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  1. #31
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Ultimately, we all have to believe something, and most times that involves a bit of faith. It is commonplace these days to put our faith in scientists, studies, and tests. These are really only as accurate as is our abilities to measure and read the stimuli we are responding to. Most of us do not perform these tests, and put our faith in those who are conducting to do so with unbiased honest intentions. We assume that, with the advent of the scientific method, that when feasible these studies will be replicable and peer reviewed. For this discussion, I'd say aluminum is to alzheimers as vaccinations are to autism. Unproven, and when any testing data has come up it seems to go with safe. Most evidence is circumstantial, though not made up or untrue. There are true believers on both sides who just want the best for their fellow man. As for me, I use antiperspirant. Old Spice high endurance Fresh, at 17% aluminum. It works well. I'm a sweaty man, and if I use deoderants I will sweat quite a bit in the summer. I dislike sweating.
    It’s tragic to think that heroic man’s great destiny is to become economic man, that men will be reduced to craven creatures who crawl across the globe competing for money, who spend their nights dreaming up new ways to swindle each other.

  2. #32
    Dependent Danny Mitchell's Avatar
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by notspendingamillion View Post
    Ultimately, we all have to believe something, and most times that involves a bit of faith. It is commonplace these days to put our faith in scientists, studies, and tests. These are really only as accurate as is our abilities to measure and read the stimuli we are responding to. Most of us do not perform these tests, and put our faith in those who are conducting to do so with unbiased honest intentions. We assume that, with the advent of the scientific method, that when feasible these studies will be replicable and peer reviewed. For this discussion, I'd say aluminum is to alzheimers as vaccinations are to autism. Unproven, and when any testing data has come up it seems to go with safe. Most evidence is circumstantial, though not made up or untrue. There are true believers on both sides who just want the best for their fellow man. As for me, I use antiperspirant. Old Spice high endurance Fresh, at 17% aluminum. It works well. I'm a sweaty man, and if I use deoderants I will sweat quite a bit in the summer. I dislike sweating.
    Well said, man.
    All deodorant I use fades too fast. I don't sweat much. But I hate pit smell, especially only a few hours after I put on antiperspirant.
    Currently wearing: Polo by Ralph Lauren

  3. #33

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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbouti View Post
    This is the last time I’ll respond just so I make myself abundantly clear.

    I do not care what your peer reviews say, or what you say, or what the official government position is on the matter. Oh yes and I couldn’t give a flying fuck what Wikipedia says.

    Aluminium has no benefit to the human body. Nada, zilch, zero benefit. It serves no biofunction AT ALL. We do not need it near our body, on our body or in our body.

    Do you ever stop to consider why people suffer from the ailments they do?
    Do you ever stop to consider why after all of the millions of man hours of scientific and medical study medical institutes, pharmaceutical companies haven’t made a cure available for any human ailment. Do you believe it is in their interest to produce a tablet that cures you? Or to provide you with a long term ‘treatment’ plan to deal with the symptoms that they will make thousands of £/€/$/¥ of profit from. Use your own discernment.

    If you have a problem these organisations can provide you with a treatment for profit. No problem = no profit. Do you get it now?
    Studies are funded. Ask yourself who funds the studies. Ask yourself who benefits.

    Don’t tell me about scientific evidence. Its catching up to what is already there.

    If you want to use aluminium containing anti-perspirants thats up to you. I don’t go near them. I wash and shower frequently and have no need for aluminium.
    Again - unsupported assertions.
    Regards,
    Renato.

  4. #34

    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato View Post
    Again - unsupported assertions.
    Regards,
    Renato.
    All I hear from you is blah blah blah
    and “Wikipedia states”....which is of course more blah.
    I’ll take my ‘unsupported assertions’ over your supported drivel any day.

    Science is one way to explain the world. Its not the only way. Science is often wrong and having to constantly try to correct its previous established facts.

    Observe the world and you will understand.

  5. #35

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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbouti View Post
    All I hear from you is blah blah blah
    and “Wikipedia states”....which is of course more blah.
    I’ll take my ‘unsupported assertions’ over your supported drivel any day.

    Science is one way to explain the world. Its not the only way. Science is often wrong and having to constantly try to correct its previous established facts.

    Observe the world and you will understand.
    All you hear from me are either supported statements or easily verifiable statements that can be looked up in thousands of history books.
    I decline to acknowledge your unsupported statements as being in any way authoritative.
    Regards,
    Renato

  6. #36

    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato View Post
    All you hear from me are either supported statements or easily verifiable statements that can be looked up in thousands of history books.
    I decline to acknowledge your unsupported statements as being in any way authoritative.
    Regards,
    Renato
    Your eyes are obscured by a lifetime of lies. Do you not see the inherent problems with studies?

    Its like believing a study conducted by a brewery on the benefits of alcohol and then publishing findings that alcohol is good for you and the more you drink the better it is for you. If you have eyes to observe you would see the conflict of interests. Alas we will not agree on this issue. You will continue to use aluminium containing antiperspirants and I will not, prefering to take more frequent showers.

  7. #37
    Dependent Danny Mitchell's Avatar
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbouti View Post
    Your eyes are obscured by a lifetime of lies. Do you not see the inherent problems with studies?

    Its like believing a study conducted by a brewery on the benefits of alcohol and then publishing findings that alcohol is good for you and the more you drink the better it is for you. If you have eyes to observe you would see the conflict of interests. Alas we will not agree on this issue. You will continue to use aluminium containing antiperspirants and I will not, prefering to take more frequent showers.
    I'm not disagreeing with you but, man, your parallels do not help your arguments. lol
    I mean, there are watch dog groups out there. Not just companies doing their own studies, and you know that.
    Currently wearing: Polo by Ralph Lauren

  8. #38

    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Danny Mitchell View Post
    I'm not disagreeing with you but, man, your parallels do not help your arguments. lol
    I mean, there are watch dog groups out there. Not just companies doing their own studies, and you know that.
    There are those that know whats going and those that don’t. It seems many here don’t and its a shame because they’ll keep doing things that will make their lives miserable as they become older with a multitude of health problems and put it down to their ‘luck’. The vast majority of health problems today are self inflicted and can be entirely avoided but there is an invested machinery at work that undermine human intelligence for profit at any cost.

    You guys and gals can make up your own minds. I wish you good luck and good health and hope you wouldn’t knowingly spray your bodies with something that will slowly poison your bodies and nervous system.

  9. #39

    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Anyway, I just picked up two of the Axe Gold white-container antiperspirant sticks because they're getting harder and harder to find in-store. Comparing them alongside the black container version, the white ones are better; they're a bit richer and stronger. The ingredient list is also slightly different between the two releases.



    If you find 'em, grab 'em.

    The Axe Night antiperspirant stick (purple sticker in white container) is also very nice.

  10. #40
    Dependent Danny Mitchell's Avatar
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbouti View Post
    There are those that know whats going and those that don’t. It seems many here don’t and its a shame because they’ll keep doing things that will make their lives miserable as they become older with a multitude of health problems and put it down to their ‘luck’. The vast majority of health problems today are self inflicted and can be entirely avoided but there is an invested machinery at work that undermine human intelligence for profit at any cost.

    You guys and gals can make up your own minds. I wish you good luck and good health and hope you wouldn’t knowingly spray your bodies with something that will slowly poison your bodies and nervous system.
    We understand that. Yes yes yes and yes. I AGREE WITH YOU.
    BUT if you also say hey hey what about a brewery saying how beer is good for you, you are shooting your very own argument in the foot. It doesn't fit with the point you are trying to convey.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Brooks Otterlake View Post
    Anyway, I just picked up two of the Axe Gold white-container antiperspirant sticks because they're getting harder and harder to find in-store. Comparing them alongside the black container version, the white ones are better; they're a bit richer and stronger. The ingredient list is also slightly different between the two releases.



    If you find 'em, grab 'em.

    The Axe Night antiperspirant stick (purple sticker in white container) is also very nice.
    Brooksy, I just grabbed two from WalMart on Saturday! I have a backup collection of five right now. I could have bought several more but didn't want to splurge on sticks of deodorant. They had two rows stocked of this stuff.
    Currently wearing: Polo by Ralph Lauren

  11. #41

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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbouti View Post
    Your eyes are obscured by a lifetime of lies. Do you not see the inherent problems with studies?

    Its like believing a study conducted by a brewery on the benefits of alcohol and then publishing findings that alcohol is good for you and the more you drink the better it is for you. If you have eyes to observe you would see the conflict of interests. Alas we will not agree on this issue. You will continue to use aluminium containing antiperspirants and I will not, prefering to take more frequent showers.
    You don't have to believe anything about the brewery's results, as they will publish how they did the test and sample sizes - and the Professional Researchers that did the testing (Professionals have professional obligations placed on them)
    Others can try replicate the test, including the Temperance League and see if they get the same result. Then others, like the Authority Nutrition/Healthline site will give details about the most significant studies in the beer drinking field, citing any criticisms made in relation to methodology and sample sizes.

    So that if someone becomes sceptical about say beer drinking or aluminium anti- perspirant - after a friend shared a really scary post from a natural therapy guru on Facebook - one can go to the site and review the related studies and their findings from around the world - and either develop some confidence in the conclusions from the studies, or reject them totally in the belief that the brewery and anti-perspirant control society/ the country/ the world.
    Regards,
    Renato

  12. #42

    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Danny Mitchell View Post


    Brooksy, I just grabbed two from WalMart on Saturday! I have a backup collection of five right now. I could have bought several more but didn't want to splurge on sticks of deodorant. They had two rows stocked of this stuff.
    I'm glad your local supply is still going strong! It's great stuff.

  13. #43
    Dependent Danny Mitchell's Avatar
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato View Post
    You don't have to believe anything about the brewery's results, as they will publish how they did the test and sample sizes - and the Professional Researchers that did the testing (Professionals have professional obligations placed on them)
    Others can try replicate the test, including the Temperance League and see if they get the same result. Then others, like the Authority Nutrition/Healthline site will give details about the most significant studies in the beer drinking field, citing any criticisms made in relation to methodology and sample sizes.

    So that if someone becomes sceptical about say beer drinking or aluminium anti- perspirant - after a friend shared a really scary post from a natural therapy guru on Facebook - one can go to the site and review the related studies and their findings from around the world - and either develop some confidence in the conclusions from the studies, or reject them totally in the belief that the brewery and anti-perspirant control society/ the country/ the world.
    Regards,
    Renato
    Exactly. Sheik, there's no way you categorize the findings of different studies all in the same box. Studies are made from different organizations for several different reasons. Some are done with several levels of shade in order to influence their results and others seek the truth. But they're all the same? Are you saying no studies should happen at all, since they're useless. No doctors, too? No regulations? No laws? That's the direction this line of thinking can get yo, which I'm sure you don't want. How far down the rabbit that hole are you comfortable with?
    I'm not saying the studies are or aren't influenced one way or another. But I certainly know that the research done by, say IU Medical versus Johnson and Johnson or Anheiser Busch versus the Center of Alcohol and Drug Abuse could give you different results. You aren't going to get scam work done by every single one of these.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Brooks Otterlake View Post
    I'm glad your local supply is still going strong! It's great stuff.
    It's the best performer out of the stuff I've used that's currently out there.
    But it's only available now at WalMart and Meijer. Target and Kroger no longer carry it around here.
    Currently wearing: Polo by Ralph Lauren

  14. #44

    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    I’ve made my views known. Are all studies the same? No. But you are getting a view that is heavily skewed towards corporate funded research and sometimes worse. If you spend long enough looking with adequate discernment you might be lucky enough to get glimpses of the truth.

    Good luck with your antiperspirant choices. I’ve adjusted my signature to reflect my view on this matter. Adieu.

  15. #45
    Dependent Danny Mitchell's Avatar
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbouti View Post
    I’ve made my views known. Are all studies the same? No. But you are getting a view that is heavily skewed towards corporate funded research and sometimes worse. If you spend long enough looking with adequate discernment you might be lucky enough to get glimpses of the truth.

    Good luck with your antiperspirant choices. I’ve adjusted my signature to reflect my view on this matter. Adieu.
    I'm not talking about your views. I've already said I agree with you. JUST USE STRONGER LEGS TO STAND ON. Adieu. Bye. Aloha.
    Currently wearing: Polo by Ralph Lauren

  16. #46
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Antiperspirant for me. I, too, dislike sweating.
    I'm more concerned about breathing diesel particulates on a daily basis whilst trawling up and down the motorway than I am about a little this 'n' that under my pits. If I had any unfavourable effects I'd change then. As of yet, I've no adverse effects.
    FWIW, I've found the Mitchums roll-on to be good.

  17. #47
    Dependent Danny Mitchell's Avatar
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    I wish Mitchum lasted longer for me because I like how their scent is not overpowering or obnoxious at all. But it only lasts around 8 hours for me.
    Currently wearing: Polo by Ralph Lauren

  18. #48

    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Benz3ne View Post
    FWIW, I've found the Mitchums roll-on to be good.
    Yeah, they do a scent free version of that one which I tried, and I didn't like how much of a powdery residue that left.

  19. #49
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    I only use deodorant, Degree. Anti-perspirant blocks the sweat glands, I don't want to keep my body from doing what it is naturally supposed to do. To each their own though.

  20. #50
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Mattybumpkin View Post
    I only use deodorant, Degree. Anti-perspirant blocks the sweat glands, I don't want to keep my body from doing what it is naturally supposed to do. To each their own though.
    That's like saying you don't like to shower because it strips your body of its natural oils and odors.

  21. #51
    Dependent Danny Mitchell's Avatar
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Prince View Post
    That's like saying you don't like to shower because it strips your body of its natural oils and odors.
    Yeah and nah. I mean that antiperspirant stays on you all day. A shower is just washing off with soup for 5 to 10 minutes. Not for 8 hours.
    I see where you're coming from Prince, as I don't have a problem with it because I don't sweat that much. I just antiperspirant mostly for odor protection because deodorant doesn't last long enough.
    Currently wearing: Polo by Ralph Lauren

  22. #52

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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    No one here uses naturally occurring anti-perspirants?

    Nature didn't just put alum crystals here for us to ignore.
    Alum was put here to stop nicks bleeding after shaving, and to stop sweat ,glands putting out all that smelly stuff that attracts predators.
    It was put here as a tool to be used.
    Regards,
    Renato

  23. #53
    Dependent Danny Mitchell's Avatar
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato View Post
    No one here uses naturally occurring anti-perspirants?

    Nature didn't just put alum crystals here for us to ignore.
    Alum was put here to stop nicks bleeding after shaving, and to stop sweat ,glands putting out all that smelly stuff that attracts predators.
    It was put here as a tool to be used.
    Regards,
    Renato
    I may not be familiar. Does this mean anything like organic type stuff? All I see at the local department stores are the big corporate brands and some smaller corporate brands that use all natural ingredients and contain no aluminum.
    Currently wearing: Polo by Ralph Lauren

  24. #54

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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Danny Mitchell View Post
    I may not be familiar. Does this mean anything like organic type stuff? All I see at the local department stores are the big corporate brands and some smaller corporate brands that use all natural ingredients and contain no aluminum.
    No, it's actual potassium alum crystals with natural aluminium salts in it.
    It's widely sold in stores down here as natural anti-perspirant, and on eBay. Usually sold as something that resembles a deodorant stick.

    Or you can buy it from some shaving shops as an alum block, which is just a small rectangular block. But for the price of one such block, you can buy five or six of them on eBay from Turkey.

    Apart from potassium alum, there is also ammonium alum in some of those natural anti-perspirant sticks. It works about the same as the potassium one, but stings slightly more when applied after shaving.

    Some potassium alum blocks leave a fine white residue after it dries on face and seals up nicks and micro-nicks, which needs washing off. The ammonium alum ones don't do that.
    Regards,
    Renato

  25. #55
    Dependent Danny Mitchell's Avatar
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Renato View Post
    No, it's actual potassium alum crystals with natural aluminium salts in it.
    It's widely sold in stores down here as natural anti-perspirant, and on eBay. Usually sold as something that resembles a deodorant stick.
    Or you can buy it from some shaving shops as an alum block, which is just a small rectangular block. But for the price of one such block, you can buy five or six of them on eBay from Turkey.

    Apart from potassium alum, there is also ammonium alum in some of those natural anti-perspirant sticks. It works about the same as the potassium one, but stings slightly more when applied after shaving.

    Some potassium alum blocks leave a fine white residue after it days on face and seals up nicks and micro-nicks, which needs washing off. The ammonium alum ones don't do that.
    Regards,
    Renato
    Interesting. It must not be as big here in Indy, USA. Unless I'm not paying enough attention, which is entirely possible. I may look into it just to try it out. I'm always on the lookout for a good scent that can keep going all day long. Not many can.
    Currently wearing: Polo by Ralph Lauren

  26. #56

    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    I can't use regular deodorants anymore. They don't last, you have to reapply them after any significant amount of work or if it's a hot day, and the scent can be too much for those around you.
    The only ones that last a significant amount of time for me are Speedsticks, but the scents aren't really modern smelling in my opinion. Musk and Fresh have a nice retro scent to them but they smell a little conspicuous when in close quarters with people. Plus I still sweat a lot with them and you run the risk of the BO mixing with the deodorant scent. Ugh.

    I feel more secure with anti-perspirants. My go to are the Gillette series.

  27. #57
    Dependent Danny Mitchell's Avatar
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Brooks Otterlake View Post
    Anyway, I just picked up two of the Axe Gold white-container antiperspirant sticks because they're getting harder and harder to find in-store. Comparing them alongside the black container version, the white ones are better; they're a bit richer and stronger. The ingredient list is also slightly different between the two releases.



    If you find 'em, grab 'em.

    The Axe Night antiperspirant stick (purple sticker in white container) is also very nice.
    Update: Perhaps they are discontinued, but it seems I am seeing an increase in the stores that carry the Axe Gold antiperspirant anti-marks. I'm still always grabbing one or two extra when I'm out, as nothing comes close to the scent and the longevity as this. Great stuff. The Axe Gold antiperspirant anti-marks in the aerosol can? Those are definitely discontinued.
    I suppose at some point, I should just message Axe to get an official answer.
    "Ducks eat for free at Subway."
    Currently wearing: Polo by Ralph Lauren

  28. #58
    Basenotes Member Joe Gilmore's Avatar
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    I used to be pretty sweaty and none of the normal sure, right guard type antiperspirants worked for more than a few hours.

    Found this stuff and gave it a go 10-15 years ago and now swear by it.

    At first you need to put it on every few days (apply after a shower before bed and wash it off in the morning) but now I only need to use it every 2 - 3 weeks.

    download.jpg
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  29. #59
    Dependent Danny Mitchell's Avatar
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Gilmore View Post
    I used to be pretty sweaty and none of the normal sure, right guard type antiperspirants worked for more than a few hours.

    Found this stuff and gave it a go 10-15 years ago and now swear by it.

    At first you need to put it on every few days (apply after a shower before bed and wash it off in the morning) but now I only need to use it every 2 - 3 weeks.

    download.jpg
    This stuff allows you to only use deodorant once every two to three weeks??
    "Ducks eat for free at Subway."
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  30. #60
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    Default Re: Deodorant VS. Antiperspirant

    Quote Originally Posted by Danny Mitchell View Post
    This stuff allows you to only use deodorant once every two to three weeks??
    As you grow older you sweat less, but there are antiperspirants that will last you 2 weeks on one application! I use one like that. I stay dry even at gym!




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