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  1. #1
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    Default Shout Out to Paul

    Hey all,
    I am currently working on a tropical Wood sea breeze perfume, and I have been for a bit of time now. I'm using Paul's Magnificent Mango Base and I just have to say: every single time I open it, I think "How does a person replicate a fruit this complicated to such detail?" It's a wonderful base to work with, and I suggest that everybody who calls themselves a perfumer should have some in their collection.

    Shout out to you, Paul Kiler. You're Kil-ing it! XD
    But in all seriousness, I look up to your talent in perfuming so much, so props to you

    Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk
    Cheers, Happy Perfuming!
    Will

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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul


  3. #3
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Indeed! He has been a mentor.
    A great colleague, neighbor and friend.
    Non-IFRA-Compliant Fragrance Art: https://www.etsy.com/shop/RoguePerfumery
    New Tuberose Fragrance! Read about it here:
    https://rogueperfumery.com

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Could you share your overall thoughts on the Mango base benj? As descriptive as possible please on how it compares to the real deal, its tenacity, any downsides and parts that you like? What colour is the mango? What type of variety does it bring to mind?

    It caught my attention when PK first mentioned it and due to what makes the real deal smell so good its a very hard accord to capture without veering into that plasticy shampoo territory that so many slide into when taking a stab at it due to how fleeting the naturals are in the first place. Not to mention the sheer amount of them that smell nothing at all like a mango but some generic fruity slash mildly white floral/terpene mashup they attempt to foist off as the king of fruits.

    Often there is a tightrope when replicating this style of vibe as too big and it ends up smelling fake/cartoony and sticking too close to truth makes it a whimper of a scent in comparison to the hail of trumpets - heck the entire orchestra, brass included - that the real aroma presents when you slice open a perfectly ripened mango as its smell certainly is something else.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Quote Originally Posted by Palmolive View Post
    Could you share your overall thoughts on the Mango base benj? As descriptive as possible please on how it compares to the real deal, its tenacity, any downsides and parts that you like? What colour is the mango? What type of variety does it bring to mind?

    It caught my attention when PK first mentioned it and due to what makes the real deal smell so good its a very hard accord to capture without veering into that plasticy shampoo territory that so many slide into when taking a stab at it due to how fleeting the naturals are in the first place. Not to mention the sheer amount of them that smell nothing at all like a mango but some generic fruity slash mildly white floral/terpene mashup they attempt to foist off as the king of fruits.

    Often there is a tightrope when replicating this style of vibe as too big and it ends up smelling fake/cartoony and sticking too close to truth makes it a whimper of a scent in comparison to the hail of trumpets - heck the entire orchestra, brass included - that the real aroma presents when you slice open a perfectly ripened mango as its smell certainly is something else.
    The very first whiff is a wonderful balance of warm sweetness and bright tartness, both very accurately capturing and blending to make the orangy yellowy bright mango note. There's a slight soapiness but nothing overwhelming or synthetic smelling about it-- mango tends to lean slightly in that direction compared to other fruits. I've been using it as a middle note, and the sweet and tartness seems to last quite a while for a fruity reconstitution. I smell vibrant, quick yellow streaks of beauty If I were to visualize it in an unrealistic perspective, almost like fireworks on a summer night exploding and whizzing in the air without a worry in the world. There's also a tropical, almost floral background to it that works great with what I'm using it for. Really, quite an accurate mango accord.

    Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk
    Cheers, Happy Perfuming!
    Will

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Becoming familiar with Paulís work, Iím interested in the mango base and Iím not even remotely a perfumer!!!

    Can I just mix it with some perfumerís alcohol and walk around smelling amazing in my sweltering and miserable Louisiana heat?!
    Sent from the bayou, using homing gators.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Quote Originally Posted by Diddy View Post
    Becoming familiar with Paulís work, Iím interested in the mango base and Iím not even remotely a perfumer!!!

    Can I just mix it with some perfumerís alcohol and walk around smelling amazing in my sweltering and miserable Louisiana heat?!
    If you want to smell like a mango and nothing else XD but I would recommend a very simple accord if you'd like to do that

    Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk
    Cheers, Happy Perfuming!
    Will

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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Quote Originally Posted by benjwi02 View Post
    The very first whiff is a wonderful balance of warm sweetness and bright tartness, both very accurately capturing and blending to make the orangy yellowy bright mango note. There's a slight soapiness but nothing overwhelming or synthetic smelling about it-- mango tends to lean slightly in that direction compared to other fruits. I've been using it as a middle note, and the sweet and tartness seems to last quite a while for a fruity reconstitution. I smell vibrant, quick yellow streaks of beauty If I were to visualize it in an unrealistic perspective, almost like fireworks on a summer night exploding and whizzing in the air without a worry in the world. There's also a tropical, almost floral background to it that works great with what I'm using it for. Really, quite an accurate mango accord.

    Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk
    Thank you. I was once talking to quite an accomplished nose about the accord and he said that it was hands down the hardest ever to replicate successfully due to a myriad of nerdy reasons. The smelly sketches he'd created that nearly hit the spot didn't stick around that long and the ones that missed the mark by a few did perform but weren't "true" mango smells. Finding that intersection on the olfactive Venn diagram seemed be quite the Quixotic quest and he was a talented time served chap in contrast to my amateur enthusiasm, hence my interest.

    Your fireworks comment got my attention as that is one of the main points from the real deal that I enjoy so much as there is a crackling effervescence that goes beyond mere fizz that kicks in as the the volatile compounds do their thing and its expanding this that I guess would be the challenge as too little and its flat and too much it grates whilst keeping the overall billowing soft/sweetness of the contradictory nature of the fruit as its such a complex aroma which is seemingly pulled in multiple directions at once whilst retaining its delicious center. Magical!

    PK, did you throw some apricot/peach in your base as I'd heard that was one of the tricks along with the clever use of Lactones and Myrcene to balance the rough with smooth. Care to share any insights as to what went into it? How you made it? What you were aiming for in terms of type of mango and how close you came to conceptualizing your vision?

    I'm quite an aficionado of this fruit and have had the pleasure of enjoying the best varieties and know its joys quite well and to this day there isn't one single fragrance out there that can honestly even come half way close to the real deal.

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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    I've been collecting Mango formulas and GC information for years.

    I looked at them to find patterns, learning from these both flavor and fragrance and GC formulas.

    There are some fruity peachy lactones for the base to carry the topnotes down.
    But I think one big struggle is to carry the bite and the sulfur molecules down into the middle, instead of just the top.
    The compounding lab doesn't even carry this middle bite note, so I have to add it in when I get it back from them. (At 20% of the formula)
    And they don't carry the sulfur molecules, nor the Jasmolactone Extra C, from Bedoukian, which runs $2300 / kg. Nor the Ocimene.

    This mango is a real balance between top to middle to bottom, and to balance the bitey and sulfur, with the sweet and fruity...
    And I didn't just spend a couple of weeks working on it.

    It certainly does help to have certain single molecules at your disposal, the Jasmolactone Extra C, Ocimene, and the right sulfur molecules.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Interesting, thanks for that. Your approach makes sense as collecting the info and pooling the best parts would be allow the creation of a far more accurate basic sketch to work on than making it from the ground up as the chap I was speaking about was.

    I'm going to have to obtain some of this Magnificence at some point.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Quote Originally Posted by pkiler View Post
    I've been collecting Mango formulas and GC information for years.

    I looked at them to find patterns, learning from these both flavor and fragrance and GC formulas.

    There are some fruity peachy lactones for the base to carry the topnotes down.
    But I think one big struggle is to carry the bite and the sulfur molecules down into the middle, instead of just the top.
    The compounding lab doesn't even carry this middle bite note, so I have to add it in when I get it back from them. (At 20% of the formula)
    And they don't carry the sulfur molecules, nor the Jasmolactone Extra C, from Bedoukian, which runs $2300 / kg. Nor the Ocimene.

    This mango is a real balance between top to middle to bottom, and to balance the bitey and sulfur, with the sweet and fruity...
    And I didn't just spend a couple of weeks working on it.

    It certainly does help to have certain single molecules at your disposal, the Jasmolactone Extra C, Ocimene, and the right sulfur molecules.
    Since Iím all in yíallís conversation as a consumer and not an artist...

    To you Paul: any chance of you releasing a fragrance that leans fruity/tropical that could be used in blisteringly hot and humid weather? My question is completely selfish. Ere does perform great in my climate, as well as Heaven Fresh. But I suppose Iím thinking something more in line with all these tropical wannabe fragrances that big business pumps out halfheartedly but done better with the loving care you put into your work.

    *No disrespect to any other artists here. Itís simply that Iím familiar with Paulís work. And Andy Tauerís. But Paul is here speaking with us...
    Sent from the bayou, using homing gators.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    I'll piggyback on Diddy's consumer question.

    You all made Paul's mango base sound so luscious, I just went through all the scents on his website to find a perfume iteration of it. I don't really see one specifically. Is there one where I could experience it?

    I think the mango has the most beautiful scent of all fruits, and certainly the most perfume-like.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Ya know, my newest winner Maderas de Oriente Oscuro came from a request too.
    Honestly, living in the near desert here, I do in fact forget to make things for hot humid places.

    I've been working on a tropical island theme scent, but to pitch it to an alcoholic drink company, for their own line of fragrances.
    I've got most, if not all the necessary pieces for it.
    But my new retail outlet store in hot hot Florida also asked for the same as Cook Bot and Diddy.
    So, I'll get to work on the Artisanal PK tropical scent.

    But, there is also another scent for a client that was released last December, Bali, for Journey Perfumes.
    It's a pleasant tropical island rather mainstream type scent for fantasizing girls dreaming of a vacation to Bali. ;-)

    I've also been working on my men's dressy easy beautiful cologne scent... ala Patou pour homme / Aventus kind of direction. That would certainly work in hot tropical, too.
    I'm yearning now to make beauty, easy to wear, classy scents... But I also want to catch that big fish ;-)

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Big fish, little fish, cardboard box.

    The corporate route makes far more sense (and money) than duking it out with the flood of niche releases that are mostly ignored as the breakout chances are so low and with the company angle all of the heavy lifting moves to them as marketing and distribution are the most expensive parts of the game. How did you get into the field of perfumery PK? Something tells me thats as story in and of itself...

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Quote Originally Posted by pkiler View Post
    Ya know, my newest winner Maderas de Oriente Oscuro came from a request too.
    Honestly, living in the near desert here, I do in fact forget to make things for hot humid places.

    I've been working on a tropical island theme scent, but to pitch it to an alcoholic drink company, for their own line of fragrances.
    I've got most, if not all the necessary pieces for it.
    But my new retail outlet store in hot hot Florida also asked for the same as Cook Bot and Diddy.
    So, I'll get to work on the Artisanal PK tropical scent.

    But, there is also another scent for a client that was released last December, Bali, for Journey Perfumes.
    It's a pleasant tropical island rather mainstream type scent for fantasizing girls dreaming of a vacation to Bali. ;-)

    I've also been working on my men's dressy easy beautiful cologne scent... ala Patou pour homme / Aventus kind of direction. That would certainly work in hot tropical, too.
    I'm yearning now to make beauty, easy to wear, classy scents... But I also want to catch that big fish ;-)
    Iím all in on a PK tropical scent and a PK dressy easy beautiful cologne scent. When do I get to place an order??? Itís hot as hades down here, Paul!
    Sent from the bayou, using homing gators.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Quote Originally Posted by pkiler View Post
    So, I'll get to work on the Artisanal PK tropical scent.
    Yesss!

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    I remember that these accords were available on creatingperfume right? Which ones are from PK ?

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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    I don't have anything at CreatingPerfume, only at Perfumer Supply House.

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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Thanks Paul! Do You know when mango will be available again ? I remember that You have made a pimeapple accord. Which accords available there are made by you ?

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    I sent another kilo of Mango to PSH, it is in stock, but she said she has been running herself ragged for one customer, and hasn't been able to update the website.
    Just write to Christine, and she'll surely get it taken care of. I just called her, and she said she was busy and we could chat tomorrow. I'll inform this thread when it is back up on the website.

    Mine there are:
    Magnificent Mango, Perfect Pineapple, and Long Lasting Lemon.
    Plus my Vanilla Absolute replacer base.

    I also sent (my) a new fixative base for her to try out and see how people like it.
    I think it is better than the fixative base from PA.

    I also sent my new Pear base.

    I simply coordinate, but did not blend the Chocolate and the Leather base.

    Coming down the pipeline are these possible bases...

    Rum (ala the top note rum base from Rhinoceros, that you can lengthen with her Rum CO2 extract)
    Gardenia
    Tuberose
    Jasmine Grandiflorum
    Black Tea
    Green Tea

    Osmanthus
    Apricot
    Honeysuckle
    Dark Plum
    Coconut




    Someone asked for a long lasting melon base, which may come at some point, it's in development.


    But I kinda can't do all of them simultaneously... I have to pick some first...

  21. #21
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Thanks for your answer Paul ! Great to hear it will be available soon! If You would even be out of ideas I can suggest Quince, till now I haven't seen that anywhere.

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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Quote Originally Posted by MiDDeN View Post
    Thanks for your answer Paul ! Great to hear it will be available soon! If You would even be out of ideas I can suggest Quince, till now I haven't seen that anywhere.
    Oh, a Quince base?
    To this point, Quince is an unknown for me, have not smelled it.
    I did employ quince in a perfume for Journey Perfumes, but that was based on research by GC, instead of by personal experience. If I am making a base, I really want it to be based on real experiences.

  23. #23
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Then please make sure You will find it somewhere. It is so amazing smell that is undescribeable. Pity that You don't live in EU, I would send You some..

  24. #24
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    Default Re: Shout Out to Paul

    Following on this Mango base discussion, Perfumer Supply House has placed the mango base back on the website. YAY!
    Also newly placed on PSH is my Vanilla Absolute replacer base, and my Fixative base.
    Since she also has it in her possession, soon, I think, will be my Pear base up too.

    PK




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