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  1. #1

    Default How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    So I took the plunge and brought some fine scales (0.001 gram)

    Great - but then I look at some formula and they want e.g. 10mg or 20mg.

    Well I've played around and 20mg is approx 1 drop/
    So 10mg is half a drop and 5mg is a quarfter of a drop.

    How can I get such small measures out of my pipette??

    thanks for your help
    *** The Man in the Bow Tie ***

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    Also "Monographs and Musings"

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  2. #2

    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    Go with the pipette to the inner wall of your container and just squeeze the top of the pipette a little bit. The (suggested) quarter of a drop will adhere to your container and run down to it's bottom.

    But there are known problems of accuracy at that tiny scale, our pros here regularly recommend to work in batches of 10 g to avoid such tiny amounts. Alternatively you could work with 10% or 1% dilutions, blowing up your quarter of a drop to 2.5 drops or even 25 drops.

  3. #3

    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    I was going to say dilutions is the way. The weight of material is tiny and add the ethanol into the calcs.
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  4. #4
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    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    You could do what I did and get your hands on a variable volume micropipettor. I got mine from a UK firm called Triple Red. It's the 1-100uL model and so far its great for small scale experiments

  5. #5

    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    Quote Originally Posted by kleinkiwi View Post
    You could do what I did and get your hands on a variable volume micropipettor. I got mine from a UK firm called Triple Red. It's the 1-100uL model and so far its great for small scale experiments
    This is what I use and they're fabulous.

    Volumate-Liquisystem-Pipette-20-200L.jpg

    Here is the economy version..

    https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_f...pette&_sacat=0
    Last edited by mumsy; 11th July 2017 at 11:03 PM.
    The PONK club - gymnosium for perfumers (NOTE:- New club matters on hold whilst I care for my mum)

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  6. #6
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    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    You can't really get that fine a drop from a plastic or glass pipette. Others have given their ideas for how to accomplish that. But honestly, I don't like much else besides dilution to accomplish tiny amounts. I don't really work diluted, to begin with, only in rare cases. And my shelves are already bursting, so to make too many dilutions is a problem of space, anyway. But I will make dilutions in 1/2 oz bottles, or 1 dram bottles. But most often, if I need a dilution, I will pick up a sample 1ml vial, and dilute in that, then tape it to the bottle to eliminate both clutter, and the need to find that crazy vial the next time.

    I might tape both a 1 dram vial or a sample vial right to the bottle, like this:

    20170711_224719.jpg
    Last edited by pkiler; 12th July 2017 at 08:03 AM.
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  7. #7
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    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    I use both micro pipettes and dilutions and still prefer dilutions for smaller amounts. The viscosity of different materials influences the micropipette, which still creates volumes and not set weights. Now and then I end up with 3 or 5 milligram when 4 was intended. Using a 10% dilution, I might not have exactly 40 mg but 39 or 40. But that's a 2% error instead of 20%.
    if it's really important, use bigger batches or greater dilutions.
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  8. #8

    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    I use the micro pipette for the control but still weigh it. When diluted, there is very little risk of error. Perhaps within the 0.005 mark unless the hand slips but then the error is recorded by the weight. I like the fine nibs to keep with each material so I can swap from one to another without risk of touch contamination. Dilutions in my organ go from 100%, 20%, 10%, 1%, 0.1% and even one at 0.001% in an extreme case of chemical power.
    Last edited by mumsy; 12th July 2017 at 09:09 AM.
    The PONK club - gymnosium for perfumers (NOTE:- New club matters on hold whilst I care for my mum)

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  9. #9
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    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    Quote Originally Posted by mumsy View Post
    I use the micro pipette for the control but still weigh it. When diluted, there is very little risk of error. Perhaps within the 0.005 mark unless the hand slips but then the error is recorded by the weight. I like the fine nibs to keep with each material so I can swap from one to another without risk of touch contamination. Dilutions in my organ go from 100%, 20%, 10%, 1%, 0.1% and even one at 0.001% in an extreme case of chemical power.
    That is exactly the way I work, I have a broad range of dilutions depending on the material (high vs low impact). Except I throw away pipette tips once used. At about €6/1000 it's not worth the risk of contamination IMHO.
    Please visit my blog for a listing of all my free formulas

  10. #10

    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    Hi
    The way i use to do its to buy lot of 10ml botles with pipet included and that no way of contamination and i can make my dilutions till a point i think its enought1-pcs-10-ml-de-Vidro-mbar-Frasco-Conta-gotas-Pipeta-Reagente-L-quido-Gota-Aromaterapia.jpg_640x6.jpg
    But you can allways be carefull and clean your pipets with pa or ethanol 99%.
    Last edited by Wisemoor; 12th July 2017 at 01:57 PM.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    Quote Originally Posted by jsparla View Post
    That is exactly the way I work, I have a broad range of dilutions depending on the material (high vs low impact). Except I throw away pipette tips once used. At about 6/1000 it's not worth the risk of contamination IMHO.
    If it posible... tell me please where do you buy tips at such prices?
    Last edited by Dmitriy; 12th July 2017 at 03:55 PM.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    Quote Originally Posted by Dmitriy View Post
    If it posible... tell me please where do you buy tips at such prices?
    This^

  13. #13
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    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    Quote Originally Posted by Wisemoor View Post
    Hi
    The way i use to do its to buy lot of 10ml botles with pipet included and that no way of contamination and i can make my dilutions till a point i think its enought1-pcs-10-ml-de-Vidro-mbar-Frasco-Conta-gotas-Pipeta-Reagente-L-quido-Gota-Aromaterapia.jpg_640x6.jpg
    But you can allways be carefull and clean your pipets with pa or ethanol 99%.
    it is an option but please be aware many aroma chemicals and essential oils will dissolve the rubber linings that hold the pipette over time.
    Please visit my blog for a listing of all my free formulas

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    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    Quote Originally Posted by mumsy View Post
    This is what I use and they're fabulous.

    Volumate-Liquisystem-Pipette-20-200L.jpg

    Here is the economy version..

    https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_f...pette&_sacat=0
    hi mumsy

    where did you buy that? cant seem to find online

    thanks

  15. #15
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    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    Quote Originally Posted by mumsy View Post
    I use the micro pipette for the control but still weigh it. When diluted, there is very little risk of error. Perhaps within the 0.005 mark unless the hand slips but then the error is recorded by the weight. I like the fine nibs to keep with each material so I can swap from one to another without risk of touch contamination. Dilutions in my organ go from 100%, 20%, 10%, 1%, 0.1% and even one at 0.001% in an extreme case of chemical power.
    For each material find out how much 100uL weighs (10 measurements then finding the average), then I do a bit of maths to figure out how uL = 0.05g and 0.01g
    This way I can simply set the pipette to a volume and know that I'm putting in the said amount each time.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    Quote Originally Posted by kleinkiwi View Post
    For each material find out how much 100uL weighs (10 measurements then finding the average), then I do a bit of maths to figure out how uL = 0.05g and 0.01g
    This way I can simply set the pipette to a volume and know that I'm putting in the said amount each time.
    Sorry, but this method is inaccurate. The error range of pipettes is way to big, especially with materials with higher viscosity than ethanol. Always, always, always keep weighing your materials when perfuming.
    Please visit my blog for a listing of all my free formulas

  17. #17
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    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    Quote Originally Posted by jsparla View Post
    That is exactly the way I work, I have a broad range of dilutions depending on the material (high vs low impact). Except I throw away pipette tips once used. At about €6/1000 it's not worth the risk of contamination IMHO.
    jsparla If it posible... tell me please where do you buy pipette tips at such prices?

  18. #18
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    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    Quote Originally Posted by Dmitriy View Post
    jsparla If it posible... tell me please where do you buy pipette tips at such prices?
    sure, sharing is caring
    https://www.praxisdienst.nl/nl/Labom...+0+5+10+l.html
    Please visit my blog for a listing of all my free formulas

  19. #19
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    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    Quote Originally Posted by jsparla View Post
    Thank you so much!

  20. #20

    Default Re: How do I measure tiny amounts .....

    OK so I invested a little and bought this:

    IMG_0796.jpg

    https://www.praxisdienst.com/en/Labo...0+l.html?cur=3

    At GBP 36.00 not bad

    Add some:

    IMG_0795.jpg

    which were about GBP 5.60 for 1000 tips

    https://www.praxisdienst.com/en/Labo...849.1500026541

    Total for both plus VAT Tax and Postage -- Took 4 days from Germany to UK all in GBP 51.00

    which wasn't bad at all. In hindsight, it would have been better to go for a higher capacity , say up to 200 microlitres
    This one goes from 0.5 to 10.0 microlitres. 10.0 is roughly half a drop / 0.010 mg

    Hope this helps someone

    PS Sorry the images are upside down
    *** The Man in the Bow Tie ***

    Edmond Roudnitska: "A Life of Perfume" - Newly Published -
    http://www.lulu.com/shop/edmond-roudnitska/a-life-of-perfume/paperback/product-23790632.html


    Arcadi Boix Camps: "Perfumery: Techniques in Evolution" now available in limited numbers:
    Also "Monographs and Musings"

    https://www,perfumers-library.com/Arcadi-Boix-Camps



    Complete Steffen Arctander Volumes in Perfumers Library
    www.SteffenArctander.com
    <div class="bnsotd"><b>Currently wearing:</b> <a href="ID26149092.html"><img src="http://www.basenotes.net/photos/100noimage.png"> Tasmeem by Rasasi</a></div>




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