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  1. #181
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Did yours seem to have any fruit notes at all, PL?

    But it sure sounds like your sample is cookin' with gas!
    The funny thing is, it continues to give off little soft explosions every time I unscrew the cap. I'm starting to think of it as the Farting Diorama.
    This is a perfume that fires its entire staff on Christmas Eve.... This is a perfume that backs dictators and arms rogue nations at a profit. This is a perfume on trial in absentia for crimes against humanity. This perfume hasn't just violated the Clean Air Act-- it's condemned under the Geneva Protocol for its use of chemical warfare.
    --Perfumieren on Panthère de Cartier Original Parfum (Cartier)

  2. #182

    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Hey, I got mine to fart, too! Just had to unscrew to see what would happen. Diorama says "pffffft".

    I did think I very briefly, very faintly got the melon-y glow; I think about an hour in. But I don't feel sure of my thoughts at all yet because as you say, the first wear is baffling. I definitely need more time with it.

    This was already one of the most interesting sampling threads; I'd say Farting Diorama puts in it first place.

  3. #183
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Also when unscrewing atomiseur decant do it half turn at a time and wait few secs.
    Beauty needs no morality or righteousness.
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  4. #184

    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by epapsiou View Post
    Also when unscrewing atomiseur decant do it half turn at a time and wait few secs.
    Lol, epap is trying to save us from ourselves, poor guy. It's all fun & games until someone loses an eye.

  5. #185
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by PerfumedLady View Post
    Hey, I got mine to fart, too! Just had to unscrew to see what would happen. Diorama says "pffffft".
    That's exactly what mine does.

    Quote Originally Posted by epapsiou View Post
    Been a while since chemistry class but a few things I am 99% sure of
    That is all fascinating.

    It will come as a surprise to exactly no one that I failed my Organic Chemistry class in college.

    Quote Originally Posted by PerfumedLady View Post
    It's all fun & games until someone loses an eye.
    The only solution is to use it all up FAST to remove the dangerous temptation.
    This is a perfume that fires its entire staff on Christmas Eve.... This is a perfume that backs dictators and arms rogue nations at a profit. This is a perfume on trial in absentia for crimes against humanity. This perfume hasn't just violated the Clean Air Act-- it's condemned under the Geneva Protocol for its use of chemical warfare.
    --Perfumieren on Panthère de Cartier Original Parfum (Cartier)

  6. #186

    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Fascinating! I actually laughed out loud at the “farting diorama”. You guys are awesome

    And yes, I second the proposal to lavish and enjoy.
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  7. #187
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Cook.bot, did the decant I sent you last year behave this way? It was from an atomizer, you may remember.

    I guess it makes sense that the propellant gas would dissolve in the juice. Then, as happens with a carbonated beverage, the liquid would continue to bubble for a while once the container is opened as the gas separates. Or not?

    I'm most confused by your observation that the liquid level dropped dramatically, even though little seemed to have left the vial. Weird.
    Currently wearing: Nombre Noir by Shiseido

  8. #188
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by RoRo View Post
    Cook.bot, did the decant I sent you last year behave this way? It was from an atomizer, you may remember.
    You're going to have to remind me which one it was. Dioressence?

    But I definitely did not have any gassy problems with anything you sent.
    This is a perfume that fires its entire staff on Christmas Eve.... This is a perfume that backs dictators and arms rogue nations at a profit. This is a perfume on trial in absentia for crimes against humanity. This perfume hasn't just violated the Clean Air Act-- it's condemned under the Geneva Protocol for its use of chemical warfare.
    --Perfumieren on Panthère de Cartier Original Parfum (Cartier)

  9. #189
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by Cook.bot View Post
    You're going to have to remind me which one it was. Dioressence?

    But I definitely did not have any gassy problems with anything you sent.
    Dioressence! That, too, was from an atomizer. I'd forgotten about that. But I was asking about Dior-Dior.
    Currently wearing: Nombre Noir by Shiseido

  10. #190
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Alright Alright Alright.
    Time for some 101s.
    Read this - https://www.explainthatstuff.com/aerosolcans.html
    Read ahead only when you have finished the above required reading.

    The Aerosol back then were mostly CFCs and not as good as aerosol in Axe sprays
    When the aerosol is decanted the propellant liquid/gas evaporates (unless the decant is airtight) and that is over 50% of the liquid content. So you get shrinkage. All aerosol decants suffer from shrinkage. I guess shrinkage has always baffled fairer sex.

    Beauty needs no morality or righteousness.
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  11. #191
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by epapsiou View Post
    Alright Alright Alright.
    Time for some 101s.
    Read this - https://www.explainthatstuff.com/aerosolcans.html
    Read ahead only when you have finished the above required reading.

    The Aerosol back then were mostly CFCs and not as good as aerosol in Axe sprays
    When the aerosol is decanted the propellant liquid/gas evaporates (unless the decant is airtight) and that is over 50% of the liquid content. So you get shrinkage. All aerosol decants suffer from shrinkage. I guess shrinkage has always baffled fairer sex.

    Basically us with our busted French Line bottles.
    oh look, I have a signature

  12. #192

    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by Cook.bot View Post
    Then you're certainly among your tribe here in this thread, Lelabelle. If you know any of his old Diors we've been discussing here, please do jump in with any thoughts you have.
    Ah, Cook.bot... I’ve definitely found my tribe

    I’m quite familiar with the 70’s and 80’s Diors and had a few in regular daily rotation in my youth. There is a structure and elegance to them that I don’t think has been equaled. Perfect studies in contrasts and balance.

    I’ve been enjoying the thread immensely, and am not sure what I could possibly add! I’m learning from others much more knowledgeable than I, and am grateful for the wonderful community we have here. Happy to be a part of it
    Chypreish”:
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  13. #193
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by grayspoole View Post
    Would vintage Miss Dior and Diorella be too floral for you? But they are extraordinary compositions so maybe not...

    And I think you might enjoy vintage Eau Sauvage, although I made the mistake of suggesting vintage ES to a younger male friend, who tried it and, alas, found it too "mature." So he gave the mini back to me.
    I think Miss Dior and Eau Sauvage are safe bets. Why am I not as sure about Diorella? Too fruity? I don't recall the Northern California Fragrance Reviewer being into fruits.

  14. #194
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by RoRo View Post
    Dioressence! That, too, was from an atomizer. I'd forgotten about that. But I was asking about Dior-Dior.
    And I had forgotten that the Dior-Dior was pressurized. But no, I didn't have any problems with either of them. Which makes me only more confused by Bavard's Diorama.
    This is a perfume that fires its entire staff on Christmas Eve.... This is a perfume that backs dictators and arms rogue nations at a profit. This is a perfume on trial in absentia for crimes against humanity. This perfume hasn't just violated the Clean Air Act-- it's condemned under the Geneva Protocol for its use of chemical warfare.
    --Perfumieren on Panthère de Cartier Original Parfum (Cartier)

  15. #195
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by epapsiou View Post
    www.explainthatstuff.com/aerosolcans.html
    Read ahead only when you have finished the above required reading.
    When the aerosol is decanted the propellant liquid/gas evaporates (unless the decant is airtight) and that is over 50% of the liquid content. So you get shrinkage. All aerosol decants suffer from shrinkage.
    Hold on a minute here.

    The propellant gas usually turns into a liquid when it's forced inside the can at high pressure during manufacturing. That makes the propellant and the product mix together. The propellant turns back to a gas (evaporates) when you push the nozzle and the pressure is released. It disappears into the air leaving behind the product you're really interested in.

    Does this mean that when you buy a 100ml bottle of pressurized perfume, you can be getting as little half the volume of actual perfume you would get in a 100ml bottle of natural spray perfume?

    Or would perfume manufacturers back in those days have used a higher concentration of perfume oils in a bottle that was going to be pressurized? (Which seems unlikely, given the costs.)


    I guess shrinkage has always baffled fairer sex.

    Personally, I would have used an analogy of condensed milk -vs- evaporated milk, but I think we get your drift.
    This is a perfume that fires its entire staff on Christmas Eve.... This is a perfume that backs dictators and arms rogue nations at a profit. This is a perfume on trial in absentia for crimes against humanity. This perfume hasn't just violated the Clean Air Act-- it's condemned under the Geneva Protocol for its use of chemical warfare.
    --Perfumieren on Panthère de Cartier Original Parfum (Cartier)

  16. #196
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by Bavard View Post
    Too fruity? I don't recall the Northern California Fragrance Reviewer being into fruits.
    Which is ironic, given that he's from the Land of Fruits and Nuts.

    (I'm allowed to say that, since I'm a native Californian.)
    This is a perfume that fires its entire staff on Christmas Eve.... This is a perfume that backs dictators and arms rogue nations at a profit. This is a perfume on trial in absentia for crimes against humanity. This perfume hasn't just violated the Clean Air Act-- it's condemned under the Geneva Protocol for its use of chemical warfare.
    --Perfumieren on Panthère de Cartier Original Parfum (Cartier)

  17. #197
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by Cook.bot View Post

    Or would perfume manufacturers back in those days have used a higher concentration of perfume oils in a bottle that was going to be pressurized? (Which seems unlikely, given the costs.)
    This




    Personally, I would have used an analogy of condensed milk -vs- evaporated milk, but I think we get your drift.
    Using kitchen reference for mansplaining.... Are you trying to get me banned.
    Beauty needs no morality or righteousness.
    It, like nature, does not give a shit
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  18. #198

    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by PerfumedLady View Post
    Oh, Lellabelle, I didn't even try all the DelRae's and still found two I'd love to have! You're scaring me with this Bois de Paradis talk; I'm a big sucker for a great rose!
    It was the standout of the line for me: classic bones, but modernized somehow. It definitely has a Roudnitska signature, but it has its own personality and style distinct from the classics. Rose can be a difficult note for me and it’s very well handled here. Lots of contrasts, and elements that play against, and with, each other without dominating. The structure isn’t as well worked out as the Roudnitska Dior’s though (to be fair, not much is). It’s more freeform, and playful. Where the Dior’s have a refined, thoughtful elegance, BDP feels a little more neo-classical. Pre-raphelite, rather than couture.
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  19. #199
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by Cook.bot View Post
    And I had forgotten that the Dior-Dior was pressurized. But no, I didn't have any problems with either of them. Which makes me only more confused by Bavard's Diorama.
    That is curious, indeed.

    Each of my atomizers seemed to be on its last legs, with feeble ejection, which I took to mean that the pressure was low in the bottles. If so, maybe the fragrance didn't have much propellant in it anymore.

    Who knows.
    Currently wearing: Nombre Noir by Shiseido

  20. #200
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    I sent Bavard a PM yesterday morning with my reactions to his Diorama sample, and after getting his response, I’m posting some thoughts here, This discussion has become so informative regarding atomizers as well as Diorama!

    My sample from Bavard arrived in good shape--no leakage. The sample bottle may have dribbled more than sprayed, but nothing out of the ordinary. I felt the perfume had aged badly however. The top and midnotes had flattened out and collapsed into a smell that was vaguely aldehydic but really just smelled of chemicals. There was little projection or longevity. It was only in the late drydown that I could perceive some resemblance to vintage Diorama, as some of the Prunol/peach base came to life on my skin. I've had this experience with the occasional vintage bottle, I always think the perfume feels "exhausted.” Poor tired vintage perfume...

    Bavard’s sample came from a 1960’s pressurized “atomiseur” or aerosal spray. These vintage atomiseurs were phased out in the late 1970’s in favor of the “vaporisateur” or natural sprays when concerns about CFC propellants emerged. In our PM conversation, Bavard wondered how to distinguish between the two. I feel the boxes/bottles usually indicate atomiseur or vaporisateur. I also think natural sprays always have the inner tube and the atomiseurs do not.

    One would think that an airtight pressurized atomizer would protect the contents of a vintage perfume, but I fear this is not always the case. I tested a pressurized Miss Balmain some time ago that was indescribably awful. I have vintage Balenciaga Michelle and Madame Rochas atomizers that smell acceptable when compared to my other bottles but I still think the perfume in them feels flat and does not last as long. I now believe the propellant may actually degrade rather than preserve the perfume so as a general rule, I avoid buying vintage atomizers, although no doubt many of them are perfectly fine.

    Of course, I had no idea that the some of the propellant could remain mixed with the perfume decanted from an atomiseur and continue to be released (evaporate?) from the sample after it was sealed. But Epapsiou and those who have experienced farting Diorama firsthand have enlightened us all...
    Currently wearing: Amarige by Givenchy

  21. #201

    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Much appreciation for these last few extremely helpful posts! Thank you everyone! epapsiou's posts strike me as the sort of thing that should be posted where the info will be easily searchable for future reference. Do we have a resource thread specifically for care, handling and shipping of vintages? If not, maybe we need one.

    Hopefully, this all will help me have some idea what I'm trying to assess on further sampling of Farting Diorama. I did also wonder about some age showing on the aldehydes, as grayspoole mentioned. But again, the first sampling was so bafflingly different from what I expected that I just didn't trust my nose about any part of it. And yes, I think I'll finish my sample quickly-it's probably going to take all of it to get my head around this thing!

    Quote Originally Posted by Lellabelle View Post
    It was the standout of the line for me: classic bones, but modernized somehow. It definitely has a Roudnitska signature, but it has its own personality and style distinct from the classics. Rose can be a difficult note for me and it’s very well handled here. Lots of contrasts, and elements that play against, and with, each other without dominating. The structure isn’t as well worked out as the Roudnitska Dior’s though (to be fair, not much is). It’s more freeform, and playful. Where the Dior’s have a refined, thoughtful elegance, BDP feels a little more neo-classical. Pre-raphelite, rather than couture.
    This sounds beautiful! Once they're stocked again, I think this will be the perfect time to order me another round of samples. Your description of the "feel" of it is in line with what I felt about those I did try. Not high fashion like Dior, yet similar in preferred notes and fragrance categories. "Pre-Raphaelite" captures DelRae's style very well. It seems you have plenty to add and I, for one, would love to read about the Diors of your youth, should you feel so inclined.

  22. #202
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by RoRo View Post
    That is curious, indeed.

    Each of my atomizers seemed to be on its last legs, with feeble ejection, which I took to mean that the pressure was low in the bottles. If so, maybe the fragrance didn't have much propellant in it anymore.

    Who knows.
    That is interesting and would explain why some atomiseur decant are not bubbly or experience shrinkage.
    I guess one way to see the pressure in your bottle is to feel how cold it gets when you spray.
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  23. #203

    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by grayspoole View Post
    Bavard wondered how to distinguish between the two. I feel the boxes/bottles usually indicate atomiseur or vaporisateur. I also think natural sprays always have the inner tube and the atomiseurs do not.
    Hi grayspoole. Just my contribution to clarify.
    The easiest way is to check if the content is expressed only in milliliters or grams and milliliters. When you read both gr. and ml. this means it is a pressurized bottle (source: my Miss Dior - purchased after your kind suggestion -, Dioressence, Poison, Magie noire, Aromatics Elixir and Femme atomiseurs). Oldest bottles can show only the grams.
    Both versions, atomiseur and natural spray, do have the inner tube.

  24. #204

    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by Bavard View Post
    I'm especially interested in Sous le Vent, so I did a comparison wearing with Diorella.

    Switching back and forth - Diorella smells like a baby. It's that soft and innocent. Sous le Vent is like cinnamon sticks, almost dangerous.
    I totally agree about the baby smell with Diorella! When I first met Dior SA Hannah, she let me smell all the reformulated Diors she had behind the counter (different store), and I took home samples of Diorling, Dioressence, and Diorella at that time. Diorella was my favorite, and I when I went back to purchase it, I told Hannah I thought it smelled like a baby’s head. She agreed, but added that she thought it had a buttered popcorn note. Which may be where they got the idea for the Miss Dior Cherie brief (caramel popcorn and strawberries).

    I also want to mention I also had a pressurizing issue with the Diorama sample you sent, but since I had prior warning, I opened it slowly like a shaken pop bottle. I got some on my hands and it’s very faint. I’ll explore it more tonight. (Thanks Bavard!)
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  25. #205
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilturko View Post
    Hi grayspoole. Just my contribution to clarify.
    The easiest way is to check if the content is expressed only in milliliters or grams and milliliters. When you read both gr. and ml. this means it is a pressurized bottle (source: my Miss Dior - purchased after your kind suggestion -, Dioressence, Poison, Magie noire, Aromatics Elixir and Femme atomiseurs). Oldest bottles can show only the grams.
    Both versions, atomiseur and natural spray, do have the inner tube.
    Hi Gilturko-

    Thanks for setting me straight on the tube/no tube issue. I don't know where I got the idea that atomiseurs do not have tubes. I even checked my Balenciaga Michelle atomiseur yesterday to be sure and I didn't see one, but now that I look at it again, dang, I see it. The tube is very fine and (almost) invisible.
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  26. #206
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by grayspoole View Post
    Hi N.CAL Fragrance Reviewer-

    I've been wondering about this, and I will send you samples so we can put it to the test. Looking at how you rate the perfumes in your wardrobe, I think you like some warmth in a perfume's base, and the one thing that is notable about vintage Diors is the almost complete absence of vanilla, labdanum, and ambery resins. It is as if Dior and his perfumers were consciously avoiding comparisons to the Guerlain aesthetic. So I think you might like vintage Dioressence. It is the only vintage Dior that has an "oriental" [sic] personality.

    Would vintage Miss Dior and Diorella be too floral for you? But they are extraordinary compositions so maybe not...

    And I think you might enjoy vintage Eau Sauvage, although I made the mistake of suggesting vintage ES to a younger male friend, who tried it and, alas, found it too "mature." So he gave the mini back to me.
    I'd be happy to try whatever you throw at me, whether I end up loving it or hating it. The learning experience is what's most important from it.

    I'll never know if Miss Dior or Diorella is too floral if I don't try it. Never tried vintage Eau Sauvage.

    I have to try vintage Jules as well. Shamefully I've never tried this fragrance before.
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  27. #207

    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by grayspoole View Post
    No one seems to be emphasizing Diorella’s skanky/funky side so I am wondering if this ingredient has been removed in the versions being discussed? Or replaced with cumin? If Bavard can write, “Diorella smells like a baby. It's that soft and innocent” I would have to say this might be a different Diorella than the one I know
    Speaking of which, does anyone know in what is different this version of Diorella from the original one?

  28. #208
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilturko View Post
    Speaking of which, does anyone know in what is different this version of Diorella from the original one?
    Gilturko-

    I believe that the teal box/gray oval label is from the early 2000's. The samples being discussed upthread may provide some insights. I stick with the houndstooth-era packaging.
    Currently wearing: Amarige by Givenchy

  29. #209
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    I recently ran across a vintage atomizer of Poison that dates to 1987. That's the latest Dior atomizer I can remember seeing.
    Anyway, just another data point regarding Christian Dior atomizers.

    I was wondering, were the propellants used in fact CFCs? On later atomizers (late '70s ~ early '80s), I have seen propane and butane listed as propellants. I'm no chemist, but I don't think these are CFCs. Still, I wonder if fragrance atomizers, even those using propane or butane, were phased out (at least in part) because the public perceived them as being harmful to the ozone layer.
    Currently wearing: Nombre Noir by Shiseido

  30. #210
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    Default Re: Women's Dior Circa 1980

    Butane and propane are not chloroflourocarbons; they have no chlorine or flourine.

    I'm giving this metal bottle of Diormama another wearing. With more performance, or heft, it would be more interesting.




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