Code of Conduct
Results 1 to 9 of 9
  1. #1

    Default Clouding (solubility?) issues with juniper berry fragrance

    Hi all,

    I having issues with clouding in a juniper berry oil heavy fragrance I created. The clouding only happens once I add the alcohol (96%, no added water), so I imagine its solubility issues? Given, I've only let it mature for 4 days in the alcohol so perhaps it will clear up after time? And I havent filtered it yet, but Im not sure that is going to help. Some of the other ingredients are diluted with DPG but I havent had issues with them before. Thoughts?

  2. #2
    Basenotes Plus
    pkiler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    6,768

    Default Re: Clouding (solubility?) issues with juniper berry fragrance

    I would try to dilute the juniper Berry, all by itself in Alcohol, and see if that is the culprit.
    If not, try your other naturals, by themselves.
    If not, consider adding in a solubilizer, and see if that helps the clouding?
    Is the Juniper berry and CO2?
    CO2's often have solubility issues, and you may need something like fatty acid ethyl or methyl esters to aid in the complete solvency of your CO2.
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    Gold Medal for "Best Aroma"; Los Angeles Artisan Fragrance Salon

  3. #3

    Default Re: Clouding (solubility?) issues with juniper berry fragrance

    Sounds like the same problem Erik Kormann had developing „Abrakabarber“, which is heavy on juniper.
    He had to reduce juniper berry oil and employed lime, pink pepper and olibanum CO2.
    The product is fantastic!

  4. #4

    Default Re: Clouding (solubility?) issues with juniper berry fragrance

    Quote Originally Posted by pkiler View Post
    I would try to dilute the juniper Berry, all by itself in Alcohol, and see if that is the culprit.
    If not, try your other naturals, by themselves.
    If not, consider adding in a solubilizer, and see if that helps the clouding?
    Is the Juniper berry and CO2?
    CO2's often have solubility issues, and you may need something like fatty acid ethyl or methyl esters to aid in the complete solvency of your CO2.
    Thanks Pkiler, I just did the test as you suggested (see attached the pictures), it's definitely the Juniper, that is 1 drop of the pure juniper being dropped into 96% alcohol. Just 1 drop and it's cloudy so it's going to be tricky to lower the quantities in a fragrance were juniper is at the heart! I'm finding out from the suplier if it's a CO2 or not, I havent heard back yet. I havent worked with solubilizers before, what is usally used? Thank you for your help with this! Juniper 1.jpgJuniper 2.jpg

  5. #5

    Default Re: Clouding (solubility?) issues with juniper berry fragrance

    Quote Originally Posted by giftmischer View Post
    Sounds like the same problem Erik Kormann had developing „Abrakabarber“, which is heavy on juniper.
    He had to reduce juniper berry oil and employed lime, pink pepper and olibanum CO2.
    The product is fantastic!
    Interesting! I have actually used Pink Pepper and citrus in the compound, but maybe I need some heavier guys in there too. Saying that, if you look at the pictures I just sent in response to Pkiler, all it seems to take is a drop and the clouds form... Took so long to get this one right from a scent perspective, so heart broken to run into this issue now. But I must persist!

  6. #6

    Default Re: Clouding (solubility?) issues with juniper berry fragrance

    If it's a CO2 extract and the berries were crushed, then some lipids would likely have been extracted from the seeds. If you allow the fragrance to sit for a few days then the lipids should precipitate to the bottom and the majority can then be poured off clear, leaving only a small amount in need of filtration. Filter papers can be a little slow if you don't have a vacuum. If time is an issue then cotton wool makes for a decent depth filter with a high flow rate; simply stuff some into the bottom of a large syringe or the neck of a funnel, compact it down a little and steadily pour the solution through.
    Last edited by Pears; 15th November 2017 at 02:16 AM.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Clouding (solubility?) issues with juniper berry fragrance

    Quote Originally Posted by Pears View Post
    If it's a CO2 extract and the berries were crushed, then some lipids would likely have been extracted from the seeds. If you allow the fragrance to sit for a few days then the lipids should precipitate to the bottom and the majority can then be poured off clear, leaving only a small amount in need of filtering. Filter papers can be a little slow if you don't have a vacuum. If time is an issue then cotton wool makes for a decent depth filter with a high flow rate; simply stuff some into the bottom of a large syringe or the neck of a funnel, compact it down a little and steadily pour the solution through.
    Thanks Pears. Im going to let it mature in the alcohol for aother couple days, then cool and filter it (I dont mind long filter times, I have some good lab quality filters), I will report back with the results! Thanks again

  8. #8

    Default Re: Clouding (solubility?) issues with juniper berry fragrance

    Sure, that will be fine. If you choose to filter a concentrated juniper solution in the future, then the higher lipid content may cause clogging of the filter paper, in which case you can pre-filter through cotton wool (which has a higher loading capacity than filter paper) and then assess if a final filtration through filter paper is required.
    Last edited by Pears; 15th November 2017 at 02:30 AM.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Clouding (solubility?) issues with juniper berry fragrance

    Quote Originally Posted by Pears View Post
    Sure, that will be fine. If you choose to filter a concentrated juniper solution in the future, then the higher lipid content may cause clogging of the filter paper, in which case you can pre-filter through cotton wool (which has a higher loading capacity than filter paper) and then assess if a final filtration through filter paper is required.
    Good to know, thanks again Pears! I shall report back

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 6
    Last Post: 18th May 2017, 01:23 AM
  2. Juniper / Juniper Berry
    By Asha in forum Note Pad: Single Note Exploration
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 3rd March 2016, 11:42 AM
  3. Maltol solubility issues
    By JEBeasley in forum Fragrance DIY
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 11th October 2014, 11:20 PM
  4. What is this note? (Answer: Juniper Berry!)
    By atrac in forum Male Fragrance Discussion
    Replies: 34
    Last Post: 8th August 2008, 04:37 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  



Loving perfume on the Internet since 2000