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  1. #31
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    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by VanillaCloud View Post
    Luca Turin has a nose.

    So do you.

    Trust YOURS.
    Absolutely agree with this!
    Small decisions, made consistently, have huge impacts. Think about what you do, be mindful of the results. Accept responsibility for your choices & do not blame others for your behavior. I speak for myself.

  2. #32

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    I would give Portrait of a Lady and Carnal Flower five stars, and maybe Geranium PM.

  3. #33

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    I think this house does feminines much better than unisex/masculine offerings, and maybe the model of letting the perfumers "create" could sort of be analogous to the (majority of) fashion in way, where the women's line allows much more room for expression and free reign to design.

    That said, I like a lot of the line, but I'm not in love with it. My favorites are L'eau D'Hiver, Geranium pour monsieur, and Vetiver Extraordinaire.


  4. #34

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by VanillaCloud View Post
    Luca Turin has a nose.

    So do you.

    Trust YOURS.
    It's always fun when this point of view pops up when talking about scents. I mean, it's legitimate, but it's based on a complete misunderstanding of the whole purpose of reviews and criticism (bear in mind I'm talking about proper reviews, not Amazon stuff). Reviews are not a matter of "trust". Reviewers aren't there to tell you "you must like this" or "trust me, uncle Greg will love this". They couldn't and shouldn't care less whether you or uncle Greg like something. Just as you shouldn't care less about whether they like something. Because the whole point of reviewing is not about liking stuff. It's just a matter of broadening your perspective and knowledge about fragrances, by means of comparisons, insights and thoughtful considerations provided by people who are (supposedly) skilled and qualified for that. And this set of abilities does not come natural to you just because you own a nose, just like having hands does not make you a surgeon (unless you only "trust your own hands" when it comes to your appendicitis). You get that with studying (both history and theory), and with practicing and training your nostrils to recognize and correlate smells and materials. Is your background the same as Luca Turin's? If yes, then - cool! If not, well then no, having a nose does not make you equal tu Luca Turin when it comes to discussing fragrances and assessing their objective qualities.
    ______________________________

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  5. #35

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by Colin Maillard View Post
    It's always fun when this point of view pops up when talking about scents. I mean, it's legitimate, but it's based on a complete misunderstanding of the whole purpose of reviews and criticism (bear in mind I'm talking about proper reviews, not Amazon stuff). Reviews are not a matter of "trust". Reviewers aren't there to tell you "you must like this" or "trust me, uncle Greg will love this". They couldn't and shouldn't care less whether you or uncle Greg like something. Just as you shouldn't care less about whether they like something. Because the whole point of reviewing is not about liking stuff. It's just a matter of broadening your perspective and knowledge about fragrances, by means of comparisons, insights and thoughtful considerations provided by people who are (supposedly) skilled and qualified for that. And this set of abilities does not come natural to you just because you own a nose, just like having hands does not make you a surgeon (unless you only "trust your own hands" when it comes to your appendicitis). You get that with studying (both history and theory), and with practicing and training your nostrils to recognize and correlate smells and materials. Is your background the same as Luca Turin's? If yes, then - cool! If not, well then no, having a nose does not make you equal tu Luca Turin when it comes to discussing fragrances and assessing their objective qualities.
    Well said! Expert judgment is always a more trustworthy source. Look at it like Robert Parker for the wine industry - he might rate a Bordeaux 92 points, but if you don't like Bordeaux, you're going to dislike it or disagree. We all have inherent bias that we have to be aware of in ourselves as well in others. If you disagree on taste/style, it's ok.


  6. #36
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    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    For me the line is extremely solid, with Portrait of a Lady easily a five star caliber composition, at least IMO.
    Current Top Ten:
    1) Portrait of a Lady original formula (EdP Frédéric Malle)
    2) Jasmin Antique (Rogue Perfumery)
    3) Giorgio for Men vintage (Giorgio Beverly Hills) - tie
    3) Giorgio V.I.P. Special Reserve (Giorgio Beverly Hills) - tie

    5) Dia pour Homme vintage edt (Amouage)

    6)
    Anat Fritz and its reissue, called Classical (Anat Fritz)
    7) Captain vintage (Molyneux)
    8) Javanese Patchouli (Zegna) - tie
    8) Monsieur de Givenchy vintage (Givenchy) - tie
    8) Polo vintage (Ralph Lauren) - tie


  7. #37

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    +1 Colin

    My 'nose' is certainly less cultured and nuanced to certain aspects of perfumery than others here on Basenotes let alone Luca Turin.

    I know what I like, but that is just personal taste

  8. #38

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by Colin Maillard View Post
    It's always fun when this point of view pops up when talking about scents. I mean, it's legitimate, but it's based on a complete misunderstanding of the whole purpose of reviews and criticism (bear in mind I'm talking about proper reviews, not Amazon stuff). Reviews are not a matter of "trust". Reviewers aren't there to tell you "you must like this" or "trust me, uncle Greg will love this". They couldn't and shouldn't care less whether you or uncle Greg like something. Just as you shouldn't care less about whether they like something. Because the whole point of reviewing is not about liking stuff. It's just a matter of broadening your perspective and knowledge about fragrances, by means of comparisons, insights and thoughtful considerations provided by people who are (supposedly) skilled and qualified for that. And this set of abilities does not come natural to you just because you own a nose, just like having hands does not make you a surgeon (unless you only "trust your own hands" when it comes to your appendicitis). You get that with studying (both history and theory), and with practicing and training your nostrils to recognize and correlate smells and materials. Is your background the same as Luca Turin's? If yes, then - cool! If not, well then no, having a nose does not make you equal tu Luca Turin when it comes to discussing fragrances and assessing their objective qualities.
    Thanks for saying this.

  9. #39
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    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    I haven't smelled any of this line, not available in my town. But as much as I respect Luca Turin's knowledge I quite often disagree with his reviews/ratings. After all he got his own taste and views, and he's sharing them, that does not mean that everyone must share them. Still, I found some of his reviews in his book enlightening, even if <i have disagreed, because it gave me another perspective on a certain fragrance.
    The synthetic perfume materials are supposed to enhance and support the use of natural raw materials, not to replace them, nor in any way to beat them off the market. The synthetic chemicals present a certain challenge to nature, and the perfumer can assist nature in her fight by utilizing the synthetic materials to the advantage of the natural raw materials. (S. Arctander)
    Currently wearing: Snuff by Elsa Schiaparelli

  10. #40

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by VanillaCloud View Post
    Luca Turin has a nose.

    So do you.

    Trust YOURS.
    ...this is about the same advice that is written on ´PERFUMES - The A/Z guide´ by Luca Turin

  11. #41

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by Colin Maillard View Post
    It's always fun when this point of view pops up when talking about scents. I mean, it's legitimate, but it's based on a complete misunderstanding of the whole purpose of reviews and criticism (bear in mind I'm talking about proper reviews, not Amazon stuff). Reviews are not a matter of "trust". Reviewers aren't there to tell you "you must like this" or "trust me, uncle Greg will love this". They couldn't and shouldn't care less whether you or uncle Greg like something. Just as you shouldn't care less about whether they like something. Because the whole point of reviewing is not about liking stuff. It's just a matter of broadening your perspective and knowledge about fragrances, by means of comparisons, insights and thoughtful considerations provided by people who are (supposedly) skilled and qualified for that. And this set of abilities does not come natural to you just because you own a nose, just like having hands does not make you a surgeon (unless you only "trust your own hands" when it comes to your appendicitis). You get that with studying (both history and theory), and with practicing and training your nostrils to recognize and correlate smells and materials. Is your background the same as Luca Turin's? If yes, then - cool! If not, well then no, having a nose does not make you equal tu Luca Turin when it comes to discussing fragrances and assessing their objective qualities.
    I'd think the guy is simply stating that one likes what one likes, so, yes, his nose, after all it is him that will pay for and wear the stuff for his own enjoyment, is more important than any reviewer's.

  12. #42
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    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    L'Eau d'Hiver is my favourite; have a bottle and 4 stars seems about right. I find it quite strong. Have tried quite a lot of the others and passed my samples on; there's always something I don't like. Would like to give En Passant another try though.
    Currently wearing: Fidji by Guy Laroche

  13. #43

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    After trying most of the line and meeting Monsieur Malle himself at Barney's, outside of Vetiver (it's OK but maybe not FBW for the price), I never really liked anything. I think Turin actually rates some of them too high. I think he gave Musc Ravageur 4 stars but to my nose it's barely 2.

    Does Malle release much these days? Seems to me he hasn't been as prolific as he was, say 5-10 years ago.
    "I exist for myself, and for those to whom my unquenchable thirst for freedom gives everything, but also for everyone, since insofar as I am able to love - I love everyone. Of noble hearts, I am the noblest - and the most generous of those that yearn to give love in return. - I am a human being, I love death and I love life."

    Egon Schiele - Self-Potrait


    My classics: Dior Homme EdT, YSL Rive Gauche PH, Helmut Lang Cuiron, L'Occitane Neroli (vintage), Davidoff Zino, L'Occitane Eau des Baux

    http://www.basenotes.net/wardrobe/2976

  14. #44
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    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    malle is slighly overrated
    but..
    POAL
    Dries Van Noten
    Vetiver Extraordinaire
    Monsieur
    are worth their price tage!
    just my two cents!

  15. #45
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    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Laca Turin is respected by me for his opinions, but he is not the ultimate authority if there even is one. I own two Malle scents. Musc Ravageur I consider one of the best musc perfumes and Carnal Flower is in my mind a masterpiece of white florals. Une Rose is an amazing rose scent and has been on my buy list, but I shutter at the price so have other rose scents to fill that fragrance space in my wardrobe.
    1. Epic Man by Amouage (33 wears)
    2. Leather Oud by Christian Dior (31 wears)
    3. M7 by Yves Saint Laurent (27 wears)
    4. Oud Imperial (black) by Perris Monte Carlo (22 wears)
    5. Russian Tea Ritual by Masque (20 wears)
    6. Fate Man by Amouage (19 wears)

    Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
    Currently wearing: H.M. by Hanae Mori

  16. #46
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    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by manicboy View Post
    After trying most of the line and meeting Monsieur Malle himself at Barney's, outside of Vetiver (it's OK but maybe not FBW for the price), I never really liked anything. I think Turin actually rates some of them too high. I think he gave Musc Ravageur 4 stars but to my nose it's barely 2.

    Does Malle release much these days? Seems to me he hasn't been as prolific as he was, say 5-10 years ago.
    Gave MR 3 stars and called it "hippy musk".

  17. #47
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    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by Peckerhead View Post
    So the question here is, do you agree or disagree ?
    Disagree.
    Remember that while it is perfectly acceptable to criticize the content of a post - criticizing the poster is not.
    Mean spirited, nasty, snide, sarcastic, hateful, and rude individuals on Basenotes don't warrant or deserve my or other Basenoters' acknowledgement or respect.

  18. #48

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by Colin Maillard View Post
    ...having a nose does not make you equal tu Luca Turin when it comes to discussing fragrances and assessing their objective qualities.
    This may be the case for movies, though even the "top" movie reviewers generally just review a percentage of the films released each year, but with fragrances there are just too many to give them all a fair chance, and in LT's case (in the first "Guide" in English) more than a few scents seem to have gotten "short shrift," and with some the actual smell was not mentioned (Polo Double Black). When you do that sort of thing you open yourself up to criticism, unless you call the book something like "A Whimsical Perfume Guide." How many Playboy, Remy Latour, Jaguar, Ferrari, Lomani, etc. scents has he reviewed? Any? Sure, if you can afford to buy all the Malle scents that your heart desires you may think you're not missing anything with the "super cheapos," but I would disagree, one of my major arguments being that they often "copy" a popular scent but use less aroma chemicals, which actually makes them more wearable. I respect LT's opinion as one of many opinions, in terms of what I'm thinking about buying, but then there is his discussion of "Inside information," which of course is interesting and few others can rival that. So, let's not compare apples and oranges here. His opinion about any particular scent is probably not "better" than another reviewer's whose taste is similar to yours (for your purposes), but his industry knowledge is something else entirely.

  19. #49

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by jdp191 View Post
    I would give Portrait of a Lady and Carnal Flower five stars, and maybe Geranium PM.
    +1 me too

  20. #50
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    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaern View Post
    Estee Lauder giving them all a good rinsing out?
    I can't comment on the rest of the range, but I enjoyed original PoL for a couple of years from a decantshop sample.

  21. #51

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    I would give 5 stars to Carnal Flower and the unjustly forgotten Iris Poudre and Lys Mediterranee. Never understood the fuss about PoaL.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  22. #52
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    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by HORNS View Post
    Thanks for saying this.
    Yes, thank you indeed!
    Currently wearing: Vétiver (new) by Carven

  23. #53

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Don't know or care who Luca is, but I will say I find most of that line repulsive, never been impressed by anything I've tried, although I haven't tried all of them. After sampling around 7 or 8 different fragrances from FM I just decided it's not for me as I didn't find one I would have bought for even $50, while a few I'd pay $50 not to have them ever sprayed on me again
    My top 30

    1. Gucci Envy / D&G By Man
    2. Amber Sky /Cedrat Boise
    3. Costarela / TFK Arab Spring
    4. Dior Homme Intense / Incense Oud
    5. Dior Homme Cologne / Chez Bond
    6. Layton / Aventus
    7. Antidote / By the Fireplace
    8. Gucci Pour Homme / Armani Attitude
    9. Black Phantom / Baccarat Rouge 540
    10. D&G The One EDP / M7
    11. Santal Majuscule / Reckless
    12. Diadema / Prada L’Homme
    13. Habdan / Tuxedo
    14. Lira / Dior Homme Sport 2012
    15. Citric Santa Eulalia / Clive X

  24. #54

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by Colin Maillard View Post
    It's always fun when this point of view pops up when talking about scents. I mean, it's legitimate, but it's based on a complete misunderstanding of the whole purpose of reviews and criticism (bear in mind I'm talking about proper reviews, not Amazon stuff). Reviews are not a matter of "trust". Reviewers aren't there to tell you "you must like this" or "trust me, uncle Greg will love this". They couldn't and shouldn't care less whether you or uncle Greg like something. Just as you shouldn't care less about whether they like something. Because the whole point of reviewing is not about liking stuff. It's just a matter of broadening your perspective and knowledge about fragrances, by means of comparisons, insights and thoughtful considerations provided by people who are (supposedly) skilled and qualified for that. And this set of abilities does not come natural to you just because you own a nose, just like having hands does not make you a surgeon (unless you only "trust your own hands" when it comes to your appendicitis). You get that with studying (both history and theory), and with practicing and training your nostrils to recognize and correlate smells and materials. Is your background the same as Luca Turin's? If yes, then - cool! If not, well then no, having a nose does not make you equal tu Luca Turin when it comes to discussing fragrances and assessing their objective qualities.
    Humorous and pretentious.

    Same as it ever was.
    I smell marshmallows!

  25. #55
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    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Reviews can be misleading to a reader if the reviewer lives in a different culture, has different personal characteristics, and is in a different stage in life. The greater the differences between the reader and the reviewer, the less useful a review is.

    Just read any review page and you will find that most have views that differ by a great margin. But all reviewers are giving their thought on the same scent! - its just that the reviewers are different.

  26. #56

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by NickZee View Post
    The greater the differences between the reader and the reviewer, the less useful a review is.
    In my experience, the exact opposite is true.

  27. #57
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    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by Colin Maillard View Post
    It's always fun when this point of view pops up when talking about scents. I mean, it's legitimate, but it's based on a complete misunderstanding of the whole purpose of reviews and criticism (bear in mind I'm talking about proper reviews, not Amazon stuff). Reviews are not a matter of "trust". Reviewers aren't there to tell you "you must like this" or "trust me, uncle Greg will love this". They couldn't and shouldn't care less whether you or uncle Greg like something. Just as you shouldn't care less about whether they like something. Because the whole point of reviewing is not about liking stuff. It's just a matter of broadening your perspective and knowledge about fragrances, by means of comparisons, insights and thoughtful considerations provided by people who are (supposedly) skilled and qualified for that. And this set of abilities does not come natural to you just because you own a nose, just like having hands does not make you a surgeon (unless you only "trust your own hands" when it comes to your appendicitis). You get that with studying (both history and theory), and with practicing and training your nostrils to recognize and correlate smells and materials. Is your background the same as Luca Turin's? If yes, then - cool! If not, well then no, having a nose does not make you equal tu Luca Turin when it comes to discussing fragrances and assessing their objective qualities.
    I think this a balanced view and criticism of the original statement of

    "Luca Turin has a nose.

    Trust YOURS."
    Last edited by purecaramel; 11th May 2017 at 06:25 AM.
    Scarcity is an illusion. Unlearn it.

  28. #58

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by VanillaCloud View Post
    Humorous and pretentious.

    Same as it ever was.
    I'd like for you to explain why you think it is humorous, but especially why you believe it to be pretentious what he said. I think you and I both would agree that reviews are about perspective - a way of looking at a fragrance that one's appreciation can be enriched by exposure to the historical and artistic context of a fragrance, which is how the evaluation of any other art shows its value. And, this is important, it doesn't matter if in the end the reviewer doesn't like the creation being discussed, because you still learned something. Or even the opinion one has can be tempered by an opposing opinion. And not everyone has a database of not just fragrances smelled, but more importantly the context of history in which a specific fragrance sits. And to bring Luca back into this, one benefits from his sharing and perspective based on the science of fragrances, of what is known and what is still up for debate - and that, to me, is what makes him rise above who has already risen above everyone and everybody who has an opinion.

  29. #59

    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by HORNS View Post
    I'd like for you to explain why you think it is humorous, but especially why you believe it to be pretentious what he said. I think you and I both would agree that reviews are about perspective - a way of looking at a fragrance that one's appreciation can be enriched by exposure to the historical and artistic context of a fragrance, which is how the evaluation of any other art shows its value. And, this is important, it doesn't matter if in the end the reviewer doesn't like the creation being discussed, because you still learned something. Or even the opinion one has can be tempered by an opposing opinion. And not everyone has a database of not just fragrances smelled, but more importantly the context of history in which a specific fragrance sits. And to bring Luca back into this, one benefits from his sharing and perspective based on the science of fragrances, of what is known and what is still up for debate - and that, to me, is what makes him rise above who has already risen above everyone and everybody who has an opinion.
    Here you go:

    "...having a nose does not make you equal [to] Luca Turin when it comes to discussing fragrances and assessing their objective qualities."

    And if I need to explain it further, there is no "objective" element to this, in terms of one's tastes. Even in terms of perceptions, we don't know that LT can detect more notes than anyone who has posted to this thread, for example. And one can't prove that being able to detect more notes means he is more useful to any particular BN member (in terms of blind buying). One could test note detection ability among those of us who posted here, but it has not been done, so that is speculation anyway. And as I said, he hasn't even reviewed nearly all or all of the "super cheapos" I enjoy. Why should I care about what he thinks of Malle scents? Those are too expensive for me and I don't think his preferences are all that similar to mine. So, to whom does that statement apply? What is he going to say when he "discusses fragrances" that is going to matter to me more than a reviewer's opinion whose preferences seem to be quite close to mine?
    Last edited by Bigsly; 11th May 2017 at 04:55 AM.

  30. #60
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    Default Re: Luca Turin on Frederic Malle

    Quote Originally Posted by VanillaCloud View Post
    Humorous and pretentious.

    Same as it ever was.
    Back at ya.

    Let's see a few reviews about your Vanilla Marshmallow Clouds.
    Scarcity is an illusion. Unlearn it.




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