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  1. #1

    Default Incense Materials

    Hi everyone,

    I've been using a handful of incense materials, and I wanted to get opinions on my impressions of the ones I've got, along with some ideas for blending w synthetics.

    Naturals:
    Olibanum EO (boswellia carteri from CP) - bright, terpenic, woody, very diffusive, lightest of the materials, least tenacious
    Olibanum Resinoid (Firmenich) - rich, deep, sweeter/balsamic notes, least diffusive, very tenacious
    Olibanum Coeur (Ventos) - dry, woody, smokier than the others, tenacious
    Bois d'Encense (Robertet) - dry, more woody, terpenic, aromatic (cedar facets from codistillation), tenacious
    Hydrocarboresin - ambery, vanillic, woody, smoky, terpenic, rich, heavy

    Synthetics:
    Velvetone (dimethyl alpha ionone) - light, transparent, woody, orris (have not tested long enough on it's own to see its "powdery" effect)
    Musk R1 - warm, powdery, exalting
    Aldehyde C12 MNA - diffusive, fizzy, provides lift to the heavier components (used around 0.1%)

    Currently I'm using the first 4 naturals in a fragrance at % listed below, but I've thought about stripping them down one by one (J. Carles method) and doing a long term evaluation on determining the optimum ratio that I like. I've got:
    Bois d'Encens (R) 2.50%
    olibanum resinoid 4.50%
    Olibanum Coeur 4.00%
    olibanum EO 3.00%
    Velvetone at 5%,
    Musk R1 at 2%.
    (Also have a large slug of Iso E Super ~35%, Vertofix at 7.50%)

    The goal is an incense note apparent in the top, with a long, spicy woody phase that isn't too heavy into the dry down. So far, it's a good start.

    Curious if you agree/disagree w what I've said, and have anything else to offer about them. Also open to other material suggestions, like Olibanol (in my cart to order).

    Currently wearing: Eau de Campagne by Sisley

  2. #2
    Super Member Godmu's Avatar
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    Default Re: Incense Materials

    Boswellia Carterii CO2
    Elemi
    'Today I'm a star. What will I be tomorrow? A black hole?'
    Woody Allen

  3. #3

    Default Re: Incense Materials

    seems you are good supplied with basenote-materials. my experience tells me that Bois d'Encens lasts even longer than the pure resin.
    for top note, i'd recommend to start building an accord with aldehyde c-9 and black pepper. very toppy, and very incensy. and go for ald c12 mna.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Incense Materials

    Quote Originally Posted by Godmu View Post
    Boswellia Carterii CO2
    Elemi
    Thanks for the suggestions, I will work on getting samples of these

    Quote Originally Posted by pavomi View Post
    seems you are good supplied with basenote-materials. my experience tells me that Bois d'Encens lasts even longer than the pure resin.
    for top note, i'd recommend to start building an accord with aldehyde c-9 and black pepper. very toppy, and very incensy. and go for ald c12 mna.
    That's funny, I actually have C-9 and Black pepper EO in my top notes, I thought they would work well, glad it wasn't a bad assumption :-)

    Currently wearing: Eau de Campagne by Sisley

  5. #5

    Default Re: Incense Materials

    Black pepper has aroma chemicals (the main one beta-caryophyllene) in it that are similar to the ones in the oriental incense materials Acronychia pedunculate and Gurjun basalm.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Incense Materials

    Quote Originally Posted by runstile View Post
    Hi everyone,

    I've been using a handful of incense materials, and I wanted to get opinions on my impressions of the ones I've got, along with some ideas for blending w synthetics.

    Naturals:
    Olibanum EO (boswellia carteri from CP) - bright, terpenic, woody, very diffusive, lightest of the materials, least tenacious
    Olibanum Resinoid (Firmenich) - rich, deep, sweeter/balsamic notes, least diffusive, very tenacious
    Olibanum Coeur (Ventos) - dry, woody, smokier than the others, tenacious
    Bois d'Encense (Robertet) - dry, more woody, terpenic, aromatic (cedar facets from codistillation), tenacious
    Hydrocarboresin - ambery, vanillic, woody, smoky, terpenic, rich, heavy

    Synthetics:
    Velvetone (dimethyl alpha ionone) - light, transparent, woody, orris (have not tested long enough on it's own to see its "powdery" effect)
    Musk R1 - warm, powdery, exalting
    Aldehyde C12 MNA - diffusive, fizzy, provides lift to the heavier components (used around 0.1%)

    Currently I'm using the first 4 naturals in a fragrance at % listed below, but I've thought about stripping them down one by one (J. Carles method) and doing a long term evaluation on determining the optimum ratio that I like. I've got:
    Bois d'Encens (R) 2.50%
    olibanum resinoid 4.50%
    Olibanum Coeur 4.00%
    olibanum EO 3.00%
    Velvetone at 5%,
    Musk R1 at 2%.
    (Also have a large slug of Iso E Super ~35%, Vertofix at 7.50%)

    The goal is an incense note apparent in the top, with a long, spicy woody phase that isn't too heavy into the dry down. So far, it's a good start.

    Curious if you agree/disagree w what I've said, and have anything else to offer about them. Also open to other material suggestions, like Olibanol (in my cart to order).
    You are using several materials that I have used in a recent incense fragrance - Bois d encens (12%), olibanum resinoid (7%), olibanum coeur (4%), iso E Super (4%), vertofix (1.5%), musk R1 (1.3%), and aldehyde c12 MNA (0.04%, at 1% dilution). All work well together. I also used cedarwood terpenes, as it seems to blend well with the materials above, but I was going for a forest type of fragrance with incense built in, so using that would depend what you want your fragrance to end up like. I really like bois d encens a lot, but it’s not terribly strong when blended with other materials so personally that’s why I used more. Black pepper sounds like a good top note as well. Good luck!

  7. #7

    Default Re: Incense Materials

    So, still working on this fragrance, I've found I really like Olibanol + Olibanum Coeur the most, and I've got them at equal parts now.

    Does anyone have any data on the evaporation curve / log p of these? I'm thinking since Olibanol is a fractionation of the EO, assuming mostly of the alcohols that it evaporates quicker, but not sure how much. TGSC lumps them into "incense specialty" so the longevity isn't really specific to each material.

    The incense bones of my formula currently is:

    Iso E Super: 20%
    Vertofix: 1%
    Cedramber: 0.1%
    Cetalox: 2%
    Benzoin resin: 0.5%
    Piconia: 1.5%
    Olibanum EO: 2.25%
    Olibanol: 7%
    Olibanum Coeur: 7%
    Amber Xtreme: 0.005% (eliminating this, started at 0.1% and reduced down to this level. It's too screechy, need to replace w another high impact material, considering AmberMax? Any other suggestions?)
    Vertenex 4%

    Woods:
    Guaiac EO Heart: 8.25%
    agarwood CO2: 0.125%

    Along w the musks, about 33%, listed in descending concentration

    Galaxolide
    ethylene brassylate
    Habanolide
    Musk R1
    Celestolide (probably removing and replacing w Galaxolide)
    Helvetolide (1% to boost, possibly eliminating)
    Cosmone
    Ambrettolide
    Last edited by runstile; 22nd May 2019 at 07:02 PM. Reason: added Benzoin and woods I forgot

    Currently wearing: Eau de Campagne by Sisley

  8. #8
    Basenotes Plus
    pkiler's Avatar
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    Default Re: Incense Materials

    You could try warming up the amber side, with Labdanum, Benzoin, or Hydrocarboresine...
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Incense Materials

    Quote Originally Posted by pkiler View Post
    You could try warming up the amber side, with Labdanum, Benzoin, or Hydrocarboresine...

    Ah, yes. I forgot to mention I have benzoin at 0.5%, but was thinking of adding maybe 0.25% Hydrocarboresin, thank you Paul.

    Currently wearing: Eau de Campagne by Sisley

  10. #10

    Default Re: Incense Materials

    benzoin is great in incense! and labdanum/hydrocarboresin are awesome in combination with cistus EO. cistus has a lovely dry incensy drydown.
    try to replace amberxtreme with ambrocenide. to my nose it has a resinous aspect.

    for further warming up - if this is in your interest - i'd try eugenol materials.
    getting it 'colder', i'd try calone in trace amounts. it would also soften the musks.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Incense Materials

    For the eugenol part i used cinnamon leaf , which I liked being also a bit cinnamic.

    And I used both ambrocenide and amberxtreme, whith the latter ~ 10 time less than the first.

    Inviato dal mio SM-J730F utilizzando Tapatalk

  12. #12
    Dependent mattmeleg's Avatar
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    Default Re: Incense Materials

    I love the smell of high grade Japanese incense, as well as Vietnamese and New Guinnea oud.
    I really hope you can catch the magic of insence.
    Best of luck!
    Know your "why," and the how is there.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Incense Materials

    Many incense blends also contain some form of sugar, so you may wish to add something for the caramelised/burnt sugar note (furaneol, 5-methyl furfural, etc.).

  14. #14

    Default Re: Incense Materials

    Thank you for all the suggestions! Definitely going to add some labdanum material, and test out traces of Ambrocenide and AmberMax (saw this one listed on Pell Wall's incense accord kit) in separate studies.

    Interesting Pears, I just ordered some 5-methyl-furfural I will evaluate it and add at 1% dilution to see how that works out.

    Matt, where do you buy Japanese incense from? Any source of EOs or are you just speaking of the actual incense you burn? I love it too, my favorite is Astier de Villate - Oulan Batour. They make theirs like traditional Japanese incense, but the scent smells Middle Eastern-ish (actually Oulan Bator is in Mongolia). Expensive but such a lovely product and excellent quality. https://www.luckyscent.com/product/5...RoC5LIQAvD_BwE

    Currently wearing: Eau de Campagne by Sisley

  15. #15
    Dependent mattmeleg's Avatar
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    Default Re: Incense Materials

    Quote Originally Posted by runstile View Post
    Thank you for all the suggestions! Definitely going to add some labdanum material, and test out traces of Ambrocenide and AmberMax (saw this one listed on Pell Wall's incense accord kit) in separate studies.

    Interesting Pears, I just ordered some 5-methyl-furfural I will evaluate it and add at 1% dilution to see how that works out.

    Matt, where do you buy Japanese incense from? Any source of EOs or are you just speaking of the actual incense you burn? I love it too, my favorite is Astier de Villate - Oulan Batour. They make theirs like traditional Japanese incense, but the scent smells Middle Eastern-ish (actually Oulan Bator is in Mongolia). Expensive but such a lovely product and excellent quality. https://www.luckyscent.com/product/5...RoC5LIQAvD_BwE

    Likely the best incense common people can get in Japan.
    http://www.yamadamatsu.co.jp/en/index.html

    They have a large collection of agar wood pieces.
    Not cheap. But good quality stuff.

    Hand rolled Japanese incense balls are incredible
    Neriko 練香 - go to Kyoto and purchase them from the above shop :-)

    ...I agree with Pears, Unsi Amber from Somalia has a lot of sugar in it, and it smells great.
    Know your "why," and the how is there.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Incense Materials

    Maybe Cashmeran or Kephalis could contribute to the insense note.

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  17. #17

    Default Re: Incense Materials

    So, update on my trials, I added hydrocarboresine 0.3% and 0.01% of Ambrocenide... It has made my incense steroidal! Granted it's only been blended 48 hours, maybe it will soften up. But I think it will allow me to drastically reduce my incense materials (~15% right now). It also is not as rough/trigeminal as AmberXtreme. I'm not sure if the effect is in combo with Hydrocarboresine at that level, I don't remember it being that powerful, I was really using it for more ambery smoky character and not loudness.

    Thanks for all the suggestions!

    Currently wearing: Eau de Campagne by Sisley

  18. #18
    Dependent mattmeleg's Avatar
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    Default Re: Incense Materials

    I agree with Cherry, cashmeran would add nice texture to your accord!
    Also, don`t forget birch tar oil for the smell of smoke!
    Oh yes, velvetone for smooth, powdery insence.

    Additionally to all the above,
    you can add the P.A. "spice accord," which is a mixture of eastern spices for oriental type fragrances.
    Matt
    Know your "why," and the how is there.




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