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  1. #1

    Default Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    As you know, Im learning a lot and am still green. Open to any feedback. Here is what I have so far in my recreation. It is getting better and better!

    Ingredient Amount Concentration % Grams w/o Ethanol % in Final Product
    Timbersilk 6.000 100 6.0000 5.0094%
    Iso E Super 22.000 100 22.0000 18.3678%
    Ambroxan 27.000 40 10.8000 9.0169%
    Helvetolide 20.000 100 20.0000 16.6980%
    Hedione HC 3.000 100 3.0000 2.5047%
    Clearwood 5.000 100 5.0000 4.1745%
    Dynascone 10.000 10 1.0000 0.8349%
    Habanolide 2.500 100 2.5000 2.0872%
    Lyral 7.000 100 7.0000 5.8443%
    Ambrettolide 3.500 100 3.5000 2.9221%
    Bergamot 5.000 100 5.0000 4.1745%
    Ambergris 1.500 100 1.5000 1.2523%
    Verymoss 10.000 50 5.0000 4.1745%
    Vanilla 0.200 100 0.2000 0.1670%
    Patchouli Acetate 1.000 100 1.0000 0.8349%
    Top note accord 1.500 100 1.5000 1.2523%
    Oak Moss Absolute 7.000 10 0.7000 0.5844%
    Lilial 3.000 100 3.0000 2.5047%
    Lapsang Tincture 0.0000 0.0000%
    Muscone 0.600 100 0.6000 0.5009%
    Norlimbanol 5.000 20 1.0000 0.8349%
    Dorinia SA E 0.800 10 0.0800 0.0668%
    Alpha Damascone 0.600 10 0.0600 0.0501%
    Fixateur 505 0.600 100 0.6000 0.5009%
    Paradisimade 0.300 10 0.0300 0.0250%
    Javanol 0.500 10 0.0500 0.0417%
    Linalool 0.500 100 0.5000 0.4174%
    Cashmeran 1.200 100 1.2000 1.0019%
    Precyclemone B 0.100 100 0.1000 0.0835%
    Cis 3 Hex 0.200 10 0.0200 0.0167%
    Cosmone 0.300 100 0.3000 0.2505%
    Amyl Salicylate 0.300 100 0.3000 0.2505%
    Cedramber 0.200 100 0.2000 0.1670%
    Trimofix 0.150 100 0.1500 0.1252%
    Hedione 8.000 100 8.0000 6.6792%
    Ethyl Vanillin 0.300 50 0.1500 0.1252%
    Cade oil 0.050 10 0.0050 0.0042%
    Pyralone 2.700 10 0.2700 0.2254%
    Safraleine 0.600 10 0.0600 0.0501%
    Floralozone 0.200 10 0.0200 0.0167%
    Amber Extreme 3.000 10 0.3000 0.2505%
    Allyl Heptoanate 0.200 100 0.2000 0.1670%
    Vertofix 0.900 100 0.9000 0.7514%
    DHM 4.000 100 4.0000 3.3396%
    Ambrox Super 5.000 20 1.0000 0.8349%
    cassis Base 0.700 100 0.7000 0.5844%
    limonene 65 0.100 100 0.1000 0.0835%
    Grisalva 0.900 20 0.1800 0.1503%
    173.200 119.78 69.1542%

  2. #2

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    I know I am biting off more than I can chew!

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Would surprise me if Ambroxan was that high.

    Where is the pineapple? Only the Ally heptanoate and damascone?
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Forgive me that is in my top note pinapple/apple accord. Here is what I used for the the accord:
    manzanate 4
    allyl heptoanate 4
    aag 12
    verdox 1
    ethyl butyrate 6

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Did you actually use the Lapsang Souchong? Your numbers say 0
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    I did in my first few iterations but once I received cade oil, I removed the lapsang tincture.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    I feel like it needs more Pyralone and Dynascone. Those will be increased in my next iteration and ambroxan decreased.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Conceivably, how much IBQ can I add??

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    That much Ambroxan above is more like Sauvage, but not Aventus.
    IBQ is quite powerful. I'd dilute to 10%, and add slowly.
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Quote Originally Posted by tuscaloosatanning View Post
    Conceivably, how much IBQ can I add??

    here's a good read, from one of our former members here, now really really missed:
    http://www.basenotes.net/threads/408...light=pyralone

  11. #11

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    I had read Ruskins post on IBQ. His knowledge is missed here, his terse demeanor, not so much.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Quote Originally Posted by tuscaloosatanning View Post
    I had read Ruskins post on IBQ. His knowledge is missed here, his terse demeanor, not so much.
    pardon?

  13. #13

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Its a running joke. Ruskin was and is the oracle on this forum but the running joke was the terse British way of speaking and responding was part of the package. He was a personality no doubt. He reminded me of Hitchens a bit

  14. #14

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Things I have learned...Dynascone is really really strong and I have way too much. I am currently at .2% and its still pretty powerful. I have added more Pyralone(.5%). Decreased Ambroxan to 6%. Bergamot up to 7%. Cassis up to .8%. Removed Ethyl Vanillin and brought Vanillin up to .7% DHM down to 3 and added Lemon EO at 1%. Its getting much better!

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Great!

    BTW, what is your Cis-3-Hex? Hexenol? Hexenal? Hexanoate? Hexenyl acetate?
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Paul, it is cis-3 Hexenyl acetate. I am going to back down Amber Extreme a touch. I feel I am getting less wood and more modern amber and thats no good. My thought process was the inclusion of Cashmeran in combo with AE and Timbersilk would make for a nice trifecta but its a bit much. I brought Cade oil up to .01% and there is not much margin for error with Cade. It may mellow and integrate with time. I feel it is becoming better but early thoughts from this iteration would be: bring bergamot down a touch and lemon up a bit. Have I mentioned Dynascone is strong? Man! I use it at 10% solution and .2% in concentrate and still....Is it possible it could be the Allyl Heptoanate that is taking over? I feel like they act similarly in this blend. Anything look way out of whack? I feel like I may be pushing it on the Norlimbanol as well. I need to test more..

    Timbersilk 10.000 100 10.0000 8.6252%
    Iso E Super 18.000 100 18.0000 15.5253%
    Ambroxan 20.000 40 8.0000 6.9001%
    Helvetolide 19.000 100 19.0000 16.3878%
    Hedione HC 3.000 100 3.0000 2.5875%
    Clearwood 5.000 100 5.0000 4.3126%
    Dynascone 2.000 10 0.2000 0.1725%
    Habanolide 2.500 100 2.5000 2.1563%
    Lyral 7.000 100 7.0000 6.0376%
    Ambrettolide 3.500 100 3.5000 3.0188%
    Bergamot 8.000 100 8.0000 6.9001%
    Ambergris 1.000 100 1.0000 0.8625%
    Verymoss 10.000 50 5.0000 4.3126%
    Vanilla 0.400 100 0.4000 0.3450%
    Patchoulol 2.000 10 0.2000 0.1725%
    Patchouli Acetate 1.000 100 1.0000 0.8625%
    Top note accord 0.660 100 0.6600 0.5693%
    Oak Moss Absolute 5.000 10 0.5000 0.4313%
    Lilial 3.000 100 3.0000 2.5875%
    Tonalide 1.000 100 1.0000 0.8625%
    Muscone 0.500 100 0.5000 0.4313%
    Norlimbanol 5.000 20 1.0000 0.8625%
    Dorinia SA E 0.800 10 0.0800 0.0690%
    Alpha Damascone 0.600 10 0.0600 0.0518%
    Fixateur 505 0.500 100 0.5000 0.4313%
    Paradisimade 0.300 10 0.0300 0.0259%
    Javanol 0.500 10 0.0500 0.0431%
    Ethyl Linalool 0.400 100 0.4000 0.3450%
    Cashmeran 0.800 100 0.8000 0.6900%
    Precyclemone B 0.100 100 0.1000 0.0863%
    Cis 3 Hex Acetate 0.200 10 0.0200 0.0173%
    Cosmone 0.300 100 0.3000 0.2588%
    Amyl Salicylate 0.300 100 0.3000 0.2588%
    Cedramber 0.200 100 0.2000 0.1725%
    Trimofix 0.150 100 0.1500 0.1294%
    Hedione 7.000 100 7.0000 6.0376%
    Cade oil 0.900 10 0.0900 0.0776%
    Pyralone 5.000 10 0.5000 0.4313%
    Safraleine 1.000 10 0.1000 0.0863%
    Floralozone 0.200 10 0.0200 0.0173%
    Amber Extreme 3.000 10 0.3000 0.2588%
    Allyl Heptoanate 0.300 100 0.3000 0.2588%
    Vertofix 0.900 100 0.9000 0.7763%
    DHM 3.000 100 3.0000 2.5875%
    cassis Base 0.800 100 0.8000 0.6900%
    Lemon Oil 1.000 100 1.0000 0.8625%
    limonene 65 0.100 100 0.1000 0.0863%
    Grisalva 0.900 20 0.1800 0.1553%

  17. #17

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    I am enjoying this exercise. I had a decant of Aventus and every time I smelled it I would glean info from it. BTW, If anyone has done a basic GC/MS, I will offset some of the cost of your purchase of the gc/ms by kicking in some cash. It doesn't have to be extensive, I would just like to get the broad strokes.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    I removed Patchoulol as well

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    The two items that *may need to be looked at is Pyralone, and Oakmoss Abs. - they may be too high. but maybe not.
    Take your dynascone out completely, and smell what you have, then make the decision to add it in or not.
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Thank you for your help Paul

  21. #21

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Amazing effort you're putting in, good job, hope it's still going as planned. Here's my two cents from my limited experience, you may already know some of this. I don't think cade is used at all, it's far too distinct and hard to work with. Citral is one of known key ingredients, so include that around .015% - .02%. Also Manzanate (apple) is likely the key top note in modern Aventus, pineapple is there to lift it, try to get that apple to peek over the top. The tart black currant should be in the back lifting the pineapple up. The bergamot looks fine, maybe a little less if you think it's diluting the apple. The rose (Dorinia SA E) and jasmine (hedione) look good to me. Other than that, maybe tone down the musks, it's mostly a tart fruity floral woody scent the musk/moss is very effervescent. There's a lot going on in that base, I dunno, other than adding more ambergris (huge factor in Creed DNA) 1-2% and lowering the ambroxan 2-3% perhaps simplify the base and pick your favorites, always keep it simple first especially the base notes. I feel like Aventus is a lot simpler than most people think with no more than 30-35 ingredients, since Erwin and his son (early in his career) made it, but I could easily be wrong. So, I have a few question for you however lol. Did you ever find what makes that nice scratchy/smokey? birch found in vintage and Poseidon's Exlixir 13zz? Could it be a combination of pyralone (IBQ) and maybe Cedramber, timbersilk I can't find the aroma chemicals involved. Maybe it's some birch quality that is separated from the polarizing campfire/wintergreen quality in the birch bark tar? Apparently the guys from Dua have to travel to Barcelona to source the "birch tar oil" that Creed also used, no other information I could find online other than IBQ and 2-IBQ being decent candidates for that mystery accord. My last question, are you going for a vintage or a modern fruity batch? I am planning on doing a similar big experiment with vintage Aventus in the future and have been experimenting with accords for a year now and there are some mystery's I need to solve before I jump in the brisk waters.
    Last edited by SharpLess; 7th August 2018 at 01:18 AM.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    The Creed family are NOT the Perfumers of their products.
    DUA also do not make their own fragrances.
    They are both sham companies claiming that they make their own fragrances.
    DUA buys their stock from clone houses, and Creed hires outside Perfumers.
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  23. #23

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Quote Originally Posted by pkiler View Post
    The Creed family are NOT the Perfumers of their products.
    DUA also do not make their own fragrances.
    They are both sham companies claiming that they make their own fragrances.
    DUA buys their stock from clone houses, and Creed hires outside Perfumers.
    *Hat-tipped*

    Thank you Paul. I really like when someone just tells it straight and more should.
    One utterance of truth destroys a thousand lies and illusions
    Currently wearing: Aventus by Creed

  24. #24

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Quote Originally Posted by pkiler View Post
    The Creed family are NOT the Perfumers of their products.
    DUA also do not make their own fragrances.
    They are both sham companies claiming that they make their own fragrances.
    DUA buys their stock from clone houses, and Creed hires outside Perfumers.
    Okay, but If DUA simply bought the rights to the ingredients why has no other clone house got it right? Some are way off target compared to Aventus, even DUA only have a few pieces of the puzzle albeit big ones. That also makes me question your first claim about Creed, why would they want to hire outside help when they themselves are master perfumers with one of the oldest legacies? Sorry nothing you said adds up to me. Let's assume there's some truth to that, perhaps some behind the scenes 'hand shakes', that just leads one to say "who knows, maybe?" I would assume DUA get most of their knowledge via gas chromatography-mass spectrometry and it led them to particular conclusions.

  25. #25

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbouti View Post
    *Hat-tipped*

    Thank you Paul. I really like when someone just tells it straight and more should.
    One utterance of truth destroys a thousand lies and illusions
    Sorry but all I got was a conspiracy theory, no truth or help was added with his statement.

  26. #26
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    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Because neither DUA or Creed people are perfumers of ANY skill, they just CLAIM they are. Not conspiracy theories... just repeated lies from these companies. They've just lied so much that the world believes their lies. My friend met the actual Aventus perfumer at WPC last June.

    Choose what you wish to believe... I'm here to give you an antidote to propaganda.
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  27. #27

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    I enjoy wearing Creed fragrances as much as anyone but their history is somewhat creative and there is no concrete evidence of them having created any fragrance as far back as 1960 let alone 1760. Their marketing makes certain suggestions like ‘this fragrance was a favourite of a Hollywood movie star’, people fill in the blanks and it isn’t in their interests to correct them, so before you know it ol’ Blue Eyes favourite fragrance is BDP is part of their history. What Paul mentioned isn’t a theory. Don’t take my word for it, look into it yourself and you will see it for yourself. I think many of their fragrances are excellent and I regularly wear them but I also think the guys and/or girls that have created these perfumes get paid a ton of money by Creed to remain unsung heroes to keep the Creed machine and history viable. Somewhere out there there’s a perfumer that actually created Aventus collecting their cheques and keeping quiet but doesn’t get an ounce of kudos for their efforts/talents.


    Edit
    Just realised Paul posted above and has actually just confirmed the point I mentioned regarding unsung hero perfumers.
    Last edited by Sheik Yerbouti; 5th August 2018 at 10:04 PM. Reason: Additional info
    Currently wearing: Aventus by Creed

  28. #28
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    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Outing the real Aventus Perfumer would be harmful to the man... so I shan't
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  29. #29

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    Quote Originally Posted by pkiler View Post
    Outing the real Aventus Perfumer would be harmful to the man... so I shan't
    I wouldn’t expect you to. If you see him please thank him for me. I doubt I’ll ever have an opportunity to do so in person. His creation has given me and many of the people I know immense pleasure. I hope he realises his contribution is appreciated and that he can one day get recognition for his creation.
    Currently wearing: Aventus by Creed

  30. #30

    Default Re: Yes... its an Aventus inspired formula

    I did some research and yes there are no pre-1970 bottles of Creed on Google images, but does that completely refute that the company ever existed prior? No, there are tons of vintage/exclusive items that have no image on Google, and there is a chance they could come out with a small lineage showcase/museum since they were so exclusive prior to GIT. In fact they haven't been widely known since 2010. Perhaps they weren't doing fragrance the whole 200+ years, but they didn't happen upon a top notch niche house by sheer deceit and mind games. It requires skill, determination understanding of chemistry and many other things the average person will never know. There are likely a fair amount of truths in the story of Creed and some exaggeration, but the story sells the brand and makes everything feel so much more extravagant. This claim takes nothing away from what I think of Creed as a brand and their masterpiece fragrances. I still don't think they would need outside noses helping when they established such a strong modern brand of fragrance with GIT and Original Vetiver. It's a possibility but I find it unlikely they would allow some nose in on their secrets. Let alone a nose working on a masterpiece perfume and never getting credit for it? People do great things to be remembered and have a legacy. This isn't the Illuminati.
    Last edited by SharpLess; 6th August 2018 at 05:43 AM.




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