases generally has anything at all to do with 'affluent snobbishness' , 'power' & stuff like that - it's more likely just passionate people wanting to share a new discovery imo.

    There's nothing much sold anywhere near me anyway, so my purchases are 99% made via the internet, whichever part of the market is under consideration.

    From reading the various sections here, people do share new low cost discoveries as well as the more expensive ones - Lomani being a recent example.

    I hope that I never stop exploring
    So was Ab Silver, which I bought - but didn't smell much like SMW to me.

    I guess my thought is that the way interests are expressed around here, most aren't exploring what is in the major stores - though there always exceptions - Midnight In Paris, being an example.
    Regards,
    Renato

  14. #14

    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato View Post
    But does a scent have to be a "gem" to warrant discussion here, or to warrant not being studiously ignored should it be raised?

    No, not necessarily, even if it's just for the BNers with experience to explain why they don't like something and to suggest alternatives.

    For instance, Armani Code is a big seller. I don't like the wood note in it, it irritates my nose. I'd recommend La Nuit L'Homme Parfum, AHS Eau Extreme, or Code Ultimate as alternatives.

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    Default Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato View Post
    But does a scent have to be a "gem" to warrant discussion here, or to warrant not being studiously ignored should it be raised?

    To my mind, with thousands of shops selling a similar range of scents around the world in huge quantities to males - they ought merit some discussion. If one peruses the threads here, one would hardly know most exist.
    Regards,
    Renato
    True, and we will observe this same effect in other enthusiast hobbies. Take automobiles.

    Is more discussion going to be engendered by the latest (or even classic) Maserati, Porsche, Ferrari, etc. Or instead by the latest Ford, Hyundai or Toyota?

    More often than not, the more exciting option will, regardless of whether it's more practical or not. Irrespective of the fact that more of us can't easily or conveniently acquire or use the more exciting option.

    I think this effect is expected.
    Last edited by JourneymanDave; 30th July 2014 at 11:04 AM.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Quote Originally Posted by andym72 View Post
    I think a big problem is that the number of new designer frags launched each year has gone through the roof, all competing for store shelf space, but the number of well made ones has stayed pretty static. So as a proportion, the designer hidden gems have actually reduced and become even more hidden, and existing greats are getting pushed off the shelves by the new stuff (which are the only ones that also come with additional marketing material that the stores can use to make a promotional display). For example, it is next to impossible to buy Burberry London in a store in my town now, it used to be everywhere and where I live is not exactly small.


    It's no wonder a lot of people on BN have given up even talking about designer frags.
    Can't find a Burberry London in London! I'd assume the Burberry store opposite harrods sell them but it would probably be full price.

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    On Fragrantica almost all discussion revolves around designer scents. Quite a different demographic there. They have the opposite problem - mention niche stuff and mot people never heard of it or tried it.

    While there are some "high end" stores available to me, I generally explore the world of niche (and designer) without leaving my home - I purchase dozens of samples every month from various sites and have them delivered to me. IMO, that's the only way to properly evaluate a scent anyway. If you don't live where any of those sites will deliver to, that is unfortunate. As for discussion, my collection leans slightly toward niche, but I do have quite a bit of designer stuff that I love and always enjoy writing/reading about.
    Current Summer Favorites:

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  18. #18

    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    The interesting challenge/situation would be to find a fragrance store located in a larger city that sells significant proportion of niche or at least designer exclusives/vintage/limited edition/discontinued/otherwise very artisan and uncommon fragrances and, apart from not going broke, also enjoys a certain popularity outside BN.

    Traveled too little so far to know whether such fragrance store actually exists, but if it does, would be among the first to visit and to more or less regularly purchase there.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    How much (more) is it worth discussing, for instance, Invictus by Paco Rabanne? It's sweet, fresh and inoffensive. It's so resolutely middle-of-the-road that the only thing you can think of saying is "I suppose it's fine". And many of the designer launches are just like Invictus. If the juice doesn't have any interesting facets, what are we going to discuss? I think members are good at sifting through the launches and generating threads about the most interesting of them.
    Last edited by furrypine; 30th July 2014 at 01:53 PM.
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  20. #20
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Plus, people can always check out the reviews for a variety of opinions on most fragrances.
    Directory contribution link:-
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  21. #21
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    I personally have quite a few Holes I can burrow for all kinds of scent and then there's the amazing WWW so no issue for me and you can always get samples from Decantshoppe ,TPC etc if you can't find them @your local Brick&mortar...
    "Thank GOD for the nose, for without it we would not be enjoying these beautiful created Scents" also Remember "Balance is everything and the key to appreciating "

  22. #22

    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    I'm on some coffee forums, and there's little talk about some kinds of coffee that the general populace drinks, and so similarly, a regular person wandering in wouldn't find much discussion of the coffee he often drinks. For example, enthusiasts don't talk much about Starbucks, mostly because we all think it's objectively and subjectively just plain bad coffee -- badly roasted, badly brewed. There's an element of snobbery too, of course, but someone with a demanding educated palate isn't going to sit around talking about Starbucks, just like people won't sit around here talking about Gucci Guilty or whatever.

  23. #23
    Renato's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Quote Originally Posted by JourneymanDave View Post
    True, and we will observe this same effect in other enthusiast hobbies. Take automobiles.

    Is more discussion going to be engendered by the latest (or even classic) Maserati, Porsche, Ferrari, etc. Or instead by the latest Ford, Hyundai or Toyota?

    More often than not, the more exciting option will, regardless of whether it's more practical or not. Irrespective of the fact that more of us can't easily or conveniently acquire or use the more exciting option.

    I think this effect is expected.
    Not necessarily.

    I belong to an astronomy forum , and yes people enthusiastically discuss their $800 Televue eyepieces, and $10,000 Takahashi telescopes, but they'll also happily discuss $29 plossl eyepieces and $600 dobsonian telescopes, and everything in-between.

    Same story at the Dpreview Sony forum, people enthusiastically discussing their $2000 A99 and latest $4000 lens, and also discussing the cheap A58 camera and $100 lenses, and everything in-between.

    At those forums, I never see anyone say Televue eyepieces are best and everything else is crap, or Sony Zeiss lenses are best, bin your Tamron lenses.
    Regards,
    Renato

  24. #24
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Quote Originally Posted by andym72 View Post
    No, not necessarily, even if it's just for the BNers with experience to explain why they don't like something and to suggest alternatives.

    For instance, Armani Code is a big seller. I don't like the wood note in it, it irritates my nose. I'd recommend La Nuit L'Homme Parfum, AHS Eau Extreme, or Code Ultimate as alternatives.
    Thanks, I agree in part, but what you then write sort of amplifies what I am trying to get at.
    What sort of discussion is it if a scent is accepted as something most people like, but it is then deemed flawed in some way, and "better" scents are suggested? (Not that I'm a fan of Armani Code).

    Regards,
    Renato

  25. #25
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Quote Originally Posted by dougczar View Post
    On Fragrantica almost all discussion revolves around designer scents. Quite a different demographic there. They have the opposite problem - mention niche stuff and mot people never heard of it or tried it.

    While there are some "high end" stores available to me, I generally explore the world of niche (and designer) without leaving my home - I purchase dozens of samples every month from various sites and have them delivered to me. IMO, that's the only way to properly evaluate a scent anyway. If you don't live where any of those sites will deliver to, that is unfortunate. As for discussion, my collection leans slightly toward niche, but I do have quite a bit of designer stuff that I love and always enjoy writing/reading about.
    Yes, when I want to read user reviews of scents nowadays, I head straight for Fragrantica. Their reviews remind me of the Basenotes reviews that were around the first five years after I joined.

    I haven't clicked on many of the obscure scent threads i see here, so i haven't seen you contributions on niche, but I often see you making good points on the few designer threads I click on.
    Regards,
    Renato

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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    I don't really agree. I see people suggest a bunch of designer stuff, and quite frequently. Dior / Chanel / Mugler / Tom ford / HM / Hermes...and the list goes on.

    I also don't see an issue with talking about niche stuff, or suggesting it. If one doesn't have access to this stuff, and isn't in close proximity to stores that sell it, where else are they going to be exposed to it? I know coming here has definitely opened my eyes to the joys of higher end fragrances. It's like Christmas now, every time I receive a box of samples .

  27. #27
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Quote Originally Posted by Ken_Russell View Post
    The interesting challenge/situation would be to find a fragrance store located in a larger city that sells significant proportion of niche or at least designer exclusives/vintage/limited edition/discontinued/otherwise very artisan and uncommon fragrances and, apart from not going broke, also enjoys a certain popularity outside BN.

    Traveled too little so far to know whether such fragrance store actually exists, but if it does, would be among the first to visit and to more or less regularly purchase there.
    Well, if you ever travel to Bassano del Grappa in Italy, go to Profumeria Lunardon. The closest thing to designer scents it stocks is Annick Goutal and Creed. Everything else is niche stuff I see mentioned here. It has been going for decades, despite there being four or five regular perfume shops a short walk away from it. Strangely, when I went there last year, a Douglas shop had opened right across the lane from it.
    Regards,
    Renato

  28. #28
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Quote Originally Posted by furrypine View Post
    How much (more) is it worth discussing, for instance, Invictus by Paco Rabanne? It's sweet, fresh and inoffensive. It's so resolutely middle-of-the-road that the only thing you can think of saying is "I suppose it's fine". And many of the designer launches are just like Invictus. If the juice doesn't have any interesting facets, what are we going to discuss? I think members are good at sifting through the launches and generating threads about the most interesting of them.
    You aren't that fond of Invictus - neither am I. Though I might pick a bottle up when it drops to $25.

    But I am fond of my 18Euro bottle of Roccobarocco Fashion Man which I am wearing today, it reminds me of Tobacco Vanille (similar vanilla effect, but my wife doesn't complain about it). I started a thread about it here with near zilch response.
    Regards,
    Renato

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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    I like the tone of these forums specifically because of the niche discussions. I live in a smaller city so my access to more exclusive fragrances is quite limited. I do still appreciate the discussions on an outstanding designer fragrance but I come here to broaden my horizons and that usually tends to lean to fragrances that aren't readily available to me.
    Currently wearing: Terre d'Hermès by Hermès

  30. #30
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    Default Re: Fragrances of the World vs Fragrances of Basenotes

    Quote Originally Posted by lpp View Post
    Plus, people can always check out the reviews for a variety of opinions on most fragrances.
    Problem with the reviews is that unless you know the reviewers, you often don't know whether they are reviewing a scent from the perspective of art/artisinal qualities or from the perspective of usefulness/agreeability with others.
    Regards,
    Renato

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