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Thread: Overdose of BHT

  1. #1

    Default Overdose of BHT

    Hello,

    By mistake, I overdosed BHT in my perfume concentrate to 0.79%.

    At this level, is there any thread or problem on health to use the final perfume at 20% concentration?

    I also noticed less projection and may be a flattened profil of the perfume (I dont know for sure because the perfume is still on aging process).

    Thank you by advance for your help.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Maybe look back at where you got the BHT and what it was for, it goes in flavor but not fragrance.
    Yikes - so scary to read things we are regulrly eating but are not safe on skin, makes you wonder about anything that contains preservatives, flavor, that covers a lot of daily products.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Quote Originally Posted by Thea in Fl View Post
    Maybe look back at where you got the BHT and what it was for, it goes in flavor but not fragrance.
    Yikes - so scary to read things we are regulrly eating but are not safe on skin, makes you wonder about anything that contains preservatives, flavor, that covers a lot of daily products.
    I agree, BHT and others substances are scary specialy in food.
    Actualy BHT and tocopherol are used a lot in perfumery as antioxidants.
    The goal is to extend the shelflife of perfume specialy for those who contains citrus notes.
    I used BHT dedicated for perfumery use.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Can you just double up your formula or is it too much material? Wondering what your intended percent was.
    Also came across something about it in lychee will try to find percentage. o interesting some things that are anti-inflammatory become dangerous at just twice the doseage!

  5. #5

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Quote Originally Posted by Thea in Fl View Post
    Can you just double up your formula or is it too much material? Wondering what your intended percent was.
    Also came across something about it in lychee will try to find percentage. o interesting some things that are anti-inflammatory become dangerous at just twice the doseage!
    BHT should be at 0.2% of pure fragrance at maximum(CAS: 128-37-0).
    I was aiming for 0.1% but what a terrible mistake... never gonna mix my formulas when I am tired again...
    For information I dont intend to sell this perfume.
    To reach this max value I would need to multiply my formula by 4 wich will be a lot concidering the price of the materials (nice amount of natural) and it is also risky..

  6. #6

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Well, it's never lost. Just mix half again, then then add 1/8 to 1/4 of your first bottle with the bht, then put that on the shelf till next time. No hurry since it will never go bad

  7. #7

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Oh, I found out the interesting thing about Lychee is you can use the skins like BHT in canning, preserving meat, but most interesting as possible surface bactericide in the garden.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Actualy they even make BHT pills saying that it could make your life longer... no comment
    Well mixing it this way is risky specialy that I will sure do some new twists of this formula in the next one, I just wanted to avoid throwing it away...
    Its sounds like this batch is ruined... Painfull !!!
    Last edited by apolo085; 6th June 2019 at 07:31 PM.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    I know, so sad to lose things... except you were just going to wear it any way that would only be losing it in a different way. It's like a gain, something you are only allowed to smell but not wear. spray it on your jeans or something.
    I see trees of green, (the cardboard type),
    red roses too, (the potpourri type)...

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Quote Originally Posted by apolo085 View Post
    Hello,

    By mistake, I overdosed BHT in my perfume concentrate to 0.79%.

    At this level, is there any thread or problem on health to use the final perfume at 20% concentration?

    I also noticed less projection and may be a flattened profil of the perfume (I dont know for sure because the perfume is still on aging process).

    Thank you by advance for your help.
    Perfume Chemicals are not the "evil," made out to be by mainstream pseudoscience.
    Companies like IFF are multi-billion dollar companies, they have a LOT of scientists+engineers = very intelligent people
    They have a lot of lawyers = VERY cautious. And they have a LOT of "safety measures."


    Despite what hippies, spiritualists, organic warriors, new age people or pseudoscientific "gurus" have to say...
    MORE OFTEN THEN NOT human created scent molecules are SAFER than natural made materials.


    There`s tonnes of literature to support my opinion on this.
    Just think about it... who knows more about the safety of human created molecules... the multi billion dollar companies,
    with hundreds of PHD`s and the engineers that work for them...

    OR the 20 something dread locked hippie that sells "organic mangos," at some over priced new age grocery store.


    When diving into perfumery...and the world of molecules, I feel that it is best to leave the pseudoscience behind.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Quote Originally Posted by Thea in Fl View Post
    I know, so sad to lose things... except you were just going to wear it any way that would only be losing it in a different way. It's like a gain, something you are only allowed to smell but not wear. spray it on your jeans or something.
    I see trees of green, (the cardboard type),
    red roses too, (the potpourri type)...
    Yes, sadly that's actually a nice trick, thanks

  12. #12

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Quote Originally Posted by mattmeleg View Post
    Perfume Chemicals are not the "evil," made out to be by mainstream pseudoscience.
    Companies like IFF are multi-billion dollar companies, they have a LOT of scientists+engineers = very intelligent people
    They have a lot of lawyers = VERY cautious. And they have a LOT of "safety measures."


    Despite what hippies, spiritualists, organic warriors, new age people or pseudoscientific "gurus" have to say...
    MORE OFTEN THEN NOT human created scent molecules are SAFER than natural made materials.


    There`s tonnes of literature to support my opinion on this.
    Just think about it... who knows more about the safety of human created molecules... the multi billion dollar companies,
    with hundreds of PHD`s and the engineers that work for them...

    OR the 20 something dread locked hippie that sells "organic mangos," at some over priced new age grocery store.


    When diving into perfumery...and the world of molecules, I feel that it is best to leave the pseudoscience behind.
    It's not like that on some things though, right? Like Lyral for instance, people keep using it because it is a favorite and the reason for ban was not important in their view. If the reason is sensitization, then some people ignore and continue to use. If the reason is possible lung inflammation at higher doses, then people start discontinuing.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Quote Originally Posted by mattmeleg View Post
    Perfume Chemicals are not the "evil," made out to be by mainstream pseudoscience.
    Companies like IFF are multi-billion dollar companies, they have a LOT of scientists+engineers = very intelligent people
    They have a lot of lawyers = VERY cautious. And they have a LOT of "safety measures."


    Despite what hippies, spiritualists, organic warriors, new age people or pseudoscientific "gurus" have to say...
    MORE OFTEN THEN NOT human created scent molecules are SAFER than natural made materials.


    There`s tonnes of literature to support my opinion on this.
    Just think about it... who knows more about the safety of human created molecules... the multi billion dollar companies,
    with hundreds of PHD`s and the engineers that work for them...

    OR the 20 something dread locked hippie that sells "organic mangos," at some over priced new age grocery store.


    When diving into perfumery...and the world of molecules, I feel that it is best to leave the pseudoscience behind.
    Easy !
    Even an overdose of naturals can be dangerous to health, and afterall, it is IFRA( with all there PHD's and engineeers) who put restriction on BHT !
    I'm not interested in arguing on another topic here, thanks !
    Last edited by apolo085; 6th June 2019 at 07:41 PM.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    I've seen BHT way over 0.2% in some GCMS data. For example, the GCMS of Dior Homme I have has it at 0.88%, and Ambre Sultan and Gucci PH at 0.38%. So, don't feel so bad, you're probably fine, but maybe make a double batch to cut it in half.


  15. #15

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Quote Originally Posted by runstile View Post
    I've seen BHT way over 0.2% in some GCMS data. For example, the GCMS of Dior Homme I have has it at 0.88%, and Ambre Sultan and Gucci PH at 0.38%. So, don't feel so bad, you're probably fine, but maybe make a double batch to cut it in half.
    Thank you very much for these informations.
    Just to make sure I get it right, do you mean 0.88% of the concentrate or the final perfume?

  16. #16

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Quote Originally Posted by apolo085 View Post
    Thank you very much for these informations.
    Just to make sure I get it right, do you mean 0.88% of the concentrate or the final perfume?
    Concentrate. GCMS data only show what's in the concentrate as the alcohol evaporates.


  17. #17

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Quote Originally Posted by runstile View Post
    Concentrate. GCMS data only show what's in the concentrate as the alcohol evaporates.
    I learned something today, thank you very much runstile !!!!

    I found also these formula examples using BHT up to 0.5% in perfume concentrate:
    http://www.thegoodscentscompany.com/...dm1029651.html

    Either I do not have a good source for IFRA's restrictions, or I do not understand how it works (at least for BHT)

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Quote Originally Posted by apolo085 View Post
    Easy !
    Even an overdose of naturals can be dangerous to health, and afterall, it is IFRA( with all there PHD's and engineeers) who put restriction on BHT !
    I'm not interested in arguing on another topic here, thanks !
    I drink a glass of coumarin a day.
    bathe in oakmoss, and use bergamot as sunscreen oil.

    ...lifes too short to worry about this stuff.
    JMHO - my opinion. Your entitled to disagree with me.
    I just think there are soooooo many other things to worry about.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Quote Originally Posted by Thea in Fl View Post
    It's not like that on some things though, right? Like Lyral for instance, people keep using it because it is a favorite and the reason for ban was not important in their view. If the reason is sensitization, then some people ignore and continue to use. If the reason is possible lung inflammation at higher doses, then people start discontinuing.
    I don't worry about "chemicals."
    Grew up on a farm, handled pesticides nearly EVERYDAY.

    And look how I turned out, 100% healthy and full grown!
    Screen Shot 2019-06-06 at 11.12.54 PM.jpg

  20. #20
    Basenotes Member Ivor Joedy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Quote Originally Posted by mattmeleg View Post
    I don't worry about "chemicals."
    I'm worried about chemicals. But I agree with you regarding oakmoss (have non IFRA from hermitageoils) and bergamot. I like furocumarine - in spring, winter (in lowlands) and even more in autumn, so I do not need St. John's wort ...

  21. #21
    Basenotes Member Ivor Joedy's Avatar
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    Cool Re: Overdose of BHT

    Quote Originally Posted by mattmeleg View Post
    And look how I turned out, 100% healthy and full grown! ...
    Now I understand the documentary about Monsanto's work among Canadian farmers -

  22. #22

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Quote Originally Posted by apolo085 View Post
    I learned something today, thank you very much runstile !!!!

    I found also these formula examples using BHT up to 0.5% in perfume concentrate:
    http://www.thegoodscentscompany.com/...dm1029651.html

    Either I do not have a good source for IFRA's restrictions, or I do not understand how it works (at least for BHT)
    The limit of 0.2% w/w (limit in final product) would correlate to 1% BHT in concentrate in a 20% perfume (1%*20% = 0.2%)


  23. #23

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Quote Originally Posted by runstile View Post
    The limit of 0.2% w/w (limit in final product) would correlate to 1% BHT in concentrate in a 20% perfume (1%*20% = 0.2%)
    Thank you very much runstile !
    I doubled my formula, now I'm on 0.38% of BHT in the perfume concetrate.
    I found one post talking about some side effect of BHT on some formulas (flaten profil)..and I kinda notice it too... it is like a hook pooling some notes and reduce their impacts and/or projection... did you noticed it on any formulas ? It can be just an impression, I have to wait 2 mounth to confirme it...

  24. #24

    Default Re: Overdose of BHT

    Quote Originally Posted by apolo085 View Post
    Thank you very much runstile !
    I doubled my formula, now I'm on 0.38% of BHT in the perfume concetrate.
    I found one post talking about some side effect of BHT on some formulas (flaten profil)..and I kinda notice it too... it is like a hook pooling some notes and reduce their impacts and/or projection... did you noticed it on any formulas ? It can be just an impression, I have to wait 2 mounth to confirme it...
    I have not used it (yet) so I can't speak on it's effect in a fragrance. It should be odorless, and I haven't heard much about a dampening effect but maybe that is possible.





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