Code of Conduct
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 46
o
  1. #1

    Default Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Hello everybody,

    I want to make room sprays and have looked around to see what others are doing.
    I came across a room spray with the following ingredients: water, alcohol and perfume.

    Furthermore, I read a good ratio of 60% water, 30% alcohol and 10% perfume.
    For alcohol I want to use 99% ethyl alcohol. The remaining 1% is 0.95% Methyl ethyl ketone, 0.03% Methylisopropyl ketone, 0.02% Methyl 3-heptanone, 0.01g BITREX
    And I use FO for perfume.

    Can I simply combine these 3 ingredients for a good room spray?

  2. #2
    Basenotes Plus
    pkiler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    8,797

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Maybe, try it and see if it meets your expectations.
    You will likely need an antibacterial in there too, if using that much water.
    What is your propellant?
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Quote Originally Posted by pkiler View Post
    Maybe, try it and see if it meets your expectations.
    You will likely need an antibacterial in there too, if using that much water.
    What is your propellant?
    I am not going to use propellant but a trigger sprayer. I want to use distilled water, which to my knowledge is free from bacteria. maybe I should add a little less water to make the alcohol a little stronger.

  4. #4
    Basenotes Plus
    pkiler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    8,797

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Just remember, even for distilled water, that water is life. Bacteria can grow in water.
    I would add inhibitors for that purpose.
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Quote Originally Posted by pkiler View Post
    Just remember, even for distilled water, that water is life. Bacteria can grow in water.
    I would add inhibitors for that purpose.
    Can I also only use the alcohol? I also saw that with a room spray.

  6. #6
    Basenotes Plus
    pkiler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    8,797

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    well, yes, you can likely use only alcohol...
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Quote Originally Posted by pkiler View Post
    well, yes, you can likely use only alcohol...
    Thanks for your advice. I'm going to try and will keep you informed if it has the desired effect.

    What about a reed diffuser? Can I only use alcohol for this? Or is that too thick to get through the sticks?

  8. #8

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    How is it possible that the room spray that I gave as an example does not contain an inhibitor? And water is listed first and therefore contains the most. Is it not the case that the alcohol ensures that the water cannot mold?

  9. #9
    Super Member
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    127

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyScents View Post
    What about a reed diffuser? Can I only use alcohol for this? Or is that too thick to get through the sticks?

    The only problem with using just alcohol (instead of a base) for reed diffusers is evaporation -- it will happen very fast in the vessel + the scent throw will be fleeting.

    This is what one reed diffuser company uses as a base: Taken from MSDS sheet available on their website.

    COMPOSITION / INFORMATION INGREDIENTS
    Product Name CAS NO EC NO Concentration
    Butoxydiglycol 112-34-5 - > = 50 %
    Ethyl Alcohol 64-17-5 - 5 - 10 %


    Here's MSDS sheet from another popular reed diffuser company = not forthcoming at all with ingredients in their base for sale.

    Section 1. Product Data
    Product Name Diffuser Base
    Personal Care Approved No
    Product Type Fragrance Compound (Mixture)
    Product Appearance and Odor Clear Liquid with Characteristic Odor
    Section 2. Physical/Chemical Data
    Specific Gravity 0.924-0.967 @ 25 Degrees C
    Water Solubility Insoluble
    Form Clear Liquid
    Section 3. Health Hazard Data
    Ingredient(s) Posing Health Hazard: The identity of the components of this mixture is proprietary information and is
    regarded to be a trade secret, in accordance with the provisions of paragraph 1910.1200 of Title 29 of the Code of
    Federal Regulations.
    However, based on health hazard determination of contained ingredients present at a
    concentration greater than one percent, this mixture presents the following health hazards:
    Possible Routes of Entry Skin contact, eye contact, inhalation, ingestion
    Effects of Exposure May be irritating to skin, eyes, and respiratory system

  10. #10

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    any one guess what the M.E.K for? in the intial formula mentioned? , and how would a diffuser not become opaque if so much water added? wouldn't that make it unstable?
    Currently wearing: Y by Yves Saint Laurent

  11. #11

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    The purpose of the methyl ethyl ketone is to be extremely nasty and make the alcohol undrinkable (to denature it.)

    Bitrex alone is not considered to accomplish this.

    Personally (I just dislike MEK from having worked with it as an aircraft mechanic, it's pretty shocking how you can taste it within a few seconds if it touches your skin at all) I don't have toxicity information on it) I would choose a different alcohol.

    EDIT -- Here's some toxicity information: https://www.epa.gov/sites/production...hyl-ketone.pdf

    I am not saying anyone is going to suffer harm from your alcohol having nearly 1% of this material. I'm saying only that this particular alcohol is using a deliberately obnoxious ingredient that is intended specifically to prevent human intake rather to be part of something humans will be drinking, breathing, or having dermal contact with.

    Personal opinion, it comes down to whether one has a personal philosophy of "let's not unnecessarily introduce even in trace amounts something that's quite nasty," (and the levels in the air would be quite low when using such a fragrance product,) or, "there comes a point where levels are so low that you don't have to be concerned particularly when the material is not a carcinogen." Either is defendable in this case I would suppose, though I haven't looked up OSHA exposure limits for concentrations in air.

    FURTHER EDIT: Odor is detectable at 25 ppm. OSHA allows 200 ppm concentration in air for 8 hour workday exposure, so basically if you can't smell it OSHA says it's okay. Roughly speaking, a room that's about 3 meters square has about 25 kg of air in it, so 25 ppm is about half a gram of MEK in the air. You would not have that from the alcohol. So I would not expect detectable MEK smell in the room.

  12. #12
    Basenotes Plus
    pkiler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    8,797

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Bill, I think that you might have misread the MEK level. OP Posted "Methyl ethyl ketone, 0.03%" in the alcohol.
    This is diluted further with fragrance, and water if chosen, etc.
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyScents View Post
    For alcohol I want to use 99% ethyl alcohol. The remaining 1% is 0.95% Methyl ethyl ketone, 0.03% Methylisopropyl ketone, 0.02% Methyl 3-heptanone, 0.01g BITREX
    I got the nearly 1% MEK from that. I meant the alcohol portion of the intended mixture, which is substantial, being an alcohol which is almost 1% MEK.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Somewhat interestingly the Code of Federal Regulations isn't backing me up or is refuting me on MEK being a denaturant ( https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/...-sec21-151.xml ), but for example Sigma says it is or can be part of a denaturing mixture: https://www.sigmaaldrich.com/catalog...g=en&region=US

  15. #15

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyScents View Post
    How is it possible that the room spray that I gave as an example does not contain an inhibitor? And water is listed first and therefore contains the most. Is it not the case that the alcohol ensures that the water cannot mold?
    Can anyone explain that to me?

  16. #16

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Quote Originally Posted by DanaB View Post
    COMPOSITION / INFORMATION INGREDIENTS
    Product Name CAS NO EC NO Concentration
    Butoxydiglycol 112-34-5 - > = 50 %
    Ethyl Alcohol 64-17-5 - 5 - 10 %
    Thanks DanaB for the explanation. But i just don't understand what needs to be done with the other 40%.

  17. #17

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Nothing is going to grow in 30% alcohol, with regards to the formula you wat to use.

    I have not looked into whether anything grows in over 50% butoxydiglycol and no water or not. I would have to see it to believe anything did, though.

    As to the unexplained 40%, they don't have to tell you everything.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Roberts View Post
    Nothing is going to grow in 30% alcohol, with regards to the formula you wat to use.

    I have not looked into whether anything grows in over 50% butoxydiglycol and no water or not. I would have to see it to believe anything did, though.

    As to the unexplained 40%, they don't have to tell you everything.
    I understand that, but is there something in the remaining 40% that still influences the strength or quality of the reed diffuser? Or should I think more about color and smell?

  19. #19
    Basenotes Plus
    pkiler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    8,797

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Roberts View Post
    I got the nearly 1% MEK from that. I meant the alcohol portion of the intended mixture, which is substantial, being an alcohol which is almost 1% MEK.
    Oh, Sorry, Bill, It was I who misread that one...
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Sooner or later it was bound to happen, the run has been like 50-0 in the other direction so far!

  21. #21

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyScents View Post
    I understand that, but is there something in the remaining 40% that still influences the strength or quality of the reed diffuser? Or should I think more about color and smell?
    See here.

  22. #22
    Super Member
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    127

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Here's something else I found -- mineral oil?


    Product Name: REED DIFFUSER BASE
    Revision Date: 06-30-2017
    Replaces:
    3. Compositon/informaton on ingredients
    Chemical Component: CAS number and other
    unique identers % (or range) of ingredient
    Hydrotreated light distllate
    (Petroleum)
    CAS# 90622-58-5 30 - 60

    The speciic chemical identy and/or exact percentage (concentraton) of compositon has been withheld as a trade
    secret.

  23. #23
    Super Member
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    127

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Also this: Dipropylene Glycol Methyl Ether Acetate

    Product identifier
    Trade name: Premium Diffuser Base LSF 0771
    Article number: LSF 0771
    CAS Number:
    88917-22-0


  24. #24

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Quote Originally Posted by Pears View Post
    See here.
    Thank you for the link. Do you know a company that sells TPM? I only found one company that sells TPM. But for 55 euro/one litre.

  25. #25

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    If you're in the UK, then try British Chemical Products.

  26. #26

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Quote Originally Posted by Pears View Post
    If you're in the UK, then try British Chemical Products.
    That's going to cost me 85 euros just to send it. Do you happen to have an alternative?

  27. #27

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Not one that is in the EU and sells to private individuals. What is your location, just in case someone near you knows?
    Last edited by Pears; 16th November 2019 at 10:43 PM.

  28. #28
    Basenotes Plus
    pkiler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    8,797

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Our friend David Ruskin often recommended Dowanol as the best solvent for Reed Diffusers, I believe.
    Paul Kiler
    PK Perfumes
    http://www.PKPERFUMES.com
    In addition to Our own PK line, we make Custom Bespoke Perfumes, perfumes for Entrepreneurs needing scents for perfumes or products, Custom Wedding Perfumes, and even Special Event Perfumes.

  29. #29

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    See post #21 Paul. Your memory serves you well.

  30. #30

    Default Re: Room spray with 3 ingredients

    Quote Originally Posted by Pears View Post
    Not one that is in the EU and sells to private individuals. What is your location, just in case someone near you knows?
    Suppose I can't find it, what is a good replacement for the TPM? I wanted a mixture consisting of DPM, TPM and fragrance.




Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 11
    Last Post: 31st October 2019, 05:08 AM
  2. Room Spray questions
    By paulnorrington in forum Just Starting Out
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 20th May 2019, 10:08 AM
  3. Solvent for room spray?
    By Manshigo in forum Fragrance DIY
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 26th September 2016, 09:19 AM
  4. Frags you only like as a room spray ?
    By Bigsly in forum Male Fragrance Discussion
    Replies: 29
    Last Post: 20th February 2010, 12:09 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  



Loving perfume on the Internet since 2000