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  1. #1
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    Default useful tips on powder dilution

    Hello everyone!
    I just bought several materials to dilute and I wanted to ask some advice about it!
    my powders are:
    tetralid (or tonalide)
    veramoss (or evernyl)
    ethyl maltol
    yara yara
    as diluents I have ethanol 96 or dpg;
    if all of these can melt, I'd rather use the dpg instead of ethanol, but only if it works well!
    I would like to dilute to 10% but if some of these materials blend well even 20% or 50%;
    I also have cetalox that have advised me to dilute in ethanol or does not dissolve well in dpg; I diluted 2 grams cetalox in 18 grams of ethanol, then 10%; if I sniff from the flask though, there is more ethanol smell than cetalox and I am not anosmic to this material; I did something wrong to dilute it so or not? 10% works well as a projection power in a formula? it could already be used in powder, but I'm not so expert to go in here is away!

  2. #2
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    Default Re: useful tips on powder dilution

    I do not know exactly from the DPG but all the molecules except Yara-Yara are well soluble in ethanol.(I really did not try it in the 50% concentration) For Yara-Yara, you most likely need Diethyl phthalate or benzyl benzoate, it is poorly soluble in ethanol and not soluble in DPG.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: useful tips on powder dilution

    an advice on cetalox:
    I diluted it to 10% but below 20-22 degrees Celsius of room temperature, formed some crystals. Then I diluted to 5% and now it no longer crystals.I use it at 5%, but certainly at 10% it is more noticeable ...
    with tonalide,also, i have some problem at 10% in low room temperature for crystals..
    For evernyle, i used it at 1%, and it's strong...very durable in drydown, it could degrade the formula if not covered properly with other durable background material...
    (all in ethanol 96)

  4. #4
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    Default Re: useful tips on powder dilution

    but if you use yara yara powder, without diluting it, should it not dissolve in ethanol?

  5. #5
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    Default Re: useful tips on powder dilution

    ok on cetalox, I think I have diluted it well then! it's just that it has a delicate yet persistent smell!
    thanks for tonalide!

  6. #6
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    Default Re: useful tips on powder dilution

    You might have trouble with ethyl maltol diluting in higher %.

    If all of your materials are also diluted, then probably a decent idea to dilute these.
    However, I don't (hardly) ever dilute powdered materials, when I formulate, I just place into the concentrate and they nearly always dissolve with the other molecules.I will however dilute Maltol, Ethyl Maltol, Vanillin and Ethyl Vanillin, just due to their strength, and my aversion to use much of them to begin with.
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
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    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: useful tips on powder dilution

    better maybe dilute it to 1% ethyl maltol? in dpg is fine? I would like to work directly with powders but I'm afraid of overdosing! thank you!

  8. #8

    Default Re: useful tips on powder dilution

    Quote Originally Posted by Geco View Post
    ...
    with tonalide,also, i have some problem at 10% in low room temperature for crystals...
    I see a similar issue with tonalide which I diluted at 10%. Now there's a lot of 'salt' in the bottom. Is it enough to rise a bit the temperature and wait?

    Thanks,
    Pierpaolo


    Inviato dal mio AGS2-W09 utilizzando Tapatalk

  9. #9
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    Default Re: useful tips on powder dilution

    it takes a warmer room or you have to wait for spring .... or lower the dilution, but the scent feels less ... or change the solvent if it is convenient (dpg, benzyl benzoate, etc.) depending on the molecule, but it changes the scent...in this case perhaps the best solution is to dilute to 5% and then put twice as many drops / grams of fragrance concentrate of tonalide in the formula. It will dilute the whole fragrance slightly, but only to a small extent ...

  10. #10
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    Default Re: useful tips on powder dilution

    Quote Originally Posted by pierpaolo72 View Post
    I see a similar issue with tonalide which I diluted at 10%. Now there's a lot of 'salt' in the bottom.
    This is a prime reason why I don't even bother to dilute powdered materials...
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: useful tips on powder dilution

    okay Paul, I'd like to use the powders directly, but I can ask how do you adjust? do you weigh the quantity you want to add before? but how do you know not to overdose? You are an expert, me not ... another question, now it is improving, but I am anosmic at galaxolide and I realized I perceive very little even tonalide ... I diluted evernyl to 10% and same thing; I feel weak and, indeed, very much like tonalide! I would say that it does not look like oakmoss at all! they are two very different things ...

  12. #12
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    Default Re: useful tips on powder dilution

    Ah, yes, weighing. I NEVER use a material in a blend without weighing it. But maybe that is not quite your question?
    I can foresee that maybe you use tiny amounts of things to accomplish our formula?

    Here's the rub. A tiny/small sample size for your formula means that every tiny amount is a large percentage.
    Say you are doing as much as 100 drops. Then one drop is 1%. 1% is often way too much of some items.
    When you increase your sample size to 1000 drops, then one drop is .1%, which is much more of a fine shading, and you can give nuances, instead of whacks on the head.

    My standard for a full formula, is to compose in a 15ml bottle, and target to make about 10 grams.
    I don't always get to 10 grams, but also, if I need to add more than 10 grams, then I still have room to add.

    My Excel Perfume Formulation Software program lets me add materials, and it constantly recalculates for me to tell me what the percentages are.
    I can start with a guess on the formula, and add in bits if they need more oomph, and not get frustrated and have to start over again immediately.

    I must start over if there is too much of something, but not if adding.

    As for Galaxolide, it is a fluid, so not sure what to say. But Tonalide and Evernyl, are solids.
    Evernyl is only an aspect of Oakmoss, it is certainly not a full spectrum replacement.

    As for anosmia, keep working on smelling those items, and in time, you might be able to smell them more...
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: useful tips on powder dilution

    this is correct Paul! I work with small quantities and try to compose formulas for small circles of people (friends and family), but I never considered doing 10 or 100 of a formula; but I work by weight not in drops and normally I try to make 10% of a parfume so 5 grams about 50 ml of total perfume even if I happen to go further because I find myself adding something that was missing or to round off a note; however, using the 10/100/1000 method helps better in replicating a formula ... I don't know the software excel perfume form, wow !!! Is it easy to use? as far as the anosmia is concerned, it often happens to me as soon as I have new materials and I smell them all together, so I have a fatigue; it happens above all with the musks and, in fact, I have had similar problems with hexadecanolide, exaltolide, habanolide, norlimbanol, madranol, hedione which I solved by continuing to smell;

  14. #14

    Default Re: useful tips on powder dilution

    I bought Tonalide 50% in Augeo from Creating Perfume and it is a stable liquid, fully dissolved. Maybe try diluting some stuff in Augeo, it seems to be very good with tough solids.


  15. #15
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    Default Re: useful tips on powder dilution

    I had never heard it, thanks for the advice!

  16. #16

    Default Re: useful tips on powder dilution

    Quote Originally Posted by Fede Fratti View Post
    I had never heard it, thanks for the advice!
    Also, when adding solids to blends, lab micro scoopulas work very well. Or you can premeasure on lab paper covers, form the cover into a funnel, and dump it in. Or, you can buy lab measuring bowls/boats.

    https://smile.amazon.com/Aozita-Pack...ords=scoopulas

    https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B00ARK0R...v_ov_lig_dp_it

    https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B001AEDI...v_ov_lig_dp_it





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