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  1. #1
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    Default it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    I have finally realized I had a block against "feminine" fragrances not because I didn't like them, but because I felt they were not for me as a man.

    I have gotten over that and love a lot of the feminine fragrances, really the vintage Diors. But I think it's great. I love the Diors, including Fahrenheit, Miss Dior, and Diorella (all vintage).

    I have some vintage Poison that I'm trying out, and life is a bit better with this realization.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Quote Originally Posted by thrilledchilled View Post
    I have finally realized I had a block against "feminine" fragrances not because I didn't like them, but because I felt they were not for me as a man.

    I have gotten over that and love a lot of the feminine fragrances.
    Happy for you.
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  3. #3
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Quote Originally Posted by hednic View Post
    Happy for you.
    thank you!

  4. #4

    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    For me it’s not as much a block as I don’t like many scents that come with women’s fragrances. I don’t like florals at all and it seems many women’s scents are heavy on this. Some of the powdery ones smell quite good tho and of course some of the vintage Chanel’s etc are wonderful, but I wouldn’t wear them

  5. #5
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    I've never had an issue with something labeled "feminine." However, upon wearing, there are certain fragrances that make me self-conscious that it feels (smells) feminine. Cap Neroli is one, Alien is another, and Plum Japonais is another still. So, they're not even labeled "feminine" but I know when I'm wearing one.

  6. #6

    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Saying its true doesn’t make it so.

    Fragrances do have a gender - Masculine and Feminine.
    There are other fragrances which can easily be worn by both genders because they lack overly masculine or feminine accords.
    Most men lean towards masculines. Most women lean towards feminines.

    People can ultimately choose to wear what they want to and they should but look at peoples wardrobes and most men are still roughly speaking wearing masculines and women are wearing mainly feminines.
    Go outside of Basenotes and that number will probably be way above 90%.

    Has anyone ever considered the possibility that fragrances marketed as For Men are done so because men prefer to wear those types of accords?
    A few favourites

    Bois du Portugal by Creed
    Aventus by Creed
    Jubilation Man by Amouage
    Mousse Illuminee by Rogue Perfumery
    Incident Diplomatique by Jovoy
    Patchouli Nobile by Nobile 1942
    Pour Monsieur EdT by Chanel
    Eau Sauvage (vtg) by Christian Dior
    Eucris EdP by GF Trumper
    Polo (Cosmair) by Ralph Lauren
    Currently wearing: tba by Unknown

  7. #7
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbouti View Post
    Saying its true doesn’t make it so.

    Fragrances do have a gender - Masculine and Feminine.
    There are other fragrances which can easily be worn by both genders because they lack overly masculine or feminine accords.
    Most men lean towards masculines. Most women lean towards feminines.

    People can ultimately choose to wear what they want to and they should but look at peoples wardrobes and most men are still roughly speaking wearing masculines and women are wearing mainly feminines.
    Go outside of Basenotes and that number will probably be way above 90%.

    Has anyone ever considered the possibility that fragrances marketed as For Men are done so because men prefer to wear those types of accords?
    Men only prefer those accords because they are taught from an early age that they are "masculine." This is how all of society works in connection with clothing, hair styles, body language, etc. No one is born knowing which fragrance notes are supposedly masculine or feminine. This is borne out by the fact that in different countries/societies different smells are gendered differently.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    I enjoy big florals actually.

    I love masculine fragrances but now I also love many feminines as well.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    but how many genders perfume doesn't have?

  10. #10

    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbouti View Post

    People can ultimately choose to wear what they want to and they should but look at peoples wardrobes and most men are still roughly speaking wearing masculines and women are wearing mainly feminines.
    Go outside of Basenotes and that number will probably be way above 90%.

    Has anyone ever considered the possibility that fragrances marketed as For Men are done so because men prefer to wear those types of accords?
    I agree mostly with the underlined. Strip away the marketing, and bottle designs. If you put Marc Jacobs Daisy in a clear glass atomizer, and Creed's Royal Oud in a clear glass atomizer you wouldn't need to be socialized into perceiving one as masculine and the other as feminine.

    However I think we are in a time where most people (thankfully) don't really care and just wear what they want to wear. I will wear stuff like ASQ's Safari Blend, Byredo's Mojave Ghost, Byredo's Rose of No Man's Land all day long and although i tested and enjoyed something like MFK's Aqua Celestia it was "too feminine" for my personality. I don't know how that could be distorted into a bad thing. It's just preference but i definitely believe "masculine", "unisex", and "feminine" fragrances are a thing. If you've broadened your taste and confidence to wear more types then good on you.
    Don't stank.
    Currently wearing: MEM by Bogue Profumo

  11. #11

    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    The gender of perfumes is fluid.
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
    See what I did there?
    A Greater Monster, The Kickstarter Letters & Death by Zamboni
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  12. #12
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Quote Originally Posted by thrilledchilled View Post
    I enjoy big florals actually.

    I love masculine fragrances but now I also love many feminines as well.
    And I love oud and leather and animalics, so I happily imbibe all across the fragrance spectrum.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Quote Originally Posted by juxtapozbliss View Post
    the gender of perfumes is fluid.
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    .
    .
    .
    .
    See what i did there?

    nice.

  14. #14

    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Quote Originally Posted by Juxtapozbliss View Post
    The gender of perfumes is fluid.
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
    See what I did there?
    Gold or Silver???







    But yeah I’m gonna be done posting in this thread now, I foresee it snowballing quite quickly.
    Don't stank.
    Currently wearing: MEM by Bogue Profumo

  15. #15
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    All perfumes are Genderless. The only exception is Lauder for Men, which if worn by women, is felonius.
    Scarcity is an illusion. Unlearn it.

  16. #16

    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Quote Originally Posted by Starblind View Post
    Men only prefer those accords because they are taught from an early age that they are "masculine." This is how all of society works in connection with clothing, hair styles, body language, etc. No one is born knowing which fragrance notes are supposedly masculine or feminine. This is borne out by the fact that in different countries/societies different smells are gendered differently.
    I see your point but I don’t think its entirely societal. Some behaviours are learned and others are present at birth. Mammals (including humans) secrete pheromones and through this they not only distinguish male from female scents in the animal world but also determine a healthy mate. Those receptors still respond given the right stimulus. Because modern ways of living have disrupted these natural patterns like medicines/ chemicals /clothing etc its quite possible that men and womens tastes have also in part come about through a primal need to seek surrogate ways to accentuate masculine and feminine pheromones over the noise of modern life. Perhaps these accords in each respective culture do just that - provide masculine and feminine.

    To say there is no difference in masculine or female scents whatsoever I think is naive.
    Growing up I was aware of my mother’s and father’s natural scent. I’m not talking about perfumes or not washing. My mother smelled feminine. My father smelled masculine. So perhaps the things we seek, masculine and feminine, are everpresent and we seek those in respective fragrances. If a perfumer were wise he or she might instinctively create perfumes to reflect those things.
    A few favourites

    Bois du Portugal by Creed
    Aventus by Creed
    Jubilation Man by Amouage
    Mousse Illuminee by Rogue Perfumery
    Incident Diplomatique by Jovoy
    Patchouli Nobile by Nobile 1942
    Pour Monsieur EdT by Chanel
    Eau Sauvage (vtg) by Christian Dior
    Eucris EdP by GF Trumper
    Polo (Cosmair) by Ralph Lauren
    Currently wearing: tba by Unknown

  17. #17
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Quote Originally Posted by purecaramel View Post
    All perfumes are Genderless. The only exception is Lauder for Men, which if worn by women, is felonius.
    lol

  18. #18
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Quote Originally Posted by purecaramel View Post
    All perfumes are Genderless. The only exception is Lauder for Men, which if worn by women, is felonius.
    Ladies, do I smell a challenge?

  19. #19

    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Have experienced this at least in two different, distinct senses - on one hand fragrances officially feminine but easily suited as unisex (to a certain point, Chanel No. 19, Escale a Portofino by Dior, even TF Black Orchid) as much as knowing quite a few cases when ladies can wear male fragrances very appropriately and effortlessly, with surprising but equally impressive outcomes.
    Yet in both cases as fragrances being and/or becoming deliberate choices of people within and outside BN following little to no gendered categories, while testing and liking to wear fragrances for either gender.

  20. #20

    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    This isn’t going to end well

  21. #21
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbouti View Post
    I see your point but I don’t think its entirely societal. Some behaviours are learned and others are present at birth. Mammals (including humans) secrete pheromones and through this they not only distinguish male from female scents in the animal world but also determine a healthy mate. Those receptors still respond given the right stimulus. Because modern ways of living have disrupted these natural patterns like medicines/ chemicals /clothing etc its quite possible that men and womens tastes have also in part come about through a primal need to seek surrogate ways to accentuate masculine and feminine pheromones over the noise of modern life. Perhaps these accords in each respective culture do just that - provide masculine and feminine.

    To say there is no difference in masculine or female scents whatsoever I think is naive.
    Growing up I was aware of my mother’s and father’s natural scent. I’m not talking about perfumes or not washing. My mother smelled feminine. My father smelled masculine. So perhaps the things we seek, masculine and feminine, are everpresent and we seek those in respective fragrances. If a perfumer were wise he or she might instinctively create perfumes to reflect those things.
    I'm with Sheik on this one as most scents, particularly Vintage scent differently on my wife than on me largely based upon natural pheromone.

    As a young man I wore Rive Gauche together with my girlfriend. I enjoyed wearing it, however, it seemed designed to decay and meld with her Feminine nether regions musk.

    I find, not all, however most, modern scents, work to sublimate and neuter natural musks.
    Scarcity is an illusion. Unlearn it.

  22. #22

    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    The Brooks Otterlake Sale Thread

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    Bentley for Men Intense, Franck Boclet Tobacco, L'Erbolario Méharées, L'Instant de Guerlain pour Homme EDT, Michael Kors Michael for Men, Rasasi Dhanal Oudh Nashwah, Tom Ford for Men Extreme

  23. #23
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbouti View Post
    I see your point but I don’t think its entirely societal. Some behaviours are learned and others are present at birth. Mammals (including humans) secrete pheromones and through this they not only distinguish male from female scents in the animal world but also determine a healthy mate. Those receptors still respond given the right stimulus. Because modern ways of living have disrupted these natural patterns like medicines/ chemicals /clothing etc its quite possible that men and womens tastes have also in part come about through a primal need to seek surrogate ways to accentuate masculine and feminine pheromones over the noise of modern life. Perhaps these accords in each respective culture do just that - provide masculine and feminine.

    To say there is no difference in masculine or female scents whatsoever I think is naive.
    Growing up I was aware of my mother’s and father’s natural scent. I’m not talking about perfumes or not washing. My mother smelled feminine. My father smelled masculine. So perhaps the things we seek, masculine and feminine, are everpresent and we seek those in respective fragrances. If a perfumer were wise he or she might instinctively create perfumes to reflect those things.
    I teach classes on gender and gendered concepts for a living, so it's probably best to not go any further on this, BUT recognizing your parent's different body odors has zero to do with whether or not an aquatic scent supposedly registers as "masculine" or a floral scent smells "feminine."

    Also, this: "Because modern ways of living have disrupted these natural patterns like medicines/ chemicals /clothing etc its quite possible that men and womens tastes have also in part come about through a primal need to seek surrogate ways to accentuate masculine and feminine pheromones over the noise of modern life. Perhaps these accords in each respective culture do just that - provide masculine and feminine" is QUITE a theory.

  24. #24
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Quote Originally Posted by City74 View Post
    This isn’t going to end well
    Hahaha! (We'll let the classes out early today since it's supposedly a holiday.)

    But here's just one of about one hundred articles written on the subject:

    https://experimentalperfumeclub.com/gender-in-perfume/

  25. #25
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Quote Originally Posted by Starblind View Post
    I teach classes on gender and gendered concepts for a living, so it's probably best to not go any further on this, BUT recognizing your parent's different body odors has zero to do with whether or not an aquatic scent supposedly registers as "masculine" or a floral scent smells "feminine."

    Also, this: "Because modern ways of living have disrupted these natural patterns like medicines/ chemicals /clothing etc its quite possible that men and womens tastes have also in part come about through a primal need to seek surrogate ways to accentuate masculine and feminine pheromones over the noise of modern life. Perhaps these accords in each respective culture do just that - provide masculine and feminine" is QUITE a theory.
    Sheik, you've been challenged.

    "Because" statements, can leave your argument open to criticism.

    Beware, Starblind is formidable.
    Scarcity is an illusion. Unlearn it.

  26. #26
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Quote Originally Posted by Starblind View Post
    Hahaha! (We'll let the classes out early today since it's supposedly a holiday.)

    But here's just one of about one hundred articles written on the subject:

    https://experimentalperfumeclub.com/gender-in-perfume/
    I am surely sceptical of argument that highlights the use of "Should" or Shouldn't. This article proves humorous, certainly.

    Could you point to any serious writing on this subject?
    Scarcity is an illusion. Unlearn it.

  27. #27
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    IMG_20190415_205255_902.jpg

    I see where this is going, so I'm just going to pull a live and let live before rolling out. Remember, if you believe perfume has gender, and someone else does not, believe so, please do not interpret that as them invalidating your gender identity (e.g. "masculinity" or "femininity") by questioning the gender assignment to the perfume you wear. That's where the root of most flame wars involving gender in perfume get their start.

    (Don't come after me, I have garlic and holy water at the ready)
    oh look, I have a signature

  28. #28
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    There are definitely scholarly works written on this topic, but I'm not sure you want to wade through the grad student nomenclature.

    But even the most straightforward articles written about this make excellent points. Take a look at these seemingly simplistic ones that explains some of the basic history behind our notions of gender and scent:

    https://lifestyle.howstuffworks.com/...-to-gender.htm

    https://i-d.vice.com/en_us/article/3...ume-and-gender

    https://www.vogue.com.au/beauty/tren...01935e1d?pos=7

    https://www.charentonmacerations.com...ce-and-gender/

    Here is where you can begin a study of some "scholarly" experiments with gender, but many of these articles are only stated in abstract form, meaning they give you the general idea, but you have to be associated with a particular college or even subscribe to a journal to read the full article:

    https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/...nalCode=swom20

  29. #29
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    Quote Originally Posted by Starblind View Post
    There are definitely scholarly works written on this topic, but I'm not sure you want to wade through the grad student nomenclature.

    But even the most straightforward articles written about this make excellent points. Take a look at these seemingly simplistic ones that explains some of the basic history behind our notions of gender and scent:

    https://lifestyle.howstuffworks.com/...-to-gender.htm

    https://i-d.vice.com/en_us/article/3...ume-and-gender

    https://www.vogue.com.au/beauty/tren...01935e1d?pos=7

    https://www.charentonmacerations.com...ce-and-gender/

    Here is where you can begin a study of some "scholarly" experiments with gender, but many of these articles are only stated in abstract form, meaning they give you the general idea, but you have to be associated with a particular college or even subscribe to a journal to read the full article:

    https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/...nalCode=swom20
    Thank-you Starblind.
    Scarcity is an illusion. Unlearn it.

  30. #30
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    Default Re: it's true: perfume doesn't have gender

    It is all a matter of perception... your genes, your childhood scent memory associations, your cultural/societal influences... the variables go on and on.
    I can cite a long list of studies but it would again boil down to how "you" perceive smells.
    And once entrenched, one has to work hard to undo them.
    However, our olfactory sense happens to have a sense of humor, and if we were all willing to tap into it and step out of the safe boundary, the joy is immense.
    Last edited by Pallas Moncreiff; 15th October 2019 at 06:14 PM.




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