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  1. #1

    Default Battling Price Gouging

    What if we all buy as many as we can afford to resell them at retail price here on the forum 1 per person with a master list to keep track of who bought what to prevent multiple bottles of something going to one member. This would be to beat the price gouging scumbags at their own game. Anyone care to join? There is risk of course, but to use judgment for which houses/artisans are most prone to price gouging. Everyone that actually appreciates the fragrance can have a much higher chance at snagging one up.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    You're asking what if I spend my time (which is money) to buy bottles at retail, deal with people on this site, risk people not wanting the perfume for years to come and it just sits around, and lastly deal with scammers just so someone can get a bottle a few bucks cheaper than what a price gouger sells? Perfume is not life nor is it necessary. There's plenty of stuff out there I'd like that I won't because of prices it's not a big deal.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    What if people only bought what they intended to use and didn't buy things that they didn't want to use and were only planning on reselling?

    And then what if people just refused to buy from resellers?

    Imagine.
    Currently wearing: Gaiac 10 by Le Labo

  4. #4

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    I’m fairly certain this wouldn’t effect price gouging. It would benefit a small group of Basenotes members to the further detriment of people that just want to buy perfume from a brand they like for personal consumption.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by ultravisitor View Post
    And then what if people just refused to buy from resellers?

    Imagine.
    A real possibility.
    Remember that while it is perfectly acceptable to criticize the content of a post - criticizing the poster is not.
    Mean spirited, nasty, snide, sarcastic, hateful, and rude individuals on Basenotes don't warrant or deserve my or other Basenoters' acknowledgement or respect.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by hednic View Post
    A real possibility.
    Truly. It's something I do every day.
    Currently wearing: Gaiac 10 by Le Labo

  7. #7

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldWineMemories View Post
    You're asking what if I spend my time (which is money) to buy bottles at retail, deal with people on this site, risk people not wanting the perfume for years to come and it just sits around, and lastly deal with scammers just so someone can get a bottle a few bucks cheaper than what a price gouger sells? Perfume is not life nor is it necessary. There's plenty of stuff out there I'd like that I won't because of prices it's not a big deal.
    Not a few bucks cheaper...2 to 5x’s cheaper. It’s not about life or necessity, it’s about standing up against a real dirt bag move, which is taking advantage of limited supply and preventing others from enjoying something. It’s arrogant and dirty.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by Dothraki View Post
    Not a few bucks cheaper...2 to 5x’s cheaper. It’s not about life or necessity, it’s about standing up against a real dirt bag move, which is taking advantage of limited supply and preventing others from enjoying something. It’s arrogant and dirty.
    The problem is we don't know which scents that we'd hypothetically buy at retail would eventually be discontinued gouger targets. The "payoff" for such a tactic may take years and may never happen...so there'd be a pretty significant risk of having to offload a lot of inventory below cost because the gouger thesis didn't pan out for that particular scent. Between that and the logistics involved, I don't see it happening/working.
    Last edited by LiveJazz; 15th July 2020 at 10:51 PM.
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  9. #9

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Yeah it sucks, but that’s how it goes with everything that’s hyped up and limited supply. If people weren’t willing to pay marked up prices then the people that are gouging would have to lower their prices to move the item.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by bl00drunzcold View Post
    Yeah it sucks, but that’s how it goes with everything that’s hyped up and limited supply. If people weren’t willing to pay marked up prices then the people that are gouging would have to lower their prices to move the item.
    Exactly. As long as people continue buying from resellers, they will create a need for those people to exist and continue selling the way that they do.
    Currently wearing: Gaiac 10 by Le Labo

  11. #11
    The Devil in the Details
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    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    If we're talking artisanal perfumes, that's up to the perfumers to better identify their buyers and limit their per-customer per-batch purchases so distribution doesn't bottle neck into the hands of a few power sellers. Even then, they use bots to make mass purchase (like they currently do with the Nintendo Switch) in order to flip when the perfumer runs out (sometimes hours after release). That responsibility belongs to the houses if they truly want a 1 bottle per person distribution. Some like ALD try, but not hard enough, and sometimes make "sequel" batches to address the problem (although they get hoarded in hours/days too).

    If we're talking discontinued designers, a lot of the gouging comes from speculation-induced power-buying which itself is caused by influencer/YouTuber hype when something is discontinued, so the grass roots approach to that is ignore the hype or take it with a grain of salt rather than echoing it or impulse blind buying based on it. You can't stop the eBay powersellers once they have vacuumed up all the bottles from discounters and other lower-priced eBay listings, but you can derail the hype train which will force them to lower prices if no FOMO frenzy begins. I've seen some older DC'd fragrances eventually flood eBay at lower prices if the train never takes off.

    Competitively buying something to try and preserve distribution fairness is fighting fire with fire and can make things a pissing match (therefore making them worse because egos), so unless you have millions to waste on "Perfume Wall Street", it's not a wise move. Plus, some things if they're old and gone from the market long enough just actually are that rare after years of use and depletion.
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  12. #12

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    True..and I know. It just sucks and it happens with everything from new electronics to freaking perfume. I guess all we can do is play our part and not pay the ridiculous prices, and hope others don’t as well.

    And just to be clear...I am not including things like vintage stuff that is rare like a 1960’s Mitsouko that someone happens to have a bottle of and sells at a high price. That’s understandable and expected.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Another way to do it is a spending limit. Only a certain portiont of the BN community will use the approach, but I have a few limits based on type of purchase and stick to it. It's not about having the money to spend but choosing where to spend it. This may mean I never get Unicorn Frags A to Z, or even the new Roja/Xerjoff whatever, but going the used/discount/gray market have got quite a few that at retail are way past the limit. Don't lose any sleep, and don't contribute to prices going up much either....

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by Dothraki View Post
    What if we all buy as many as we can afford to resell them at retail price here on the forum 1 per person with a master list to keep track of who bought what to prevent multiple bottles of something going to one member. This would be to beat the price gouging scumbags at their own game. Anyone care to join? There is risk of course, but to use judgment for which houses/artisans are most prone to price gouging. Everyone that actually appreciates the fragrance can have a much higher chance at snagging one up.
    This is basically a version of price gouging. Or at least hogging supply.
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  15. #15

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    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Is this thread in response to the Fjerne listings on Ebay?
    Fjerne was not advertised as having a certain number of bottles for sale. It was available for anyone to buy for the couple of days that Josh had it listed on his website. From what I understand it wasn't taken down because it sold out. The sellers on Ebay did not prevent anyone else from getting a bottle who wanted one.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by AZsmells View Post
    Is this thread in response to the Fjerne listings on Ebay?
    Fjerne was not advertised as having a certain number of bottles for sale. It was available for anyone to buy for the couple of days that Josh had it listed on his website. From what I understand it wasn't taken down because it sold out. The sellers on Ebay did not prevent anyone else from getting a bottle who wanted one.
    I am not one of the sellers but I don't get all the hate. There's a ton of perfumes on Ebay that people sell for profit. There's a ton of people who sell all sorts of collectibles for a profit.
    Whether we like it or not perfumes are a collectible. Not everyone buys them to wear them. I'd love a bottle of Guerlain Djedi. A bottle sold on Ebay for $3150 a couple of months ago. I'm not mad at the seller for making a profit.
    OP never gave context, but if this is the reason for the thread, the first paragraph of my original reply still stands.

    With semi-bespoke or limited availability stuff like Artisanal perfume, it's up to the original seller to defend against anything perceived as gouging, because the supply chain starts with them. Even then, there's only so much they can do, because of bot nets and other methods to circumvent purchase limits. DC'd mass market scents require hype from the community to get scalping started, because it takes a concerted effort to bring a perfume to the attention of enough resellers that might want to monopolize supply when there are thousands or millions of bottles out there after the production ends.

    For the record, I'm not against selling things for a profit. If you bought it, and you want to sell it for more and someone takes the offer, good for you. I may eventually sell backups myself if I find myself not needing them, although I'd much rather trade than sell tbh. I think we can all agree that investment resale of collectables is a moral gray area because they aren't needful things, and deciding when something is fair or "gouged" can be hard, but actual scalping is pretty clearly exploitative (like with concert tickets and the aforementioned Nintendo systems in my previous comment).
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  17. #17

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    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by Zealot Crusader View Post
    OP never gave context, but if this is the reason for the thread, the first paragraph of my original reply still stands.

    With semi-bespoke or limited availability stuff like Artisanal perfume, it's up to the original seller to defend against anything perceived as gouging, because the supply chain starts with them. Even then, there's only so much they can do, because of bot nets and other methods to circumvent purchase limits. DC'd mass market scents require hype from the community to get scalping started, because it takes a concerted effort to bring a perfume to the attention of enough resellers that might want to monopolize supply when there are thousands or millions of bottles out there after the production ends.

    For the record, I'm not against selling things for a profit. If you bought it, and you want to sell it for more and someone takes the offer, good for you. I may eventually sell backups myself if I find myself not needing them, although I'd much rather trade than sell tbh. I think we can all agree that investment resale of collectables is a moral gray area because they aren't needful things, and deciding when something is fair or "gouged" can be hard, but actual scalping is pretty clearly exploitative (like with concert tickets and the aforementioned Nintendo systems in my previous comment).
    Yes I am against actual scalping.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by AZsmells View Post
    Is this thread in response to the Fjerne listings on Ebay?
    Fjerne was not advertised as having a certain number of bottles for sale. It was available for anyone to buy for the couple of days that Josh had it listed on his website. From what I understand it wasn't taken down because it sold out. The sellers on Ebay did not prevent anyone else from getting a bottle who wanted one.
    slumberhouse is notorious for price gouging and very limited/mysterious availability

    this is why there are 4 bottles on there already at ridiculous prices

    people know that others will pay for a much higher price

  19. #19
    Super Member HabibiGotIt's Avatar
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    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Isn't someone on here selling Emperor Hind for $850?? I am shocked. A first release from a noname house? The hype is real. I wouldn't pay more than $200 for it. Can't imagine it's better than EO1 or C&P or Oud Maximus.

    Crazy part is someone will probably buy it lol.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by Jcelello View Post
    I’m fairly certain this wouldn’t effect price gouging. It would benefit a small group of Basenotes members to the further detriment of people that just want to buy perfume from a brand they like for personal consumption.
    This.

  21. #21

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by Zealot Crusader View Post
    OP never gave context, but if this is the reason for the thread, the first paragraph of my original reply still stands.

    With semi-bespoke or limited availability stuff like Artisanal perfume, it's up to the original seller to defend against anything perceived as gouging, because the supply chain starts with them. Even then, there's only so much they can do, because of bot nets and other methods to circumvent purchase limits. DC'd mass market scents require hype from the community to get scalping started, because it takes a concerted effort to bring a perfume to the attention of enough resellers that might want to monopolize supply when there are thousands or millions of bottles out there after the production ends.

    For the record, I'm not against selling things for a profit. If you bought it, and you want to sell it for more and someone takes the offer, good for you. I may eventually sell backups myself if I find myself not needing them, although I'd much rather trade than sell tbh. I think we can all agree that investment resale of collectables is a moral gray area because they aren't needful things, and deciding when something is fair or "gouged" can be hard, but actual scalping is pretty clearly exploitative (like with concert tickets and the aforementioned Nintendo systems in my previous comment).
    You can’t even buy concert tickets or stand up comedy anymore because there are scalpers that buy up every seat, resell for 10x’s the venue price.

    This is partially in response to Fjerne but not for myself. I am not interested in Fjerne but I see a ton of people here...fragrance lovers and enthusiasts, missed out only to see them for sale at double the cost or more on eBay the very next day. There are a few I’m waiting for to be released and I absolutely know it’s going to be extremely hard to snag a bottle before the scalpers do. It’s tough enough already with limited supply we don’t need the extra hassel from people who just want some quick free money.

    I think you are right. It’s up to the original sellers/vendors to limit 1 per customer of each, when they only have so many available. Let’s hope they are paying attention to this thread.

  22. #22
    I’m not old: I’m vintage.
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    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by Dothraki View Post
    I think you are right. It’s up to the original sellers/vendors to limit 1 per customer of each, when they only have so many available. Let’s hope they are paying attention to this thread.
    It's exceedingly unlikely they're paying attention to this thread. However, it's just as unlikely that they're unaware of the phenomenon. Undetermined is how much of a problem they think it is, if at all, since the primary concern of most sellers is moving product, not to whom.

  23. #23

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by PStoller View Post
    It's exceedingly unlikely they're paying attention to this thread. However, it's just as unlikely that they're unaware of the phenomenon. Undetermined is how much of a problem they think it is, if at all, since the primary concern of most sellers is moving product, not to whom.
    That’s simply not true. Many of them are basenotes members and take feedback to provide what the small community asks of them. I’m not talking about store brands or “niche” though. These are artisan perfumers and distillers. Artists with a love and passion for what they do. Myself as a former professional artist I can tell you this.... ya give the fans what they want ; )

  24. #24

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by HabibiGotIt View Post
    Isn't someone on here selling Emperor Hind for $850?? I am shocked. A first release from a noname house? The hype is real. I wouldn't pay more than $200 for it. Can't imagine it's better than EO1 or C&P or Oud Maximus.

    Crazy part is someone will probably buy it lol.
    Imagine it went on sale for $850 initially? Who on earth would buy it? It would still be available for sure. But you’re right, someone might actually pay that for something they haven’t even smelled. Not because it is the greatest fragrance of all time or even unique, but because it is sold out and unlikely to be made again. And, of course, hyped on here. The problem is not just the scalpers, it’s the people that will pay too much money just to join the chorus of people hyping a given fragrance at a given time. I’m not judging those people. I’ve overpaid for fragrances. I’ve blind bought fragrances based on hype alone. My lengthy marketplace threads are proof of my terrible blind-buying habit. Emperor Hind is nice, but doesn’t smell objectively better or all that different than any number of attars and spray perfumes by similar artisans that happen to be available at the moment, EO1 included. I like EO1 more and they are similar in my opinion. It also smells nearly identical to Attar Mastaan, to my nose anyways, which I believe is still available.

    By the way, who on here differentiates between a scalper who buys in bulk to resell and someone who purchased one bottle for personal use and later sells it at the same inflated price because the market determines the item to be worth that amount at the time of sale? How about someone who blind-buys a discontinued fragrance for an inflated price, dislikes it, and resells it at the same inflated price to break even?

    Do strangers owe a duty to people on this site to only sell rare and discontinued items at or slightly above original retail price? Or should they for fear of being called a scalper or price gouger?

  25. #25

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by PStoller View Post
    since the primary concern of most sellers is moving product, not to whom.
    This. If Russian Adam or any of these other guys really wanted to, they could set up strict restrictions on their site like Supreme does.

  26. #26
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    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    A risky move to make, as it is difficult to know which ones will be discontinued, and further more, I am here for the hobby, not to try to control something unavoidable.

  27. #27

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by Jcelello View Post
    Imagine it went on sale for $850 initially? Who on earth would buy it? It would still be available for sure. But you’re right, someone might actually pay that for something they haven’t even smelled. Not because it is the greatest fragrance of all time or even unique, but because it is sold out and unlikely to be made again. And, of course, hyped on here. The problem is not just the scalpers, it’s the people that will pay too much money just to join the chorus of people hyping a given fragrance at a given time. I’m not judging those people. I’ve overpaid for fragrances. I’ve blind bought fragrances based on hype alone. My lengthy marketplace threads are proof of my terrible blind-buying habit. Emperor Hind is nice, but doesn’t smell objectively better or all that different than any number of attars and spray perfumes by similar artisans that happen to be available at the moment, EO1 included. I like EO1 more and they are similar in my opinion. It also smells nearly identical to Attar Mastaan, to my nose anyways, which I believe is still available.

    By the way, who on here differentiates between a scalper who buys in bulk to resell and someone who purchased one bottle for personal use and later sells it at the same inflated price because the market determines the item to be worth that amount at the time of sale? How about someone who blind-buys a discontinued fragrance for an inflated price, dislikes it, and resells it at the same inflated price to break even?

    Do strangers owe a duty to people on this site to only sell rare and discontinued items at or slightly above original retail price? Or should they for fear of being called a scalper or price gouger?
    You make an excellent point with the EO1 example. However, I haven’t tried Emperor Hind so there might be a note in there that just strikes with someone. But in the end it’s the whole supply and demand thing that pushes the price. I don’t think selling off a personal bottle at the inflated market price is scalping, only if it was purchased for the purpose of reselling and especially if multiple bottles were purchased to resell.

  28. #28

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by Dothraki View Post
    You make an excellent point with the EO1 example. However, I haven’t tried Emperor Hind so there might be a note in there that just strikes with someone. But in the end it’s the whole supply and demand thing that pushes the price. I don’t think selling off a personal bottle at the inflated market price is scalping, only if it was purchased for the purpose of reselling and especially if multiple bottles were purchased to resell.
    You can’t have it both ways though. You can’t call someone a price gouger for buying multiple bottles to make a profit, and then not call a person selling their personal bottle for the same price as the other person a price gouger.

    Apparently I’m a price gouger because the one bottle of Fjerne I bought didn’t click with me so I offered it up to someone here, and HE OFFERED me a whole whopping $40 more than I paid for it.

  29. #29

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by bl00drunzcold View Post
    You can’t have it both ways though. You can’t call someone a price gouger for buying multiple bottles to make a profit, and then not call a person selling their personal bottle for the same price as the other person a price gouger.

    Apparently I’m a price gouger because the one bottle of Fjerne I bought didn’t click with me so I offered it up to someone here, and HE OFFERED me a whole whopping $40 more than I paid for it.
    That’s completely different. Regardless of what you do with your bottle, you only took one from the supply. If you ordered 5 bottles to resell that’s a different story.

  30. #30

    Default Re: Battling Price Gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by Dothraki View Post
    That’s completely different. Regardless of what you do with your bottle, you only took one from the supply. If you ordered 5 bottles to resell that’s a different story.
    They’re still making it unobtainable for the average person by raising the price exorbitantly. The only difference is that one person is doing it more. The person selling Emperor Hind for $850 is price gouging. If they hadn’t bought that bottle, I could have.




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