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  1. #1
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    Default $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    I'm always checking eBay for vintage Schiaparelli frags, and ran across this closed sale of an empty box which blew my mind, and might be of interest to others here.

    It's a Schiap I've never seen before, of interest on a few levels -- the closing price, of course, but also the name: Le Roy Soleil. Now of course this would mean "The Sun King" (Louis IV), but it's spelled wrong -- the correct French spelling is Roi, not Roy. Does anyone know anything about this frag or the odd spelling?

    (In case the link to the auction stops working, I saved two photos that I'm uploading here also. There was no size listed by the seller, so I can't help with that, but you can see that the base of it is as wide as the palm of a man's hand.)

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/OLD-FRENCH-L...-/111936828682


    Attachment 52600

    Attachment 52601

  2. #2
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    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    It's quite stunning and ornate.
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  3. #3
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    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Quite a presentation! I know nothing about it, but I do know that the Salvador Dali house has released a number of "Le Roy Soleil" fragrances/flankers, all spelled without an I.

  4. #4

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Quite beautiful. I suspect it would have been a store display item. I could be wrong but it does seem a bit on the large side for retail packaging.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Quote Originally Posted by Suspended View Post
    Quite beautiful. I suspect it would have been a store display item. I could be wrong but it does seem a bit on the large side for retail packaging.
    I'll bet you're right. The wide part of the clamshell must be at least 6"-7" across.


    Quote Originally Posted by IsoESuperman View Post
    Quite a presentation! I know nothing about it, but I do know that the Salvador Dali house has released a number of "Le Roy Soleil" fragrances/flankers, all spelled without an I.
    Interesting. Hmmm. Salvador Dali = Surrealist. Elsa Schiaparelli famously hung out with Surrealists, and created Surrealist works like the famous lobster dress. I wonder if "Le Roy" could be some kind of French pun, related to Surrealism?

  6. #6

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cook.bot View Post
    I'll bet you're right. The wide part of the clamshell must be at least 6"-7" across.




    Interesting. Hmmm. Salvador Dali = Surrealist. Elsa Schiaparelli famously hung out with Surrealists, and created Surrealist works like the famous lobster dress. I wonder if "Le Roy" could be some kind of French pun, related to Surrealism?
    I'm sure she was friends with Dali.

  7. #7

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Ok, just did a quick search and found that the perfume bottle and this case were designed by Dali, probably the reason it went for so much cash.

    You can read more here
    http://www.house-of-francheska.co.uk/schiaparelli-5.htm
    There are some nice pics too.

  8. #8

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Quote Originally Posted by IsoESuperman View Post
    Quite a presentation! I know nothing about it, but I do know that the Salvador Dali house has released a number of "Le Roy Soleil" fragrances/flankers, all spelled without an I.
    It's the archaic spelling of roi.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Quote Originally Posted by Suspended View Post
    Ok, just did a quick search and found that the perfume bottle and this case were designed by Dali, probably the reason it went for so much cash.

    You can read more here
    http://www.house-of-francheska.co.uk/schiaparelli-5.htm
    There are some nice pics too.
    Wow! And wow again. That bottle! I can't begin to imagine what price it would fetch, with the bottle, in that condition. And what must the juice have been like...

    Wasn't there a famous Dali clamshell piece goofing on the Botticelli "Venus Rising"? A painting? Or a sculpture in the garden of his home/museum? Something like that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Suspended View Post
    It's the archaic spelling of roi.
    Really? I didn't see that anywhere in my searches. How'd you find that out?

  10. #10

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cook.bot View Post

    Really? I didn't see that anywhere in my searches. How'd you find that out?
    Google It was also an alternative name for King Louis XIV


    and, yes...I'd love a whiff of that scent. If the stunning presentation is anything to go by. I wonder if it has an oceanic or beach-y quality.
    Last edited by Suspended; 8th July 2016 at 12:14 AM.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Quote Originally Posted by Suspended View Post
    Google It was also an alternative name for King Louis XIV

    and, yes...I'd love a whiff of that scent. If the stunning presentation is anything to go by. I wonder if it has an oceanic or beach-y quality.
    Huh. You must have Googling powers superior to mine. I couldn't find nuthin' on it.

    Re: the scent -- since it was Schiaparelli, I'll bet it was animalic. Skanky, even. Louis Quatorze, powdered wigs, inch-thick makeup, no baths.. Yeah, I'd bet on skanky.

  12. #12

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cook.bot View Post
    Huh. You must have Googling powers superior to mine. I couldn't find nuthin' on it.

    Re: the scent -- since it was Schiaparelli, I'll bet it was animalic. Skanky, even. Louis Quatorze, powdered wigs, inch-thick makeup, no baths.. Yeah, I'd bet on skanky.
    Ha ha! You are probably right, Louis Quatorze' skanky drawers

    The fragrance is still available in the Dali line but I doubt it bears any resemblance. The bottle and packaging have certainly been somewhat down graded (being diplomatic.)

  13. #13

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    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    I knew that the bottle was extremely rare and superexpensive. But didn't imagine the box would be as well.

    Who knows what it might have smelled-although in this case I'd bet it was about the bottle, not the content. And I wish Schiaparelli shocking were still available...

    cacio

  14. #14
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    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Quote Originally Posted by cacio View Post
    And I wish Schiaparelli shocking were still available...

    cacio

    From your lips to God's ears.

    I've managed to acquire three mini bottles of Shocking over the past several years, and treasure every precious skanky drop of it.

  15. #15

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Price has never made sense. Nor was it intended to.
    Over here prize falcons and camels easily sell for $100,000.
    for swap/sale:



  16. #16

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    According to the Perfume Bottles Price guide, the bottle is worth $9,000-$10,000. The bottle and box together is worth $12,500. I don't think the value has that much to do with the fact that Dali designed it. All other things being equal, if some obscure designer had conceived of it, it would probably still be worth a similar amount.

  17. #17

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Quote Originally Posted by beleriand View Post
    According to the Perfume Bottles Price guide, the bottle is worth $9,000-$10,000. The bottle and box together is worth $12,500. I don't think the value has that much to do with the fact that Dali designed it. All other things being equal, if some obscure designer had conceived of it, it would probably still be worth a similar amount.
    Yes, Dali is so irrelevant as an artist

  18. #18

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Quote Originally Posted by Suspended View Post
    Yes, Dali is so irrelevant as an artist
    So, I guess this $55,000 bottle must have been designed by Picasso?

    https://www.liveauctioneers.com/item...s-dior-perfume

    or these $31,000 bottles by Van Gogh?

    https://www.liveauctioneers.com/item...erfume-bottles

    and why is this ultra rare bottle by Dali only 140 Euros?

    http://www.miniparfum.com/fr/accueil...-feu-dali.html

  19. #19

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Can you imagine how very glamorous the woman must have been who had this on her dressing table. If only we could just catch a glimpse of what this wonderful thing has seen with its clammy eye.
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  20. #20

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Quote Originally Posted by beleriand View Post
    So, I guess this $55,000 bottle must have been designed by Picasso?

    https://www.liveauctioneers.com/item...s-dior-perfume

    or these $31,000 bottles by Van Gogh?

    https://www.liveauctioneers.com/item...erfume-bottles

    and why is this ultra rare bottle by Dali only 140 Euros?

    http://www.miniparfum.com/fr/accueil...-feu-dali.html
    The first bottle is mega rare and by one of last centuries most important designers. A couturier that is currently still very much at the top of their game.

    The second bottles are also very rare and very beautiful from a collectors position.

    The Dali bottle has no creative merit and an Ebay search will show just how "rare" it actually is (not at all.) Your comparisons are, at best, very biased and that makes your point ridiculous. Also, $140 isn't that bad for a fairly standard 'miniature.'
    Last edited by Suspended; 24th August 2017 at 06:31 PM.

  21. #21

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Quote Originally Posted by mumsy View Post
    Can you imagine how very glamorous the woman must have been who had this on her dressing table. If only we could just catch a glimpse of what this wonderful thing has seen with its clammy eye.
    I prefer to think of someone living in squalor and this their only magnificent thing left in life (think Gray Gardens with fancy perfume.)

  22. #22

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?


  23. #23

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    How does the bottles' being rare help your point, which was that Le Roy Soleil's value was based on its having been designed by Dali? Of course their rarity figures into the value. That's the whole point. Rare and beautiful perfume bottles like La Roy Soleil are worth lots of money, regardless of who they're designed by. Bottles that aren't rare or beautiful aren't worth a lot, even when they are designed by Dali. That's exactly what I originally said, which you criticized. I can find thousands of examples of bottles worth more than Le Roy Soleil. It doesn't seem to be worth any more than any other bottle of its sort.

    And an ebay search for Coup de Feu lead me to find one sold one with what appears to be the wrong box and an auction for an empty box, so it's at least rare enough that not everyone who wants one can have one, and, yet, still not that valuable, despite being designed by Dali. 1/2 an ounce isn't a mini.

  24. #24

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    Quote Originally Posted by beleriand View Post
    How does the bottles' being rare help your point, which was that Le Roy Soleil's value was based on its having been designed by Dali? Of course their rarity figures into the value. That's the whole point. Rare and beautiful perfume bottles like La Roy Soleil are worth lots of money, regardless of who they're designed by. Bottles that aren't rare or beautiful aren't worth a lot, even when they are designed by Dali. That's exactly what I originally said, which you criticized. I can find thousands of examples of bottles worth more than Le Roy Soleil. It doesn't seem to be worth any more than any other bottle of its sort.

    And an ebay search for Coup de Feu lead me to find one sold one with what appears to be the wrong box and an auction for an empty box, so it's at least rare enough that not everyone who wants one can have one, and, yet, still not that valuable, despite being designed by Dali. 1/2 an ounce isn't a mini.
    It was made by a perfume house, not Dali. It isn't a Dali designed, it's a Dali license. It's like comparing a Mickey Mouse mug from Walmart with a drawing done by Walt himself. Absolutely, it's a beautiful object regardless of provenance but as one of this century's biggest artists, with painting selling in the tens of millions, I find it ignorant to say his name doesn't affect the value.

    Also, that auctions website you listed seems somewhat dodgy to me. That second listing with the Maggie Noir (1970's creation) and Tresor (1990's) being listed as vintage bottles from the 50's. Can you see a problem there?

  25. #25

    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    The bottles actually were designed by Dali.

    http://www.perfumeintelligence.co.uk...es/Marquay.htm

    That auction is from the annual convention of the IPBA.

    http://www.perfumebottlesauction.com/

    And that's Magie, not Magie Noir, and a different Tresor that was released in the 50s.

    http://perfumeintelligence.co.uk/lib.../t/t3/t3p6.htm

    I mean, if there was some Dali fanatic who just had to have the bottle because it was designed by him, then, sure, I can see how that would affect the value, but it's just my opinion that, in most cases, that bottle, looking like it does and as rare as it is, would be worth pretty much the same amount if an unknown person had designed it. There's just no shortage of bottles worth around what the Dali bottle is worth. I didn't cherry pick those examples:

    https://classic.liveauctioneers.com/...bhagwan-bottle

    https://classic.liveauctioneers.com/...perfume-bottle

    https://classic.liveauctioneers.com/...perfume-bottle

    https://classic.liveauctioneers.com/...tle-for-madhva

    http://www.coutaubegarie.com/html/in...11&lng=fr&np=1

    http://www.coutaubegarie.com/html/fi...rdre=&aff=1&r=
    Last edited by beleriand; 27th August 2017 at 10:43 PM.

  26. #26
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    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?


  27. #27
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    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?



    Here's an ad from 1947. Dali's own Roy Soleil used a similar design:


  28. #28
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    Default Re: $2,100 for empty Schiaparelli box?? Le Roy Soleil?

    If you really want to know how it smells…

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/VTG-NIB-194...t/264266645327




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